MacPhail: Deal is dead (p. 297), stop posting, go outside

[Guest]

Second, you can label it is "old timey" or whatever other snide putdown you can come up with, but the idea of putting a guy with a good OBP and speed at the top of the lineup to be a "leadoff hitter" is in fact a position and fills a role on the team. With a guy that steals 50 bases a year, that is the equivalent of taking 50 singles and making them doubles. Unfortunately that doesn't factor into his OPS so that you can compare OPS cleanly. Murton provides very little stolen bases. Further, a leadoff hitter is the guy on your team who is going to get the most at bats during a game. What a concept to have a guy that can actually get on base and make things happen.

 

Finally, I agree with you on Pie.

Actually, it's not the same as turning singles into doubles. Doubles also have the benefit of driving in additional runs beyond what singles do.

 

Also, if you're going to list that benefit, you also have to take away the outs from his CS as a negative.

 

Fair enough, take away the CS and count the SB as 2B's i'm sure that his OPS would be far superior. In this case Roberts gets CS 14% that is pretty good rate.

Again, you can't just count sb as doubles, though.

 

Apparently statistics aren't full proof? For the exact reasons that your stating. Which was precisely my point.

 

MAJOR PWNAGE!!!!

Yeah, okay...

 

I thought about adding something else to make it seem more sarcastic....but I knew there were consequences either way.

I have a pretty thick skin.

[E.J.]

Baltimore Sun

For the second consecutive winter meetings, the Orioles are involved in serious trade talks involving second baseman Brian Roberts.

 

This time, it's the Chicago Cubs, a frequent trade partner of the Orioles and a team that needs a left-handed hitter, who are aggressively pursuing Roberts, according to several team sources. As of tonight, no deal appeared imminent and one club source said he believed the winter meetings would end tomorrow morning without the Orioles having dealt any of their players, including Roberts, shortstop Miguel Tejada or ace left-hander Erik Bedard.

 

Although no specifics have been revealed, one baseball source said the Cubs have put a "significant" offer on the table that would include a starting pitcher for Roberts, the Orioles' lone All-Star in 2007.

 

One player in the proposal is believed to be right-handed pitcher Sean Gallagher, who entered last season as the Cubs' fifth-ranked prospect, according to Baseball America. Gallagher, 21, pitched primarily in Double-A during the 2007 season, going 7-2 with a 3.39 ERA in 11 starts. He made eight appearances in relief for the Cubs, allowing 14 earned runs in 14 innings.

 

It's likely the second player in the deal would be a position player, although the Cubs' top prospect, outfielder Felix Pie, is not being offered, according to a team source. One possibility is outfielder Matt Murton, 26, who hit .281 last year with eight home runs and 22 RBIs in 235 at-bats

[brinoch]

Nothing's been out of line yet, but let's keep it civil...

 

yet another case of "let's pile on the newbie". you'd think it would get old (but some people just can't help it)

rchap's not a newbie. He/she just doesn't post much.

 

i realize that, but people put too much into post count as far as whose opinions they do/don't respect

 

There are many people who have more posts than I do. But I think people respect my opinion, and did even before I was a mod.

[BigbadB]

Really -- and the smarter people on the board may dispute this -- it makes sense to stack the order from highest OBP to lowest (very, very simplified reasoning there).

 

I would definitely dispute this. Good hitting isn't just good OBP. SLG factors in there as well. Based on what you just said, Soriano would be the #8 hitter in the line up if each other player in the line up had a better OBP.

[ThePenguin11]

Someone lock this thread, it's gone so far above and beyond its original point.

 

It's funny how trade threads always end up being arguements over semantics. I want to get into the time machine someone was using earlier to listen to Levine so I can skip ahead and see if the trade happens or not.

[erik316wttn]

Getting things back on track...

 

Gallagher and Murton is too expensive for Roberts alone. I'd rather do the Murton for Teahen deal if that's the case.

[BigbadB]

Someone lock this thread, it's gone so far above and beyond its original point.

 

More walruses please.

[E.J.]

Someone lock this thread, it's gone so far above and beyond its original point.

 

More walruses please.

 

post padder.

[Abe Frohman]

Well, I am sure you agree with me that guys with high OB% are best at the top of the order for a few reasons - most importantly they will get the most plate appearances.

 

Guys that are good hitters are best at the top of the order, however they achieve that.

 

Well, to be more concise, I wouldn't bat Adam Dunn at the top of the order.

 

As for the second paragraph, you're almost just saying you want a good hitter to follow every other hitter in your lineup. Which is comparable I think to, "get the best eight hitters regardless of the mold they fit (and get the best hitters the most ABs)."

 

Yeah, that is basically it.

[XZero771679666304]

Getting things back on track...

 

Gallagher and Murton is too expensive for Roberts alone. I'd rather do the Murton for Teahen deal if that's the case.

 

 

I think it will take at least Gallagher and Murton, and I don't think that is particularly unreasonable.

[BigbadB]

Getting things back on track...

 

Gallagher and Murton is too expensive for Roberts alone. I'd rather do the Murton for Teahen deal if that's the case.

 

I was kind of hoping Gallagher was going to be in the rotation next year, so I'm not all that thrilled to see him go. But, I do like Roberts.

[brinoch]

Someone lock this thread, it's gone so far above and beyond its original point.

 

More walruses please.

 

That really was an awesome lolwalrus.

[CUBZ99]

Getting things back on track...

 

Gallagher and Murton is too expensive for Roberts alone. I'd rather do the Murton for Teahen deal if that's the case.

 

It must be Gallagher, Murton and Cedeno. Levine made a guarantee that Cedeno was part of the package. I agree with you though. Personally, I don't want to see Gallagher in any trade this offseason.

[rchap24]

Nothing's been out of line yet, but let's keep it civil...

He is clearly trying to outdue or whatever he think hes doing and make me feel dumb so im sorry if im out of line, but hes really offended

Well, technically it wasn't against the rules of the forum. But I did see what was going on and asked everyone to keep it civil.

k thanks and sorry for the you guys I really didnt mean anything by that just said it. It wasnt aimed at anyone in particular

[Guest]

Nothing's been out of line yet, but let's keep it civil...

He is clearly trying to outdue or whatever he think hes doing and make me feel dumb so im sorry if im out of line, but hes really offended

Well, technically it wasn't against the rules of the forum. But I did see what was going on and asked everyone to keep it civil.

k thanks and sorry for the you guys I really didnt mean anything by that just said it. It wasnt aimed at anyone in particular

No worries.

[BigbadB]

Someone lock this thread, it's gone so far above and beyond its original point.

 

More walruses please.

 

post padder.

 

:-k

[E.J.]

Someone lock this thread, it's gone so far above and beyond its original point.

 

More walruses please.

 

post padder.

 

:-k

 

It was a joke made by O_O in this thread. You'd had to rifle through about 10 pages of crap to find it.

[erik316wttn]

Getting things back on track...

 

Gallagher and Murton is too expensive for Roberts alone. I'd rather do the Murton for Teahen deal if that's the case.

 

I was kind of hoping Gallagher was going to be in the rotation next year, so I'm not all that thrilled to see him go. But, I do like Roberts.

 

But would you do Murton and Gallagher straight up? Especially when we could get more for those two. We could get Teahen for Murton, and Gallagher could be used as an add-on to a major trade.

 

Now if you have either Tejada or Bedard coming back over, then definately send them Gallagher, but not just for Roberts alone.

[Guest]

Getting things back on track...

 

Gallagher and Murton is too expensive for Roberts alone. I'd rather do the Murton for Teahen deal if that's the case.

 

I was kind of hoping Gallagher was going to be in the rotation next year, so I'm not all that thrilled to see him go. But, I do like Roberts.

 

But would you do Murton and Gallagher straight up? Especially when we could get more for those two. We could get Teahen for Murton, and Gallagher could be used as an add-on to a major trade.

 

Now if you have either Tejada or Bedard coming back over, then definately send them Gallagher, but not just for Roberts alone.

It's been established that the Royals won't do Teahen for Murton.

[BigbadB]

Someone lock this thread, it's gone so far above and beyond its original point.

 

More walruses please.

 

post padder.

 

:-k

 

It was a joke made by O_O in this thread. You'd had to rifle through about 10 pages of crap to find it.

 

Oh, I know. I was just padding my post count some more. :D

[hawkeyecub]

Okay I'm sure it was posted already in this thread but what is the consensus on Roberts' defense at 2B?

[Guest]

Okay I'm sure it was posted already in this thread but what is the consensus on Roberts' defense at 2B?

Pretty average IMO

[E.J.]

Someone lock this thread, it's gone so far above and beyond its original point.

 

More walruses please.

 

post padder.

 

:-k

 

It was a joke made by O_O in this thread. You'd had to rifle through about 10 pages of crap to find it.

 

Oh, I know. I was just padding my post count some more. :D

 

Well you need to stop already because I'm trying to catch up to your post count. :P

[Wrigley Rat]

Someone lock this thread, it's gone so far above and beyond its original point.

 

It's funny how trade threads always end up being arguements over semantics. I want to get into the time machine someone was using earlier to listen to Levine so I can skip ahead and see if the trade happens or not.

I'm in that time machine, and sorry to say the trade has not happened yet. I guess being two minutes ahead of the rest of you guys wasn't worth the millions I paid for it!

[erik316wttn]

Getting things back on track...

 

Gallagher and Murton is too expensive for Roberts alone. I'd rather do the Murton for Teahen deal if that's the case.

 

I was kind of hoping Gallagher was going to be in the rotation next year, so I'm not all that thrilled to see him go. But, I do like Roberts.

 

But would you do Murton and Gallagher straight up? Especially when we could get more for those two. We could get Teahen for Murton, and Gallagher could be used as an add-on to a major trade.

 

Now if you have either Tejada or Bedard coming back over, then definately send them Gallagher, but not just for Roberts alone.

It's been established that the Royals won't do Teahen for Murton.

 

Oh.

 

Well, never mind that, then. But I still think those 2 for Roberts straight up is a bad deal.