Hall of Fame & Steroids/PEDs

[BigbadB]

The Hall of Fame is a joke, and likely always will be.

[Derwood]

The Hall of Fame is a joke, and likely always will be.

 

just wait until Clemens, Bonds, etc. aren't elected. At that point it should just be shut down

[Soul]

The Hall of Fame is a joke, and likely always will be.

 

just wait until Clemens, Bonds, etc. aren't elected. At that point it should just be shut down

 

They've kept Rose out for something off the field for decades. People still make the pilgrimage to Cooperstown. Trust me, they won't miss Clemens and Bonds one bit.

[Sammy Sofa]

The Hall of Fame is a joke, and likely always will be.

 

just wait until Clemens, Bonds, etc. aren't elected. At that point it should just be shut down

 

They've kept Rose out for something off the field for decades. People still make the pilgrimage to Cooperstown. Trust me, they won't miss Clemens and Bonds one bit.

 

Rose was one guy who willingly and repeatedly broke established rules in baseball. The "steroid era" players are going to keep piling up outside the door despite only a few of them being "caught" after the fact largely through heresay and innuendo for something that wasn't against the rules at the time, all in the face of how they arguably saved the game post-strike.

[Soul]

The Hall of Fame is a joke, and likely always will be.

 

just wait until Clemens, Bonds, etc. aren't elected. At that point it should just be shut down

 

They've kept Rose out for something off the field for decades. People still make the pilgrimage to Cooperstown. Trust me, they won't miss Clemens and Bonds one bit.

 

Rose was one guy who willingly and repeatedly broke established rules in baseball. The "steroid era" players are going to keep piling up outside the door despite only a few of them being "caught" after the fact largely through heresay and innuendo for something that wasn't against the rules at the time, all in the face of how they arguably saved the game post-strike.

 

How many of these guys do we really want in there anyway? Palmiero? Let guys like him pile up outside the door all day, doesn't bother me any. And as for Clemens & Bonds, the funny thing about them is, all they would have had to do is simply acknowledge their mistake. People would forgive. Because people *always* forgive. Same probably would have gone for Rose.

 

...well ok, unless you're Santo and you click your heels. Then CONDEMN AND DAMN YOU TO HELL.

[fromthestretch]

The Hall of Fame is a joke, and likely always will be.

 

just wait until Clemens, Bonds, etc. aren't elected. At that point it should just be shut down

 

They've kept Rose out for something off the field for decades. People still make the pilgrimage to Cooperstown. Trust me, they won't miss Clemens and Bonds one bit.

 

Rose was one guy who willingly and repeatedly broke established rules in baseball. The "steroid era" players are going to keep piling up outside the door despite only a few of them being "caught" after the fact largely through heresay and innuendo for something that wasn't against the rules at the time, all in the face of how they arguably saved the game post-strike.

 

How many of these guys do we really want in there anyway? Palmiero? Let guys like him pile up outside the door all day, doesn't bother me any. And as for Clemens & Bonds, the funny thing about them is, all they would have had to do is simply acknowledge their mistake. People would forgive. Because people *always* forgive. Same probably would have gone for Rose.

 

...well ok, unless you're Santo and you click your heels. Then CONDEMN AND DAMN YOU TO HELL.

 

Considering that the well-publicized punishment for betting on baseball games is lifetime banishment from major league baseball, I'm not sure an apology from Rose would suffice.

[Sammy Sofa]

The Hall of Fame is a joke, and likely always will be.

 

just wait until Clemens, Bonds, etc. aren't elected. At that point it should just be shut down

 

They've kept Rose out for something off the field for decades. People still make the pilgrimage to Cooperstown. Trust me, they won't miss Clemens and Bonds one bit.

 

Rose was one guy who willingly and repeatedly broke established rules in baseball. The "steroid era" players are going to keep piling up outside the door despite only a few of them being "caught" after the fact largely through heresay and innuendo for something that wasn't against the rules at the time, all in the face of how they arguably saved the game post-strike.

 

How many of these guys do we really want in there anyway? Palmiero?

 

Yeah, that's who I was focusing on and not guys like McGwire, Sosa and Bonds.

[Soul]

The Hall of Fame is a joke, and likely always will be.

 

just wait until Clemens, Bonds, etc. aren't elected. At that point it should just be shut down

 

They've kept Rose out for something off the field for decades. People still make the pilgrimage to Cooperstown. Trust me, they won't miss Clemens and Bonds one bit.

 

Rose was one guy who willingly and repeatedly broke established rules in baseball. The "steroid era" players are going to keep piling up outside the door despite only a few of them being "caught" after the fact largely through heresay and innuendo for something that wasn't against the rules at the time, all in the face of how they arguably saved the game post-strike.

 

How many of these guys do we really want in there anyway? Palmiero?

 

Yeah, that's who I was focusing on and not guys like McGwire, Sosa and Bonds.

 

We'll see what happens when Sammy comes up. There's not the evidence of steroid use that there is with Bonds.

[Careless]

The Hall of Fame is a joke, and likely always will be.

 

just wait until Clemens, Bonds, etc. aren't elected. At that point it should just be shut down

 

They've kept Rose out for something off the field for decades. People still make the pilgrimage to Cooperstown. Trust me, they won't miss Clemens and Bonds one bit.

 

Rose was one guy who willingly and repeatedly broke established rules in baseball. The "steroid era" players are going to keep piling up outside the door despite only a few of them being "caught" after the fact largely through heresay and innuendo for something that wasn't against the rules at the time, all in the face of how they arguably saved the game post-strike.

Steroids were against the rules since you were in elementary school.

 

Steroids were against the rules since you were in elementary school.

 

Steroids were against the rules since you were in elementary school.

 

Steroids were against the rules since you were in elementary school.

 

Steroids were against the rules since you were in elementary school.

 

How many freaking times does this need to be said?

 

(ok, you might be over 25, I'm not really sure about you)

 

Saying "steroids weren't illegal because there was no punishment" is no different from saying "Police searches without warrants are never unconstitutional"

Edited August 5, 2008 by Careless

[Sammy Sofa]

The Hall of Fame is a joke, and likely always will be.

 

just wait until Clemens, Bonds, etc. aren't elected. At that point it should just be shut down

 

They've kept Rose out for something off the field for decades. People still make the pilgrimage to Cooperstown. Trust me, they won't miss Clemens and Bonds one bit.

 

Rose was one guy who willingly and repeatedly broke established rules in baseball. The "steroid era" players are going to keep piling up outside the door despite only a few of them being "caught" after the fact largely through heresay and innuendo for something that wasn't against the rules at the time, all in the face of how they arguably saved the game post-strike.

Steroids were against the rules since you were in elementary school.

 

Steroids were against the rules since you were in elementary school.

 

Steroids were against the rules since you were in elementary school.

 

Steroids were against the rules since you were in elementary school.

 

Steroids were against the rules since you were in elementary school.

 

How many freaking times does this need to be said?

 

Most of the key substances of the steroid era were either banned by MLB after the fact or most of the players accused were "caught" (and I use the term VERY loosely) after the fact.

[Careless]

The Hall of Fame is a joke, and likely always will be.

 

just wait until Clemens, Bonds, etc. aren't elected. At that point it should just be shut down

 

They've kept Rose out for something off the field for decades. People still make the pilgrimage to Cooperstown. Trust me, they won't miss Clemens and Bonds one bit.

 

Rose was one guy who willingly and repeatedly broke established rules in baseball. The "steroid era" players are going to keep piling up outside the door despite only a few of them being "caught" after the fact largely through heresay and innuendo for something that wasn't against the rules at the time, all in the face of how they arguably saved the game post-strike.

Steroids were against the rules since you were in elementary school.

 

Steroids were against the rules since you were in elementary school.

 

Steroids were against the rules since you were in elementary school.

 

Steroids were against the rules since you were in elementary school.

 

Steroids were against the rules since you were in elementary school.

 

How many freaking times does this need to be said?

 

Most of the key substances of the steroid era were either banned by MLB after the fact or most of the players accused were "caught" (and I use the term VERY loosely) after the fact.

No.

[Sammy Sofa]

Yes.

 

Times a jillion.

 

Plus infinity.

 

Punchbuggy yellow.

[Careless]

Yes.

 

Times a jillion.

 

Plus infinity.

 

Punchbuggy yellow.

ok, wallow on in your ignorance. Just please don't try to spread it around again.

[Sammy Sofa]

How about if you have a counterpoint you make it instead of being Cryptic McDickwrappedinanenigmaboxedinariddle?

 

I'm not saying all of it was OK in baseball, but most of these guys were "busted" after the fact, and most of those non-conclusively. It's diversionary BS.

Edited August 5, 2008 by Sammy Sofa

[Careless]

How about if you have a counterpoint you make it instead of being Cryptic McDickwrappedinanenigmaboxedinariddle?

 

I'm not saying all of it was OK in baseball, but most of these guys were "busted" after the fact, and most of those non-conclusively. It's diversionary BS.

I've said it before. It's getting really irritating that people keep repeating this stupid meme that things weren't against the rules since Bush I was president. It reflects horribly upon the sports journalists who covered this originally, and it's particularly annoying because the best big-exposure treatment of this in recent years seems to have been completely ignored (a 10 or so page ESPN article back around 2004)

 

In 1991, the comish declared all illegal/controlled drugs against the rules. He specifically mentioned steroids and all controlled substances (HGH being something covered by this)

[Sammy Sofa]

How about if you have a counterpoint you make it instead of being Cryptic McDickwrappedinanenigmaboxedinariddle?

 

I'm not saying all of it was OK in baseball, but most of these guys were "busted" after the fact, and most of those non-conclusively. It's diversionary BS.

I've said it before. It's getting really irritating that people keep repeating this stupid meme that things weren't against the rules since Bush I was president. It reflects horribly upon the sports journalists who covered this originally, and it's particularly annoying because the best big-exposure treatment of this in recent years seems to have been completely ignored (a 10 or so page ESPN article back around 2004)

 

In 1991, the comish declared all illegal/controlled drugs against the rules. He specifically mentioned steroids and all controlled substances (HGH being something covered by this)

 

Interesting. I had no idea Vincent did that. Why did Selig seemingly have to start from scratch? Something about Vincent's notice/memo must have been solid enough, otherwise Selig could have just used it as precedent.

 

That said, not everything these guys were accused of using was always illegal during the steroids era.

[Vanilla Ice]

Also, they were against the law

[Sammy Sofa]

Also, they were against the law

 

OK, then nobody who has ever broken the law can get into the HOF.

 

Whoops.

[OleMissCub]

Also, they were against the law

 

OK, then nobody who has ever broken the law can get into the HOF.

 

Whoops.

 

Hell, even The Babe was arrested several times.

[fromthestretch]

Also, they were against the law

 

I've posted this before, but I find it interesting when discussing steroid use:

 

http://www.baseballmusings.com/archives/008374.php

[Sammy Sofa]

In 1991, the comish declared all illegal/controlled drugs against the rules. He specifically mentioned steroids and all controlled substances (HGH being something covered by this)

 

Interesting. I had no idea Vincent did that. Why did Selig seemingly have to start from scratch? Something about Vincent's notice/memo must have been solid enough, otherwise Selig could have just used it as precedent.

 

Does anyone have an asnwer for this? I'm not tryin to pick a fight...it really doesn't make any sense to me why Vincent's memo wouldn't hae been used as some kind of precedent.

[Derwood]

In 1991, the comish declared all illegal/controlled drugs against the rules. He specifically mentioned steroids and all controlled substances (HGH being something covered by this)

 

Interesting. I had no idea Vincent did that. Why did Selig seemingly have to start from scratch? Something about Vincent's notice/memo must have been solid enough, otherwise Selig could have just used it as precedent.

 

Does anyone have an asnwer for this? I'm not tryin to pick a fight...it really doesn't make any sense to me why Vincent's memo wouldn't hae been used as some kind of precedent.

 

wasn't the disconnect that while the league said PED's were against the rules, the MLBPA wouldn't budge on testing for it, basically making the rule unenforceable?

[Sammy Sofa]

In 1991, the comish declared all illegal/controlled drugs against the rules. He specifically mentioned steroids and all controlled substances (HGH being something covered by this)

 

Interesting. I had no idea Vincent did that. Why did Selig seemingly have to start from scratch? Something about Vincent's notice/memo must have been solid enough, otherwise Selig could have just used it as precedent.

 

Does anyone have an asnwer for this? I'm not tryin to pick a fight...it really doesn't make any sense to me why Vincent's memo wouldn't hae been used as some kind of precedent.

 

wasn't the disconnect that while the league said PED's were against the rules, the MLBPA wouldn't budge on testing for it, basically making the rule unenforceable?

 

So does that mean Vincent's memo was basically moot and meaningless?

[Derwood]

In 1991, the comish declared all illegal/controlled drugs against the rules. He specifically mentioned steroids and all controlled substances (HGH being something covered by this)

 

Interesting. I had no idea Vincent did that. Why did Selig seemingly have to start from scratch? Something about Vincent's notice/memo must have been solid enough, otherwise Selig could have just used it as precedent.

 

Does anyone have an asnwer for this? I'm not tryin to pick a fight...it really doesn't make any sense to me why Vincent's memo wouldn't hae been used as some kind of precedent.

 

wasn't the disconnect that while the league said PED's were against the rules, the MLBPA wouldn't budge on testing for it, basically making the rule unenforceable?

 

So does that mean Vincent's memo was basically moot and meaningless?

 

i'm sure it was well-intentioned. i don't know the history of the commissionership (word?) well enough to know who let the union have so much power

[Sammy Sofa]

In 1991, the comish declared all illegal/controlled drugs against the rules. He specifically mentioned steroids and all controlled substances (HGH being something covered by this)

 

Interesting. I had no idea Vincent did that. Why did Selig seemingly have to start from scratch? Something about Vincent's notice/memo must have been solid enough, otherwise Selig could have just used it as precedent.

 

Does anyone have an asnwer for this? I'm not tryin to pick a fight...it really doesn't make any sense to me why Vincent's memo wouldn't hae been used as some kind of precedent.

 

wasn't the disconnect that while the league said PED's were against the rules, the MLBPA wouldn't budge on testing for it, basically making the rule unenforceable?

 

So does that mean Vincent's memo was basically moot and meaningless?

 

i'm sure it was well-intentioned. i don't know the history of the commissionership (word?) well enough to know who let the union have so much power

 

I'm really curious about this now since it seems like such a action would have meant a lot more over the last 10 years, but this is the first I've heard of it.