Chicago Sports Webio

[Guest]

He's still an idiot, but how many hot dog vendors become millionaire radio stars for the better part of a decade. It's not just luck.

 

Why not?

 

He may of got a lucky break, but at some point you have to marketable, and he has been to warrant a contract that paid him 1.5 million a year. Is that pure luck?

I never listened to this guy It doesn't take talent to talk and think like your idiot listeners. It takes talent to get people to listen to you that don't think like you. I don't know if North was able to do that, if he was...

[Banedon]

He's still an idiot, but how many hot dog vendors become millionaire radio stars for the better part of a decade. It's not just luck.

 

Why not?

 

He may of got a lucky break, but at some point you have to marketable, and he has been to warrant a contract that paid him 1.5 million a year. Is that pure luck?

I never listened to this guy It doesn't take talent to talk and think like your idiot listeners. It takes talent to get people to listen to you that don't think like you. I don't know if North was able to do that, if he was...

 

He wouldn't have gotten a $1.5 million contract from a local sports talk radio station if he wasn't delivering ratings.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

He wouldn't have gotten a $1.5 million contract from a local sports talk radio station if he wasn't delivering ratings.

 

Would Dusty Baker have gotten a huge major-league contract if he wasn't delivering the wins?

 

Sometimes, being in the right place when good things happen can convince people that you made the good things happen.

[Banedon]

He wouldn't have gotten a $1.5 million contract from a local sports talk radio station if he wasn't delivering ratings.

 

Would Dusty Baker have gotten a huge major-league contract if he wasn't delivering the wins?

 

Sometimes, being in the right place when good things happen can convince people that you made the good things happen.

 

Dusty had a team full of good players that delivered wins. Mike North was the only guy on the radio...ok he shared time with some other guys that failed with other pairings...Buffone...Huebner...Jiggetts. People didn't listen because he had a kick butt producer or something. That's a terrible comparison.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

Dusty had a team full of good players that delivered wins. Mike North was the only guy on the radio...ok he shared time with some other guys that failed with other pairings...Buffone...Huebner...Jiggetts. People didn't listen because he had a kick butt producer or something. That's a terrible comparison.

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but he was handed the midday slot from the very beginning of WSCR. It's possible that a lot of guys could have been pulling in ratings taking that slot for that station at that time.

[SouthSideRyan]

North wasn't even pulling in great ratings. The 1.5M contract was absurd the second it was signed.

[C.C.]

Dusty had a team full of good players that delivered wins. Mike North was the only guy on the radio...ok he shared time with some other guys that failed with other pairings...Buffone...Huebner...Jiggetts. People didn't listen because he had a kick butt producer or something. That's a terrible comparison.

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but he was handed the midday slot from the very beginning of WSCR. It's possible that a lot of guys could have been pulling in ratings taking that slot for that station at that time.

 

He was arguably the most famous name in Chicago radio for over a decade. Love him or hate him he was popular and you had a strong opinion of him.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

He was arguably the most famous name in Chicago radio for over a decade. Love him or hate him he was popular and you had a strong opinion of him.

 

I honestly don't have a strong opinion of him. I'm just taking issue with the "results mean talent" assumption. It's wrong as often as it's right.

[C.C.]

He was arguably the most famous name in Chicago radio for over a decade. Love him or hate him he was popular and you had a strong opinion of him.

 

I honestly don't have a strong opinion of him. I'm just taking issue with the "results mean talent" assumption. It's wrong as often as it's right.

 

Define Talent?

[Hairyducked Idiot]

Define Talent?

 

Innate attributes that caused the desired result (in this case, ratings).

 

I'm not convinced that a lot of people couldn't have pulled in serious ratings by being the WSCR midday guy from the beginning.

[Banedon]

Dusty had a team full of good players that delivered wins. Mike North was the only guy on the radio...ok he shared time with some other guys that failed with other pairings...Buffone...Huebner...Jiggetts. People didn't listen because he had a kick butt producer or something. That's a terrible comparison.

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but he was handed the midday slot from the very beginning of WSCR. It's possible that a lot of guys could have been pulling in ratings taking that slot for that station at that time.

 

I don't have the ratings info to really be able to debate this with any facts backing me up, but the midday slot has been problematic since North left it though, so clearly it's not an "anybody can do it" situation.

 

BTW...I hate you all for making me defend Mike North in any way.

[C.C.]

Define Talent?

 

Innate attributes that caused the desired result (in this case, ratings).

 

I'm not convinced that a lot of people couldn't have pulled in serious ratings by being the WSCR midday guy from the beginning.

 

Possibly. But we'll never know, and you can't assume they could because it never happened. We have to stick with what we know.

Edited June 15, 2009 by C.C.

[C.C.]

Dusty had a team full of good players that delivered wins. Mike North was the only guy on the radio...ok he shared time with some other guys that failed with other pairings...Buffone...Huebner...Jiggetts. People didn't listen because he had a kick butt producer or something. That's a terrible comparison.

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but he was handed the midday slot from the very beginning of WSCR. It's possible that a lot of guys could have been pulling in ratings taking that slot for that station at that time.

 

I don't have the ratings info to really be able to debate this with any facts backing me up, but the midday slot has been problematic since North left it though, so clearly it's not an "anybody can do it" situation.

 

BTW...I hate you all for making me defend Mike North in any way.

 

Yes, this! I'd rather defend Michael Bay.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

Define Talent?

 

Innate attributes that caused the desired result (in this case, ratings).

 

I'm not convinced that a lot of people couldn't have pulled in serious ratings by being the WSCR midday guy from the beginning.

 

Possibly. But we'll never know and you can't assume they could because it never happened. We have to stick with what we know.

 

True, but we don't have to make positive conclusions based on what we know. As is so often the case, we can't assume causation just because there's correlation.

 

Assuming North caused the ratings is to me the same sort of thinking that leads to RBIs being a skill and Baker being baseball's best manager. (Not exactly the same, because we have actual evidence against the two baseball-related ones.)

 

I'll let it go at that, because no one should be forced to defend Mike North :)

Edited June 15, 2009 by Hairyducked Idiot

[jersey cubs fan]

He was arguably the most famous name in Chicago radio for over a decade.

 

That's probably not true. Sports radio is a niche market.

 

But what does any of this have to do with his level of shrewdness? He was the right guy in the right place at the right time. He wasn't shrewd, he is an idiot. Idiots can be popular and make lots of money in a short period of time, and once you have popularity and money, it's a lot easier to keep making money, but the guy is an idiot who hasn't had success since an ill-advised contract expired. Where is the evidence that he is shrewd?

[jersey cubs fan]

Dusty had a team full of good players that delivered wins. Mike North was the only guy on the radio...ok he shared time with some other guys that failed with other pairings...Buffone...Huebner...Jiggetts. People didn't listen because he had a kick butt producer or something. That's a terrible comparison.

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but he was handed the midday slot from the very beginning of WSCR. It's possible that a lot of guys could have been pulling in ratings taking that slot for that station at that time.

 

I don't have the ratings info to really be able to debate this with any facts backing me up, but the midday slot has been problematic since North left it though, so clearly it's not an "anybody can do it" situation.

 

BTW...I hate you all for making me defend Mike North in any way.

 

Nobody is making you defend the guy. You don't have to claim he's shrewd. There's no evidence to suggest he is shrewd. He enjoyed success in what was a quickly growing business. But it's not like he invented or perfected it.

 

The guy who is shrewd is the guy who realized he could make money by putting an idiot like North on the air.

[Banedon]

He was arguably the most famous name in Chicago radio for over a decade.

 

That's probably not true. Sports radio is a niche market.

 

But what does any of this have to do with his level of shrewdness? He was the right guy in the right place at the right time. He wasn't shrewd, he is an idiot. Idiots can be popular and make lots of money in a short period of time, and once you have popularity and money, it's a lot easier to keep making money, but the guy is an idiot who hasn't had success since an ill-advised contract expired. Where is the evidence that he is shrewd?

 

The 5 year $1.5 million contract is the evidence for me. The guy negotiated a ridiculous contract for what is, like you just said, a niche market. It's local sports radio...yes, it's Chicago, so "local" is a pretty decent size, but at the time, they weren't web broadcasting or anything, so it was a very limited audience. Maybe I have a misconception of local talk radio salaries, and maybe this wasn't that out of line from other personalities, but that's my "evidence".

[C.C.]

 

Assuming North caused the ratings is to me the same sort of thinking that leads to RBIs being a skill and Baker being baseball's best manager. (Not exactly the same, because we have actual evidence against the two baseball-related ones.)

 

 

You lost me there... Those aren't really comparable.

 

 

I'll let it go at that, because no one should be forced to defend Mike North :)

 

Good.

[jersey cubs fan]

He was arguably the most famous name in Chicago radio for over a decade.

 

That's probably not true. Sports radio is a niche market.

 

But what does any of this have to do with his level of shrewdness? He was the right guy in the right place at the right time. He wasn't shrewd, he is an idiot. Idiots can be popular and make lots of money in a short period of time, and once you have popularity and money, it's a lot easier to keep making money, but the guy is an idiot who hasn't had success since an ill-advised contract expired. Where is the evidence that he is shrewd?

 

The 5 year $1.5 million contract is the evidence for me. The guy negotiated a ridiculous contract for what is, like you just said, a niche market. It's local sports radio...yes, it's Chicago, so "local" is a pretty decent size, but at the time, they weren't web broadcasting or anything, so it was a very limited audience. Maybe I have a misconception of local talk radio salaries, and maybe this wasn't that out of line from other personalities, but that's my "evidence".

 

7 figure radio contracts are not at all abnormal. People get them quite frequently, and the good ones keep getting them. You don't have to be particularly shrewd to get them, you just have to get a large audience.

[C.C.]

He was arguably the most famous name in Chicago radio for over a decade.

 

That's probably not true. Sports radio is a niche market.

 

But what does any of this have to do with his level of shrewdness? He was the right guy in the right place at the right time. He wasn't shrewd, he is an idiot. Idiots can be popular and make lots of money in a short period of time, and once you have popularity and money, it's a lot easier to keep making money, but the guy is an idiot who hasn't had success since an ill-advised contract expired. Where is the evidence that he is shrewd?

 

The 5 year $1.5 million contract is the evidence for me. The guy negotiated a ridiculous contract for what is, like you just said, a niche market. It's local sports radio...yes, it's Chicago, so "local" is a pretty decent size, but at the time, they weren't web broadcasting or anything, so it was a very limited audience. Maybe I have a misconception of local talk radio salaries, and maybe this wasn't that out of line from other personalities, but that's my "evidence".

 

7 figure radio contracts are not at all abnormal. People get them quite frequently, and the good ones keep getting them. You don't have to be particularly shrewd to get them, you just have to get a large audience.

 

How many Chicago sports radio guys got a 7 figure deal? I don't think anyone besides North. I could be wrong though...

[Banedon]

He was arguably the most famous name in Chicago radio for over a decade.

 

That's probably not true. Sports radio is a niche market.

 

But what does any of this have to do with his level of shrewdness? He was the right guy in the right place at the right time. He wasn't shrewd, he is an idiot. Idiots can be popular and make lots of money in a short period of time, and once you have popularity and money, it's a lot easier to keep making money, but the guy is an idiot who hasn't had success since an ill-advised contract expired. Where is the evidence that he is shrewd?

 

The 5 year $1.5 million contract is the evidence for me. The guy negotiated a ridiculous contract for what is, like you just said, a niche market. It's local sports radio...yes, it's Chicago, so "local" is a pretty decent size, but at the time, they weren't web broadcasting or anything, so it was a very limited audience. Maybe I have a misconception of local talk radio salaries, and maybe this wasn't that out of line from other personalities, but that's my "evidence".

 

7 figure radio contracts are not at all abnormal. People get them quite frequently, and the good ones keep getting them. You don't have to be particularly shrewd to get them, you just have to get a large audience.

 

For sports talk radio? In Chicago?

 

THE AIR UP THERE (Radio personalities who make more than $1 million; source: Robert Feder, Chicago Sun-Times)

Spike O'Dell

Morning host, WGN 720 AM

 

Ed Volkman ("Eddie")

Morning host, WBBM 96.3 FM

 

Joe Bohannon ("JoBo")

Morning host, WBBM 96.3 FM

 

Jonathon Brandmeier ("Johnny B.")

Morning host, WLUP 97.9 FM

 

Eric Ferguson

Morning host, WTMX 101.9 FM

 

Mike North

Morning host, WSCR 670 AM

 

Roe Conn

Afternoon host, WLS 890 AM

 

Steve Dahl

Afternoon host, WCKG 105.9 FM

 

 

http://www.chicagomag.com/Chicago-Magazine/April-2007/Money-in-Chicago-2007/Who-Makes-What-Salaries-List/

 

That info is from 2007, but that's 4 years after he signed that deal, and there's still no other sports talk guys on there.

[jersey cubs fan]

That info is from 2007, but that's 4 years after he signed that deal, and there's still no other sports talk guys on there.

 

And neither is North. Wouldn't it make more sense to think he got lucky with perfect timing that one time than think he's some sort of shrewd businessmen and that it's shocking he would get involved with a fraudulant huckster's scam? I don't understand how somebody could think Mike North is shrewd, and be surprised that a venture he was involved in starting came to a crashing hault months into it's existence. I mean, it actually makes more sense to me that the only type of person that would actually hire a guy like Mike North as an "executive" at his company is somebody who declared bankrupty multiple times. Seriously, if he was shrewd, why would he even get involved with somebody like that?

[C.C.]

That info is from 2007, but that's 4 years after he signed that deal, and there's still no other sports talk guys on there.

 

And neither is North. Wouldn't it make more sense to think he got lucky with perfect timing that one time than think he's some sort of shrewd businessmen and that it's shocking he would get involved with a fraudulant huckster's scam? I don't understand how somebody could think Mike North is shrewd, and be surprised that a venture he was involved in starting came to a crashing hault months into it's existence. I mean, it actually makes more sense to me that the only type of person that would actually hire a guy like Mike North as an "executive" at his company is somebody who declared bankrupty multiple times. Seriously, if he was shrewd, why would he even get involved with somebody like that?

 

There's a boat load of shrewd business men/woman who got involved with Bernard Madoff...

[SouthSideRyan]

That info is from 2007, but that's 4 years after he signed that deal, and there's still no other sports talk guys on there.

 

And neither is North. Wouldn't it make more sense to think he got lucky with perfect timing that one time than think he's some sort of shrewd businessmen and that it's shocking he would get involved with a fraudulant huckster's scam? I don't understand how somebody could think Mike North is shrewd, and be surprised that a venture he was involved in starting came to a crashing hault months into it's existence. I mean, it actually makes more sense to me that the only type of person that would actually hire a guy like Mike North as an "executive" at his company is somebody who declared bankrupty multiple times. Seriously, if he was shrewd, why would he even get involved with somebody like that?

 

There's a boat load of shrewd business men/woman who got involved with Bernard Madoff...

 

That's not really comparable.

[Banedon]

Wouldn't it make more sense to think he got lucky with perfect timing that one time than think he's some sort of shrewd businessmen and that it's shocking he would get involved with a fraudulant huckster's scam?

 

Well yes, with the benefit of hindsight that's a much easier conclusion to come to...

 

I don't understand how somebody could think Mike North is shrewd, and be surprised that a venture he was involved in starting came to a crashing hault months into it's existence.

 

Really? You don't understand how someone that thinks that North is shrewd would be surprised when he made a terrible business decision?

 

I mean, it actually makes more sense to me that the only type of person that would actually hire a guy like Mike North as an "executive" at his company is somebody who declared bankrupty multiple times.

 

WSCR offered him a renewal contract of $700-900k, so it's not like he was unhireable.

 

Seriously, if he was shrewd, why would he even get involved with somebody like that?

 

Yeah, that was the question I originally asked! lol

 

My whole point was that maybe he's not quite as shrewd as he once was, or at least as he may have appeared. Because this clearly was a pretty poor decision.