NFC Championship: Bears vs. Saints - Sun Jan 21, 2 pm CST

[OleMissCub]

 

You really don't know much of anything about the Bears. That much is quite clear. I'm liking how much people are overlooking them and focusing on the supposed really hot Saints. They lost to the Redskins late in the season when the playoff seedings were up in the air. They lost many games during the season. Yet, for some reason, it's the Bears that have to prove something here. It's amusing.

 

You had the 32nd ranked strength of schedule. That's dead last. Saints had the 3rd ranked SOS.

[David]

Saints win 50-3 this weekend. Best Defense, Best Offense, and Best Special teams in the NFL. They didn't lose a single game the entire season.

 

QFT

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

(or not)

[gflore34]

Saints win 50-3 this weekend. Best Defense, Best Offense, and Best Special teams in the NFL. They didn't lose a single game the entire season.

 

 

Bears shouldn't even bother to show up, they've obviously no chance at victory...

[Chocolate Milk]

Are you really trying to claim the Saints defense is better than the Bears defense? Really?

.

 

Definitely not overall. The Bears D is a beast. But the second half of the season y'all played poor offensive teams and gave up a ton of points. I showed you stats that showed that during OUR second half we played good offensive teams and gave up few points.

 

Right now I think the Saints D is better. The stats prove that easily.

 

no they don't. but your belief that they do prove you don't know much about football.

 

How do the stats not prove this???

 

Look at your last 3 "real" games:

 

You gave up 31 points to the 29th ranked offense in football! Then a week later gave up 21 points to the 22nd ranked offense. Then last week you gave up 24 points to the 19th ranked offense.

 

Our last 3 "real games:

 

16 points to the 13th ranked offense, 7 points to the 14th ranked offense, then 24 points to the 2nd ranked offense.

 

2 of either Peanut, Vasher, or Todd Johnson were missing for all those games in question. I doubt you'll accept this as a reason though. You are the only one in the entire country who thinks the Saints have a better defense than the Bears and it's not because everyone else is wrong.

[OleMissCub]

Stats are meaningless to you guys apparently.

 

I find it humorous to watch you guys squirm when confronted with the fact that your D gave up a boatload of points to some of the crappiest offenses in the NFL.

[OleMissCub]

 

2 of either Peanut, Vasher, or Todd Johnson were missing for all those games in question. I doubt you'll accept this as a reason though. You are the only one in the entire country who thinks the Saints have a better defense than the Bears and it's not because everyone else is wrong.

 

No I'm not. The Saints are playing better defense right now than the Bears. It's not that complicated. Injuries have hurt your defense.

[Chocolate Milk]

 

You really don't know much of anything about the Bears. That much is quite clear. I'm liking how much people are overlooking them and focusing on the supposed really hot Saints. They lost to the Redskins late in the season when the playoff seedings were up in the air. They lost many games during the season. Yet, for some reason, it's the Bears that have to prove something here. It's amusing.

 

You had the 32nd ranked strength of schedule. That's dead last. Saints had the 3rd ranked SOS.

 

Based on what? They played 2 teams with a winning record. Their schedule was ranked 22nd by FootballOutsiders.

[Chocolate Milk]

 

2 of either Peanut, Vasher, or Todd Johnson were missing for all those games in question. I doubt you'll accept this as a reason though. You are the only one in the entire country who thinks the Saints have a better defense than the Bears and it's not because everyone else is wrong.

 

No I'm not. The Saints are playing better defense right now than the Bears. It's not that complicated. Injuries have hurt your defense.

 

That wooshing sound you hear are things going right over your head.

[goonys evil twin]

Are you really trying to claim the Saints defense is better than the Bears defense? Really?

.

 

Definitely not overall. The Bears D is a beast. But the second half of the season y'all played poor offensive teams and gave up a ton of points. I showed you stats that showed that during OUR second half we played good offensive teams and gave up few points.

 

Right now I think the Saints D is better. The stats prove that easily.

 

no they don't. but your belief that they do prove you don't know much about football.

 

How do the stats not prove this???

 

Look at your last 3 "real" games:

 

You gave up 31 points to the 29th ranked offense in football! Then a week later gave up 21 points to the 22nd ranked offense. Then last week you gave up 24 points to the 19th ranked offense.

 

Our last 3 "real games:

 

16 points to the 13th ranked offense, 7 points to the 14th ranked offense, then 24 points to the 2nd ranked offense.

 

You clearly don't understand what was happening in those Bears games. They were playing with back of the roster filler. They were going out to big leads is meaningless games and allowed a couple teams to come back late (yet they still won, unlike the Saints that couldn't beat a terrible Redskins teams when things still mattered). They were playing with guys in the secondary who will not sniff the defensive side of the ball in this game, and they were playing extremely soft, almost prevent style defense the whole time. The coaching staff was setting up for the playoffs 2 months ago. The fact that they gave up some yards and points to weak teams in the 4th quarter of meaningless games they still won really means nothing as far as how good the team actually is.

[Chocolate Milk]

Are you really trying to claim the Saints defense is better than the Bears defense? Really?

.

 

Definitely not overall. The Bears D is a beast. But the second half of the season y'all played poor offensive teams and gave up a ton of points. I showed you stats that showed that during OUR second half we played good offensive teams and gave up few points.

 

Right now I think the Saints D is better. The stats prove that easily.

 

no they don't. but your belief that they do prove you don't know much about football.

 

How do the stats not prove this???

 

Look at your last 3 "real" games:

 

You gave up 31 points to the 29th ranked offense in football! Then a week later gave up 21 points to the 22nd ranked offense. Then last week you gave up 24 points to the 19th ranked offense.

 

Our last 3 "real games:

 

16 points to the 13th ranked offense, 7 points to the 14th ranked offense, then 24 points to the 2nd ranked offense.

 

You clearly don't understand what was happening in those Bears games. They were playing with back of the roster filler. They were going out to big leads is meaningless games and allowed a couple teams to come back late (yet they still won, unlike the Saints that couldn't beat a terrible Redskins teams when things still mattered). They were playing with guys in the secondary who will not sniff the defensive side of the ball in this game, and they were playing extremely soft, almost prevent style defense the whole time. The coaching staff was setting up for the playoffs 2 months ago. The fact that they gave up some yards and points to weak teams in the 4th quarter of meaningless games they still won really means nothing as far as how good the team actually is.

 

The Bears also pulled most of their defense starters about halfway through the 3rd quarter in the Lions game, as well.

[YearofDaCubs]

Are you really trying to claim the Saints defense is better than the Bears defense? Really?

.

 

Definitely not overall. The Bears D is a beast. But the second half of the season y'all played poor offensive teams and gave up a ton of points. I showed you stats that showed that during OUR second half we played good offensive teams and gave up few points.

 

Right now I think the Saints D is better. The stats prove that easily.

 

no they don't. but your belief that they do prove you don't know much about football.

 

How do the stats not prove this???

 

Look at your last 3 "real" games:

 

You gave up 31 points to the 29th ranked offense in football! Then a week later gave up 21 points to the 22nd ranked offense. Then last week you gave up 24 points to the 19th ranked offense.

 

Our last 3 "real games:

 

16 points to the 13th ranked offense, 7 points to the 14th ranked offense, then 24 points to the 2nd ranked offense.

 

You clearly don't understand what was happening in those Bears games. They were playing with back of the roster filler. They were going out to big leads is meaningless games and allowed a couple teams to come back late (yet they still won, unlike the Saints that couldn't beat a terrible Redskins teams when things still mattered). They were playing with guys in the secondary who will not sniff the defensive side of the ball in this game, and they were playing extremely soft, almost prevent style defense the whole time. The coaching staff was setting up for the playoffs 2 months ago. The fact that they gave up some yards and points to weak teams in the 4th quarter of meaningless games they still won really means nothing as far as how good the team actually is.

That super powered NO offense was able to manage an astonishing 10 points at home against the Redskins haha.

[David]

I love how OMC keeps using yards and points with far more sophisticated and better metrics available. At the very least, try looking at those yards and points within the context of what actually was going on with the team.

 

It's akin to saying that Kerry Wood sucks because he never won 15 games.

[goonys evil twin]

Are you really trying to claim the Saints defense is better than the Bears defense? Really?

.

 

Definitely not overall. The Bears D is a beast. But the second half of the season y'all played poor offensive teams and gave up a ton of points. I showed you stats that showed that during OUR second half we played good offensive teams and gave up few points.

 

Right now I think the Saints D is better. The stats prove that easily.

 

no they don't. but your belief that they do prove you don't know much about football.

 

How do the stats not prove this???

 

Look at your last 3 "real" games:

 

You gave up 31 points to the 29th ranked offense in football! Then a week later gave up 21 points to the 22nd ranked offense. Then last week you gave up 24 points to the 19th ranked offense.

 

Our last 3 "real games:

 

16 points to the 13th ranked offense, 7 points to the 14th ranked offense, then 24 points to the 2nd ranked offense.

 

You clearly don't understand what was happening in those Bears games. They were playing with back of the roster filler. They were going out to big leads is meaningless games and allowed a couple teams to come back late (yet they still won, unlike the Saints that couldn't beat a terrible Redskins teams when things still mattered). They were playing with guys in the secondary who will not sniff the defensive side of the ball in this game, and they were playing extremely soft, almost prevent style defense the whole time. The coaching staff was setting up for the playoffs 2 months ago. The fact that they gave up some yards and points to weak teams in the 4th quarter of meaningless games they still won really means nothing as far as how good the team actually is.

 

The Bears also pulled most of their defense starters about halfway through the 3rd quarter in the Lions game, as well.

 

The Bears were spanking Detroit, STL, and Tampa earlier in those games, then went soft late, both via scheme and personel (and very likely, individual intensity of play). They were playing without Tank Johnson, Vasher/Tillman and Todd Johnson for that stretch as well. Despite all the yards they gave up to STL late, they still won by 15 freaking points.

 

The defense was the reason they won the Minnesota game, the reason they were in the New England game, and the focus of the Jets win. They gave up some points to the Giants, but largely shut them down. Mike Brown went down early, while Tommie Harris became a non-factor much earlier in the season, when there were concerns about some sort of leg issue hobbling his play.

 

The defense is not close to the 85 Bears, but it's clearly the best defense alive in the playoffs.

[UMFan83]

The Special Teams DVOA rankings have the Saints at 14 and the Bears at 1. Could this be a reason the Saints are doing OK in YPG and the Bears not as good? With a lesser kick return game, teams generally have to drive for less yards to score then the Bears opponents have to.

[BleedCubbieBlue81]

The Bears have been playing throwaway games for quite some time. When you already clinch the playoffs, and are pretty much a shoe in for home field advantage, you're not going to run your full offensive and defensive schemes. Why would you show your hand when it's not necessary? Its like playing in the preseason. You may be playing your starters, but they're not running the same plays or coverages they normally would for the whole game. Why give the scouts something to write about and something to prepare for?

 

It's the same reason Denny Green thought the Bears were bad, because when he saw them in preseason, they were running a grade school offense.

 

And just to point out, thinking the Saints have a better defense than the Bears is completely insane. Especially when they're ranked 5th in YPG, 3rd in Points per game, and 2nd in DVOA while the Saints are 11th in YPG, 13 in PPG, and 19th in DVOA. There really is no comparison.

[David]

The Special Teams DVOA rankings have the Saints at 14 and the Bears at 1. Could this be a reason the Saints are doing OK in YPG and the Bears not as good? With a lesser kick return game, teams generally have to drive for less yards to score then the Bears opponents have to.

 

Another valid point.

[UMFan83]

BTW, in the GB game, out of the 26 points GB scored, 14 of them were a direct result of Rex Grossman throwing an INT for a TD. That should not count on the D's record. Edited January 18, 2007 by UMFan83

[Chocolate Milk]

The Special Teams DVOA rankings have the Saints at 14 and the Bears at 1. Could this be a reason the Saints are doing OK in YPG and the Bears not as good? With a lesser kick return game, teams generally have to drive for less yards to score then the Bears opponents have to.

 

Yes. The Saints don't generate a ton of short field situations (low turnovers forced, average special teams). It's hard to consistantly drive the length of the field against any NFL defense.

[OleMissCub]

duece and reggie aren't nearly as good playing real football as they are playing indoor football. That will probably end up being a bigger factor than most people think. I don't think either of them averaged even close to 4 yards a carry on real fields.

 

On grass:

 

Deuce is averaging 17 carries, 62 yards, and 3.7ypc

 

Bush is averaging 12 carries, 44 yards, and 3.6ypc

 

In Dome:

 

Deuce is averaging 16 carries, 76 yards, and 4.75ypc

 

Bush is averaging 7 carries, 30 yards, and 3.8ypc

[David]

duece and reggie aren't nearly as good playing real football as they are playing indoor football. That will probably end up being a bigger factor than most people think. I don't think either of them averaged even close to 4 yards a carry on real fields.

 

On grass:

 

Deuce is averaging 17 carries, 62 yards, and 3.7ypc

 

Bush is averaging 12 carries, 44 yards, and 3.6ypc

 

In Dome:

 

Deuce is averaging 16 carries, 76 yards, and 4.75ypc

 

Bush is averaging 7 carries, 30 yards, and 3.8ypc

 

In other words...

 

Good in dome...bad on grass.

[BleedCubbieBlue81]

And I also keep hearing about how the Eagles had the 2nd or 3rd best offense this year, but how much of that happened before they lost their starting quarterback? They were still a good team with Garcia, but without McNabb, you didn't beat the same offense that you'd have seen with him in there.

[UMFan83]

duece and reggie aren't nearly as good playing real football as they are playing indoor football. That will probably end up being a bigger factor than most people think. I don't think either of them averaged even close to 4 yards a carry on real fields.

 

On grass:

 

Deuce is averaging 17 carries, 62 yards, and 3.7ypc

 

Bush is averaging 12 carries, 44 yards, and 3.6ypc

 

In Dome:

 

Deuce is averaging 16 carries, 76 yards, and 4.75ypc

 

Bush is averaging 7 carries, 30 yards, and 3.8ypc

 

In other words...

 

Good in dome...bad on grass.

 

I would say good in dome, noticably not as good on grass. But 3.7 YPC is still pretty decent. Don't expect us to just shut down the run game.

[Chocolate Milk]

Didn't mean to jump all over you OleMiss. I think most Bears fans would agree that the Bears defense has fallen off a little late in the season. But honestly, they did have siginigant injuries (players are now back), they were playing prevent in a lot of those games, they put in the scrubs in some of those games, and really the games were meaningless. Whether or not you want to beleive that stuff, it's true.

 

I really think that trying to argue that the Saints have a better defense based on the last few games isn't a really good argument, especially using stuff like total yards. The Bears do give up yardage but they work to force turnovers. Yardage isn't a very good indicator of how a defense plays if it is used in a vaccum.

[David]

The anticipation is killing me worse than for last week's game.

 

I just want to see what's going to happen in this game.

 

I'm both optimistic and pessimistic at the same time about this game...is that even possible??

[David]

I would say good in dome, noticably not as good on grass. But 3.7 YPC is still pretty decent. Don't expect us to just shut down the run game.

 

I don't know... if we held them to those numbers, which they are averaging on grass, I'd say we did our job as far as the run is concerned.