Phillies sign Ibanez- 3/30

[AZCub]

This is great news because Ibanez will command more $$ than Bradley will, and only landed $10mil/year. This sets the market for us and it fits our payroll perfectly. I love it.

 

You'd think he'd get more, but this market is not all that cut and dried and you just never know who is going to get what.

 

In terms of talent? Yes. But he won’t get more. His injury history is too vast and his mental baggage history too scary to command more than Ibanez just received. I just can't see it happening. Stranger things have certainly happened though.

[jersey cubs fan]

This is great news because Ibanez will command more $$ than Bradley will, and only landed $10mil/year. This sets the market for us and it fits our payroll perfectly. I love it.

 

You'd think he'd get more, but this market is not all that cut and dried and you just never know who is going to get what.

 

In terms of talent? Yes. But he won’t get more. His injury history is too vast and his mental baggage history too scary to command more than Ibanez just received. I just can't see it happening. Stranger things have certainly happened though.

 

I should have clarified that what I meant is you'd think Ibanez would get more, because of Bradley's issues, but you never no.

[jersey cubs fan]

Defense fluctuates a lot, but Fukudome is clearly a plus defender and Ibanez is clearly a minus defender. Both by a fairly decent margin.

 

And it's also clear that it's just the opposite with the bat, the far more important part of their games. My point is people are making huge assumptions about the exact nature of the difference with their gloves.

[AZCub]

This is great news because Ibanez will command more $$ than Bradley will, and only landed $10mil/year. This sets the market for us and it fits our payroll perfectly. I love it.

 

You'd think he'd get more, but this market is not all that cut and dried and you just never know who is going to get what.

 

In terms of talent? Yes. But he won’t get more. His injury history is too vast and his mental baggage history too scary to command more than Ibanez just received. I just can't see it happening. Stranger things have certainly happened though.

 

I should have clarified that what I meant is you'd think Ibanez would get more, because of Bradley's issues, but you never no.

 

 

Ahh, I follow you now.

 

It could happen still, sure. His talent is obviously greater than Ibanez...I'm just hoping that his mental instability comes with a Dr. Phil discount.

 

One of the reasons I am glad DeRosa is still around is A.) IF we sign Bradley, there's our insurance policy, and B.) DeRosa and D-Lee are great clubhouse guys that could provide some hope in controlling this clown.

[jersey cubs fan]

One of the reasons I am glad DeRosa is still around is A.) IF we sign Bradley, there's our insurance policy, and B.) DeRosa and D-Lee are great clubhouse guys that could provide some hope in controlling this clown.

 

I would doubt very much that Derosa would have any sort of positive clubhouse effect on Bradley.

[davearm2]

Defense fluctuates a lot, but Fukudome is clearly a plus defender and Ibanez is clearly a minus defender. Both by a fairly decent margin.

 

And it's also clear that it's just the opposite with the bat, the far more important part of their games. My point is people are making huge assumptions about the exact nature of the difference with their gloves.

The nature of the difference is easy to describe (one's good, the other's bad), but difficult to quantify in a meaningful way.

 

So while we know it's there, it's hard to pin down the exact magnitude of the difference. One defensive rating system will say one thing, and another something else. Then you're left arguing which rating system is better, and the truth is none have gained broad acceptance yet.

[nilodnayr]

Defense fluctuates a lot, but Fukudome is clearly a plus defender and Ibanez is clearly a minus defender. Both by a fairly decent margin.

 

And it's also clear that it's just the opposite with the bat, the far more important part of their games. My point is people are making huge assumptions about the exact nature of the difference with their gloves.

 

Well, in terms of offense per position, I'd say Ibanez is slightly above average with the bat and Fukudome is pretty decently below average. What assumptions are people making about the difference in their gloves? Both observationally and quantitatively, its ridiculously obvious.

 

In terms of the importance of their defense vs offense, I think that will be one of the next big things studied. Colin just did a quick and dirty at HBT asking the question "is a run saved equal to a run earned"...his answer, was it was pretty darn close.

[UK1679666180]

I think this is an odd move, given the poss. regression of Ibanez unless there are some clubhouse issues that obviously didn't prevent them winning it all or Burrell looking for more, I don't see why Philly went after Ibanez.

 

Their line-up is extremely balanced regardless of Burrell or Ibanez.

 

Rollins

Utley

Howard

Worth

Victorino

 

With those 5 you have two switch-hitters, two lefties and a righty that murders lefties.

 

As far as Ibanez on the Cubs, his bat is a great fit and his defense is bad enough to where they would have to make Soriano a RF'er.

[bdutts]

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=3764268

 

that's a relief

 

 

Why? The guy can rake.

 

He's 36, is expensive, awful on defense, and I wouldn't say an .837 OPS for a corner outfielder is "raking".

 

And yet many around here want Hermida, who put up less than .800 OPS in 2008.

[UK1679666180]

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=3764268

 

that's a relief

 

 

Why? The guy can rake.

 

He's 36, is expensive, awful on defense, and I wouldn't say an .837 OPS for a corner outfielder is "raking".

 

And yet many around here want Hermida, who put up less than .800 OPS in 2008.

 

Comparing Ibanez and Hermida is apples and oranges. Age, salary, talent, defensive position, Hermida's below avg. '08 all favor him as a better option than Ibanez.

[Tracer Bullet]

My point is what I said. It seem pretty obvious to me there's a high likelihood of never seeing "March through June" again.

what makes that so obvious?

 

oh, and i'd also be remiss if i didn't mention Fuku was roughly 5 runs better than Ibanez on the basepaths last year

 

I'm guessing it's obvious to him because Fukudome didn't just hit some rough patches that held down his numbers, but rather he was a complete piece of crap at the plate for months.

 

I don't get why people are thanking god that Ibanez won't be available. He wasn't ideal, but they are more likely than not getting somebody, and they could do a lot worse.

 

$10m for a 40-year-old Ibanez would have probably been the worst payment per year of any of Hendry's signings, that is until Soriano's 40 (or whatever age he'll be in last year of his contract).

 

When all is said and done, I'm not sure we'll be able to nail down the winner of that award.

 

But for what it's worth, Ibanez turned 36 during this season. A 3 year deal won't pay him a dime when he's 40.

 

Sorry, 39. How dare I round up 1 year.

[jersey cubs fan]

My point is what I said. It seem pretty obvious to me there's a high likelihood of never seeing "March through June" again.

what makes that so obvious?

 

oh, and i'd also be remiss if i didn't mention Fuku was roughly 5 runs better than Ibanez on the basepaths last year

 

I'm guessing it's obvious to him because Fukudome didn't just hit some rough patches that held down his numbers, but rather he was a complete piece of crap at the plate for months.

 

I don't get why people are thanking god that Ibanez won't be available. He wasn't ideal, but they are more likely than not getting somebody, and they could do a lot worse.

 

$10m for a 40-year-old Ibanez would have probably been the worst payment per year of any of Hendry's signings, that is until Soriano's 40 (or whatever age he'll be in last year of his contract).

 

When all is said and done, I'm not sure we'll be able to nail down the winner of that award.

 

But for what it's worth, Ibanez turned 36 during this season. A 3 year deal won't pay him a dime when he's 40.

 

Sorry, 39. How dare I round up 1 year.

 

You're so sensitive.

 

I said, for what it's worth. But seriously, who rounds ages? We're talking about a finite number of years these guys play, it's not hard to just use the actual age instead of next highest number that makes my argument look better than it is.

[blangen]

not sure if i've ever posted on here, but i've had an account for some time. i'm speculating bradley signs for 3/33-34 at least, which i'd be fine with. i know the injury and mental history push some teams away, but to be honest, he is flat out scary when healthy. mlbtraderumors had him looking for at least 4/40, but with this market who knows what he'll wind up with.

[17 Seconds]

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=3764268

 

that's a relief

 

 

Why? The guy can rake.

 

He's 36, is expensive, awful on defense, and I wouldn't say an .837 OPS for a corner outfielder is "raking".

 

well, I can understand the age, but he can rake it. I understand you define "rake it" different than I do. So be it.

 

 

Ibanez hit .293 this season, with 23 homers, 110 RBIs, a .358 on-base percentage and a .472 slugging percentage. He is one of just five outfielders who have driven in at least 100 runs in each of the past three seasons. The others: Carlos Beltran, Magglio Ordonez, Carlos Lee and Bobby Abreu.

 

yes because rbis are such a good way to evaluate talent. sorry, a .472 slugging percentage from a corner outfielder isn't raking. he's a good hitter.

 

A good hitter would have certainly been better than Fukudome. I don't think he's incredible or anything, but the comments of "oh thank GOD!" are a little over the top.

 

first of all, i never said "thankg god". second, i don't know why you're comparing him to fukudome. fukudome sucks and is not an option for rf right now (at least not for jim and lou). it's been made very clear that jim is getting a lh rf, and we know who most of the prime candidates are. the other options are better, and that's why i said it's relifer. fukudome doesn't really have anything to do with this conversation.

[17 Seconds]

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=3764268

 

that's a relief

 

 

Why? The guy can rake.

 

He's 36, is expensive, awful on defense, and I wouldn't say an .837 OPS for a corner outfielder is "raking".

 

And yet many around here want Hermida, who put up less than .800 OPS in 2008.

 

possibly the worst comparison ever

[nilodnayr]

not sure if i've ever posted on here, but i've had an account for some time. i'm speculating bradley signs for 3/33-34 at least, which i'd be fine with. i know the injury and mental history push some teams away, but to be honest, he is flat out scary when healthy. mlbtraderumors had him looking for at least 4/40, but with this market who knows what he'll wind up with.

 

Welcome!

[The Other 15]

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=3764268

 

that's a relief

 

 

Why? The guy can rake.

 

He's 36, is expensive, awful on defense, and I wouldn't say an .837 OPS for a corner outfielder is "raking".

 

well, I can understand the age, but he can rake it. I understand you define "rake it" different than I do. So be it.

 

 

Ibanez hit .293 this season, with 23 homers, 110 RBIs, a .358 on-base percentage and a .472 slugging percentage. He is one of just five outfielders who have driven in at least 100 runs in each of the past three seasons. The others: Carlos Beltran, Magglio Ordonez, Carlos Lee and Bobby Abreu.

 

yes because rbis are such a good way to evaluate talent. sorry, a .472 slugging percentage from a corner outfielder isn't raking. he's a good hitter.

 

Since you qualified your critique of Ibanez as a "corner OF," did you check and see how many corner OF's finished with higher slugging over the last3 years in the AL?

 

2008 - 4 corner OF finished with higher SLG

2007 - 6 corner OF Finished with higher SLG

2006 - 2 corner OF finished with higher SLG

 

Out of 30 (or more) starting corner outfielder in the AL, Ibanez SLG seems to be pretty good,.....from a corner outfielder.