Aramis will not waive no trade clause

[davearm2]

Inasmuch as he's paid to be the power threat they need, I'd say the term godawful fits just fine.

[SouthSideRyan]

Yep, everyone else will get better except for Aramis.

Everyone else will get better. Who knows about Aramis.

 

Are you serious Clark?

[Sammy Sofa]

Nobody said it was. One poster brought up whether it was realistic for him to get eight figures if he ended up producing above an .850 OPS. The production of 3B around baseball is going to strongly influence whether that happens or not, so, yes, if he rebounds that much then there's a very good chance he could command at least $10 million next year.

 

And no, he hasn't been "godawful" this year. He hasn't been the power threat they need, especially not for the money he's getting, but he's not "godawful."

 

I have no doubt someone will throw $10 mil at him, I meant is it worth it to us. IMO the money would be better spent elsewhere.

 

Probably. I'd have little problem with a combo of Baker/DeWitt over there as a stopgap instead of likely overpaying for Aramis.

[Sammy Sofa]

Inasmuch as he's paid to be the power threat they need, I'd say the term godawful fits just fine.

 

In that specific role, sure. But as a whole he's been pretty middle of the pack, as TT pointed out. "Godawful" is pretty melodramatic, especially since we actually saw what a "godawful" Aramis looks like just last year.

[davearm2]

Yep, everyone else will get better except for Aramis.

Everyone else will get better. Who knows about Aramis.

 

Are you serious Clark?

Of course. Leaguewide numbers for 3Bs are extremely likely to revert toward the mean (i.e., get better). There's nothing specific to being a 3B that's causing a precipitous drop in offensive production (relative to history). The whole notion is preposterous, frankly.

 

Who knows what Aramis' hitting problem is. But it isn't that he stands nearest to 3B when the team is in the field.

[davearm2]

Inasmuch as he's paid to be the power threat they need, I'd say the term godawful fits just fine.

 

In that specific role, sure. But as a whole he's been pretty middle of the pack, as TT pointed out. "Godawful" is pretty melodramatic, especially since we actually saw what a "godawful" Aramis looks like just last year.

So you're good with a .745 OPS being "godawful", but a .750 is something else?

[Sammy Sofa]

Yep, everyone else will get better except for Aramis.

Everyone else will get better. Who knows about Aramis.

 

Are you serious Clark?

Of course. Leaguewide numbers for 3Bs are extremely likely to revert toward the mean (i.e., get better). There's nothing specific to being a 3B that's causing a precipitous drop in offensive production (relative to history). The whole notion is preposterous, frankly.

 

Who knows what Aramis' hitting problem is. But it isn't that he stands nearest to 3B when the team is in the field.

 

Wait, you honestly think anyone is arguing that?

[davearm2]

Yep, everyone else will get better except for Aramis.

Everyone else will get better. Who knows about Aramis.

 

Are you serious Clark?

Of course. Leaguewide numbers for 3Bs are extremely likely to revert toward the mean (i.e., get better). There's nothing specific to being a 3B that's causing a precipitous drop in offensive production (relative to history). The whole notion is preposterous, frankly.

 

Who knows what Aramis' hitting problem is. But it isn't that he stands nearest to 3B when the team is in the field.

 

Wait, you honestly think anyone is arguing that?

What else would be the point of comparing his production to other 3Bs?

[Sammy Sofa]

Because the tract of the discussion was revolving around what Aramis could potentially command if he had a dramatic rebound that ended up with him OPSing over .850. The performance of other people at the position he plays is going to influence how much he'll be able to make next season as a FA. Nobody's saying that there's something exclusive to 3B dragging them down; plenty of teams will look at their options and just assume it was a fluke, but others are going to look at someone like the hypothetically OPSing .850+ Aramis as their best option to improve the position. I don't know why you think that the performance of other people playing the same position wouldn't impact how much money he'd make as a FA if he rebounded that dramatically.

[Guest]

What else would be the point of comparing his production to other 3Bs?

 

Because maybe, the fact that every other 3B in the league is having a very down season is at least a partial explanation for why Aramis has had a down season. You can't ignore a league-wide pratfall in offense and just look at one player's year over year numbers and declare "he declined!".

[Sammy Sofa]

What else would be the point of comparing his production to other 3Bs?

 

Because maybe, the fact that every other 3B in the league is having a very down season is at least a partial explanation for why Aramis has had a down season. You can't ignore a league-wide pratfall in offense and just look at one player's year over year numbers and declare "he declined!".

 

Yes, but it's likely not something specific to 3B. I think what you're saying is that offense in general is down, but it's just more pronounced (for a number of reasons) at 3B, right?

[Guest]

What else would be the point of comparing his production to other 3Bs?

 

Because maybe, the fact that every other 3B in the league is having a very down season is at least a partial explanation for why Aramis has had a down season. You can't ignore a league-wide pratfall in offense and just look at one player's year over year numbers and declare "he declined!".

 

Yes, but it's likely not something specific to 3B. I think what you're saying is that offense in general is down, but it's just more pronounced (for a number of reasons) at 3B, right?

 

Of course, it's league-wide, independent of position. I used his position because it's a lot easier to contextualize 7th of 17 eligible 3B than it is 65th of 204 eligible position players or whatever he is, and because the whole discussion is about either keeping Aramis or replacing him with one of his peers.

[Sammy Sofa]

What else would be the point of comparing his production to other 3Bs?

 

Because maybe, the fact that every other 3B in the league is having a very down season is at least a partial explanation for why Aramis has had a down season. You can't ignore a league-wide pratfall in offense and just look at one player's year over year numbers and declare "he declined!".

 

Yes, but it's likely not something specific to 3B. I think what you're saying is that offense in general is down, but it's just more pronounced (for a number of reasons) at 3B, right?

 

Of course, it's league-wide, independent of position. I used his position because it's a lot easier to contextualize 7th of 17 eligible 3B than it is 65th of 204 eligible position players or whatever he is, and because the whole discussion is about either keeping Aramis or replacing him with one of his peers.

 

Right. Just want to make sure it's clear enough for Mr. arm2.

[questionmarkgrace]

Nobody said it was. One poster brought up whether it was realistic for him to get eight figures if he ended up producing above an .850 OPS. The production of 3B around baseball is going to strongly influence whether that happens or not, so, yes, if he rebounds that much then there's a very good chance he could command at least $10 million next year.

 

And no, he hasn't been "godawful" this year. He hasn't been the power threat they need, especially not for the money he's getting, but he's not "godawful."

 

I have no doubt someone will throw $10 mil at him, I meant is it worth it to us. IMO the money would be better spent elsewhere.

 

Probably. I'd have little problem with a combo of Baker/DeWitt over there as a stopgap instead of likely overpaying for Aramis.

 

I agree this may be our best bet. with so many holes on the roster these two could put together some decent numbers especially if how baker has been this year and DeWitt as of late is any indication.

[davearm2]

What else would be the point of comparing his production to other 3Bs?

 

Because maybe, the fact that every other 3B in the league is having a very down season is at least a partial explanation for why Aramis has had a down season. You can't ignore a league-wide pratfall in offense and just look at one player's year over year numbers and declare "he declined!".

 

Yes, but it's likely not something specific to 3B. I think what you're saying is that offense in general is down, but it's just more pronounced (for a number of reasons) at 3B, right?

 

Of course, it's league-wide, independent of position. I used his position because it's a lot easier to contextualize 7th of 17 eligible 3B than it is 65th of 204 eligible position players or whatever he is, and because the whole discussion is about either keeping Aramis or replacing him with one of his peers.

 

Right. Just want to make sure it's clear enough for Mr. arm2.

So then we all agree (with the possible exception of the term "godawful"):

 

Nobody should be taking any comfort in the fact that everyone else's 3B has sucked too, unless they think 3Bs hitting like 70s era shortstops is a true longterm trend.

 

Ramirez has been godawful. The rest is just coincidence.

[Guest]

That is (more or less) the exact opposite of "we all agree"

[Outshined_One]

So then we all agree (with the possible exception of the term "godawful"):

 

Nobody should be taking any comfort in the fact that everyone else's 3B has sucked too, unless they think 3Bs hitting like 70s era shortstops is a true longterm trend.

 

Ramirez has been godawful. The rest is just coincidence.

 

From what I've read, everyone agrees with this statement.

[Little Slide Rooter]

Nobody said it was. One poster brought up whether it was realistic for him to get eight figures if he ended up producing above an .850 OPS. The production of 3B around baseball is going to strongly influence whether that happens or not, so, yes, if he rebounds that much then there's a very good chance he could command at least $10 million next year.

 

And no, he hasn't been "godawful" this year. He hasn't been the power threat they need, especially not for the money he's getting, but he's not "godawful."

 

I have no doubt someone will throw $10 mil at him, I meant is it worth it to us. IMO the money would be better spent elsewhere.

 

Probably. I'd have little problem with a combo of Baker/DeWitt over there as a stopgap instead of likely overpaying for Aramis.

 

In a perfect world, Baker/DeWitt is a good enough platoon and then Vitters is ready mid 2012 or 2013. Baker has terrorized lefties and DeWitt has been very solid in a small sample size. Really, it all depends on the offseason plans. If they don't plan to spend and decide to build from within, it really wont matter whose on 3rd and what's on 2nd.

[imb]

HE'S HEATING UP

[Sammy Sofa]

HE'S ON FIRE.

[rynefan]

He can look so bad. Terrible at bat in the 8th inning of the Sunday Phils game.... ugly strikeout.

[Shilzzz]

BOOMSHAKALAKA!

[Rob]

IS IT THE SHOES?

[Little Slide Rooter]

THE NAIL IN THE COFFIN

[Sammy Sofa]

*Shatters backboard*

 

*Throws controller down*