Will Carroll says that there's something big that's close

[nilodnayr]

And Scherholz wouldn't make the trade anyway unless Prior were healthy.

 

You wouldn't think, but he did trade for a banged up Mike Hampton who hasn't been particularly healthy with the Braves either. Not to mention, after a few years of having somebody else pay Hampton's salary, I believe they are on the hook for the next couple years. Maybe they need to get creative to make some room.

 

I'm usually not one to say that if a GM got burned by X player and Y player is in the same situation then he will shy away, but this might be one of those scenarios.

 

From everything that I've read, the Braves are at the limit of their budget after getting rid of Giles. They can't really add anything, but they don't have to get rid of anymore.

 

I'd like for the cubs to get involved somehow with their excess of arms in the pen though.

[RichHillIsABeast]

And Scherholz wouldn't make the trade anyway unless Prior were healthy.

 

You wouldn't think, but he did trade for a banged up Mike Hampton who hasn't been particularly healthy with the Braves either. Not to mention, after a few years of having somebody else pay Hampton's salary, I believe they are on the hook for the next couple years. Maybe they need to get creative to make some room.

 

Schuerholz is big on IP when evaluating pitchers. Hampton may have been banged up, but he took the mound 30+ times for years when the Braves traded for him. Prior hasn't pitched much the last couple of seasons.

[goonys evil twin]

And Scherholz wouldn't make the trade anyway unless Prior were healthy.

 

You wouldn't think, but he did trade for a banged up Mike Hampton who hasn't been particularly healthy with the Braves either. Not to mention, after a few years of having somebody else pay Hampton's salary, I believe they are on the hook for the next couple years. Maybe they need to get creative to make some room.

 

Schuerholz is big on IP when evaluating pitchers. Hampton may have been banged up, but he took the mound 30+ times for years when the Braves traded for him. Prior hasn't pitched much the last couple of seasons.

 

Maybe he came to the conclusion that emphasizing quantity over quality can be exremely risky and that consistent innings isn't the same as stable pitching. It's all a risk. Taking the guy who might make 32 starts but probably won't do all that well may or may not be smarter than taking the guy who probably won't make 32 starts but will do well when he does start. And of course, Hampton showed him that consistently making your starts doesn't guarantee you will in the future. The pitching gods are fickle. Maybe the market for mediocre innings is so overheated that a $4m gamble on a guy who might not pitch much starts to make a lot more sense. If your budget is tight, shedding one high payroll player and getting back a potential great player (and more payroll flexibility) could become an intriguing option.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

While some of the minor pieces might be changed somewhat, I could see this deal as a possibility.

 

Cubs get: A. Jones.

 

Braves get: Prior, Ohman and Baldelli.

 

Rays get: Davies or James plus prospects from the Cubs, possibly Dopirak or Harvey.

 

The Cubs would either platoon Murton and Jacque or deal Jacque and sign Floyd. The Cubs line-up would be heavily right-handed, so I could see Jones or Floyd playing lots over Murton.

 

While Prior could be the difference in our rotation being medicore or good, it's evident Hendry isn't counting on him. The Braves may be more willing to take a gamble knowing they are losing Jones at season's end. This would give the Cubs excellent production in CF and at the same time still leave the position open for Pie in the future. The Braves also would believe they are replacing Jones with Baldelli.

 

The Rays would get the pitcher they desire for Baldelli.

 

I could also see Theriot or Cedeno involved as the Braves really have no one to play second base next year.

 

If the Cubs are certain they can sign Floyd to provide a LH bat, Jacque could be moved.

 

Another variation could have Prior moving to the Rays as the centerpiece of the Baldelli deal and the Braves hanging on to their young pitchers.

 

While I really doubt the Cubs are one of the teams in these discussions, it is fun speculating.

 

I have wondered if this three-way could also involve the Angels and Baltimore. The Braves with Tejada and Andruw Jones moving in the deal along with prospects from the Angels.

[cheapseats]

Carroll just updated that a deal seemed close over the weekend but isn't as close now, which doesn't mean it won't happen as Schuerholz usually works slowly.

 

Andruw Jones is the centerpiece.

 

The Braves want to replace Jones and they want to improve last year's horrid bullpen.

 

CF possibilities include Granderson, Markakis, and Baldelli.

 

The Braves are willing to include Andy LaRoche. Some of the deals being worked on include Tim Hudson, Mark Texeira, and Dontrelle Willis.

 

http://www.baseballprospectus.com/unfiltered/?p=120

 

I'd be pissed if I were the dodgers

 

:D

 

Good catch. Clearly he means Adam LaRoche, but I didn't notice he said Andy when I first read it.

[RichHillIsABeast]

And Scherholz wouldn't make the trade anyway unless Prior were healthy.

 

You wouldn't think, but he did trade for a banged up Mike Hampton who hasn't been particularly healthy with the Braves either. Not to mention, after a few years of having somebody else pay Hampton's salary, I believe they are on the hook for the next couple years. Maybe they need to get creative to make some room.

 

Schuerholz is big on IP when evaluating pitchers. Hampton may have been banged up, but he took the mound 30+ times for years when the Braves traded for him. Prior hasn't pitched much the last couple of seasons.

 

Maybe he came to the conclusion that emphasizing quantity over quality can be exremely risky and that consistent innings isn't the same as stable pitching. It's all a risk. Taking the guy who might make 32 starts but probably won't do all that well may or may not be smarter than taking the guy who probably won't make 32 starts but will do well when he does start. And of course, Hampton showed him that consistently making your starts doesn't guarantee you will in the future. The pitching gods are fickle. Maybe the market for mediocre innings is so overheated that a $4m gamble on a guy who might not pitch much starts to make a lot more sense. If your budget is tight, shedding one high payroll player and getting back a potential great player (and more payroll flexibility) could become an intriguing option.

 

Hampton caught the injury bug all of a sudden after the Braves acquired him. Prior hasn't just caught the injury bug.

 

Prior would net us peanuts right now. If he comes back healthy to ST and pitches like he did in '03, his value skyrockets.

 

We're not counting on him and his salary is peanuts (with the Cubs payroll). Holding onto him now is the smart move. He tanks and they're out a couple mil. He is healthy and we probably make the playoffs or we can deal him for actual value.

[oldstyle81]

carroll is going to be on WGN tonight sometime

[RammyFanny]

carroll is going to be on WGN tonight sometime

If he says anything new give us an update please (if you're listening)

[Larry Horse]

I'm curious why people think Prior has any trade value right now.

[RynoRules]

Holy crip, if all Atl wants is relief help we should get in on this action right now.

 

How's this lineup look?:

 

Soriano

Murt

Lee

A. Jones

ARam

Barrett

DeRosa

Izturis

 

:shock:

[Jazz]

A. Jones is enticing, but man he is going to be EXPENSIVE to resign if we do get him. Were talking 6 years, 100 mil minimum. Probably more.

[BigbadB]

I could also see Theriot or Cedeno involved as the Braves really have no one to play second base next year.

 

While I'm not aware that any of the guys the Braves have are the next Jeff Kent, they do have plenty of guys that they like at 2b for next year. Prado, Aybar, Johnson and Orr are all options, and all might or likely are better than Cedeno or Theriot.

 

The production Giles has given them the last year wouldn't be hard to match from one of the above guys.

[RynoRules]

A. Jones is enticing, but man he is going to be EXPENSIVE to resign if we do get him. Were talking 6 years, 100 mil minimum. Probably more.

 

Let him walk and put Pie in center. He'll easily be a Type A FA, so we will be well compensated. If we are only giving up two middle relievers and a pitching prospect to get this done, its a no-brainer, IMO.

 

EDIT: And I just thought of a great sophmoric response to the title of this thread:

 

"That's what she said."

[TheDude]

carroll is going to be on WGN tonight sometime

 

Anything interesting?

[nilodnayr]

A. Jones is enticing, but man he is going to be EXPENSIVE to resign if we do get him. Were talking 6 years, 100 mil minimum. Probably more.

 

Let him walk and put Pie in center. He'll easily be a Type A FA, so we will be well compensated. If we are only giving up two middle relievers and a pitching prospect to get this done, its a no-brainer, IMO.

 

EDIT: And I just thought of a great sophmoric response to the title of this thread:

 

"That's what she said."

 

 

Offering two middle relievers and a pitching prospect won't even be enough to talk to Schuerholz's secretary.

[RynoRules]

A. Jones is enticing, but man he is going to be EXPENSIVE to resign if we do get him. Were talking 6 years, 100 mil minimum. Probably more.

 

Let him walk and put Pie in center. He'll easily be a Type A FA, so we will be well compensated. If we are only giving up two middle relievers and a pitching prospect to get this done, its a no-brainer, IMO.

 

EDIT: And I just thought of a great sophmoric response to the title of this thread:

 

"That's what she said."

 

 

Offering two middle relievers and a pitching prospect won't even be enough to talk to Schuerholz's secretary.

 

Funny, but that is contradicted by the rumors floated earlier in this thread, if you wish to go back and read them.

[nilodnayr]

A. Jones is enticing, but man he is going to be EXPENSIVE to resign if we do get him. Were talking 6 years, 100 mil minimum. Probably more.

 

Let him walk and put Pie in center. He'll easily be a Type A FA, so we will be well compensated. If we are only giving up two middle relievers and a pitching prospect to get this done, its a no-brainer, IMO.

 

EDIT: And I just thought of a great sophmoric response to the title of this thread:

 

"That's what she said."

 

 

Offering two middle relievers and a pitching prospect won't even be enough to talk to Schuerholz's secretary.

 

Funny, but that is contradicted by the rumors floated earlier in this thread, if you wish to go back and read them.

 

Funny, but the rumor is "trying to find Jones’ replacement on the cheap, and working more on the bullpen". So if by two middle relievers and a pitching prospect you mean two middle relievers and Felix Pie, then you are absolutely correct. And that may not be enough as Baldelli, Granderson and Markakis are probably more attractive than Pie.

[RynoRules]

Even funnier - I was talking about the same three-way deal you were discussing in another thread. You know, the one where Atl gets Badelli plus relievers from us, TB gets LaRoche and prospects from both teams (none of whom are named Pie), and we get Andruw Jones. That's the proposed/rumored scenario, and IMO, its a no-brainer for the Cubs.

 

Try reading what I wrote before criticizing.

[nilodnayr]

Even funnier - I was talking about the same three-way deal you were discussing in another thread. You know, the one where Atl gets Badelli plus relievers from us, TB gets LaRoche and prospects from both teams (none of whom are named Pie), and we get Andruw Jones. That's the proposed/rumored scenario, and IMO, its a no-brainer for the Cubs.

 

Try reading what I wrote before criticizing.

 

Ohh I didn't realize by "rumors floated" you meant trade scenarios fans pulled out of their behinds. I'm sorry.

[RynoRules]

Even funnier - I was talking about the same three-way deal you were discussing in another thread. You know, the one where Atl gets Badelli plus relievers from us, TB gets LaRoche and prospects from both teams (none of whom are named Pie), and we get Andruw Jones. That's the proposed/rumored scenario, and IMO, its a no-brainer for the Cubs.

 

Try reading what I wrote before criticizing.

 

Ohh I didn't realize by "rumors floated" you meant trade scenarios fans pulled out of their behinds. I'm sorry.

 

And I too am sorry - I guess I thought this was the transactions forum on a message bd. Forgive me.

[nilodnayr]

Even funnier - I was talking about the same three-way deal you were discussing in another thread. You know, the one where Atl gets Badelli plus relievers from us, TB gets LaRoche and prospects from both teams (none of whom are named Pie), and we get Andruw Jones. That's the proposed/rumored scenario, and IMO, its a no-brainer for the Cubs.

 

Try reading what I wrote before criticizing.

 

Ohh I didn't realize by "rumors floated" you meant trade scenarios fans pulled out of their behinds. I'm sorry.

 

And I too am sorry - I guess I thought this was the transactions forum on a message bd. Forgive me.

 

trade proposals <> rumors. I pasted a quote from the Will Carroll article, that is what I consider a rumor, not pure conjecture on our part.

 

If we have a chance to get involved it would be because the deal has stalled at Chuck James. The only way we get to the table is with Rich Hill.

 

THT ranked James as the #47 prospect last year (and salty #30). Our only entry was Pie at #43.

 

Topprospectalert.com has Salty as the braves #1 and Escobar as #8 this year (James isn't a prospect anymore).

 

BP had Hill at #47 on their list last year and James as an honorable mention due to his fly ball tendencies, which shouldn't be as big of a problem in Tropicana.

 

I don't see how we get involved in this without giving up significant talent.

[Wheelimus]

Surprised nobody has brought up Veal. He seems like the kind of guy who would be right up the Braves alley. They'd mold him into gold.

 

Jacque, one of Howry or Eyre, Veal, and, say, Sean Marshall. What if that was the price?

 

Check please...

[BigbadB]

Surprised nobody has brought up Veal. He seems like the kind of guy who would be right up the Braves alley. They'd mold him into gold.

 

Jacque, one of Howry or Eyre, Veal, and, say, Sean Marshall. What if that was the price?

 

Check please...

 

That's an awful lot for a 1 year rental and salary relief to the team wanting to be out from under his contract. I wouldn't think it would take that much. But, the market is awful whack this offseason.

[NorthsideAvenger]

Surprised nobody has brought up Veal. He seems like the kind of guy who would be right up the Braves alley. They'd mold him into gold.

 

Jacque, one of Howry or Eyre, Veal, and, say, Sean Marshall. What if that was the price?

 

Check please...

 

That's an awful lot for a 1 year rental and salary relief to the team wanting to be out from under his contract. I wouldn't think it would take that much. But, the market is awful whack this offseason.

 

And the Cubs wouldn't be forced to give up much to get AJ. I would be fine with J. Jones in CF, with Pie comin gup in 2008, rather then to give up Veal and Marshall for a possible one yr rental. Now, if the Cubs could extend AJ for at least 4 yrs at around $70 mill, that's another story.

[dew1679666265]

A. Jones is enticing, but man he is going to be EXPENSIVE to resign if we do get him. Were talking 6 years, 100 mil minimum. Probably more.

 

If the intent was to re-sign him, the best idea would be to frontload the contract so that he's hitting the cheaper years as Soriano, et al hit their expensive years.

Of course there is the option others have mentioned of letting him walk.