Guzman isn't ready for this level yet...

[erik316wttn]

I know Guzman has only had two starts, but they were against two of the worst teams in baseball. He looked unimpressive (if not downright bad) in both of them. And it's not like the lineups (outside of Miguel Cabrera and Jason Bay) were all that tough.

 

I like the kid. He's got electirc stuff, but he can't control it. I think he'll be an effective starter one day, but today is not that day. He needs more time, period.

[goonys evil twin]

I know Guzman has only had two starts, but they were against two of the worst teams in baseball. He looked unimpressive (if not downright bad) in both of them. And it's not like the lineups (outside of Miguel Cabrera and Jason Bay) were all that tough.

 

I like the kid. He's got electirc stuff, but he can't control it. I think he'll be an effective starter one day, but today is not that day. He needs more time, period.

 

Lots of good pitchers looked like Guzman did in their debut (at times fantastic, at times out of control, but not in over his head).

[Brian]

I think he stays up till Wood returns, that is unless Hill is alot worse than him.

[Andy]

He's had two bad starts, that doesn't mean he's not ready for this level necessarily. It means that he has had two bad starts - nothing more.

 

Now if it's a month from now and he hasn't had a good start yet, then we can talk.

[jjgman21]

yet another example of the closer a guy gets to Wrigley Field, the more he refuses to throw strikes?

[CaliforniaRaisin]

I know Guzman has only had two starts, but they were against two of the worst teams in baseball. He looked unimpressive (if not downright bad) in both of them. And it's not like the lineups (outside of Miguel Cabrera and Jason Bay) were all that tough.

 

I like the kid. He's got electirc stuff, but he can't control it. I think he'll be an effective starter one day, but today is not that day. He needs more time, period.

 

Lots of good pitchers looked like Guzman did in their debut (at times fantastic, at times out of control, but not in over his head).

 

While I agree with you, I never felt Gooz was ready given how he was pitching at Iowa. He's still rusty from throwing so few innings the past few seasons and recovering from the injuries.

[CaliforniaRaisin]

yet another example of the closer a guy gets to Wrigley Field, the more he refuses to throw strikes?

 

Most pitchers' control gets worse as the pitch at higher levels, with better, more patient hitters at the higher level. This is especially so when they first reach a higher level.

 

I think it's more a case of a guy who's still working his way back from injuries.

[CubfaninCA]

well, his next 2 starts are against another bad lineup, san diego. see how he does against them and go from there.

[Jehrico]

Maddux got 5 starts in '86. He put up a 5.52 ERA with a 1.774 WHIP.

 

Guzman's a little worse after his first 2 starts...5.91 ERA and a 1.96 WHIP. He's given up 7 BBs and 2 HBP in 10.2 innings. His control in the minors has never been that bad. He has so far shown an ability to strike out more than a guy an inning, even with the control problems. I'm attributing this to a case of nerves (that's built up over 3 years thanks to injuries) for the time being. I like the idea of reevaluating when Wood comes up, see if he settles down after his 2nd or 3rd start.

[Guest]

After two starts, Marshall had all of 9 IP with a 7.71 ERA. I think it's a bit early to make any decisions about Guzman.

[Jon]

Maddux got 5 starts in '86. He put up a 5.52 ERA with a 1.774 WHIP.

 

Guzman's a little worse after his first 2 starts...5.91 ERA and a 1.96 WHIP. He's given up 7 BBs and 2 HBP in 10.2 innings. His control in the minors has never been that bad. He has so far shown an ability to strike out more than a guy an inning, even with the control problems. I'm attributing this to a case of nerves (that's built up over 3 years thanks to injuries) for the time being. I like the idea of reevaluating when Wood comes up, see if he settles down after his 2nd or 3rd start.

I don't think it's necessarily nerves. He just hasn't regained his control yet, which wasn't that much better in Iowa. He may not have walked as many batters, but it resulted in a lot of deep counts and long ABs. Of course, he was having the same problem in the AFL.

 

Guzman with the Cubs:

87 pitches, 52 strikes

104 pitches (yeow), 70 strikes

 

total:

191 - 122 strikes, 69 balls

 

Guzman at AAA:

85 pitches, 54 strikes

103 pitches (yeow again), 63 strikes

95 pitches, 56 strikes

 

total:

283 - 173 strikes, 110 balls

 

And here are Hill's numbers, just for the heck of it:

 

Hill at AAA:

79 pitches, 54 strikes

91 pitches, 60 strikes

98 pitches, 61 strikes

98 pitches, 63 strikes

 

total:

366 - 238 strikes, 128 balls

Edited May 4, 2006 by Jon

[goonys evil twin]

I know Guzman has only had two starts, but they were against two of the worst teams in baseball. He looked unimpressive (if not downright bad) in both of them. And it's not like the lineups (outside of Miguel Cabrera and Jason Bay) were all that tough.

 

I like the kid. He's got electirc stuff, but he can't control it. I think he'll be an effective starter one day, but today is not that day. He needs more time, period.

 

Lots of good pitchers looked like Guzman did in their debut (at times fantastic, at times out of control, but not in over his head).

 

While I agree with you, I never felt Gooz was ready given how he was pitching at Iowa. He's still rusty from throwing so few innings the past few seasons and recovering from the injuries.

 

Ready is a relative term. Few pitchers are ready when they are brought up. They struggle early and develop.

He's 24 years old, he's got 300+ professional innings under his belt. He might be rusty and he might not be ready to start 32 games in the bigs, but he's as ready as any prospect to get some time starting. And he's only doing it for emergency purposes.

[oldstyle81]

aardsma wasant ready for the big leagues, Guzman has the stuff, he just needs rothschild to convince him to use it

 

 

BTW if first impressions were everything, Ryne Sandberg would not be in the HOF after his 1-32 start

[ManCrushOnNomar]

It isn't like he got absolutely shelled, he just had some control problems. Luckily he was missing out of the zone as opposed to over the plate. I think you can attribute his bad outings to big league jitters, and they'll go away. He's shown flashes of awesome stuff, and I think he can deliver, just give him time to grow into his role.

[CaliforniaRaisin]

aardsma wasant ready for the big leagues, Guzman has the stuff, he just needs rothschild to convince him to use it

 

 

BTW if first impressions were everything, Ryne Sandberg would not be in the HOF after his 1-32 start

 

Aardsma has good stuff.

[JC]

Christ, I'm just happy Guzman hasn't had a leg fall off or something. I'll take my chances with him as long as he simply can still pitch...

[TXCubsFan]

When (if?) Wood and Prior return, should the Cubs return Guzman to Iowa or keep him in long relief, like they did with Zambrano early in his career?

[Jehrico]

Maddux got 5 starts in '86. He put up a 5.52 ERA with a 1.774 WHIP.

 

Guzman's a little worse after his first 2 starts...5.91 ERA and a 1.96 WHIP. He's given up 7 BBs and 2 HBP in 10.2 innings. His control in the minors has never been that bad. He has so far shown an ability to strike out more than a guy an inning, even with the control problems. I'm attributing this to a case of nerves (that's built up over 3 years thanks to injuries) for the time being. I like the idea of reevaluating when Wood comes up, see if he settles down after his 2nd or 3rd start.

I don't think it's necessarily nerves. He just hasn't regained his control yet, which wasn't that much better in Iowa. He may not have walked as many batters, but it resulted in a lot of deep counts and long ABs. Of course, he was having the same problem in the AFL.

 

Guzman with the Cubs:

87 pitches, 52 strikes

104 pitches (yeow), 70 strikes

 

total:

191 - 122 strikes, 69 balls

 

Guzman at AAA:

85 pitches, 54 strikes

103 pitches (yeow again), 63 strikes

95 pitches, 56 strikes

 

total:

283 - 173 strikes, 110 balls

 

And here are Hill's numbers, just for the heck of it:

 

Hill at AAA:

79 pitches, 54 strikes

91 pitches, 60 strikes

98 pitches, 61 strikes

98 pitches, 63 strikes

 

total:

366 - 238 strikes, 128 balls

 

That's about a 64% ratio of strikes to pitches thrown for Guzman, while Hill is at 65%. That's really not that bad of control on either part. I don't Guzman's problem is control, he can throw his share of strikes. He's thinking too much. When he gets ahead of someone, he starts picking the corners and missing. There are some momentary bouts of wildness, but overall, it appeared to me like he's trying to hard to make the perfect pitch with 3 strikes and he ends up running up his pitch totals and even giving a few walks away. Either that, or he's doing the same thing if he gets behind 1-0 or 2-0 in the count. I can't read his mind of course, but I think he's trying to hard to pitch like a finesse pitcher rather than pitching like a power pitcher with nasty stuff like we know he can.

[NCCubFan]

When (if?) Wood and Prior return, should the Cubs return Guzman to Iowa or keep him in long relief, like they did with Zambrano early in his career?

I hope they send him back to Iowa to start. As much time as he missed the past few years, I think he needs regular action, not pitching out of the bullpen.

[bobbyd20]

Guzman will look fine as soon as some other team trots out a lineup as impatient at the plate at the Cubs.

[Soul]

Christ, I'm just happy Guzman hasn't had a leg fall off or something. I'll take my chances with him as long as he simply can still pitch...

 

Haha. Sad but true. It really has come to that, at least until we get Woody & Prior back.