Who goes to the bullpen?

[bukie]

If we're going based on production so far this year, it's Lilly.

 

If we're going based on expected production going forward, it's Silva.

 

If we're going based on salary, it's Gorzelanny or Wells.

 

If we're going based on what we think Lou will do, that way madness lies.

[Guest]

My guess would be Gorzo goes to the pen. I wonder if they would consider doing something really stupid like putting Dempster back there. He's the only one that has really had success in the pen before and he has late inning experience.

 

My guess is it's probably Randy Wells going to the pen, which would almost make less sense than Dempster.

Wells and Gorz have been our two best starters so far this season by a fairly sizeable margin. Demp then has a big gap between him and Silva, with Lilly trailing everyone by another large margin.

 

My feeling is that the likelihood of each pitcher ending up in the pen is exactly in sequence with how much they're contributing as a starter. Which is completely backwards.

[TommyJohn]

I would want to trade Silva. His value right now should be the highest since his big signing. I would imagine a team looking to contend and beef up their starting pitching would be interested in trading for him. Trade him for prospects. The salary relief would also be helpful.

 

We should also trade Theriot. I think teams still value him as an above average shortstop and to us he's no better than our other alternatives at 2nd (Fontenot and Baker).

 

We could use a dominant reliever. But if one isn't available, trade both or either for prospects and salary relief. And gear towards making a helpful trade near trading deadline if we're in it.

[jersey cubs fan]

I would want to trade Silva. His value right now should be the highest since his big signing. I would imagine a team looking to contend and beef up their starting pitching would be interested in trading for him. Trade him for prospects. The salary relief would also be helpful.

 

We should also trade Theriot. I think teams still value him as an above average shortstop and to us he's no better than our other alternatives at 2nd (Fontenot and Baker).

 

We could use a dominant reliever. But trade both or either for prospects and salary relief. And gear towards making a helpful trade near trading deadline if we're in it.

 

I'd love to do both, but I'm not sure it's going to be possible. If Hendry did turn around those two for salary relief and prospects, I'd be impressed.

[Sammy Sofa]

Hell, I'd be impressed if he even traded them together for a decent reliever. They're tough sells given what they're making.

[jersey cubs fan]

Hell, I'd be impressed if he even traded them together for a decent reliever. They're tough sells given what they're making.

 

It wouldn't be tough to trade them for a reliever if the Cubs are eating all costs.

[Sammy Sofa]

Hell, I'd be impressed if he even traded them together for a decent reliever. They're tough sells given what they're making.

 

It wouldn't be tough to trade them for a reliever if the Cubs are eating all costs.

 

Well, that's why I'd only be impressed if he did it without having to do that.

[rawaction]

if you get to guess two guys, i'm going to guess the other three, that way one of us is right for sure.

 

I meant to say, preference for Gorzo....not guess.

[scarey]

People advocating trading Silva tot he Royals are not being very empathetic. Silva is a good fit for a contender that has a sudden hole in their rotation, not a young struggling team that's trying to build a sustainable major league roster.

 

The only guys from our rotation that the Royals would be interested in are Gorzelanny and Wells.

[jersey cubs fan]

People advocating trading Silva tot he Royals are not being very empathetic. Silva is a good fit for a contender that has a sudden hole in their rotation, not a young struggling team that's trying to build a sustainable major league roster.

 

The only guys from our rotation that the Royals would be interested in are Gorzelanny and Wells.

 

Teams do find value in innings eaters though. If they could get Silva without paying much salary, they could view it as saving some of their young arms and hopefully getting average 180+ innings every year.

[Guest]

People advocating trading Silva tot he Royals are not being very empathetic. Silva is a good fit for a contender that has a sudden hole in their rotation, not a young struggling team that's trying to build a sustainable major league roster.

 

The only guys from our rotation that the Royals would be interested in are Gorzelanny and Wells.

 

Dayton Moore is also a dumb person. And would probably loooove Ryan Theriot.

[daske17]

I'm in favor of a six-man rotation. Let's challenge conventional wisdom!

[scarey]

People advocating trading Silva tot he Royals are not being very empathetic. Silva is a good fit for a contender that has a sudden hole in their rotation, not a young struggling team that's trying to build a sustainable major league roster.

 

The only guys from our rotation that the Royals would be interested in are Gorzelanny and Wells.

 

Dayton Moore is also a dumb person. And would probably loooove Ryan Theriot.

 

Well, in that case I think we should do a Chad Tracy for Moustakas swap too.

[Guest]

People advocating trading Silva tot he Royals are not being very empathetic. Silva is a good fit for a contender that has a sudden hole in their rotation, not a young struggling team that's trying to build a sustainable major league roster.

 

The only guys from our rotation that the Royals would be interested in are Gorzelanny and Wells.

 

Dayton Moore is also a dumb person. And would probably loooove Ryan Theriot.

 

Well, in that case I think we should do a Chad Tracy for Moustakas swap too.

 

We're not talking about trading for the Royals' best players, or their best prospects. Kila has been in AAA for 3 years and hasn't gotten any opportunity, it's clear they don't value him. Gordon would obviously be a little different, but they're getting restless with him and his ineffectiveness, and the aforementioned Moustakas is killing the ball. Moore's most recent acquisitions are Podsednik, Ankiel, and Betancourt, he's not good at his job, and it's not unreasonable to think some team could buy low on Kila or even Gordon.

[Guest]

Dayton Moore is also evidence of your point in another thread, TT.

 

When he was hired, all evidence pointed to him as a great GM candidate. However, he's been pretty miserable since day 1 on the job. It's easy to say that Hendry is far from the ideal GM and that we could do better. But it isn't easy to find a great GM. I'm not saying we shouldn't move on and start that search. Just that we need to do it with our eyes open about the risks.

 

(btw - I don't want to derail this thread too badly. The real discussion about Hendry right now should probably be in the "who to fire" thread in polls.

[jersey cubs fan]

Dayton Moore is also evidence of your point in another thread, TT.

 

When he was hired, all evidence pointed to him as a great GM candidate. However, he's been pretty miserable since day 1 on the job. It's easy to say that Hendry is far from the ideal GM and that we could do better. But it isn't easy to find a great GM. I'm not saying we shouldn't move on and start that search. Just that we need to do it with our eyes open about the risks.

 

(btw - I don't want to derail this thread too badly. The real discussion about Hendry right now should probably be in the "who to fire" thread in polls.

 

That is the reason why it makes perfect sense for Ricketts to take his time on this decision, not a reason why not to fire Hendry though.

[treebird]

Dayton Moore is also evidence of your point in another thread, TT.

 

When he was hired, all evidence pointed to him as a great GM candidate. However, he's been pretty miserable since day 1 on the job. It's easy to say that Hendry is far from the ideal GM and that we could do better. But it isn't easy to find a great GM. I'm not saying we shouldn't move on and start that search. Just that we need to do it with our eyes open about the risks.

 

(btw - I don't want to derail this thread too badly. The real discussion about Hendry right now should probably be in the "who to fire" thread in polls.

 

That is the reason why it makes perfect sense for Ricketts to take his time on this decision, not a reason why not to fire Hendry though.

 

it's also a reason to start the search sooner rather than later. the sooner we have a new gm, the sooner we can get rid of him or her if things don't work out.

[illiniguy]

Dayton Moore is also evidence of your point in another thread, TT.

 

When he was hired, all evidence pointed to him as a great GM candidate. However, he's been pretty miserable since day 1 on the job. It's easy to say that Hendry is far from the ideal GM and that we could do better. But it isn't easy to find a great GM. I'm not saying we shouldn't move on and start that search. Just that we need to do it with our eyes open about the risks.

 

(btw - I don't want to derail this thread too badly. The real discussion about Hendry right now should probably be in the "who to fire" thread in polls.

Dayton Moore hasn't been all bad. He's resigned Greinke for cheap, loaded the farm system with a lot of talent. I'd trade our system for the Royals' one right now. Granted that is partly because Starlin just moved up, but still. He's been bad, but if he had 140 million to spend I'm sure he'd win 80 games a year like Hendry has.

[Guest]

Dayton Moore is also evidence of your point in another thread, TT.

 

When he was hired, all evidence pointed to him as a great GM candidate. However, he's been pretty miserable since day 1 on the job. It's easy to say that Hendry is far from the ideal GM and that we could do better. But it isn't easy to find a great GM. I'm not saying we shouldn't move on and start that search. Just that we need to do it with our eyes open about the risks.

 

(btw - I don't want to derail this thread too badly. The real discussion about Hendry right now should probably be in the "who to fire" thread in polls.

Dayton Moore hasn't been all bad. He's resigned Greinke for cheap, loaded the farm system with a lot of talent. I'd trade our system for the Royals' one right now. Granted that is partly because Starlin just moved up, but still. He's been bad, but if he had 140 million to spend I'm sure he'd win 80 games a year like Hendry has.

 

Outside of the draft, which really isn't his territory as GM anyway, what's one acquisition Moore has made that hasn't been poor to horrendous? Meche, maybe, and Cruz if he hadn't fallen off a cliff. On the other hand, Ankiel, Podsednik, Betancourt, and Kendall, and that's just the last 9 months.

[illiniguy]

Dayton Moore is also evidence of your point in another thread, TT.

 

When he was hired, all evidence pointed to him as a great GM candidate. However, he's been pretty miserable since day 1 on the job. It's easy to say that Hendry is far from the ideal GM and that we could do better. But it isn't easy to find a great GM. I'm not saying we shouldn't move on and start that search. Just that we need to do it with our eyes open about the risks.

 

(btw - I don't want to derail this thread too badly. The real discussion about Hendry right now should probably be in the "who to fire" thread in polls.

Dayton Moore hasn't been all bad. He's resigned Greinke for cheap, loaded the farm system with a lot of talent. I'd trade our system for the Royals' one right now. Granted that is partly because Starlin just moved up, but still. He's been bad, but if he had 140 million to spend I'm sure he'd win 80 games a year like Hendry has.

 

Outside of the draft, which really isn't his territory as GM anyway, what's one acquisition Moore has made that hasn't been poor to horrendous? Meche, maybe, and Cruz if he hadn't fallen off a cliff. On the other hand, Ankiel, Podsednik, Betancourt, and Kendall, and that's just the last 9 months.

Moore prides himself on player development, so you cannot just assume he has nothing to do with the draft. Yes his acquistions have been awful, but again he has zero money to work with. When Jim has zero money to work with he goes out and gets John Grabow, Aaron Miles, Bob Howry. I agree that Moore sucks, but I think Hendry is just as bad. Jim just gets 140 million to throw around.

[Guest]

I agree that Moore sucks, but I think Hendry is just as bad. Jim just gets 140 million to throw around.

 

That's just not true. Hendry has made plenty of good moves that would've been possible with any payroll. Moore hasn't made any.

[jersey cubs fan]

I agree that Moore sucks, but I think Hendry is just as bad. Jim just gets 140 million to throw around.

 

That's just not true. Hendry has made plenty of good moves that would've been possible with any payroll. Moore hasn't made any.

 

when?

[Guest]

I agree that Moore sucks, but I think Hendry is just as bad. Jim just gets 140 million to throw around.

 

That's just not true. Hendry has made plenty of good moves that would've been possible with any payroll. Moore hasn't made any.

 

when?

 

Off the top of my head: Barrett, Dempster, DeRosa, Byrd, Gorzelanny, trading DeRosa, Karros/Grudzielanek, Lee, and probably Ramirez(although 6M was a little more in 2003)

[illiniguy]

I agree that Moore sucks, but I think Hendry is just as bad. Jim just gets 140 million to throw around.

 

That's just not true. Hendry has made plenty of good moves that would've been possible with any payroll. Moore hasn't made any.

 

when?

 

Off the top of my head: Barrett, Dempster, DeRosa, Byrd, Gorzelanny, trading DeRosa, Karros/Grudzielanek, Lee, and probably Ramirez(although 6M was a little more in 2003)

And again the Royals are not in a postition to add the kind of salary that allows you to trade for and keep Lee, Aramis, and DeRosa. Moore also got Soria to sign a cheap deal which I would consider a good deal. I'm sure that Dayton thinks that Hanley Ramirez would be a great guy to trade for, but the difference is Jim can go get him because he has the money to do so.

[jersey cubs fan]

I agree that Moore sucks, but I think Hendry is just as bad. Jim just gets 140 million to throw around.

 

That's just not true. Hendry has made plenty of good moves that would've been possible with any payroll. Moore hasn't made any.

 

when?

 

Off the top of my head: Barrett, Dempster, DeRosa, Byrd, Gorzelanny, trading DeRosa, Karros/Grudzielanek, Lee, and probably Ramirez(although 6M was a little more in 2003)

 

Um, that's ridiculous. No way he could pull those off with "any payroll". How long has Moore been a GM? Hendry has been a GM for 8 years, obviously over time he's going to pull off a favorable deal or two.