The A-Ram contingency plan

[HoopsCubs]

First shot across the bow? Or warning to fans that Aramis isn't coming back?

 

He gone.

[USSoccer]

First shot across the bow? Or warning to fans that Aramis isn't coming back?

 

He gone.

 

Based on what?

[goonys evil twin]

First shot across the bow? Or warning to fans that Aramis isn't coming back?

 

He gone.

 

Based on what?

 

For me, it's just a gut feeling. Hendry has said he thinks Ramirez wants to stay, and doesn't think he'll test free agency. That tells me Hendry is prepared to add a couple years to the deal, but not start fresh with a whole new package. We've also heard a lot about the need for clutch hitters, and I bet many within the organization view Ramirez's slow start as a character flaw, and of course, there's the hustle question. It's getting late in this process. For all intents and purposes, Ramirez is a free agent. Hendry doesn't let free agents, or pending free agents, he wants to keep, go this far without having a new deal. He's also the kind of guy who would let a guy walk, then find a replacement, and talk about how that guy is an addition to the team, as opposed to just a replacement.

 

Throw in a cubs source talking about contingency plans, and "getting offense from a couple different places", and it doesn't look good.

 

I'm still hoping he stays, but I don't like the direction this has gone.

[don_kessinger_was_good]

I wouldn't cry if Aramis leaves. He's not a prime time guy. His "numbers" vastly overstate his value. At $10MM/year, OK, but Lee-type money at 13? Nope.

 

Make the A-Rod trade and use the Aramis money for a pitcher. Heck, maybe there's a side agreement between the Cubs and Yanks; NY gets Aramis signed, they send A-Rod to the Cubs for a couple of pitchers and a reserve player like Jones.

 

I don't care about the age difference, A-Rod >>> Aramis.

 

Finally, LA doesn't seem to be interested in bringing back Nomar, but we could sure use him if he could give us 125 games started or so.

[Tedward]

He gone.

 

Is that the vibe that your sources are telling you, hoops?

[USSoccer]

For me, it's just a gut feeling. Hendry has said he thinks Ramirez wants to stay, and doesn't think he'll test free agency. That tells me Hendry is prepared to add a couple years to the deal, but not start fresh with a whole new package. We've also heard a lot about the need for clutch hitters, and I bet many within the organization view Ramirez's slow start as a character flaw, and of course, there's the hustle question. It's getting late in this process. For all intents and purposes, Ramirez is a free agent. Hendry doesn't let free agents, or pending free agents, he wants to keep, go this far without having a new deal. He's also the kind of guy who would let a guy walk, then find a replacement, and talk about how that guy is an addition to the team, as opposed to just a replacement.

 

Throw in a cubs source talking about contingency plans, and "getting offense from a couple different places", and it doesn't look good.

 

I'm still hoping he stays, but I don't like the direction this has gone.

 

I'm hoping this article is just typical Paul Sullivan crap. He doesn't care for Ramirez; maybe he's just trying to create a public consensus that isn't necessarily there.

 

As far as Hendry waiting to lock guys up, he's done this before. Lee and Ramirez each gave Opening Day deadlines, IIRC, to get an extension worked out, and each time Hendry waited til the last minute to get it done. I can't recall if Wood's extension was the same way, but there is some precedent.

 

I cannot imagine Hendry being dumb enough to not resign him. If the organization thought his hustle and "clutchiness" was going to preclude them from resigning him (they had to know he'd opt out), they should have dealt him at the deadline.

[goonys evil twin]

I wouldn't cry if Aramis leaves. He's not a prime time guy. His "numbers" vastly overstate his value. At $10MM/year, OK, but Lee-type money at 13? Nope.

 

What is a prime time player? In their 3 years on the Cubs, Aramis has outperformed Lee 2 years. Ramirez has a 950 OPS in the playoffs. And when the rest of his team was choking away 2004, Ramirez was producing.

[FergieJ31]

It's hard to imagine ARam looking forward to playing w/Piniella at the helm. It's like someone before was saying here: hiring Lou = kissing ARam goodbye.

[USSoccer]

I wouldn't cry if Aramis leaves. He's not a prime time guy. His "numbers" vastly overstate his value. At $10MM/year, OK, but Lee-type money at 13? Nope.

.

 

Aramis is every bit as good as Lee. He's worth at least as much.

[goonys evil twin]

As far as Hendry waiting to lock guys up, he's done this before. Lee and Ramirez each gave Opening Day deadlines, IIRC, to get an extension worked out, and each time Hendry waited til the last minute to get it done. I can't recall if Wood's extension was the same way, but there is some precedent.

 

Entirely different. In each of those cases he signed guys several months before they could reach free agency. He had the leverage of knowing those guys could get hurt and lose out on millions. Ramirez is already a free agent, even if he hasn't used the option. You should view him just like you'd view a normal free agent with no option. There is zero incentive for Ramirez to sign before free agency, even though Hendry keeps saying he doens't think Ramirez will use that option.

[USSoccer]

It's hard to imagine ARam looking forward to playing w/Piniella at the helm. It's like someone before was saying here: hiring Lou = kissing ARam goodbye.

 

Is this another "Aramis is a lazy oaf who doesn't want to work" post?

[HoopsCubs]

He gone.

 

Is that the vibe that your sources are telling you, hoops?

 

No, actually, most of my sources feel he will be extended by the last minute. My gut too tells me otherwise.

[USSoccer]

As far as Hendry waiting to lock guys up, he's done this before. Lee and Ramirez each gave Opening Day deadlines, IIRC, to get an extension worked out, and each time Hendry waited til the last minute to get it done. I can't recall if Wood's extension was the same way, but there is some precedent.

 

Entirely different. In each of those cases he signed guys several months before they could reach free agency. He had the leverage of knowing those guys could get hurt and lose out on millions. Ramirez is already a free agent, even if he hasn't used the option. You should view him just like you'd view a normal free agent with no option. There is zero incentive for Ramirez to sign before free agency, even though Hendry keeps saying he doens't think Ramirez will use that option.

 

If he doesn't think Aramis will opt out unless he gets a Lee-type deal he's dumb, and again, if they didn't want him back because of some stupid intangible reason, they should have dealt him.

[soapy]

I wouldn't cry if Aramis leaves. He's not a prime time guy. His "numbers" vastly overstate his value. At $10MM/year, OK, but Lee-type money at 13? Nope.

 

What is a prime time player? In their 3 years on the Cubs, Aramis has outperformed Lee 2 years. Ramirez has a 950 OPS in the playoffs. And when the rest of his team was choking away 2004, Ramirez was producing.

I was going to say the same thing. Thank you, goony.

 

I really don't understand the amount of "piling on" on Aramis. He's arguably the best offensive player on the team. Second at worst.

[Mizzou]

My only problem with Aramis is that he doesn't give his all every time. And that's nowhere near a big enough problem to warrant not resigning him. Ramirez is a great player, hustle or no hustle. To not bring him back because he loafs sometimes would be so stupid.

[CuseCubFan69]

Ramirez should be priority #1 for Hendry and if this falls through, which I think it will, it's going to be a huge step back for the Cubs. Now, they have to trade players to get a guy to play third that they could have dealt for a Tejada/ARod type guy to play SS. IMO even if Hendry does everything right after losing Ramirez it'll only make the Cubs 10 to 15 games better which isn't near enough.

[BigbadB]

80 XBH's, 119 RBI's with basically crap hitting in front of him all year, 13 errors at the hot corner in 157 games played is not elite?

 

Wow, our expectations have really gotten lofty.

 

No, he's not A-Rod. He isn't getting paid like A-Rod and no one expects him to perform like A-Rod. Would I rather have A-Rod? Depends. I'd rather have both. Is A-Rod a big enough difference maker to match Aramis type production and also make up for another position of need as well? I doubt it.

 

In other words, this team is not going to be much better offensively if all they do is replace Aramis with A-Rod.

 

Finding a way to keep Aramis should be the top priority. Take care of what you can control first (something they completely ignored last year with Nomar), then attempt to strengthen the roster with things you cannot control, like trading for Drew or signing Soriano, etc...

 

A-Rod: 62 XBH's, 121 RBI with premier hitters in front of him all year, 26 errors at the hot corner in 157 games is not nearly as impressive as Aramis was this year.

 

A-Rod did put up staggering numbers in Arlington, but I wonder what Aramis might do if he played in that stadium all year.

 

Letting Aramis get away this year would be the worst thing that could happen to this organization this offseason. Period.

[Vinestal]

If Aram decided to leave I dont see how we would be able to salvage a contending offense with what we have left. Also I think the chances of us landing A-rod are slim to none. Even if we did get A-rod when and if Aram leaves it's going to be an ugly looking offense. Seems like most of the offense's that Hendry has created have been pretty ugly though, I dont think he gets what it takes to build a competetive lineup.

[Backtobanks]

Ramirez should be priority #1 for Hendry and if this falls through, which I think it will, it's going to be a huge step back for the Cubs. Now, they have to trade players to get a guy to play third that they could have dealt for a Tejada/ARod type guy to play SS. IMO even if Hendry does everything right after losing Ramirez it'll only make the Cubs 10 to 15 games better which isn't near enough.

 

I don't think ARam is going anywhere, but obtaining ARod or Tejada is a step backward because ARam matches them in production and the Cubs don't have to give up players for him.

[BigbadB]

Ramirez should be priority #1 for Hendry and if this falls through, which I think it will, it's going to be a huge step back for the Cubs. Now, they have to trade players to get a guy to play third that they could have dealt for a Tejada/ARod type guy to play SS. IMO even if Hendry does everything right after losing Ramirez it'll only make the Cubs 10 to 15 games better which isn't near enough.

 

I don't think ARam is going anywhere, but obtaining ARod or Tejada is a step backward because ARam matches them in production and the Cubs don't have to give up players for him.

 

Agreed!

[Banedon]

Ramirez should be priority #1 for Hendry and if this falls through, which I think it will, it's going to be a huge step back for the Cubs. Now, they have to trade players to get a guy to play third that they could have dealt for a Tejada/ARod type guy to play SS. IMO even if Hendry does everything right after losing Ramirez it'll only make the Cubs 10 to 15 games better which isn't near enough.

 

I don't think ARam is going anywhere, but obtaining ARod or Tejada is a step backward because ARam matches them in production and the Cubs don't have to give up players for him.

 

I'm still pulling to get one of them, but I want them in addition to A-ram, not in lieu of.

[CuseCubFan69]

Ramirez should be priority #1 for Hendry and if this falls through, which I think it will, it's going to be a huge step back for the Cubs. Now, they have to trade players to get a guy to play third that they could have dealt for a Tejada/ARod type guy to play SS. IMO even if Hendry does everything right after losing Ramirez it'll only make the Cubs 10 to 15 games better which isn't near enough.

 

I don't think ARam is going anywhere, but obtaining ARod or Tejada is a step backward because ARam matches them in production and the Cubs don't have to give up players for him.

 

What I wrote was if ARam is still on the Cubs they can trade for an ARod or Tejada to play SS instead of 3rd. But, to examine what you wrote wouldn't ARod at SS and a more productive player at 3rd be better than what the Cubs could get for SS and Ramirez? Let's say Ramirez and Lugo vs Arod and the best available 3rd baseman....which would be better? Don't forget if the Cubs do lose ARam they will have an extra 13 to spend, will there be quality around to use the money on....well that one's on Mr. Hendry and the market.

[CubColtPacer]

Ramirez should be priority #1 for Hendry and if this falls through, which I think it will, it's going to be a huge step back for the Cubs. Now, they have to trade players to get a guy to play third that they could have dealt for a Tejada/ARod type guy to play SS. IMO even if Hendry does everything right after losing Ramirez it'll only make the Cubs 10 to 15 games better which isn't near enough.

 

I don't think ARam is going anywhere, but obtaining ARod or Tejada is a step backward because ARam matches them in production and the Cubs don't have to give up players for him.

 

The only thing with that is that Ramirez's money will come off the books as well, which will allow the Cubs to sign another big-time FA.

 

Don't get me wrong-I'll be very disappointed if the Cubs don't re-sign Ramirez. I definitely think it is a big priority that the Cubs sign him. Right now, the team is looking at signing or trading for one big hitter. If Ramirez leaves, they will hopefully just take the money and go get two big hitters instead.

[USSoccer]

Ramirez should be priority #1 for Hendry and if this falls through, which I think it will, it's going to be a huge step back for the Cubs. Now, they have to trade players to get a guy to play third that they could have dealt for a Tejada/ARod type guy to play SS. IMO even if Hendry does everything right after losing Ramirez it'll only make the Cubs 10 to 15 games better which isn't near enough.

 

I don't think ARam is going anywhere, but obtaining ARod or Tejada is a step backward because ARam matches them in production and the Cubs don't have to give up players for him.

 

The only thing with that is that Ramirez's money will come off the books as well, which will allow the Cubs to sign another big-time FA.

 

Don't get me wrong-I'll be very disappointed if the Cubs don't re-sign Ramirez. I definitely think it is a big priority that the Cubs sign him. Right now, the team is looking at signing or trading for one big hitter. If Ramirez leaves, they will hopefully just take the money and go get two big hitters instead.

 

There is not a single FA that can match Aramis's production.

[jmajew]

Ramirez should be priority #1 for Hendry and if this falls through, which I think it will, it's going to be a huge step back for the Cubs. Now, they have to trade players to get a guy to play third that they could have dealt for a Tejada/ARod type guy to play SS. IMO even if Hendry does everything right after losing Ramirez it'll only make the Cubs 10 to 15 games better which isn't near enough.

 

I don't think ARam is going anywhere, but obtaining ARod or Tejada is a step backward because ARam matches them in production and the Cubs don't have to give up players for him.

 

The only thing with that is that Ramirez's money will come off the books as well, which will allow the Cubs to sign another big-time FA.

 

Don't get me wrong-I'll be very disappointed if the Cubs don't re-sign Ramirez. I definitely think it is a big priority that the Cubs sign him. Right now, the team is looking at signing or trading for one big hitter. If Ramirez leaves, they will hopefully just take the money and go get two big hitters instead.

 

There is not a single FA that can match Aramis's production.

 

IF Aram leaves we are left with a huge hole. However, it can be filled through either signing or players or trading for players. The problem I have is that Hendry did not see this coming, if he really wants to stay with the Cubs we should have had an extension worked out by the All-Star break. If we hadn't gotten him gaurenteed then we should have traded him. Do you know how many teams would have taken Aramis at the trading deadline? Probably every contending team. I guarentee you we could have gotten Ervin Santanna or John Lackey straight up for Aramis. I just can't stand the thought of losing him for nothing.

 

I know hindsight is 20/20. But the signs had to be there.