Barry Rozner wonders does Dusty want to be fired?

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

In his article is yesterday's Daily Herald, Barry Rozner raises the question whether Dusty is making statements designed to get him out of Chicago.

 

Here's his lead in:

 

Unless the Cubs start bailing water, the rest of the season will be devoted to the Daily Dusty, a game of chicken with Cubs manager Dusty Baker seemingly trying to get fired, while Cubs management denies the possibility, praises him and perhaps hopes he will walk away on his own.

 

It’s possible neither will happen and Baker will be forced — albeit at $4 million — to manage the Cubs in 2006.

 

 

Rozner goes on to mention that Dusty is making rather strange comments that constantly seem to raise the ire of management.

 

He mentions Dusty discussion the possible retirement of Maddux to the statements regarding putting Wood back in the rotation this year.

 

Rozner compares what Baker is doing here to the games he played in San Francisco at the end of his tenure there.

 

What seems obvious is that Baker doesn’t want to be here anymore and that he’s starting to play the same game he did in San Francisco, where he put the blame for his departure on ownership, while getting sympathy from a fawning media and fan base.

 

It’s not working here, but Baker is resorting to many of the same tactics, making himself the victim of second-guessers and cheap shots, instead of a manager responsible for a team lacking fire, fundamentals and fan support.

 

 

The article raises some serious questions about Baker and what could happen here in Chicago if he isn't let go. Nice article all around.

[Ram1380]

Typical Baker, oh how I loathe this phony, self serving, pile of dog squeeze.

[Backtobanks]

I think both the Cubs and Baker are playing kind of cat-and-mouse game to figure out a way to get Baker out of Chicago after this season. Many people have pointed out that Baker & Hendry are not on the same page, as much as they both try to deny it. Hendry had been pushing for the kids to play and Dempster to close all season. Hendry has pointed out that it's Baker's job to run the day-to-day, on-field activities and he (Hendry) isn't going to interfere. I think it is going to be an interesting off season for the Cubs.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

I think both the Cubs and Baker are playing kind of cat-and-mouse game to figure out a way to get Baker out of Chicago after this season. Many people have pointed out that Baker & Hendry are not on the same page, as much as they both try to deny it. Hendry had been pushing for the kids to play and Dempster to close all season. Hendry has pointed out that it's Baker's job to run the day-to-day, on-field activities and he (Hendry) isn't going to interfere. I think it is going to be an interesting off season for the Cubs.

 

I agree. I think the best case scenario would be for the Cubs and Baker to sit down and agree on a mutual buy-out. Possibly, the Cubs pay Baker 2 million to go away and he is free to manage elsewhere. This makes too much sense, so I doubt it happens at all.

[frostwyrm]

Everything would be simpler if Hendry hadn't given Baker a 4 year contract. I expect the next Cubs manager will get a 3 year deal at the most.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

I don't have a problem with a four year deal as long as you aren't paying four million a year for four years. It's a lot easier to eat the last year of the contract for a manager when it isn't that much money.

[10man]

I still stick to the line that Hendry signed Baker 2 years too long. I cannot wait for this contract to be up.

[rawaction]

It is gonna be interesting. What positions are gonna be opening up that may attract Dusty? I do think he is tiring of this team and the city. I do think that Hendry would like a lower profile manager at the helm. So much was expected of Dusty's Cubs.

 

I think it would be in everyone's best interest to part ways. Dusty can go manage under less scrutiny in Seattle or somewhere. Hendry can get his first firing out of the way and possibly buy himself some more time (if Dusty is back and the Cubs finish under .500 this and next year, Hendry has to go too) by starting in a new direction. And most importantly, the Cubs will be a better team for it all.

[frostwyrm]

I can envision some hilarious scenarios in which Dusty is on a small market team that is forced to rebuild from within, yet he still refuses to play the youngsters. Or he could end up in a big market with a media and fan base that are far less forgiving of failure than Chicago. Dusty thinks he has it bad in Chicago, but it can get a whole lot worse for him depending on where he goes.

[rawaction]

I can envision some hilarious scenarios in which Dusty is on a small market team that is forced to rebuild from within, yet he still refuses to play the youngsters. Or he could end up in a big market with a media and fan base that are far less forgiving of failure than Chicago. Dusty thinks he has it bad in Chicago, but it can get a whole lot worse for him depending on where he goes.

 

Look toward Tampa for that hilarious scenario.

 

As for Dusty, I mentioned Seattle in my last post. They aren't doing too well, and I could see that being a decent fit in some ways. Doesn't Dusty's kid still live in the SF area? Seattle would be the closest to home position he could possibly get. There are some players in place to at least make an interesting team the next few years. He would have veterans Beltre, Sexson, Ichiro, Ibanez, and whoever's catching to throw out there everday. Of course he would also be forced to play guys like Reed, Snelling, and Morse. They have spent money in the past and may do so again. And there's always Felix Hernandez for him to run into the ground.

[Backtobanks]

It is gonna be interesting. What positions are gonna be opening up that may attract Dusty? I do think he is tiring of this team and the city. I do think that Hendry would like a lower profile manager at the helm. So much was expected of Dusty's Cubs.

 

I think it would be in everyone's best interest to part ways. Dusty can go manage under less scrutiny in Seattle or somewhere. Hendry can get his first firing out of the way and possibly buy himself some more time (if Dusty is back and the Cubs finish under .500 this and next year, Hendry has to go too) by starting in a new direction. And most importantly, the Cubs will be a better team for it all.

 

I think the wording will be very important (i.e. kind of a mutual decision to release Baker for another job). I don't think they will use words like "fired" or "quit" as both sides will say wonderful things about each other. Of course all of us will know the truth.

[frostwyrm]

Wherever Baker goes I hope he has input in personnel decisions. Much comedy would ensue if he could get Neifi, Estes, Holla, and Macias signed to his new team

[Cubfanintheknow]

I still stick to the line that Hendry signed Baker 2 years too long. I cannot wait for this contract to be up.

 

Except that there's no way Baker would come here for anything less than four years. And Jim Hendry wanted him badly enough to give it to him.

[Soul]

I still stick to the line that Hendry signed Baker 2 years too long. I cannot wait for this contract to be up.

 

Except that there's no way Baker would come here for anything less than four years. And Jim Hendry wanted him badly enough to give it to him.

 

Right. So again: how is Hendry escaping the axe? I never hear any media on his case, nobody ever examines the endless train of bad moves he has made to get us in this position, the incredible ignorance of players who were obviously not capable of staying injury free, the blind seeking of Dusty Baker without knowing anything about his lack of actual managerial skills.

 

In my view this whole debacle rests right at the feet of one Mr. Jim Hendry. Every season has been worse than the last. Every year a deeper nightmare. Sure he made a couple good moves in 2003. Good for him. GM's with TALENT make great moves every single season. Witness Jocketty and Beane. Hendry couldn't touch their jock straps.

 

It's time for Hendry to go back to running the minor leagues and bring in an actual talented GM.

[rawaction]

I still stick to the line that Hendry signed Baker 2 years too long. I cannot wait for this contract to be up.

 

Except that there's no way Baker would come here for anything less than four years. And Jim Hendry wanted him badly enough to give it to him.

 

Right. So again: how is Hendry escaping the axe? I never hear any media on his case, nobody ever examines the endless train of bad moves he has made to get us in this position, the incredible ignorance of players who were obviously not capable of staying injury free, the blind seeking of Dusty Baker without knowing anything about his lack of actual managerial skills.

 

In my view this whole debacle rests right at the feet of one Mr. Jim Hendry. Every season has been worse than the last. Every year a deeper nightmare. Sure he made a couple good moves in 2003. Good for him. GM's with TALENT make great moves every single season. Witness Jocketty and Beane. Hendry couldn't touch their jock straps.

 

It's time for Hendry to go back to running the minor leagues and bring in an actual talented GM.

 

That's a completely unfair assessment. What "endless train of bad moves"? Alfonseca, Estes, Maddux, and not getting full value for Sosa (he was obviously put in a bad spot) is all I count. There are plenty more good than bad moves. You can't honestly complain about the trades he's made. You can't complain about the FA signings too much, especially in light of the money and years the non-Cubs have received.

[Cubfanintheknow]

I still stick to the line that Hendry signed Baker 2 years too long. I cannot wait for this contract to be up.

 

Except that there's no way Baker would come here for anything less than four years. And Jim Hendry wanted him badly enough to give it to him.

 

Right. So again: how is Hendry escaping the axe? I never hear any media on his case, nobody ever examines the endless train of bad moves he has made to get us in this position, the incredible ignorance of players who were obviously not capable of staying injury free, the blind seeking of Dusty Baker without knowing anything about his lack of actual managerial skills.

 

In my view this whole debacle rests right at the feet of one Mr. Jim Hendry. Every season has been worse than the last. Every year a deeper nightmare. Sure he made a couple good moves in 2003. Good for him. GM's with TALENT make great moves every single season. Witness Jocketty and Beane. Hendry couldn't touch their jock straps.

 

It's time for Hendry to go back to running the minor leagues and bring in an actual talented GM.

 

Talent-wise, the Cubs are probably not as bad as their record indicates. They sould be a couple games over .500 unstead of five games under. I really don't have a problem with most of the Cubs roster as it stands--which is Hendry's job--but I don't like the way it's being used--which is Baker's job.

[Soul]

I still stick to the line that Hendry signed Baker 2 years too long. I cannot wait for this contract to be up.

 

Except that there's no way Baker would come here for anything less than four years. And Jim Hendry wanted him badly enough to give it to him.

 

Right. So again: how is Hendry escaping the axe? I never hear any media on his case, nobody ever examines the endless train of bad moves he has made to get us in this position, the incredible ignorance of players who were obviously not capable of staying injury free, the blind seeking of Dusty Baker without knowing anything about his lack of actual managerial skills.

 

In my view this whole debacle rests right at the feet of one Mr. Jim Hendry. Every season has been worse than the last. Every year a deeper nightmare. Sure he made a couple good moves in 2003. Good for him. GM's with TALENT make great moves every single season. Witness Jocketty and Beane. Hendry couldn't touch their jock straps.

 

It's time for Hendry to go back to running the minor leagues and bring in an actual talented GM.

 

That's a completely unfair assessment. What "endless train of bad moves"? Alfonseca, Estes, Maddux, and not getting full value for Sosa (he was obviously put in a bad spot) is all I count. There are plenty more good than bad moves. You can't honestly complain about the trades he's made. You can't complain about the FA signings too much, especially in light of the money and years the non-Cubs have received.

 

Oh come on. Unfair assessment? The Garciaparra signing---everyone knew he would be injured for the season. If you didn't, then you weren't seeing him objectively. No closer-----NO CLOSER. No middle relief of consequence. Keeping Remlinger. Keeping Macias on the team. Thinking Neifi was the answer if Nomar went down. Hollandsworth.

 

Clement. CLEMENT!

 

Add those to your list. It's been all downill since '03, my fellow Cub fan. And Hendry has been at the center of it all.

Edited August 14, 2005 by Soul

[Soul]

I still stick to the line that Hendry signed Baker 2 years too long. I cannot wait for this contract to be up.

 

Except that there's no way Baker would come here for anything less than four years. And Jim Hendry wanted him badly enough to give it to him.

 

Right. So again: how is Hendry escaping the axe? I never hear any media on his case, nobody ever examines the endless train of bad moves he has made to get us in this position, the incredible ignorance of players who were obviously not capable of staying injury free, the blind seeking of Dusty Baker without knowing anything about his lack of actual managerial skills.

 

In my view this whole debacle rests right at the feet of one Mr. Jim Hendry. Every season has been worse than the last. Every year a deeper nightmare. Sure he made a couple good moves in 2003. Good for him. GM's with TALENT make great moves every single season. Witness Jocketty and Beane. Hendry couldn't touch their jock straps.

 

It's time for Hendry to go back to running the minor leagues and bring in an actual talented GM.

 

Talent-wise, the Cubs are probably not as bad as their record indicates. They sould be a couple games over .500 unstead of five games under. I really don't have a problem with most of the Cubs roster as it stands--which is Hendry's job--but I don't like the way it's being used--which is Baker's job.

 

I see. And who wanted Baker to be his manager? Case closed.

[hawkeyecub]

 

Oh come on. Unfair assessment? The Garciaparra signing---everyone knew he would be injured for the season. If you didn't, then you weren't seeing him objectively. No closer-----NO CLOSER. No middle relief of consequence. Keeping Remlinger. Keeping Macias on the team. Thinking Neifi was the answer if Nomar went down. Hollandsworth.

 

Clement. CLEMENT!

 

Add those to your list. It's been all downill since '03, my fellow Cub fan. And Hendry has been at the center of it all.

 

You knew Nomar was going to be injured for the season? Wow you have some amazing talents.

No closer? We have a solid closer in Dempster. Hendry was intent on making him the closer all winter. At some point during spring training either he or Dusty decided with the injuries of Prior and Wood he should be shifted to starter.

What middle relief did you want him to sign? Middle relievers aren't worth giving big dollars to because they're so inconsistent. Remlinger and Hawkins were two of the top relief options when we signed them.

Honestly who else were you going to sign to backup Nomar who was willing to be a backup? Please, give me one example of someone who would have been a major upgrade on Neifi that was willing to play behind Nomar.

You wanted him to re-sign Clement and also make those other upgrades on the same budget? How was he going to do that? Besides, Matt hasn't exactly been pitching up to that contract this year.

Hollandsworth is fine as a 4th OF. Hendry doesn't pencil in the lineups everyday.

Where was he going to dump Remlinger without eating almost his entire contract?

Macias is fine as a 25th man. Again, Hendry doesn't fill in the lineups.

 

For all of your complaints, I'd like to see what you would have done on a similar budget to counteract the poor decisions that you think Hendry made.

[cbbryan]

I still stick to the line that Hendry signed Baker 2 years too long. I cannot wait for this contract to be up.

 

Except that there's no way Baker would come here for anything less than four years. And Jim Hendry wanted him badly enough to give it to him.

 

Right. So again: how is Hendry escaping the axe? I never hear any media on his case, nobody ever examines the endless train of bad moves he has made to get us in this position, the incredible ignorance of players who were obviously not capable of staying injury free, the blind seeking of Dusty Baker without knowing anything about his lack of actual managerial skills.

 

In my view this whole debacle rests right at the feet of one Mr. Jim Hendry. Every season has been worse than the last. Every year a deeper nightmare. Sure he made a couple good moves in 2003. Good for him. GM's with TALENT make great moves every single season. Witness Jocketty and Beane. Hendry couldn't touch their jock straps.

 

It's time for Hendry to go back to running the minor leagues and bring in an actual talented GM.

 

That's a completely unfair assessment. What "endless train of bad moves"? Alfonseca, Estes, Maddux, and not getting full value for Sosa (he was obviously put in a bad spot) is all I count. There are plenty more good than bad moves. You can't honestly complain about the trades he's made. You can't complain about the FA signings too much, especially in light of the money and years the non-Cubs have received.

 

Oh come on. Unfair assessment? The Garciaparra signing---everyone knew he would be injured for the season. If you didn't, then you weren't seeing him objectively. No closer-----NO CLOSER. No middle relief of consequence. Keeping Remlinger. Keeping Macias on the team. Thinking Neifi was the answer if Nomar went down. Hollandsworth.

 

Clement. CLEMENT!

 

Add those to your list. It's been all downill since '03, my fellow Cub fan. And Hendry has been at the center of it all.

 

To a certain point, I agree. I think there have been questionable moves on Hendry's part. I don't know that everyone "knew" that Garciaparra was going to be hurt.........how do you project a torn groin? I think for what was on the market, 8.25 million was a tad too high. I would have rather gone after Renteria...........I don't know that he'd have been any better at this point (w/ the exception that he's actually played.).

 

Neifi was signed to be a utility guy in my mind. Again, they didn't project, nor can you project that Nomar would be out w/ a serious injury for that long. Neifi wasn't suppose to be in the starting line-up that often.

 

Macias is awful and shouldn't see the field once a week. I'm a bit frustrated that he has a roster spot. Remmy was old and not used properly. I can't say that I was that upset when he was signed though. He was old, but I thought he'd contribute more then he did.

 

The one thing I will agree w/ you on is Clement. I'm usually pretty upset if a prospect that I like ends up on another team and does well.............ala Sisco and we get nothing in return. I wouldn't have anything against the trading of Willis for Clement (I know Alf and Taverez were involved too.), but when you make a trade like that...............YOU HAVE TO SIGN CLEMENT. You don't trade Willis and then let Clement go. I know that it would have been tough to keep him "with-in the budget," but it would have only been for this year that you'd been alittle over what you wanted to spend.

 

Other then that trade, I've actually like his other moves and I'd like that move if Clement was still a Cub.

 

Hendry can give Baker all the ingredients for success............Baker's gotta make it work on the field and he just plain hasn't gotten it done.

[Soul]

 

Oh come on. Unfair assessment? The Garciaparra signing---everyone knew he would be injured for the season. If you didn't, then you weren't seeing him objectively. No closer-----NO CLOSER. No middle relief of consequence. Keeping Remlinger. Keeping Macias on the team. Thinking Neifi was the answer if Nomar went down. Hollandsworth.

 

Clement. CLEMENT!

 

Add those to your list. It's been all downill since '03, my fellow Cub fan. And Hendry has been at the center of it all.

 

You knew Nomar was going to be injured for the season? Wow you have some amazing talents.

No closer? We have a solid closer in Dempster. Hendry was intent on making him the closer all winter. At some point during spring training either he or Dusty decided with the injuries of Prior and Wood he should be shifted to starter.

What middle relief did you want him to sign? Middle relievers aren't worth giving big dollars to because they're so inconsistent. Remlinger and Hawkins were two of the top relief options when we signed them.

Honestly who else were you going to sign to backup Nomar who was willing to be a backup? Please, give me one example of someone who would have been a major upgrade on Neifi that was willing to play behind Nomar.

You wanted him to re-sign Clement and also make those other upgrades on the same budget? How was he going to do that? Besides, Matt hasn't exactly been pitching up to that contract this year.

Hollandsworth is fine as a 4th OF. Hendry doesn't pencil in the lineups everyday.

Where was he going to dump Remlinger without eating almost his entire contract?

Macias is fine as a 25th man. Again, Hendry doesn't fill in the lineups.

 

For all of your complaints, I'd like to see what you would have done on a similar budget to counteract the poor decisions that you think Hendry made.

 

Yes, I knew Nomar was going down for the season in February. And I wasn't the only one. Didn't take any talent at all----he always goes down. He's made of glass.

 

Solid closer in Dempster?? How about having a solid closer coming out of spring training for a change, instead of blowing leads in April & May until you figure out what to do? There's a novel idea: have a good team coming out of spring training!! Oh, wait, it's only a novel idea in Wrigleyville. All the other winning teams have already figured that out.

 

Middle relief---wow, there were plenty of guys available. I'll give you one: Dustin Hermanson. He's done very, very well on the South Side. Yet Hendry didn't even give him a look. Why?

 

As for a backup to Nomar---how about signing a decent shortstop who isn't made of glass in the first place? Other than that, there is a massive laundry list of players who are better than Neifi Perez. He's junk and everyone knew it. Are you saying no other teams signed a backup shortstop who was better than Neifi Perez last offseason? That's a big glass of Cubbie Kool-ade!! You're allowed to drink it if you want to, of course. And I'm allowed to call it what it is.

 

Hendry already did dump Remlinger. So why wait until now?

 

So you're saying Macias is good for a guy with half his butt back in the minors? OK, I'll give you that. I expect more from my bench though. Especially when our bench is as woeful as it has been.

 

Budget? The Cubs have the biggest budget in the NL. Teams with less than 1/3 of our payroll are beating us in the standings. This isn't about budget. How can you possibly even bring that up, when the Cards are 20 games better than us on many, many millions less budget? How about the Stros? What's their budget----20 million less? 25?

 

Again----yes, Baker fills out the lineup cards. So who hired Baker? Yep---Hendry was the guy who wanted him. So sorry dude, but that one isn't going to fly either.

[Soul]

Hendry can give Baker all the ingredients for success............Baker's gotta make it work on the field and he just plain hasn't gotten it done.

 

Understood. Although, as I have been saying, if you hire a manager who can't get the job done, then at some point that also has to come back on you.

[cbbryan]

Hendry can give Baker all the ingredients for success............Baker's gotta make it work on the field and he just plain hasn't gotten it done.

 

Understood. Although, as I have been saying, if you hire a manager who can't get the job done, then at some point that also has to come back on you.

 

I'm not saying that Hendry doesn't deserve any blame. I'm just saying that Baker deserves more because he dictates who plays and how players are utilized. I think that if Baker manages this team next year and we see the same results, Hendry will hit the bricks w/ Baker.

 

Again, though. Baker has done a much worse job doing his job then Hendry. If Hendry corrects the problem...........he could save his job. If he doesn't correct the problem and continues to let Dusty manage this team into next year, then I would be in agreement that he would be gone.

 

 

One more thing...........just curious to know how everyone feels. If one argues that Hendry hired Baker, thus Hendry should be fired, or at least held accountable to the extent that Baker is...............what about MacPhail? Should MacPhail be under the gun because he hired Hendry and Hendry hired Dusty, or do we simply judge who gets fired by how they perform their major responsibilities w/ the team?

[Wheelimus]

Of course Dusty wants to be fired, he gets his money next year and can still go work someplace else.

 

More likely is management takes a more active role in telling him what to do, and if he doesn't like it he can QUIT, saving us the money.

 

In fact, if I were Cubs management, I'd start forcing the issue now by dictating who plays...

[hawkeyecub]

 

Yes, I knew Nomar was going down for the season in February. And I wasn't the only one. Didn't take any talent at all----he always goes down. He's made of glass.

 

Solid closer in Dempster?? How about having a solid closer coming out of spring training for a change, instead of blowing leads in April & May until you figure out what to do? There's a novel idea: have a good team coming out of spring training!! Oh, wait, it's only a novel idea in Wrigleyville. All the other winning teams have already figured that out.

 

Middle relief---wow, there were plenty of guys available. I'll give you one: Dustin Hermanson. He's done very, very well on the South Side. Yet Hendry didn't even give him a look. Why?

 

As for a backup to Nomar---how about signing a decent shortstop who isn't made of glass in the first place? Other than that, there is a massive laundry list of players who are better than Neifi Perez. He's junk and everyone knew it. Are you saying no other teams signed a backup shortstop who was better than Neifi Perez last offseason? That's a big glass of Cubbie Kool-ade!! You're allowed to drink it if you want to, of course. And I'm allowed to call it what it is.

 

Hendry already did dump Remlinger. So why wait until now?

 

So you're saying Macias is good for a guy with half his butt back in the minors? OK, I'll give you that. I expect more from my bench though. Especially when our bench is as woeful as it has been.

 

Budget? The Cubs have the biggest budget in the NL. Teams with less than 1/3 of our payroll are beating us in the standings. This isn't about budget. How can you possibly even bring that up, when the Cards are 20 games better than us on many, many millions less budget? How about the Stros? What's their budget----20 million less? 25?

 

Again----yes, Baker fills out the lineup cards. So who hired Baker? Yep---Hendry was the guy who wanted him. So sorry dude, but that one isn't going to fly either.

 

Your use of hyperbole is staggering.

You KNEW Nomar was going down FOR THE SEASON, because he always goes down and he's made of glass? Wow. Are you sure about that? From '97-2000 he never played fewer than 135 games. In '01 he missed almost the entire season. He played 156 games in '02 and 156 games in '03. Last year he played exactly half a season (81 games). So in his 9 career seasons coming into '05 there were only 2 seasons where he played less than 135 games. But you're right he's made of glass and always goes down. :roll:

 

Again, Hendry had a solid closer in Spring Training in Dempster. Many here were comfortable with Hawkins starting the season as closer because he had always been an effective reliever in the past.

Like I said as far as middle relief, I'm glad he didn't spend the big bucks. Relievers are incredibly inconsistent and for every Dustin Hermanson you name I can name 10 who have flopped after getting a big contract.

 

Why not dump Remlinger until now? Maybe because he wanted to see if he could still pitch. Early on he was effective when used properly.

 

I already adressed your bogus claim that Nomar is made of glass and has never stayed healthy. Again name me one backup SS who was available and better than Neifi. That's all I'm asking.

 

Don't use that "Cubbie Kool-Aid" condescending tone with me. That's the last thing I'm doing and the last thing I've done all season.