Kroeger

[don_kessinger_was_good]

OK, I usually like to keep up better with the minor league kids, but what is the Kroeger story? How did we get him, what is his skillset and projection, defensive outlook for position, etc...

 

And what are his complete 07 numbers to-date, they must be pretty eyepopping at this point based on how many times I see a good day posted for him in the minor league game threads.

[don_kessinger_was_good]

Oops, sorry, then I find a thread on another page on the same topic. I'd delete this one, but I see no delete thread button, even though I'm the thread initiator.

 

In any event, I would still like to see Kroeger's 07 numbers so far if anyone has them.

[biittner77]

Here's his numbers. To see them in a more user friendly format click on the box score link and then click on his name.

TEN SOU

AVG G -AB-- R- H-2B-3B HR RBI TB BB SO SB CS OBP SLG OPS

.375 53 176 32 66 12 2 --9 -42 109 22 26-- 6-- 2- .448-.619-1.067

 

The key stat for Kroeger is that he is 25. With Pie up for the duration perhaps he'll get promoted to Iowa and we'll see if he's figured things out.

[mg420]

he was claimed off waivers from arizona diamondbacks, 1/6/06. he's 24 not 25 btw. i dont know why his age should be an issue. howard was 26 last year in his rookie year and tori hunter didnt get a hot at the bigs until he was 27. the way he is hitting at aa, it would be insane not to give him a shot in rf. i dont know anything about his defense but he's got to be an upgrade from jones & murton.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Hitting at AA was never a problem for Kroeger, he mashed there when he was 22. It's AAA that gave him trouble. He hit really well for 200 AB's before a brief callup, then fell on his face in 2 consecutive full seasons at AAA, in two different systems and both the PCL and International League. I agree with Biittner, promote him to AAA now that Pie is in the bigs to stay, and see if he can hit there in an extended stay.

[davearm]

I remember Kroeger was a semi-popular target back when the Cubs were looking for a team to dump Corey Patterson on, and Kroeger was falling/ had fallen out of favor with ARI.

 

I'm mildly impressed by his resurgence this year, and he's still young enough to have a chance, but as others have stated, he needs to show some success at AAA before he belongs on the bigleague radar.

[jersey cubs fan]

he was claimed off waivers from arizona diamondbacks, 1/6/06. he's 24 not 25 btw. i dont know why his age should be an issue. howard was 26 last year in his rookie year and tori hunter didnt get a hot at the bigs until he was 27. the way he is hitting at aa, it would be insane not to give him a shot in rf. i dont know anything about his defense but he's got to be an upgrade from jones & murton.

 

Ryan Howard got a cup of coffee in 2004 at age 24. He split his age 25 season at AAA and the majors, and stuck in the majors at 26. He was also highly productive as he moved up the minor league ladder. He didn't repeat levels and advanced at a solid pace. This Kroeger character repeated high A, and washed out at AAA after playing there in 2004, 2005 and 2006, and getting worse each year. His age matters because it's only now, as he approaches 25, that he's putting up these numbers after a demotion back to AA. It would be insane to suggest he has to be an upgrade to Murton.

 

Torii Hunter was in the majors by 22. He didn't stick until 25, but he got numerous shots before then. You comparisons are pointless.

[biittner77]

Hitting at AA was never a problem for Kroeger, he mashed there when he was 22. It's AAA that gave him trouble. He hit really well for 200 AB's before a brief callup, then fell on his face in 2 consecutive full seasons at AAA, in two different systems and both the PCL and International League. I agree with Biittner, promote him to AAA now that Pie is in the bigs to stay, and see if he can hit there in an extended stay.

 

It would also have the added benefit of moving Patterson back to 2nd base where he belongs.

[mg420]

he was claimed off waivers from arizona diamondbacks, 1/6/06. he's 24 not 25 btw. i dont know why his age should be an issue. howard was 26 last year in his rookie year and tori hunter didnt get a hot at the bigs until he was 27. the way he is hitting at aa, it would be insane not to give him a shot in rf. i dont know anything about his defense but he's got to be an upgrade from jones & murton.

 

Ryan Howard got a cup of coffee in 2004 at age 24. He split his age 25 season at AAA and the majors, and stuck in the majors at 26. He was also highly productive as he moved up the minor league ladder. He didn't repeat levels and advanced at a solid pace. This Kroeger character repeated high A, and washed out at AAA after playing there in 2004, 2005 and 2006, and getting worse each year. His age matters because it's only now, as he approaches 25, that he's putting up these numbers after a demotion back to AA. It would be insane to suggest he has to be an upgrade to Murton.

Torii Hunter was in the majors by 22. He didn't stick until 25, but he got numerous shots before then. You comparisons are pointless.

 

as are most if not all of your "observations".

[Transmogrified Tiger]

he was claimed off waivers from arizona diamondbacks, 1/6/06. he's 24 not 25 btw. i dont know why his age should be an issue. howard was 26 last year in his rookie year and tori hunter didnt get a hot at the bigs until he was 27. the way he is hitting at aa, it would be insane not to give him a shot in rf. i dont know anything about his defense but he's got to be an upgrade from jones & murton.

 

Ryan Howard got a cup of coffee in 2004 at age 24. He split his age 25 season at AAA and the majors, and stuck in the majors at 26. He was also highly productive as he moved up the minor league ladder. He didn't repeat levels and advanced at a solid pace. This Kroeger character repeated high A, and washed out at AAA after playing there in 2004, 2005 and 2006, and getting worse each year. His age matters because it's only now, as he approaches 25, that he's putting up these numbers after a demotion back to AA. It would be insane to suggest he has to be an upgrade to Murton.

Torii Hunter was in the majors by 22. He didn't stick until 25, but he got numerous shots before then. You comparisons are pointless.

 

as are most if not all of your "observations".

 

Well, at least you explained why.

[mg420]

he was claimed off waivers from arizona diamondbacks, 1/6/06. he's 24 not 25 btw. i dont know why his age should be an issue. howard was 26 last year in his rookie year and tori hunter didnt get a hot at the bigs until he was 27. the way he is hitting at aa, it would be insane not to give him a shot in rf. i dont know anything about his defense but he's got to be an upgrade from jones & murton.

 

Ryan Howard got a cup of coffee in 2004 at age 24. He split his age 25 season at AAA and the majors, and stuck in the majors at 26. He was also highly productive as he moved up the minor league ladder. He didn't repeat levels and advanced at a solid pace. This Kroeger character repeated high A, and washed out at AAA after playing there in 2004, 2005 and 2006, and getting worse each year. His age matters because it's only now, as he approaches 25, that he's putting up these numbers after a demotion back to AA. It would be insane to suggest he has to be an upgrade to Murton.

Torii Hunter was in the majors by 22. He didn't stick until 25, but he got numerous shots before then. You comparisons are pointless.

 

as are most if not all of your "observations".

 

Well, at least you explained why.

 

just my opinion. why argue with a man who knows everything there is to know about baseball?

[jersey cubs fan]

he was claimed off waivers from arizona diamondbacks, 1/6/06. he's 24 not 25 btw. i dont know why his age should be an issue. howard was 26 last year in his rookie year and tori hunter didnt get a hot at the bigs until he was 27. the way he is hitting at aa, it would be insane not to give him a shot in rf. i dont know anything about his defense but he's got to be an upgrade from jones & murton.

 

Ryan Howard got a cup of coffee in 2004 at age 24. He split his age 25 season at AAA and the majors, and stuck in the majors at 26. He was also highly productive as he moved up the minor league ladder. He didn't repeat levels and advanced at a solid pace. This Kroeger character repeated high A, and washed out at AAA after playing there in 2004, 2005 and 2006, and getting worse each year. His age matters because it's only now, as he approaches 25, that he's putting up these numbers after a demotion back to AA. It would be insane to suggest he has to be an upgrade to Murton.

Torii Hunter was in the majors by 22. He didn't stick until 25, but he got numerous shots before then. You comparisons are pointless.

 

as are most if not all of your "observations".

 

Well, at least you explained why.

 

just my opinion. why argue with a man who knows everything there is to know about baseball?

 

Who knows everything? All I know is Kroeger is a terrible comparison for Howard and Hunter.

[imb]

he was claimed off waivers from arizona diamondbacks, 1/6/06. he's 24 not 25 btw. i dont know why his age should be an issue. howard was 26 last year in his rookie year and tori hunter didnt get a hot at the bigs until he was 27. the way he is hitting at aa, it would be insane not to give him a shot in rf. i dont know anything about his defense but he's got to be an upgrade from jones & murton.

 

Ryan Howard got a cup of coffee in 2004 at age 24. He split his age 25 season at AAA and the majors, and stuck in the majors at 26. He was also highly productive as he moved up the minor league ladder. He didn't repeat levels and advanced at a solid pace. This Kroeger character repeated high A, and washed out at AAA after playing there in 2004, 2005 and 2006, and getting worse each year. His age matters because it's only now, as he approaches 25, that he's putting up these numbers after a demotion back to AA. It would be insane to suggest he has to be an upgrade to Murton.

Torii Hunter was in the majors by 22. He didn't stick until 25, but he got numerous shots before then. You comparisons are pointless.

 

as are most if not all of your "observations".

 

Well, at least you explained why.

 

just my opinion. why argue with a man who knows everything there is to know about baseball?

 

That's a good question, but you could at least give it a shot.

 

ps I usually like to base my opinions on facts

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v257/vance_the_cubs_fan/thread_rocks.jpg

[Guest]

Hitting at AA was never a problem for Kroeger, he mashed there when he was 22. It's AAA that gave him trouble. He hit really well for 200 AB's before a brief callup, then fell on his face in 2 consecutive full seasons at AAA, in two different systems and both the PCL and International League. I agree with Biittner, promote him to AAA now that Pie is in the bigs to stay, and see if he can hit there in an extended stay.

 

It would also have the added benefit of moving Patterson back to 2nd base where he belongs.

 

EPatt was already getting action at LF while Pie was at AAA, the Cubs appear to be making a concerted effort to get him playing time there no matter the Iowa roster.

[Guest]

he was claimed off waivers from arizona diamondbacks, 1/6/06. he's 24 not 25 btw. i dont know why his age should be an issue. howard was 26 last year in his rookie year and tori hunter didnt get a hot at the bigs until he was 27. the way he is hitting at aa, it would be insane not to give him a shot in rf. i dont know anything about his defense but he's got to be an upgrade from jones & murton.

 

Ryan Howard got a cup of coffee in 2004 at age 24. He split his age 25 season at AAA and the majors, and stuck in the majors at 26. He was also highly productive as he moved up the minor league ladder. He didn't repeat levels and advanced at a solid pace. This Kroeger character repeated high A, and washed out at AAA after playing there in 2004, 2005 and 2006, and getting worse each year. His age matters because it's only now, as he approaches 25, that he's putting up these numbers after a demotion back to AA. It would be insane to suggest he has to be an upgrade to Murton.

Torii Hunter was in the majors by 22. He didn't stick until 25, but he got numerous shots before then. You comparisons are pointless.

 

as are most if not all of your "observations".

 

Well, at least you explained why.

 

just my opinion. why argue with a man who knows everything there is to know about baseball?

 

???

 

Goony backed up why the comparison of Kroeger to Howard and Hunter weren't valid. You just respodned that his posts are pointless.

[biittner77]

he was claimed off waivers from arizona diamondbacks, 1/6/06. he's 24 not 25 btw. i dont know why his age should be an issue. howard was 26 last year in his rookie year and tori hunter didnt get a hot at the bigs until he was 27. the way he is hitting at aa, it would be insane not to give him a shot in rf. i dont know anything about his defense but he's got to be an upgrade from jones & murton.

 

Age is an issue because he's old for his level.

 

The bolded part: do you mean that his defense has to be better than Murton or Jones? If so I'd agree but that doesn't warrant a promotion, at least not until they can find a new home for Jones. In any case, OF defense is less of a concern than offense right now.

 

In the mean time let Kroeger set AAA on fire. I have no problem exploring other options for the Cubs OF. I just don't see Kroeger being able to supplant Floyd at this point and I doubt if he could outproduce Murton. Very clearly Kroeger has nothing left to prove at AA.

[biittner77]

Hitting at AA was never a problem for Kroeger, he mashed there when he was 22. It's AAA that gave him trouble. He hit really well for 200 AB's before a brief callup, then fell on his face in 2 consecutive full seasons at AAA, in two different systems and both the PCL and International League. I agree with Biittner, promote him to AAA now that Pie is in the bigs to stay, and see if he can hit there in an extended stay.

 

It would also have the added benefit of moving Patterson back to 2nd base where he belongs.

 

EPatt was already getting action at LF while Pie was at AAA, the Cubs appear to be making a concerted effort to get him playing time there no matter the Iowa roster.

 

I know but I can always hope that they'll do the smart thing and move him back to 2nd base where he has value beyond the utility role he seems destined for as an OF unless he can play CF.

[Guest]

Hitting at AA was never a problem for Kroeger, he mashed there when he was 22. It's AAA that gave him trouble. He hit really well for 200 AB's before a brief callup, then fell on his face in 2 consecutive full seasons at AAA, in two different systems and both the PCL and International League. I agree with Biittner, promote him to AAA now that Pie is in the bigs to stay, and see if he can hit there in an extended stay.

 

It would also have the added benefit of moving Patterson back to 2nd base where he belongs.

 

EPatt was already getting action at LF while Pie was at AAA, the Cubs appear to be making a concerted effort to get him playing time there no matter the Iowa roster.

 

I know but I can always hope that they'll do the smart thing and move him back to 2nd base where he has value beyond the utility role he seems destined for as an OF unless he can play CF.

 

Even if he could play CF, he'd be buried on the depth chart by Pie and even Colvin.

 

Sadly it appears his defense at 2B is not good enough to stick there.

[mg420]

he was claimed off waivers from arizona diamondbacks, 1/6/06. he's 24 not 25 btw. i dont know why his age should be an issue. howard was 26 last year in his rookie year and tori hunter didnt get a hot at the bigs until he was 27. the way he is hitting at aa, it would be insane not to give him a shot in rf. i dont know anything about his defense but he's got to be an upgrade from jones & murton.

 

Ryan Howard got a cup of coffee in 2004 at age 24. He split his age 25 season at AAA and the majors, and stuck in the majors at 26. He was also highly productive as he moved up the minor league ladder. He didn't repeat levels and advanced at a solid pace. This Kroeger character repeated high A, and washed out at AAA after playing there in 2004, 2005 and 2006, and getting worse each year. His age matters because it's only now, as he approaches 25, that he's putting up these numbers after a demotion back to AA. It would be insane to suggest he has to be an upgrade to Murton.

Torii Hunter was in the majors by 22. He didn't stick until 25, but he got numerous shots before then. You comparisons are pointless.

 

as are most if not all of your "observations".

 

Well, at least you explained why.

 

just my opinion. why argue with a man who knows everything there is to know about baseball?

 

That's a good question, but you could at least give it a shot.

 

ps I usually like to base my opinions on facts

 

facts are subject to interpetation. off the top of my head i can recall that goony was certain that padilla would be a better choice than marquis who was referred to as crap and not good. in hindsight, that was a pointless opinon/observation.

[Guest]

So because goony was wrong before, we should ignore what he says? At least he backs up what he says with facts. I'm sure you've been wrong about something before, so I will ignore all that you say. Heck, we've all been wrong before - let's ignore every post here.

[imb]

I think you're having trouble with the meaning of the words "fact" and "opinion".

[Flames24Rulz]

he was claimed off waivers from arizona diamondbacks, 1/6/06. he's 24 not 25 btw. i dont know why his age should be an issue. howard was 26 last year in his rookie year and tori hunter didnt get a hot at the bigs until he was 27. the way he is hitting at aa, it would be insane not to give him a shot in rf. i dont know anything about his defense but he's got to be an upgrade from jones & murton.

 

Ryan Howard got a cup of coffee in 2004 at age 24. He split his age 25 season at AAA and the majors, and stuck in the majors at 26. He was also highly productive as he moved up the minor league ladder. He didn't repeat levels and advanced at a solid pace. This Kroeger character repeated high A, and washed out at AAA after playing there in 2004, 2005 and 2006, and getting worse each year. His age matters because it's only now, as he approaches 25, that he's putting up these numbers after a demotion back to AA. It would be insane to suggest he has to be an upgrade to Murton.

Torii Hunter was in the majors by 22. He didn't stick until 25, but he got numerous shots before then. You comparisons are pointless.

 

as are most if not all of your "observations".

 

Well, at least you explained why.

 

just my opinion. why argue with a man who knows everything there is to know about baseball?

 

That's a good question, but you could at least give it a shot.

 

ps I usually like to base my opinions on facts

 

facts are subject to interpetation. off the top of my head i can recall that goony was certain that padilla would be a better choice than marquis who was referred to as crap and not good. in hindsight, that was a pointless opinon/observation.

 

There were many who thought Padilla was a better option than Marquis.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

There were many who thought Padilla was a better option than Marquis.

 

including Marquis himself

[don_kessinger_was_good]

So basically, it's likely that sometime in the next few weeks we'll see no less than three players in Iowa that can mash but are playing out of position because of suspect defense at their original spots: E-Patt, Kroeger and Jake Fox. Plus, Buck Coats was originally a SS, and McGahee has been all over the diamond.

 

I like that the Cubs are willing to try new things to find a home for a kid with a bat, but I think these "square peg/round hole" problems suggest the Cubs should start moving some of these guys to AL organizations, where there are more options thanks to the DH and deeper benches than in the NL.

 

Also, can I go on record in this thread and be angry about the whole Josh Hamilton thing? Was a free shot at a former high 1st round pick worth giving up for a mere $50,000? I know, I've heard the argument "the Cubs were never interested in him", but they should have been.