Could Cubs be building Schwarber's trade value?

[downsr30]

Could it be possible that the Cubs are holding Schwarber behind the plate to keep his value high as can be? As a catcher, Schwarber's bat is more valuable than any prospect in the game - IF another team believes he can be that guy behind the plate. He came up and took advantage of the week he had at the big league level.

 

You're in the GM seat: Would you give up Schwarber in a trade for Hamels? It might hurt a bit later, but it's something to consider. As much as us Cubs fans want to say "I'll give up Baez, Almora, and Vogelbach for Hamels." That's great - there's a reason you're willing to trade those players - they don't have much value. I'll play GM and probably get torn apart for it: Schwarber and Baez for Hamels, Papelbon, Andres Blanco

 

We lose a couple big pieces but we aren't just trading for a rental in Hamels - we are getting a star pitcher. With Rizzo, Bryant, Castro, Russell, Soler - the Cubs could do something like this, next offseason you sign a Price and a good outfield bat - you have a good size payroll, but you 3 very good starters this year, 4 next year.. A deeper bench and bullpen this year, and if you can grab a good bat next year, you are set with a good farm system still coming up.

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[CyHawk_Cub]

I'd give up Schwarber for a Sonny Gray-type guy. I like Hamels just fine, but I'd rather roll the dice on a FA TORP this coming offseason, spending only $$$ (& losing 1st rd pick in 2016).

[CubInOK]

Why can't Schwarber be that guy in LF? He still might not be good enough to stick at catcher.

[downsr30]

I'm not buying Baez - show me the guys who have struck out at his rate and been sustainably successful in the MLB - that list is very short. He's an athlete and a middle infielder which are both pluses. The negatives is that it's highly likely he'd get exploited at the major league level. I hope he proves me wrong, and I think he'll get one more REAL chance to prove his changes, and that'll most likely be either in Chicago or somewhere else at the start of 2016.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[downsr30]

My guess has been somewhere between where Dan Uggla was in his prime and where he is now.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Guest]

I'm not buying Baez - show me the guys who have struck out at his rate and been sustainably successful in the MLB - that list is very short. He's an athlete and a middle infielder which are both pluses. The negatives is that it's highly likely he'd get exploited at the major league level. I hope he proves me wrong, and I think he'll get one more REAL chance to prove his changes, and that'll most likely be either in Chicago or somewhere else at the start of 2016.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/s/schmimi01.shtml

 

Look at his first couple partial years as he tried to break in.

[Guest]

Maybe the Cubs think he can catch.

 

Also, hard no on Schwarber for Hamels.

[Sammy Sofa]

Yeah, I wouldn't trade Schwarber for Hamels, but I'd have zero problem with the Cubs being proactive and trading him as a main piece in a deal for a serious impact bat.

[SouthSideRyan]

I'm not buying Baez - show me the guys who have struck out at his rate and been sustainably successful in the MLB - that list is very short. He's an athlete and a middle infielder which are both pluses. The negatives is that it's highly likely he'd get exploited at the major league level. I hope he proves me wrong, and I think he'll get one more REAL chance to prove his changes, and that'll most likely be either in Chicago or somewhere else at the start of 2016.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/s/schmimi01.shtml

 

Look at his first couple partial years as he tried to break in.

 

His 40 PA year or his year where he was averageish?

[Sammy Sofa]

I'm not buying Baez - show me the guys who have struck out at his rate and been sustainably successful in the MLB - that list is very short. He's an athlete and a middle infielder which are both pluses. The negatives is that it's highly likely he'd get exploited at the major league level. I hope he proves me wrong, and I think he'll get one more REAL chance to prove his changes, and that'll most likely be either in Chicago or somewhere else at the start of 2016.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/s/schmimi01.shtml

 

Look at his first couple partial years as he tried to break in.

 

His 40 PA year or his year where he was averageish?

 

All either does it make me even more worried about Baez given how terrible his time was. We would have killed for him to have those numbers.

[Guest]

I'm not buying Baez - show me the guys who have struck out at his rate and been sustainably successful in the MLB - that list is very short. He's an athlete and a middle infielder which are both pluses. The negatives is that it's highly likely he'd get exploited at the major league level. I hope he proves me wrong, and I think he'll get one more REAL chance to prove his changes, and that'll most likely be either in Chicago or somewhere else at the start of 2016.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/s/schmimi01.shtml

 

Look at his first couple partial years as he tried to break in.

 

His 40 PA year or his year where he was averageish?

In 1973, Schmidt's 30.6% strikeout rate was 225% higher than the league average of 13.6%.

In 2014, Javy's 41.4% strikeout rate was 204% higher than the league average of 20.3%.

 

Context is important, people

[downsr30]

Do you have any other stats to back your argument up outside of one case that also happens to be one of the best hitters in baseball history?

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Sammy Sofa]

In 1973, Schmidt's 30.6% strikeout rate was 225% higher than the league average of 13.6%.

In 2014, Javy's 41.4% strikeout rate was 204% higher than the league average of 20.3%.

 

Context is important, people

 

That's not tremendously reassuring.

[Guest]

Javy's career is littered with him struggling in his first exposure to a new level, making adjustments, and then eventually dominating said level. There were additional signs in his limited AAA time that he had made progress from last year too. These are not hard proof Javy will be awesome, but I'm not compelled by tales of similar failures when very few players have Javy's physical gifts or track record of improvement. That doesn't make awesome Javy the most likely outcome, and I'm overall a bit pessimistic on him being a consistently above average player, but the simplistic 'Javy struck out X in this short span, how could any player ever overcome this?' arguments are bad ones.

[Sammy Sofa]

Look, the obvious answer is to trade him, Schwarber and Castro. I say go nuts.

[jersey cubs fan]

I really do not get the faith in the "he sucked at every level then improved" argument.

[Guest]

I really do not get the faith in the "he sucked at every level then improved" argument.

It is a demonstration of his ability to make adjustments.

[jersey cubs fan]

I really do not get the faith in the "he sucked at every level then improved" argument.

It is a demonstration of his ability to make adjustments.

 

Adjustments to minor league pitchers.

[downsr30]

If you're the Phillies, Schwarber is an extremely attractive piece as they already have one of the best up and coming hitters in baseball as their 3rd basemen in Franco. Trading for young pitching is very dangerous and the Phillies can't really afford to miss - so to speak - on this Hamels deal whenever it happens. Schwarber is by no means a for sure thing, but getting him would be huge for them.

 

On the Cubs side - the Cubs have 4 needs in my eyes as a fan in ranking of most importance:

 

Big-time starter - Lester hasn't been an ace yet this year, Arietta has been more like one. If you add Hamels to the mix you now have a very good 1-2-3 punch and a back end of the rotation that fills out very solid as well.

 

Bench help - we have all seen our share of Herrera, Ross, and Baxter this year. At times these fellas can be OK and serve somewhat of a purpose but all would probably be average at best players at the AAA level. My proposal was to add Andres Blanco - a player with decent speed, some experience and a good versatile bat.

 

Bullpen - our bullpen has been solid of late but there are still uncertainties and I think that's because there's too many floating pieces and uncertain roles - which can be good and bad. Adding a guy like Papelbon to the back end would move everyone else down and allow the other guys to fit into their roles. Also would give us a closer with experience in big spots - which does have value.

 

Big bat - while the Cubs have a very nasty upcoming offense - they don't have a veteran big bat which could be helpful down the stretch. Not something they "need" but would be a very comforting addition. Adding a bat like Carlos Gonzalez (injury free) would be huge - not likely, but huge.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[jersey cubs fan]

I love the idea of trading for Hamels but have very little interest in using Schwarber in that deal.

[Sammy Sofa]

Big bat - while the Cubs have a very nasty upcoming offense - they don't have a veteran big bat which could be helpful down the stretch. Not something they "need" but would be a very comforting addition. Adding a bat like Carlos Gonzalez (injury free) would be huge - not likely, but huge.

 

I'm all about that big bat, but CarGo is not it. His numbers stink this year, plus while he may be injury-free now, his track record shows that's not likely to last. If you're moving Schwarber and others you target someone a bit younger and a lot better.

[downsr30]

Yea, by no means would I use Schwarber in a deal for Cargo. I was simply thinking of a deal simply to add an experienced bat that's a threat. His numbers are similar to Coghlans, but he's an overall better hitter when he's on the field. If it wouldn't cost much, I'd be interested but I'm with you - if you can find a younger piece with more upside - do it for sure.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[sneakypower]

Maybe the Cubs think he can catch.

 

Also, hard no on Schwarber for Hamels.

a Michael Scott no, even

 

Javy's career is littered with him struggling in his first exposure to a new level, making adjustments, and then eventually dominating said level. There were additional signs in his limited AAA time that he had made progress from last year too. These are not hard proof Javy will be awesome, but I'm not compelled by tales of similar failures when very few players have Javy's physical gifts or track record of improvement. That doesn't make awesome Javy the most likely outcome, and I'm overall a bit pessimistic on him being a consistently above average player, but the simplistic 'Javy struck out X in this short span, how could any player ever overcome this?' arguments are bad ones.

oh god it's the Josh Vitters narrative all over again

[mul21]

I really do not get the faith in the "he sucked at every level then improved" argument.

It is a demonstration of his ability to make adjustments.

 

Adjustments to minor league pitchers.

 

Adjustments to the best pitchers he's seen yet. And he's done it at every level he's been to outside of the majors to this point. TT is probably correct with his thoughts, but to just completely poo poo his potential is silly.

 

And sneaky, you're using Vitters as a comparison? Come one, those guys were never in the same league talent wise and you know it.

[downsr30]

Imagine all the times the Cubs could have traded Brett Jackson and his 158 k's at AAA but they held onto him too long because he had value.. Well he sucked.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk