Revised Cubs Top 10

[UK1679666180]

I'm probably higher on Lake than most but probably down on Flaherty and Harrison than most. I somewhat liked Flaherty in Beloit, but recently I have not been as impressed, his bat is getting slower and defensively he's not as sharp as he was earlier.

[TruffleShuffle]

i know you guys have been eagerly awaiting my top 10.

 

1. Josh Vitters

2. Jay Jax

3. Starlin Castro

4. Andrew Cashner

5. Chris Carpenter

6. Jeff Samardzija

7. H-J Lee

8. Dae Eun Rhee

9. Brett Jackson

10. Steve Clevenger

 

I really like Carpenter, and I think that Rhee will come back strong from his TJ surgery (though the hiatus is a bit concerning). I think that Clevenger will be a pretty solid backup catcher - obviousy he doesn't have the ceiling that a lot of other guys do but I think he's a good bet to become a major leaguer for a few years.

[Guest]

i know you guys have been eagerly awaiting my top 10.

 

1. Josh Vitters

2. Jay Jax

3. Starlin Castro

4. Andrew Cashner

5. Chris Carpenter

6. Jeff Samardzija

7. H-J Lee

8. Dae Eun Rhee

9. Brett Jackson

10. Steve Clevenger

 

I really like Carpenter, and I think that Rhee will come back strong from his TJ surgery (though the hiatus is a bit concerning). I think that Clevenger will be a pretty solid backup catcher - obviousy he doesn't have the ceiling that a lot of other guys do but I think he's a good bet to become a major leaguer for a few years.

 

Surprised you don't have Kyler Burke up there. You've really been beating his drum more than almost everyone else here.

[TruffleShuffle]

Surprised you don't have Kyler Burke up there. You've really been beating his drum more than almost everyone else here.

 

i think the chance that he makes the big leagues is pretty small, but if he puts it together he could be really good. he controls the strike zone fairly well and has nice doubles power, which might grow into home run power as he matures. the cubs don't have a lot of high ceiling players and that's how i view burke.

[Guest]

Surprised you don't have Kyler Burke up there. You've really been beating his drum more than almost everyone else here.

 

i think the chance that he makes the big leagues is pretty small, but if he puts it together he could be really good. he controls the strike zone fairly well and has nice doubles power, which might grow into home run power as he matures. the cubs don't have a lot of high ceiling players and that's how i view burke.

 

I'd rate Burke ahead of Brett Jackson. Their ages are comparable (Burke is 4 months older than Jackson), they both have questions on their HR power and Burke controls the strike zone better. And Burke has been putting up his .800 OPS at Peoria.

[Rob]

People tend to forget Burke was a supplemental first rounder since we didn't actually draft him. His stock here is a good bit lower than it should be.

[TruffleShuffle]

i think he gets overlooked because he flopped twice at low-a. now i'd argue that trying him at full season ball was a bad idea in 2007 - he was raw and struggled in his debut in the AZL - but he's moved fairly slowly so far. but he has nice tools and i'm looking forward to seeing how he does the next year or two.

[KingCubsFan]

i think he gets overlooked because he flopped twice at low-a. now i'd argue that trying him at full season ball was a bad idea in 2007 - he was raw and struggled in his debut in the AZL - but he's moved fairly slowly so far. but he has nice tools and i'm looking forward to seeing how he does the next year or two.

The Padres drafted him knowing he was very raw and drafte him pretty much solely on his power potential. So it's not really that much of a surprise it took him a while to figure it out, but most teams don't have patience even when they say they do. It's like when an NBA team drafts some raw, athletic player who will take time to develop. They promptly let him ride the bench for 2.5-3 years to ride the bench/struggle and then cut ties.

[Little Slide Rooter]

Ill give it a stab

 

1. Josh Vitters

2. Andrew Cashner

3. Jay Jackson

4. Chris Carpenter

5. Starlin Castro

6. Hak Ju Lee

7. Casey Coleman

8. Dae Eun Rhee

9. Brett Jackson

10. Josh Harrison

 

-Darwin Barney, Marquez Smith, Tyler Colvin, Tony Thomas, Steve Clevenger, and Michael Brenley are all guys Id like to keep an eye on, as well as multiple young pitchers(Searle, Gaub, Archer, McDaniel to name a few). I dont know what to make of Rebel Ridling. I could see him as a Hoffpauir type, finally making it to the bigs in his late 30's.

-I also dont quite know what to make of Samrdzjia at this point. We need to decide if hes a reliever or a starter and go with it. If we plan on using him as a starter, hes much better off in Iowa than at the end of the bullpen in the bigs.

-Aside from Jackson, I really no nothing about any of the AZL or DZL guys.

[Illini Iceman]

I dont know what to make of Rebel Ridling. I could see him as a Hoffpauir type, finally making it to the bigs in his late 30's.

 

In fairness to Hoffpauir, he was a bit of a late bloomer but is only 29 right now so it's not like he is some old guy they finally decided to promote. Even Bobby Scales is only 31.

[Little Slide Rooter]

I dont know what to make of Rebel Ridling. I could see him as a Hoffpauir type, finally making it to the bigs in his late 30's.

 

In fairness to Hoffpauir, he was a bit of a late bloomer but is only 29 right now so it's not like he is some old guy they finally decided to promote. Even Bobby Scales is only 31.

 

In prospect terms, 29 is some old guy. Even if he plays until hes 35, he'll only have a 6 year major league career.

[Illini Iceman]

I dont know what to make of Rebel Ridling. I could see him as a Hoffpauir type, finally making it to the bigs in his late 30's.

 

In fairness to Hoffpauir, he was a bit of a late bloomer but is only 29 right now so it's not like he is some old guy they finally decided to promote. Even Bobby Scales is only 31.

 

In prospect terms, 29 is some old guy. Even if he plays until hes 35, he'll only have a 6 year major league career.

 

Maybe a little old, but you said Ridling might be a "Hoffpauir type" and finally make it "to the bigs in his late 30's". 29 is quite a bit earlier than his late 30's. It not like he is Jim Morris or something.

[NCCubFan]

I dont know what to make of Rebel Ridling. I could see him as a Hoffpauir type, finally making it to the bigs in his late 30's.

 

In fairness to Hoffpauir, he was a bit of a late bloomer but is only 29 right now so it's not like he is some old guy they finally decided to promote. Even Bobby Scales is only 31.

I'm sure it's a typo and he meant late 20s. Chances are a player would be released and out of baseball before he hits late 30s if he hasn't been called up yet.

[Little Slide Rooter]

I dont know what to make of Rebel Ridling. I could see him as a Hoffpauir type, finally making it to the bigs in his late 30's.

 

In fairness to Hoffpauir, he was a bit of a late bloomer but is only 29 right now so it's not like he is some old guy they finally decided to promote. Even Bobby Scales is only 31.

I'm sure it's a typo and he meant late 20s. Chances are a player would be released and out of baseball before he hits late 30s if he hasn't been called up yet.

 

That is correct. Unless were talking Scotty "Die Hard" McClain.

[sandbergcubs]

i saw this listed on bleed cubbie blue, was it you outshined one??

 

As things stand now...

This system has taken a substantial step forward compared to last season. Right now, we’re probably hovering around average/slightly below average compared to other farm systems. It seems like the Cubs have four guys who could crack the Top 100 depending on how they continue to develop. Last year’s draft was a huge boon to the system and the international signings have continued to contribute. The key to the continuing growth of the system is going to come from this year’s draft. There are some intriguing names, but the Cubs need to make a few more signings before I consider this draft a success. Getting Jackson, LeMahieu, and Kirk signed was great, but adding guys like Raley, Burruel, Sheppard, and Whaley would really, really help.

 

My list hasn’t changed much since last doing this. So, without further adieu…

 

1) 3B Josh Vitters – Duh. He’s had some struggles in Daytona, but give the guy time before jumping down his throat. [Rant]The problem with the internet and minor league baseball is that everyone wants production now now now now now!!! Guys take time to develop. They have a learning curve. Vitters being streaky as a 20 year old doesn’t make him the next C-Patt, Harvey, Dopirak, etc. It means he’s still developing and growing. Be patient and look to the long run, rather than latch onto the latest flavor of the month. If he’s the next big flop, we sure as heck won’t find out this year and most likely won’t find out next year, either.[/end rant] A-

 

2) P Jay Jackson – There’s a lot to like with him and he has a lot to offer. Not much to say about him. B+/A-

 

3) SS Starlin Castro – The errors are a bit worrying, but everything else is quite promising. I’ve heard elsewhere that his problems have come on routine plays, rather than on hard ones, which is a promising sign. Having someone Castro’s age do what he’s doing in Daytona is quite excellent. B+

 

4) P Andrew Cashner: His stock has been on the rise lately with some excellent outings in Tennessee. He was drafted for his fastball-slider combo, but apparently he’s had some issues with the slider this season and has been relying on a changeup that’s working out pretty well for him. The biggest problem with him in my mind is whether he can handle a rotation workload. Next season will answer that question, but a strong finish to this season would be welcome. B+/B

 

I’d put a decent-sized gap here after these four. There’s still talent from here on out, but a lot of it is either unpolished, inconsistent, or needs to work on some particularly worrying flaw.

 

5) P Jeff Samardzija – Nothing more to say about him. B/B-

 

6) P Chris Carpenter – The injury history and walks scare me, but he’s got middle of the rotation stuff and has had very good results. I’m hoping his scratch tonight was nothing. B/B-

 

7) SS Hak-Ju Lee – I’m loving his production down in Boise. He’s got excellent upside and has shown very good speed and defense thus far. Still, he has a long way to go and his lack of power might be an issue down the line. B-

 

I’d put another gap here. After the Top 7, there’s a glut of guys who could be ranked in pretty much any order depending on what you value that are all pretty much in the C+ range. The rest of my list goes…

 

8) OF Brett Jackson – Unless he suffers a complete meltdown or proceeds to destroy the Northwest League for the rest of the season, I’m not moving him from here. We’ll see how he looks when he faces better pitching. The lack of power is curious, though. C+

 

9) P Ryan Searle – Been inconsistent with Daytona, but he has fantastic sink and has been getting results despite his youth. His attitude is worrisome, but if he can develop, yikes. C+

 

10) IF Ryan Flaherty – If you look past his batting average, he’s been putting up good numbers in Peoria. I maintain he’s run into some bad luck and is due for a turnaround, especially considering he was drafted primarily for his bat. C+

 

Other names I’d consider in the C+ range:

 

2B Tony Thomas (went completely into the toilet after a hot streak, but has great tools)

IF Junior Lake (fantastic abilities across the board, but needs to produce)

OF Brandon Guyer (hard times in Tennessee, good times in Daytona)

OF Tyler Colvin (injuries have really hurt him this season)

OF Kyler Burke (iffy on him, but he’s doing reasonably well in Peoria and age-appropriate)

P Chris Archer (producing, but needs better control and needs to get bumped to Daytona)

P Dan McDaniel (inconsistent, but excellent repertoire)

P Casey Coleman (limited upside, good production and intangibles)

P Jeff Beliveau (loving everything but the walks)

P Dae-Eun Rhee (Holding back on ranking him until he’s healthy)

[toonsterwu]

I've been toying around with a top 30 list in my spare time. Right now, my top 10 would sit something like

 

1. Josh Vitters, B+.

2a. Andrew Cashner, B/B+.

2b. Jay Jackson, B/B+.

4. Starlin Castro, B.

5. Chris Carpenter, B-.

6. Hak-ju Lee, B-.

7. Brett Jackson, B-/C+.

 

I think most people largely agree on that top 7, now that Samardzija is off the charts. The last 3 spots could honestly be filled by about 20 people, with various different arguments possible, from readiness assets to potential to floor, and so forth. Right now, I think I'm leaning

 

8. Ryan Flaherty, C+/B-.

9. Ryan Searle, C+/B-.

10. DJ LeMahieu, C+/B-.

 

That said, still toying around and still some season left to go. I think there's going to be a deep crop of guys where you can make a "C+" argument (obviously, depends on how each individual grades, but speaking generally right now). Actually, I think I could make a case for 11-20 to be all C+'s, although that's way to positive.

 

That said, rankings are simply for fun and discussion.

 

___________________

 

Btw, I believe that was O_O's list from a couple weeks ago. Not sure if anything has changed for him.

[Outshined_One]

i saw this listed on bleed cubbie blue, was it you outshined one??

 

As things stand now...

This system has taken a substantial step forward compared to last season. Right now, we’re probably hovering around average/slightly below average compared to other farm systems. It seems like the Cubs have four guys who could crack the Top 100 depending on how they continue to develop. Last year’s draft was a huge boon to the system and the international signings have continued to contribute. The key to the continuing growth of the system is going to come from this year’s draft. There are some intriguing names, but the Cubs need to make a few more signings before I consider this draft a success. Getting Jackson, LeMahieu, and Kirk signed was great, but adding guys like Raley, Burruel, Sheppard, and Whaley would really, really help.

 

My list hasn’t changed much since last doing this. So, without further adieu…

 

1) 3B Josh Vitters – Duh. He’s had some struggles in Daytona, but give the guy time before jumping down his throat. [Rant]The problem with the internet and minor league baseball is that everyone wants production now now now now now!!! Guys take time to develop. They have a learning curve. Vitters being streaky as a 20 year old doesn’t make him the next C-Patt, Harvey, Dopirak, etc. It means he’s still developing and growing. Be patient and look to the long run, rather than latch onto the latest flavor of the month. If he’s the next big flop, we sure as heck won’t find out this year and most likely won’t find out next year, either.[/end rant] A-

 

2) P Jay Jackson – There’s a lot to like with him and he has a lot to offer. Not much to say about him. B+/A-

 

3) SS Starlin Castro – The errors are a bit worrying, but everything else is quite promising. I’ve heard elsewhere that his problems have come on routine plays, rather than on hard ones, which is a promising sign. Having someone Castro’s age do what he’s doing in Daytona is quite excellent. B+

 

4) P Andrew Cashner: His stock has been on the rise lately with some excellent outings in Tennessee. He was drafted for his fastball-slider combo, but apparently he’s had some issues with the slider this season and has been relying on a changeup that’s working out pretty well for him. The biggest problem with him in my mind is whether he can handle a rotation workload. Next season will answer that question, but a strong finish to this season would be welcome. B+/B

 

I’d put a decent-sized gap here after these four. There’s still talent from here on out, but a lot of it is either unpolished, inconsistent, or needs to work on some particularly worrying flaw.

 

5) P Jeff Samardzija – Nothing more to say about him. B/B-

 

6) P Chris Carpenter – The injury history and walks scare me, but he’s got middle of the rotation stuff and has had very good results. I’m hoping his scratch tonight was nothing. B/B-

 

7) SS Hak-Ju Lee – I’m loving his production down in Boise. He’s got excellent upside and has shown very good speed and defense thus far. Still, he has a long way to go and his lack of power might be an issue down the line. B-

 

I’d put another gap here. After the Top 7, there’s a glut of guys who could be ranked in pretty much any order depending on what you value that are all pretty much in the C+ range. The rest of my list goes…

 

8) OF Brett Jackson – Unless he suffers a complete meltdown or proceeds to destroy the Northwest League for the rest of the season, I’m not moving him from here. We’ll see how he looks when he faces better pitching. The lack of power is curious, though. C+

 

9) P Ryan Searle – Been inconsistent with Daytona, but he has fantastic sink and has been getting results despite his youth. His attitude is worrisome, but if he can develop, yikes. C+

 

10) IF Ryan Flaherty – If you look past his batting average, he’s been putting up good numbers in Peoria. I maintain he’s run into some bad luck and is due for a turnaround, especially considering he was drafted primarily for his bat. C+

 

Other names I’d consider in the C+ range:

 

2B Tony Thomas (went completely into the toilet after a hot streak, but has great tools)

IF Junior Lake (fantastic abilities across the board, but needs to produce)

OF Brandon Guyer (hard times in Tennessee, good times in Daytona)

OF Tyler Colvin (injuries have really hurt him this season)

OF Kyler Burke (iffy on him, but he’s doing reasonably well in Peoria and age-appropriate)

P Chris Archer (producing, but needs better control and needs to get bumped to Daytona)

P Dan McDaniel (inconsistent, but excellent repertoire)

P Casey Coleman (limited upside, good production and intangibles)

P Jeff Beliveau (loving everything but the walks)

P Dae-Eun Rhee (Holding back on ranking him until he’s healthy)

 

Yep! That was a few weeks ago, I believe. I'll tweak it again at season's end, but right now I'd probably do the following...

 

-Vitters from A- to B+ due to the recurrence of his hand injury. His injury history is starting to become worrying. I'd still keep him at #1, though.

-Probably will end up giving out additional B+ grades to Jay Jackson, Starlin Castro, and Andrew Cashner in that order if they all keep producing.

-Drop Samardzija off the list due to losing his rookie eligibility.

-Put Carpenter at B- unless he finishes the season strong in AA. He could rise to a B.

-Keep the next few Haku-Ju Lee-Brett Jackson-Ryan Searle-Ryan Flaherty.

-Maaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaybe bump Brett Jackson from a C+ to a B- if he continues doing well in Peoria.

-At #10...geez, that's a really hard one. Maybe Kyler Burke? My gut is that #10 will be occupied by a 2009 draftee, perhaps Kirk or Raley. We'll see about that one.

[dew1679666265]

There are some intriguing names, but the Cubs need to make a few more signings before I consider this draft a success. Getting Jackson, LeMahieu, and Kirk signed was great, but adding guys like Raley, Burruel, Sheppard, and Whaley would really, really help.

 

Just letting you know, the Cubs have signed Raley and Burruel.

[Outshined_One]

There are some intriguing names, but the Cubs need to make a few more signings before I consider this draft a success. Getting Jackson, LeMahieu, and Kirk signed was great, but adding guys like Raley, Burruel, Sheppard, and Whaley would really, really help.

 

Just letting you know, the Cubs have signed Raley and Burruel.

 

That was my comment from a few weeks ago. I'm still holding out hope that the Cubs can get Sheppard and Whaley.

[Guest]

There are some intriguing names, but the Cubs need to make a few more signings before I consider this draft a success. Getting Jackson, LeMahieu, and Kirk signed was great, but adding guys like Raley, Burruel, Sheppard, and Whaley would really, really help.

 

Just letting you know, the Cubs have signed Raley and Burruel.

 

That was a re-post of something Outshined_One said pre-Raley and Burruel signings.

[dew1679666265]

There are some intriguing names, but the Cubs need to make a few more signings before I consider this draft a success. Getting Jackson, LeMahieu, and Kirk signed was great, but adding guys like Raley, Burruel, Sheppard, and Whaley would really, really help.

 

Just letting you know, the Cubs have signed Raley and Burruel.

 

That was a re-post of something Outshined_One said pre-Raley and Burruel signings.

 

Yep, now I get it. Sorry about that.

[toonsterwu]

There are some intriguing names, but the Cubs need to make a few more signings before I consider this draft a success. Getting Jackson, LeMahieu, and Kirk signed was great, but adding guys like Raley, Burruel, Sheppard, and Whaley would really, really help.

 

Just letting you know, the Cubs have signed Raley and Burruel.

 

That was my comment from a few weeks ago. I'm still holding out hope that the Cubs can get Sheppard and Whaley.

 

Those are the only two major ones left, right?

[davell]

Nah, Keenyn Walker and Chad Taylor are definitely guys that are major overslots. Taylor has already turned us down though, not sure if we are still trying anything with him or not. Eric Erickson is a guy that I've had my eye on, seems like someone who could easily go out next year and improve his stock with a solid year. Maybe, we see enough in him now to give him the money he wants now...... Andrew Clark appears to want major overslot money too.

[Outshined_One]

Nah, Keenyn Walker and Chad Taylor are definitely guys that are major overslots. Taylor has already turned us down though, not sure if we are still trying anything with him or not. Eric Erickson is a guy that I've had my eye on, seems like someone who could easily go out next year and improve his stock with a solid year. Maybe, we see enough in him now to give him the money he wants now...... Andrew Clark appears to want major overslot money too.

 

Esquivel reportedly has a strong commitment...I want to say with Kansas State? Reportedly, he'd be incredibly difficult to pry away.

[Guest]

Nah, Keenyn Walker and Chad Taylor are definitely guys that are major overslots. Taylor has already turned us down though, not sure if we are still trying anything with him or not. Eric Erickson is a guy that I've had my eye on, seems like someone who could easily go out next year and improve his stock with a solid year. Maybe, we see enough in him now to give him the money he wants now...... Andrew Clark appears to want major overslot money too.

 

Esquivel reportedly has a strong commitment...I want to say with Kansas State? Reportedly, he'd be incredibly difficult to pry away.

 

Yeah, Kansas State.