Cy Zambrano?

[soccer10k]

Let's not forget how bad it was for Z in the first couple months. Also, his 8 straight wins are going to turn some heads. I like Z or Webb SO FAR.

 

I'll bet Z pulls away in the second half.

 

Z has to catch Webb before he can pull away from him.

Webb is doing his part to help that happen tonight.

 

Webb's ERA is now 2.64.

[texascub]

Let's not forget how bad it was for Z in the first couple months. Also, his 8 straight wins are going to turn some heads. I like Z or Webb SO FAR.

 

I'll bet Z pulls away in the second half.

 

Z has to catch Webb before he can pull away from him.

Webb is doing his part to help that happen tonight.

 

Webb's ERA is now 2.64.

 

And his RA is 2.98 as well now and Z's is 3.46. That's still a decent gap but not as big as the ERA gap, and IMO RA is a better factor of how much a pitcher helps his team than ERA. The difference in WHIP is now down to 0.10. Webb may still have a lead, but Z is coming on fast.

[soccer10k]

Let's not forget how bad it was for Z in the first couple months. Also, his 8 straight wins are going to turn some heads. I like Z or Webb SO FAR.

 

I'll bet Z pulls away in the second half.

 

Z has to catch Webb before he can pull away from him.

Webb is doing his part to help that happen tonight.

 

Webb's ERA is now 2.64.

 

And his RA is 2.98 as well now and Z's is 3.46. That's still a decent gap but not as big as the ERA gap, and IMO RA is a better factor of how much a pitcher helps his team than ERA. The difference in WHIP is now down to 0.10. Webb may still have a lead, but Z is coming on fast.

 

Why is RA a better factor? It's not the pitcher's fault if he gives up unearned runs. Obviously unearned runs are going to affect the outcome of the game but this award is for who is the best pitcher for the year and statistics that a pitcher can't control (re: wins, unearned runs) shouldn't affect who wins the award.

 

Don't forget about Chris Carpenter as well, who I also have in front of Z at this point.

[Andy]

The NL record for homers by a pitcher is 7 by Drysdale, from the Muskat's Cubs Notes article today.

 

If a vote were held today, I think Glavine or Z would get it, but Webb should get it as of now. If Z continues doing what he is doing the remainder of the season though, I'd expect him to get it.

[dvdd127]

Brandon Webb is 11-3 also and his ERA is .76 lower than Z's and Webb's WHIP is lower as well (1.11 compared to 1.23). A team's record should not come into play when deciding the Cy Young. The award is handed out to the best pitcher in the league, not the best pitcher on the best team. Fact is, Webb has been a better so far this year.

I agree that the teams record should not be taken into consideration... but unfortunately it sometimes is.

[Abe Frohman]

It's really all quite simple: who would you most like on the mound for you in the big game?

 

I don't think many people would pick Webb over Zambrano. I don't think I can come up with anyone I would rather have starting for my team than El Toro.

[impaler_240]

I doubt it matters, but does offensive have any impact on the Cy?

 

Z is a menace not only on the mound, but he drives in runs too. He is one of the better hitters on the Cubs, actually.

[soccer10k]

It's really all quite simple: who would you most like on the mound for you in the big game?

 

I don't think many people would pick Webb over Zambrano. I don't think I can come up with anyone I would rather have starting for my team than El Toro.

 

The Cy Young award isn't handed out to the pitcher who you would want on the mound in a big game, it's handed out to the pitcher who pitched the best over the course of the whole season. So far, Webb and Carpenter have pitched better than Zambrano. I'm not saying I would pick either of those two over Z in a big game, but fact is they have pitched better than Z this year. Will they continue to? Who knows. But if the Cy Young was handed out today, Z would not win it.

[Abe Frohman]

It's really all quite simple: who would you most like on the mound for you in the big game?

 

I don't think many people would pick Webb over Zambrano. I don't think I can come up with anyone I would rather have starting for my team than El Toro.

 

The Cy Young award isn't handed out to the pitcher who you would want on the mound in a big game, it's handed out to the pitcher who pitched the best over the course of the whole season. So far, Webb and Carpenter have pitched better than Zambrano. I'm not saying I would pick either of those two over Z in a big game, but fact is they have pitched better than Z this year. Will they continue to? Who knows. But if the Cy Young was handed out today, Z would not win it.

 

I can respect that analysis, but I wouldn't say that Zambrano would not win it. He is definately in the running, especially after winning 8 straight, with as many wins, and leading the NL in strikeouts.

[soccer10k]

Brandon Webb is 11-3 also and his ERA is .76 lower than Z's and Webb's WHIP is lower as well (1.11 compared to 1.23). A team's record should not come into play when deciding the Cy Young. The award is handed out to the best pitcher in the league, not the best pitcher on the best team. Fact is, Webb has been a better so far this year.

I agree that the teams record should not be taken into consideration... but unfortunately it sometimes is.

 

A teams record is also indirectly taken into consideration because the number one criterion used for evaluating the Cy Young winner is wins (not that it is the correct way). Who is more likely to get wins, the pitcher on a first place team or a pitcher on a fifth place team? Look at last year. Clemens was the best pitcher in the league but got no run support. Carpenter played for the best team in the league, got run support, and won the Cy Young even though his ERA was almost a point higher than Clemens' because he went 21-5 while Clemens went 13-8.

[Andy]

Brandon Webb is 11-3 also and his ERA is .76 lower than Z's and Webb's WHIP is lower as well (1.11 compared to 1.23). A team's record should not come into play when deciding the Cy Young. The award is handed out to the best pitcher in the league, not the best pitcher on the best team. Fact is, Webb has been a better so far this year.

I agree that the teams record should not be taken into consideration... but unfortunately it sometimes is.

 

A teams record is also indirectly taken into consideration because the number one criterion used for evaluating the Cy Young winner is wins (not that it is the correct way). Who is more likely to get wins, the pitcher on a first place team or a pitcher on a fifth place team? Look at last year. Clemens was the best pitcher in the league but got no run support. Carpenter played for the best team in the league, got run support, and won the Cy Young even though his ERA was almost a point higher than Clemens' because he went 21-5 while Clemens went 13-8.

Usually, the record difference won't be that high though. What happened to Clemens last year was little short of legendary.

[Brad]

If Zambrano keeps up this winning streak, I think he has a great chance at getting the Cy Young.

[soccer10k]

Brandon Webb is 11-3 also and his ERA is .76 lower than Z's and Webb's WHIP is lower as well (1.11 compared to 1.23). A team's record should not come into play when deciding the Cy Young. The award is handed out to the best pitcher in the league, not the best pitcher on the best team. Fact is, Webb has been a better so far this year.

I agree that the teams record should not be taken into consideration... but unfortunately it sometimes is.

 

A teams record is also indirectly taken into consideration because the number one criterion used for evaluating the Cy Young winner is wins (not that it is the correct way). Who is more likely to get wins, the pitcher on a first place team or a pitcher on a fifth place team? Look at last year. Clemens was the best pitcher in the league but got no run support. Carpenter played for the best team in the league, got run support, and won the Cy Young even though his ERA was almost a point higher than Clemens' because he went 21-5 while Clemens went 13-8.

Usually, the record difference won't be that high though. What happened to Clemens last year was little short of legendary.

 

Again though, who is likely to get more wins: a player on a fifth place team or a player on a first place team? Nine times out of ten, it's going to be the player on a first place team.

 

Z is likely to get hurt in the eyes of the voters by playing for the Cubs because he is going to lose some victories that he would get if he played for a good team. He's probably lost a couple wins already this year and is likely to lose another couple over the course of the last two months of the season.

[TB_11]

A teams record is also indirectly taken into consideration because the number one criterion used for evaluating the Cy Young winner is wins (not that it is the correct way). Who is more likely to get wins, the pitcher on a first place team or a pitcher on a fifth place team? Look at last year. Clemens was the best pitcher in the league but got no run support. Carpenter played for the best team in the league, got run support, and won the Cy Young even though his ERA was almost a point higher than Clemens' because he went 21-5 while Clemens went 13-8.

 

Usually, the record difference won't be that high though. What happened to Clemens last year was little short of legendary.

 

If you're referring to the best pitcher getting hosed out of a Cy Young because his W-L wasn't the eye-catching, it's happened a few times in recent years:

 

2005 NL Cy Young went to Carpenter (21-5, 151 ERA+), should have gone to Clemens (13-8, 221 ERA+)

 

2005 AL Cy Young went to Bartolo Colon (21-8, 120 ERA+), should have gone to Santana (16-7, 153 ERA+)

 

2004 NL Cy Young went to Clemens (18-4, 145 ERA+), should have gone

to Randy Johnson (16-14, 171 ERA+)

 

2003 Al Cy Young went to Halladay (22-7, 145 ERA+), maybe could have gone to Pedro (14-4, 212 ERA+, but had 187 IP to Halladay's 266)

 

2002 AL Cy Young went to Zito (23-5, 169 ERA+), should have gone to Pedro (20-4, 196 ERA+)

 

2001 Al Cy Young went to Clemens (20-3, 128 ERA+), could have gone to Mays (17-13, 143 ERA+), Mussina (17-11, 142 ERA+), Garcia (18-6, 138 ERA+), or Buerhle (16-8, 140 ERA+).

[Catman61]

Again though, who is likely to get more wins: a player on a fifth place team or a player on a first place team? Nine times out of ten, it's going to be the player on a first place team.

 

Z is likely to get hurt in the eyes of the voters by playing for the Cubs because he is going to lose some victories that he would get if he played for a good team. He's probably lost a couple wins already this year and is likely to lose another couple over the course of the last two months of the season.

 

Carpenter and Z both have 6 starts with Game Scores over 50 that they got no decisions and each have a tough loss (game score over 50 & tagged with the loss)

 

Z has 1 more win, 1 less loss Carpenter has a lower ERA and WHIP, they are pretty close and the Cy Young predictor reflects as much

Webb - 114.6

Carpenter - 101.1

Zambrano - 100.4

 

http://proxy.espn.go.com/mlb/features/cy

[wastra]

I doubt most voters pay attention to anything aside from the gross cumulative stats:

 

W/L

ERA

K

IP

 

But these type of awards ARE generally driven by press as well-Dive into the stands and you'll get a gold glove when you're the 4th best defensive shortstop in your league, for instance.

 

So if Z can turn this consecutive win streak into something really memorable, he can sway a lot of voters simply due to the coverage he'll get by the media. Outside shot, probably, since he'll have a hard time on this team winning consistantly...but he's done it so far.

[goonys evil twin]

I doubt most voters pay attention to anything aside from the gross cumulative stats:

 

W/L

ERA

K

IP

 

But these type of awards ARE generally driven by press as well-Dive into the stands and you'll get a gold glove when you're the 4th best defensive shortstop in your league, for instance.

 

So if Z can turn this consecutive win streak into something really memorable, he can sway a lot of voters simply due to the coverage he'll get by the media. Outside shot, probably, since he'll have a hard time on this team winning consistantly...but he's done it so far.

 

IP would be way down that list. And instead of W/L I think they concentrate more on win totals. 20-12 would get more credit than 14-2.

[thedaymen]

I doubt most voters pay attention to anything aside from the gross cumulative stats:

 

W/L

ERA

K

IP

 

But these type of awards ARE generally driven by press as well-Dive into the stands and you'll get a gold glove when you're the 4th best defensive shortstop in your league, for instance.

 

So if Z can turn this consecutive win streak into something really memorable, he can sway a lot of voters simply due to the coverage he'll get by the media. Outside shot, probably, since he'll have a hard time on this team winning consistantly...but he's done it so far.

 

Because this award is voted upon by the baseball writer's associated ; I imagine Z will have a hard time winning such an award because he's a "bad guy" that has a "temper problem." How often when listening to road broadcasters do we here about his wild temper? He'll have to win 20 and have the best era to even have a shot at this award until he's a couple years removed from his recent most recent controversy.

 

Unless he becomes a Red Sock, then his temper will be cute.

[Andy]

A teams record is also indirectly taken into consideration because the number one criterion used for evaluating the Cy Young winner is wins (not that it is the correct way). Who is more likely to get wins, the pitcher on a first place team or a pitcher on a fifth place team? Look at last year. Clemens was the best pitcher in the league but got no run support. Carpenter played for the best team in the league, got run support, and won the Cy Young even though his ERA was almost a point higher than Clemens' because he went 21-5 while Clemens went 13-8.

 

Usually, the record difference won't be that high though. What happened to Clemens last year was little short of legendary.

 

If you're referring to the best pitcher getting hosed out of a Cy Young because his W-L wasn't the eye-catching, it's happened a few times in recent years:

 

2005 NL Cy Young went to Carpenter (21-5, 151 ERA+), should have gone to Clemens (13-8, 221 ERA+)

 

2005 AL Cy Young went to Bartolo Colon (21-8, 120 ERA+), should have gone to Santana (16-7, 153 ERA+)

 

2004 NL Cy Young went to Clemens (18-4, 145 ERA+), should have gone

to Randy Johnson (16-14, 171 ERA+)

 

2003 Al Cy Young went to Halladay (22-7, 145 ERA+), maybe could have gone to Pedro (14-4, 212 ERA+, but had 187 IP to Halladay's 266)

 

2002 AL Cy Young went to Zito (23-5, 169 ERA+), should have gone to Pedro (20-4, 196 ERA+)

 

2001 Al Cy Young went to Clemens (20-3, 128 ERA+), could have gone to Mays (17-13, 143 ERA+), Mussina (17-11, 142 ERA+), Garcia (18-6, 138 ERA+), or Buerhle (16-8, 140 ERA+).

I was referring to his lack of run support. The Cy voters screw people every year. :D

[soccer10k]

I doubt most voters pay attention to anything aside from the gross cumulative stats:

 

W/L

ERA

K

IP

 

But these type of awards ARE generally driven by press as well-Dive into the stands and you'll get a gold glove when you're the 4th best defensive shortstop in your league, for instance.

 

So if Z can turn this consecutive win streak into something really memorable, he can sway a lot of voters simply due to the coverage he'll get by the media. Outside shot, probably, since he'll have a hard time on this team winning consistantly...but he's done it so far.

 

If Z can turn this consecutive win streak into something really memorable, he'll likely end up with the best record and most wins in the NL which would likely get him the Cy Young.

[Laura]

Cubs.com[/url]"]

The bullpen battled through and helped improve Zambrano's Cy Young resume with another victory. Zambrano is now tied for first in the National League with 12 wins and continues to lead the league in strikeouts with 152.

 

The optimistic pitcher said he's not focused on individual accolades right now.

 

"I think it's too soon to think about [the Cy Young Award]," Zambrano said. "I just want to keep pitching for my team and keep doing the best possible for this team to get into the pennant race. ... We still have a chance and I'm one of the guys who think that you never have to give up. At the end, when you have that 'X' that says you're eliminated, that's when you give up."

[Southpaw191679666239]

Cubs.com[/url]"]

We still have a chance and I'm one of the guys who think that you never have to give up. At the end, when you have that 'X' that says you're eliminated, that's when you give up."

 

I admire his heart, passion and energy... but this team was done way before Memorial Day. :(

[Sammy Sofa]

Knowing Carlos, he's probably thinking they can just have him pitch every other day and things will just work themselves out.

 

All hail Z!!!!!!

[Andy]

Not a Z-like effort from Carlos, but more than good enough to win. Gotta love him.

[soccer10k]

Z pitching decently against the second best team in the NL coupled with Carpenter struggling against the lowly Cubs should vault Z ahead of Carp in the NL Cy standings. Hopefully the Cubs can help Z out more by hitting Webb hard tomorrow.