2024 AFL Thread

[Bertz]

Kyle Schwarber caught more innings in 2015 (the last season before his gruesome knee injury) than Ballesteros did here in 2024 🙃

[CubinNY]

5 minutes ago, Bertz said:

Kyle Schwarber caught more innings in 2015 (the last season before his gruesome knee injury) than Ballesteros did here in 2024 🙃

No. 

438 innins to 595 innigs. But whatever, he spent no time in the minors for 'development'. They knew he wasn't a catcher. 

[Bertz]

53 minutes ago, CubinNY said:

No. 

438 innins to 595 innigs. But whatever, he spent no time in the minors for 'development'. They knew he wasn't a catcher. 

Ah, I fat fingered Moises' innings and got 565.  Still Schwarber was at 574 (you didn't count MLB innings) so the broader point still stands that they're in largely the same position.  

The knee injury put a sudden and definitive end to Schwarber the catcher but their situations and their reputations are/were pretty similar.

[Jason Ross]

1 hour ago, CubinNY said:

Probably the fact that they didn't even try to see if Schwarber could catch. He spent about 1.3 full seasons in the minors and played OF more than catcher and not by a small percentagew. He was never a catcher in professional baseball in any real sense. It's not a "vibe". 

Kyle Schwarber played a third of his 2015 games at catcher upon being called up. It's fair to say that the Cubs didn't turn over the keys to him at catcher - but it's pretty hard to play 21 games behind the plate out of 60 and claim that he wasn't a catcher in any "real" sense. He was seen as a potential MLB catcher. He then tore his knee and all was abandoned there. 

As of today, I would be shocked if Ballesteros came up in 2025 and started 1/3rd of his games at catcher, for example, unless the sample size is super small and the Cubs are that far up/down in the standings.

[CubinNY]

18 minutes ago, 1908_Cubs said:

Kyle Schwarber played a third of his 2015 games at catcher upon being called up. It's fair to say that the Cubs didn't turn over the keys to him at catcher - but it's pretty hard to play 21 games behind the plate out of 60 and claim that he wasn't a catcher in any "real" sense. He was seen as a potential MLB catcher. He then tore his knee and all was abandoned there. 

As of today, I would be shocked if Ballesteros came up in 2025 and started 1/3rd of his games at catcher, for example, unless the sample size is super small and the Cubs are that far up/down in the standings.

where did he play 2/3 of the time? Did the Cubs have two catchers on the roster? He wasn't a catching prospect. 

[Jason Ross]

28 minutes ago, CubinNY said:

where did he play 2/3 of the time? Did the Cubs have two catchers on the roster? He wasn't a catching prospect. 

So I think we need a little history reminder here. In 2015, the Cubs were starting Miguel Montero at catcher. Montero finished the season with a 107 wRC+ and was worth 3.1 fWAR. Needless to say, the Chicago Cubs in 2015 didn't have a catching issue. The backup catcher was David Ross, who was used as a personal catcher for one of every five starts on top of his normal catching duties. Was he good in 2015? No. But no one was replacing him for those Lester starts, so it's not like there's going to be any movement there.

Kyle Schwarber was called up prior to the Cubs game on July 17th - Montero had been recently hurt. From July 17th until August 6th (right before Montero's re-call), Schwarber played 15 of his 19 games at catcher. After that, as the third catcher, he played...four games. 

So...to recap: 

1. The Cubs called up Kyle Schwarber upon their starting catcher being hurt. The only other partial call up prior was to be a DH in the AL, but his real callup coincided with a need at catcher.

2., Kyle Schwarber played a good deal of catcher during that time in which they needed a catcher.

3. Upon their good starting catcher returning, and having the need for a personal catcher for Lester, Schwarber played mostly LF. They did not need a catcher any more. 

4. Kyle Schwarber tore his knee to shreds the next season and we never really saw the experiment continue.

The Cubs didn't operate like a team who didn't see Kyle Schwarber as a potential catcher. They used him as a catcher when they needed him to, and then used him in other ways afterwards because the position was quite productive. 

This is also an odd hill to die on before Ballesteros comes up. He's logged zero innings at MLB catcher and so far in Triple-A is splitting time between C, DH and even a few moonlights at 1b. We have no idea how much he'll play at catcher at the MLB level - he may play more...currently his only MLB competition would be Miguel Amaya...far short of a catcher having a 3 win season. Now, the Cubs may add someone like Logan O'Hoppe, who they reportedly tried to trade for in July in which case, he probably wouldn't play at catcher at all over O'Hoppe or Amaya due to his defensive questions. They may add a backup type and he'd be able to force his way in. But we've yet to see any way shape or form how the Cubs view him at the level of Schwarber. So to say he's better than Schwarber based on this information...it's illogical. It doesn't follow a throughline. This is acting like the Cubs used Ballesteros a ton at the MLB level and Schwarber none. When the reality is Schwarber was originally called up as a catching solution to a catching injury and Ballesteros is in the AFL right now. At best it's an incomplete data set,(which suggests that the catching situation for both would be identical upon callup) at worse it's just misrepresenting how the Cubs used Schwarber in 2015.

[CaliforniaRaisin]

 

[CaliforniaRaisin]

 

[CaliforniaRaisin]

 

[Rex Buckingham]

I know AFL pitching is generally not very good, but it's so fun watching him continue to hit so well

[CubinNY]

9 hours ago, Rex Buckingham said:

I know AFL pitching is generally not very good, but it's so fun watching him continue to hit so well

A little better look at that body. He’s Vogelbach Jr. 

[CaliforniaRaisin]

 

[We Got The Whole 9]

Is Mo in the KB/Schwarber convo as far as offensive milb careers go?

[Bertz]

14 minutes ago, We Got The Whole 9 said:

Is Mo in the KB/Schwarber convo as far as offensive milb careers go?

He's likely going to debut in MLB at the same age where they were being drafted.

Guys who produce as much as Moises in the high minors as young as he is tend to turn into special players at a pretty good clip.

If you want to pump the breaks I'd point to two things:

- None of his contact, power, or patience numbers are off the charts.  So it's fair to question what that carrying tool will be towards stardom

- If he doesn't catch his bat has to clear the highest possible bar.  Schwarber is a great example: career 123 wRC+ but only 2.2 WAR per 600 plate appearances.  Schwarber without the postseason heroics is a pretty pedestrian player

[mul21]

On 10/26/2024 at 7:17 AM, CubinNY said:

A little better look at that body. He’s Vogelbach Jr. 

You say a lot of very definitive things with zero evidence to back you up.

[CubinNY]

15 minutes ago, mul21 said:

You say a lot of very definitive things with zero evidence to back you up.

dumbass, there is a video of him just above the post. 

[mul21]

Just now, CubinNY said:

dumbass, there is a video of him just above the post. 

Ah, yes, name calling.  I'd advise you to go look at Vogelbach in the minors.  This is a very, very bad take.

[CubinNY]

12 minutes ago, mul21 said:

Ah, yes, name calling.  I'd advise you to go look at Vogelbach in the minors.  This is a very, very bad take.

Here you go,

https://www.shutterstock.com/editorial/image-editorial/tacoma-first-baseman-dan-vogelbach-33-watches-5897264i

[CaliforniaRaisin]

105.6 mph EV, 407’

[Bertz]

I know the pitching down there is pretty sad, but an 1150 OPS is still extremely fun

[CubinNY]

20 minutes ago, Bertz said:

I know the pitching down there is pretty sad, but an 1150 OPS is still extremely fun

The sound of that is amazing 

[craig]

14 hours ago, Bertz said:

I know the pitching down there is pretty sad, but an 1150 OPS is still extremely fun

https://www.mlb.com/gameday/solar-sox-vs-saguaros/2024/10/28/787551/final/box

Not to be negative.  But looking at today's box score, his OPS is only 3rd on his team, and the other team had a higher-OPS guy too.   (One an age-24 CF, one a 21-year-old catcher with strong defensive scouting.  Obviously as always Moises' has the "for-his-age" appeal.  But every team in the AFL has one or more guys with numbers in his ballpark.). 

Young for age means a ton.  In his league, he's 9th in OPS, 8th in average, 3rd in HR.  Excellent for sure.   Especially for a catcher, less for a DH.  

Edited October 29, 2024 by craig

[We Got The Whole 9]

He homered again tonight 

[CaliforniaRaisin]

 

[CaliforniaRaisin]