Week 13: Bears vs. Minnesota - Sunday, Dec 3, 12 pm CST

[Southpaw191679666239]

I don't care if you're Johnny Unitas, you need more than 3 games against tomato cans to get ready for tough playoff games.

 

Good thing he'd have 4 then ;)

[Chocolate Milk]

I think we'll see a senario similar to last year. Rex has a half to pull himself together before he's benched on MNF (SNF last year Orton was benched).

 

I don't know what his deal is. Is he a total headcase? I'm starting to think so. How one could have such highs followed by such lows is beyond my comprehension.

[goonys evil twin]

Okay, I'm done defending Rex. If Lovie wants to keep throwing him out there for now, fine, but if he doesn't improve soon, I'm going to jump on the bench him bandwagon.

 

 

 

If Tommie is done for the year, that really sucks. The first playoff game is still going to be 6 weeks away, so he might be able to come back. And at this point, I wouldn't want anything more than that. Then again, championship teams have to still be able to win when missing a piece or two. I think the Bears can survive and still thrive if Harris is out. This is when d-line depth will really start to pay off.

 

 

 

Benson needs to get the ball more.

 

Bench him in week 14 though? See, this is the problem with the whole bench Grossman scenarios. I don't necessarily disagree, but at this point in the season I don't care if you're Johnny Unitas, you need more than 3 games against tomato cans to get ready for tough playoff games.

 

If Grossmen fails to improve, I would not have a problem giving Griese a 3-game warmup before the playoffs begin. He's not a rookie. He's not in virgin territory. I like that Grossman brings a potential for big plays. And as long as he was bouncing back from bad games, I thought they'd be fine with him as QB. They've already beaten playoff caliber teams, both home and away, with Rex playing less than stellar. But back-to-back disaster games erodes my confidence in his ability to bounce back. 3 in a row would be unacceptable. Rex is no longer a "virtual rookie" with 21 games under his belt (including playoff). I was fine with the occasional setback earlier in the year. I was fine with how he came out of the NY trip. But I am not fine with tolerating prolonged very bad play. He absolutely has to show up Monday night.

[sweetpeteman]

I just want to say, however, that the jerks on ESPNews yestaurday that were trying to find a divide in the locker room between the defense and offense due to Rex's poor play need to be kicked.

 

One of the questions by the host to the reporter at Soldier Field was if there was a divide and it was obvious by the way it was answered and the hosts reaction that they were hoping for one.

[Banedon]

So if you bench Grossman for the rest of the season, do you make it a QB competition between him and Griese next season at training camp? Do you look at drafting another QB? What do the Bears really think of Orton as far as future potential? (Not that I want him starting any games at all this season.) I thought we had some QB stability this season. Boo.

 

This was interesting in the Suntimes link that Soul posted...

 

Hester figures to supplant Rashied Davis as the kick returner after Davis fumbled the opening kick. Hester had 68 yards on three returns.

 

''He's done a good job, he's done a real good job,'' Toub said. ''There is a good chance he will be our kick returner.''

[goonys evil twin]

So if you bench Grossman for the rest of the season, do you make it a QB competition between him and Griese next season at training camp? Do you look at drafting another QB? What do the Bears really think of Orton as far as future potential? (Not that I want him starting any games at all this season.) I thought we had some QB stability this season. Boo.

 

This was interesting in the Suntimes link that Soul posted...

 

Hester figures to supplant Rashied Davis as the kick returner after Davis fumbled the opening kick. Hester had 68 yards on three returns.

 

''He's done a good job, he's done a real good job,'' Toub said. ''There is a good chance he will be our kick returner.''

 

I'd let Rex and Griese battle it out next summer, unless Rex catches fire and wins the whole thing this year, or Griese comes in and looks amazing and wins the whole thing this year. With Rex's play quite shaky, Angelo doesn't have to extend him this offseason, so you let him play out a contract year and earn a new deal next year. That means beating out the competition and playing well.

[Soul]

Okay, I'm done defending Rex. If Lovie wants to keep throwing him out there for now, fine, but if he doesn't improve soon, I'm going to jump on the bench him bandwagon.

 

 

 

If Tommie is done for the year, that really sucks. The first playoff game is still going to be 6 weeks away, so he might be able to come back. And at this point, I wouldn't want anything more than that. Then again, championship teams have to still be able to win when missing a piece or two. I think the Bears can survive and still thrive if Harris is out. This is when d-line depth will really start to pay off.

 

 

 

Benson needs to get the ball more.

 

Bench him in week 14 though? See, this is the problem with the whole bench Grossman scenarios. I don't necessarily disagree, but at this point in the season I don't care if you're Johnny Unitas, you need more than 3 games against tomato cans to get ready for tough playoff games.

 

If Grossmen fails to improve, I would not have a problem giving Griese a 3-game warmup before the playoffs begin. He's not a rookie. He's not in virgin territory. I like that Grossman brings a potential for big plays. And as long as he was bouncing back from bad games, I thought they'd be fine with him as QB. They've already beaten playoff caliber teams, both home and away, with Rex playing less than stellar. But back-to-back disaster games erodes my confidence in his ability to bounce back. 3 in a row would be unacceptable. Rex is no longer a "virtual rookie" with 21 games under his belt (including playoff). I was fine with the occasional setback earlier in the year. I was fine with how he came out of the NY trip. But I am not fine with tolerating prolonged very bad play. He absolutely has to show up Monday night.

 

I'm not fine with it either. I just see Detroit, Tampa, Green Bay on the schedule and think to myself, I wouldn't feel prepared for anything if I played those 3 teams and that's it.

[Soul]

So if you bench Grossman for the rest of the season, do you make it a QB competition between him and Griese next season at training camp? Do you look at drafting another QB? What do the Bears really think of Orton as far as future potential? (Not that I want him starting any games at all this season.) I thought we had some QB stability this season. Boo.

 

This was interesting in the Suntimes link that Soul posted...

 

Hester figures to supplant Rashied Davis as the kick returner after Davis fumbled the opening kick. Hester had 68 yards on three returns.

 

''He's done a good job, he's done a real good job,'' Toub said. ''There is a good chance he will be our kick returner.''

 

When I saw that I thought to myself, "bout damn time."

[goonys evil twin]

I'm not fine with it either. I just see Detroit, Tampa, Green Bay on the schedule and think to myself, I wouldn't feel prepared for anything if I played those 3 teams and that's it.

 

Well, there's nothing you can do about the schedule. It would be a bad idea to go into the playoffs with a guy playing as poorly as Rex has been of late. I'd feel much more comfortable giving Griese 3 games against subpar competition than going into the playoffs with Rex playing a string of bad games.

[Chocolate Milk]

I'm not fine with it either. I just see Detroit, Tampa, Green Bay on the schedule and think to myself, I wouldn't feel prepared for anything if I played those 3 teams and that's it.

 

Well, there's nothing you can do about the schedule. It would be a bad idea to go into the playoffs with a guy playing as poorly as Rex has been of late. I'd feel much more comfortable giving Griese 3 games against subpar competition than going into the playoffs with Rex playing a string of bad games.

 

It's not like Griese is a rookie either. If he's not ready to play with 3 games under his belt then he's got the wrong job.

[Brendan]

well, i got back to dc late last night after going to the game. without reading all 50+ pages, let me add some thoughts.

 

(1) it's been said, i'm sure, but it was damn cold that day. we stayed in a hotel off wacker and decided to walk to/from the stadium. when we were moving, it wasn't that bad, but sitting in the stadium for 3 hours really sapped the heat from you. i got back to bwi where it was upper 20s, and it felt tropical.

 

(2) the crowd is absolutely relentless towards rex, with the only "cheer" for him coming when they reported his passing stats late in the game. i'm not sure what's going on in his head, but he made some awful reads, especially early in the game (that pick thrown right to the defense, missing a WIDE-OPEN moose for an early td). he definitely seemed rattled, later over throwing screen passes, etc, and i think was/is seriously pressing. i was hoping the harris td would have settled him down, but it didn't come close.

 

(3) they ran all over us.

 

(4) benson needs to play more.

 

(5) urlacher is, i'd venture to say, still vastly underrated in the national media. he's a beast, and any "briggs is just as good as he is" talk is crap. but i still hope they can keep lance here.

[Soul]

well, i got back to dc late last night after going to the game. without reading all 50+ pages, let me add some thoughts.

 

(1) it's been said, i'm sure, but it was damn cold that day. we stayed in a hotel off wacker and decided to walk to/from the stadium. when we were moving, it wasn't that bad, but sitting in the stadium for 3 hours really sapped the heat from you. i got back to bwi where it was upper 20s, and it felt tropical.

 

(2) the crowd is absolutely relentless towards rex, with the only "cheer" for him coming when they reported his passing stats late in the game. i'm not sure what's going on in his head, but he made some awful reads, especially early in the game (that pick thrown right to the defense, missing a WIDE-OPEN moose for an early td). he definitely seemed rattled, later over throwing screen passes, etc, and i think was/is seriously pressing. i was hoping the harris td would have settled him down, but it didn't come close.

 

(3) they ran all over us.

 

(4) benson needs to play more.

 

(5) urlacher is, i'd venture to say, still vastly underrated in the national media. he's a beast, and any "briggs is just as good as he is" talk is crap. but i still hope they can keep lance here.

 

Wow, we must have lost by 10 points. Damn.

 

Oh wait...

 

 

J/K. It is getting a little old hearing how terrible we were on a day when we won by 10 points though. Yes, there are issues, big ones. Which bad teams win through their mistakes? Only the good ones do that :wink:

[goonys evil twin]

Wow, we must have lost by 10 points. Damn.

 

Oh wait...

 

 

J/K. It is getting a little old hearing how terrible we were on a day when we won by 10 points though. Yes, there are issues, big ones. Which bad teams win through their mistakes? Only the good ones do that :wink:

 

Nobody is saying "we" were terrible. Grossman was terrible. I took issue with people saying Grossman was terrible in the Jets game. They acted as if they won in spite of Rex trying to lose the game. That was not the case. But this game was different. It just shows you how much more impressive the defense and special teams are that they could win by that much with such bad QB play.

[Chocolate Milk]

Wow, we must have lost by 10 points. Damn.

 

Oh wait...

 

 

J/K. It is getting a little old hearing how terrible we were on a day when we won by 10 points though. Yes, there are issues, big ones. Which bad teams win through their mistakes? Only the good ones do that :wink:

 

Nobody is saying "we" were terrible. Grossman was terrible. I took issue with people saying Grossman was terrible in the Jets game. They acted as if they won in spite of Rex trying to lose the game. That was not the case. But this game was different. It just shows you how much more impressive the defense and special teams are that they could win by that much with such bad QB play.

 

Sean Salisbury said that the Bears aren't the best defense in the league any more.

[goonys evil twin]

Wow, we must have lost by 10 points. Damn.

 

Oh wait...

 

 

J/K. It is getting a little old hearing how terrible we were on a day when we won by 10 points though. Yes, there are issues, big ones. Which bad teams win through their mistakes? Only the good ones do that :wink:

 

Nobody is saying "we" were terrible. Grossman was terrible. I took issue with people saying Grossman was terrible in the Jets game. They acted as if they won in spite of Rex trying to lose the game. That was not the case. But this game was different. It just shows you how much more impressive the defense and special teams are that they could win by that much with such bad QB play.

 

Sean Salisbury said that the Bears aren't the best defense in the league any more.

 

Sean Salisbury was a bad QB whose biggest claim to fame is the ability to yell at a skinny nerd.

[CaliforniaRaisin]

Wow, we must have lost by 10 points. Damn.

 

Oh wait...

 

 

J/K. It is getting a little old hearing how terrible we were on a day when we won by 10 points though. Yes, there are issues, big ones. Which bad teams win through their mistakes? Only the good ones do that :wink:

 

Nobody is saying "we" were terrible. Grossman was terrible. I took issue with people saying Grossman was terrible in the Jets game. They acted as if they won in spite of Rex trying to lose the game. That was not the case. But this game was different. It just shows you how much more impressive the defense and special teams are that they could win by that much with such bad QB play.

 

Sean Salisbury said that the Bears aren't the best defense in the league any more.

 

Sean Salisbury was a bad QB whose biggest claim to fame is the ability to yell at a skinny nerd.

 

From what I hear, Ricky Manning Jr. does it better.

[Brendan]

Wow, we must have lost by 10 points. Damn.

 

Oh wait...

 

 

J/K. It is getting a little old hearing how terrible we were on a day when we won by 10 points though. Yes, there are issues, big ones. Which bad teams win through their mistakes? Only the good ones do that :wink:

 

Nobody is saying "we" were terrible. Grossman was terrible. I took issue with people saying Grossman was terrible in the Jets game. They acted as if they won in spite of Rex trying to lose the game. That was not the case. But this game was different. It just shows you how much more impressive the defense and special teams are that they could win by that much with such bad QB play.

 

i think that's exactly right. and, let's be honest, the bears had a lot of turnovers. again. had the vikes been able to capitalize on any of them (especially the davis fumble), it may have been a different game. if this had been anomalous for rex, i'd have likely just chalked it up to the elements (temps, swirling winds, etc, etc). but yesterday was a day filled with awful decisions, not just overthrown balls. i suppose i hope rex is just feeling the fatigue of a long nfl season and will regain some poise as the playoffs near.

[Chocolate Milk]

I'm kind of confused, now. I feel like Lovie has to change QB's with another stinker from Rex. Yet on the other hand, he seems to be backing Rex vehemently. I'm not so sure he'll make the change.

[Banedon]

Wow the 2007 QB free agent class is pretty poor. Thought I'd check to see if there was any upgrades to be made....

 

Nope.

 

Matt Schaub, RFA, Atlanta Falcons

Chris Simms, UFA, Tampa Bay Buccaneers

Damon Huard, UFA, Kansas City Chiefs

Rohan Davey, RFA, Arizona Cardinals

Shaun King, UFA, Indianapolis Colts

John Navarre, RFA, Arizona Cardinals

Tim Rattay, UFA, Tampa Bay Buccaneers

Anthony Wright, UFA, Cincinnati Bengals

 

http://www.footballsfuture.com/2007/nfl/freeagents.html

[hawkeyecub]

It just shows you how much more impressive the defense and special teams are that they could win by that much with such bad QB play.

 

No it really doesn't.

It shows you how incompetent Brad Johnson was and has been.

Your defense really wasn't very impressive yesterday. It was a result of Brad Johnson being incredibly bad and poor play-calling on the part of Childress more than any great defensive performance.

 

We completely gashed you on the ground all day long even though the Bears were repeatedly bringing an 8th man into the box. Our three running backs had 31 carries for 187 yards (6 yards a carry). Ciatrick Fason had 1 carry all year and he had 75 yards on 11 carries yesterday, and his long was only 14. Chester Taylor gashed you, Fason gashed you and Moore gashed you. Holes were there all day long and the Bears tackling was poor. For some inexplicable reason, Childress went away from it.

 

Second half play-calling was awful. We carried it 5 times for 25 yards in the opening drive of the second half. Then Harris went out. Then we get the INT and the ball across midfield where we throw an INT on 1st down. Oh well, defense gets the ball back down 7-6 midway through the 3rd. We bust runs of 13, 13 and 6 setting up 2nd and 4 at your 45. Instead of staying on the ground we nearly throw a pick and then Manning takes the next pass back for 6. We get the ball back down 14-6 and throw on 1st down again, right to Urlacher.

 

Honestly look at the turnovers you forced, it was Johnson handing you the ball. One was a pass to a wide open tight end (in field goal range) who let the ball bounce off his pads into the air for an interception. Another was Johnson throwing a dump pass 8 yards too long to Urlacher. The first one was thrown right to a safety with no one in the vicinity. The Manning one was just Johnson being clueless.

We had recievers open all day but Johnson either missed them, threw a poor pass or they dropped it.

 

Wow that was a long rant.

Edited December 4, 2006 by hawkeyecub

[goonys evil twin]

I'm kind of confused, now. I feel like Lovie has to change QB's with another stinker from Rex. Yet on the other hand, he seems to be backing Rex vehemently. I'm not so sure he'll make the change.

 

Lovie has, for the most part, been pretty good about cutting bait. I think he's given more leeway to Grossman for perfectly acceptable reasons, and I think he's given more leeway to Jones because of how the locker room feels. In the case of the RB, I think he's just biding his time, knowing that a relatively unscathed Benson would be a big plus for the playoffs, and that Jones is susceptible to getting banged up.

 

Lovie said many of the same things he's saying now about Orton last year. But he didn't hesitate to make a change when it was time.

 

I think a stinker from Rex could be enough for Lovie to make a move. I read his anger in the postgame talk being directed more at Rex putting him in that position than at the media members who actually asked the questions.

 

A ho-hum game (with a win), probably will be enough for Rex to keep his job though.

[goonys evil twin]

It just shows you how much more impressive the defense and special teams are that they could win by that much with such bad QB play.

 

No it really doesn't.

It shows you how incompetent Brad Johnson was and has been.

Your defense really wasn't very impressive yesterday. It was a result of Brad Johnson being incredibly bad and poor play-calling on the part of Childress more than any great defensive performance.

 

We completely gashed you on the ground all day long. Our three running backs had 31 carries for 187 yards (6 yards a carry). Ciatrick Fason had 1 carry all year and he had 75 yards on 11 carries yesterday, and his long was only 14. Chester Taylor gashed you, Fason gashed you and Moore gashed you. Holes were there all day long and the Bears tackling was poor. For some inexplicable reason, Childress went away from it.

 

Second half play-calling was awful. We carried it 5 times for 25 yards in the opening drive of the second half. Then Harris went out. Then we get the INT and the ball across midfield where we throw an INT on 1st down. Oh well, defense gets the ball back down 7-6 midway through the 3rd. We bust runs of 13, 13 and 6 setting up 2nd and 4 at your 45. Instead of staying on the ground we nearly throw a pick and then Manning takes the next pass back for 6. We get the ball back down 14-6 and throw on 1st down again, right to Urlacher.

 

Honestly look at the turnovers you forced, it was Johnson handing you the ball. One was a pass to a wide open tight end (in field goal range) who let the ball bounce off his pads into the air for an interception. Another was Johnson throwing a dump pass 8 yards too long to Urlacher. The first one was thrown right to a safety with no one in the vicinity. The Manning one was just Johnson being clueless.

 

Wow that was a long rant.

 

You're right, the Bears defense and special teams never make plays and that was all about Johnson.

[Chocolate Milk]

I'm kind of confused, now. I feel like Lovie has to change QB's with another stinker from Rex. Yet on the other hand, he seems to be backing Rex vehemently. I'm not so sure he'll make the change.

 

Lovie has, for the most part, been pretty good about cutting bait. I think he's given more leeway to Grossman for perfectly acceptable reasons, and I think he's given more leeway to Jones because of how the locker room feels. In the case of the RB, I think he's just biding his time, knowing that a relatively unscathed Benson would be a big plus for the playoffs, and that Jones is susceptible to getting banged up.

 

Lovie said many of the same things he's saying now about Orton last year. But he didn't hesitate to make a change when it was time.

 

I think a stinker from Rex could be enough for Lovie to make a move. I read his anger in the postgame talk being directed more at Rex putting him in that position than at the media members who actually asked the questions.

 

A ho-hum game (with a win), probably will be enough for Rex to keep his job though.

 

I think you are probably right. Lovie has shown he knows the right time to cut bait.

 

One of the things that is frustrating me here is that I'm not sure what I WANT to happen? Would I rather have Griese come in to bring some consistancy? Rex has completely crapped the bed too many times for me to be comforable with him in the playoffs now. I think playing Rex would be better in the long term but the team is ready to win NOW.

 

I'm torn.

[Chocolate Milk]

It just shows you how much more impressive the defense and special teams are that they could win by that much with such bad QB play.

 

No it really doesn't.

It shows you how incompetent Brad Johnson was and has been.

Your defense really wasn't very impressive yesterday. It was a result of Brad Johnson being incredibly bad and poor play-calling on the part of Childress more than any great defensive performance.

 

We completely gashed you on the ground all day long even though the Bears were repeatedly bringing an 8th man into the box. Our three running backs had 31 carries for 187 yards (6 yards a carry). Ciatrick Fason had 1 carry all year and he had 75 yards on 11 carries yesterday, and his long was only 14. Chester Taylor gashed you, Fason gashed you and Moore gashed you. Holes were there all day long and the Bears tackling was poor. For some inexplicable reason, Childress went away from it.

 

Second half play-calling was awful. We carried it 5 times for 25 yards in the opening drive of the second half. Then Harris went out. Then we get the INT and the ball across midfield where we throw an INT on 1st down. Oh well, defense gets the ball back down 7-6 midway through the 3rd. We bust runs of 13, 13 and 6 setting up 2nd and 4 at your 45. Instead of staying on the ground we nearly throw a pick and then Manning takes the next pass back for 6. We get the ball back down 14-6 and throw on 1st down again, right to Urlacher.

 

Honestly look at the turnovers you forced, it was Johnson handing you the ball. One was a pass to a wide open tight end (in field goal range) who let the ball bounce off his pads into the air for an interception. Another was Johnson throwing a dump pass 8 yards too long to Urlacher. The first one was thrown right to a safety with no one in the vicinity. The Manning one was just Johnson being clueless.

We had recievers open all day but Johnson either missed them, threw a poor pass or they dropped it.

 

Wow that was a long rant.

 

You did not have "receivers open all day" that is just completely absurd.

 

I like how you left out how pressure caused almost every Johnson interception.

[goonys evil twin]

I think you are probably right. Lovie has shown he knows the right time to cut bait.

 

One of the things that is frustrating me here is that I'm not sure what I WANT to happen? Would I rather have Griese come in to bring some consistancy? Rex has completely crapped the bed too many times for me to be comforable with him in the playoffs now. I think playing Rex would be better in the long term but the team is ready to win NOW.

 

I'm torn.

 

Since Griese is not immune to mistakes and far from a guarantee for the Bears to win the SB, I think I'd rather Grossman just start playing better.