General Cubs Chit-Chat

[Gmoney08]

 

Theo's much closer to making yet another costumed getaway than being able to do some laurel-resting.

 

He can leave in a gorilla suit and rest on his laurels easily.

 

He is a hall of famer if he loses 100 games the next 5 years and retires.

 

Well, that's certainly one way to stan for this guy. A weird one, IMO.

 

Isnt a stan overexagerrating someones success, being overly stubborn?

 

Where did I over embelish his accomplishments? If the Cubs totally tanked now after this great 5 year stretch and Theos 17 year stretch as a head exec would he not be a hall of famer?

 

He can definitely rest on his laurels if he had to. Obviously im sure he would like to add to his successes..

[Sammy Sofa]

Because who gives a damn what his reputation is going to be down the line? I mean, besides you and the two guys who liked that confounding post.

 

Like, why would Epstein's reputation when he finally retires have anything to do with taking a long hard look at the pricey declining team and terrible farm system he's presiding over right now? Who looks at the current state of the Cubs organization and gives themselves comfort by thinking, "well, at least Theo's rep is safe and secure when he finally calls it a day, who cares how the rest of it goes?"

 

It's weird.

[GaryWoods]

 

Yeah, the ever escalating horsefeathers of seeking out players like Chapman and Murphy, and the ongoing enabling of Russell, all while talking out of the other side of their mouth about things like character and whatnot. Seemingly just rolling right along with the owners crying poor, and then demonstrating rather (IMO) piss-poor ability to counter that limitation via, well, anything. Underwhelming at best trades, signings and drafts for several years, unimpressively inconsistent and flawed player development (I think all of the "Cubs Way" talk has demonstrated itself to be mostly horsefeathers fluff nonsense...or the Cubs Way is a horsefeathers way to develop most players. Take your pick)...nobody is going to deny they had an incredible surge that resulted in what we all wanted...but that's now sandwiched by multiple years first of terrible tanking, and now a steady slide that demonstrates more and more that these guys repeatedly dropped the ball in terms of maintaining just how damn good this team was (and building to both maintain it and setup for the future), and they've basically had to scramble to play catch up almost from the moment the WS was won.

 

I think just tossing out there that they're a "top 3 FO in baseball" like that's a given is a VERY generous stretch.

 

They have a track record going back to 03 that is pretty phenomenal.

 

You can argue about bringing Russell, Chapman and Murphy in but it is very hard to argue against their baseball results.

 

I also wouldnt have gave a horsefeathers if they got rid of Russell, but they I absolute understand the approach to try to help him rehabilitate his life as well. His ex was even in full support of it as well.

 

His ex could either support the decision or collect child support from Russell's salary working at Burger King. Not a tough decision.

 

That's just what I was thinking. She has a vested interest in him not being in jail.

[Sammy Sofa]

Jesus horsefeathering Christ.

[CoolHandLuke]

If a rich retired guy got divorced with a young child would he pay child support based on the zero dollars per year income, or would it be based on his worth derived from previously earned money?

[Bryants Disco Ball]

Theo punched his ticket to the Hall of Fame the night the Cubs won Game 7.

 

Now, whether someone thinks he should be a Hall of Famer certainly can be a discussion, but he's still already in.

[Sammy Sofa]

Theo punched his ticket to the Hall of Fame the night the Cubs won Game 7.

 

Now, whether someone thinks he should be a Hall of Famer certainly can be a discussion, but he's still already in.

 

It wasn't a debate or discussion anyone was actually having; it was an odd non-sequitur reply to people pointing out that the job Epstein and co. are currently doing is looking pretty shaky at best.

 

Let's not ignore the weirder part that multiple people would apparently be fine with their favorite baseball team being terrible for years because their favorite baseball executive is HoF-worthy.

[Bryants Disco Ball]

Theo punched his ticket to the Hall of Fame the night the Cubs won Game 7.

 

Now, whether someone thinks he should be a Hall of Famer certainly can be a discussion, but he's still already in.

 

It wasn't a debate or discussion anyone was actually having; it was an odd non-sequitur reply to people pointing out that the job Epstein and co. are currently doing is looking pretty shaky at best.

 

Let's not ignore the weirder part that multiple people would apparently be fine with their favorite baseball team being terrible for years because their favorite baseball executive is HoF-worthy.

 

Opps. I only got in on the end of the convo. My bad.

[GaryWoods]

If a rich retired guy got divorced with a young child would he pay child support based on the zero dollars per year income, or would it be based on his worth derived from previously earned money?

 

Varies by state. In my state, the formula for child support is based on the income differential. If he had no income and she had any income at all, the formula would require her to pay him child support (provided they shared custody).

 

That doesn't mean that she can't demand a chunk of his wealth to take care of the kid or that the court wouldn't order it, but that falls under division of assets rather than child support.

[Gmoney08]

Theo punched his ticket to the Hall of Fame the night the Cubs won Game 7.

 

Now, whether someone thinks he should be a Hall of Famer certainly can be a discussion, but he's still already in.

 

It wasn't a debate or discussion anyone was actually having; it was an odd non-sequitur reply to people pointing out that the job Epstein and co. are currently doing is looking pretty shaky at best.

 

Let's not ignore the weirder part that multiple people would apparently be fine with their favorite baseball team being terrible for years because their favorite baseball executive is HoF-worthy.

 

You were the one with the stupid comment implying he cant rest on his "laurels."

 

I simply replied, that yes.. yes he can. His career speaks for himself..

 

No I dont want him to, nor does any Cubs fan but he clearly can easily never do a positive thing in baseball again and have had an amazing career.

[squally1313]

Theo punched his ticket to the Hall of Fame the night the Cubs won Game 7.

 

Now, whether someone thinks he should be a Hall of Famer certainly can be a discussion, but he's still already in.

 

It wasn't a debate or discussion anyone was actually having; it was an odd non-sequitur reply to people pointing out that the job Epstein and co. are currently doing is looking pretty shaky at best.

 

Let's not ignore the weirder part that multiple people would apparently be fine with their favorite baseball team being terrible for years because their favorite baseball executive is HoF-worthy.

 

You were the one with the stupid comment implying he cant rest on his "laurels."

 

I simply replied, that yes.. yes he can. His career speaks for himself..

 

No I dont want him to, nor does any Cubs fan but he clearly can easily never do a positive thing in baseball again and have had an amazing career.

 

Yes, that's accurate. The same goes for Jon Lester. Do you think Jon Lester is one of the best pitchers in baseball right now?

 

The game caught up to Theo.

[Gmoney08]

Theo punched his ticket to the Hall of Fame the night the Cubs won Game 7.

 

Now, whether someone thinks he should be a Hall of Famer certainly can be a discussion, but he's still already in.

 

It wasn't a debate or discussion anyone was actually having; it was an odd non-sequitur reply to people pointing out that the job Epstein and co. are currently doing is looking pretty shaky at best.

 

Let's not ignore the weirder part that multiple people would apparently be fine with their favorite baseball team being terrible for years because their favorite baseball executive is HoF-worthy.

 

It wasnt non-sequitur at all, it was in reply to your asinine "laurels" comment.

 

And again you are embelishing, who in the hell said we would be fine with the Cubs being terrible. All that was said is Theo's career is solidified as pretty successful no matter what happens going forward.

 

Since you have trouble with reading comprehension Ill use an example. Jon Lester has had a hell of a career, even if his ERA is 6+ the next five years.

 

That statement, just like the Theo statement does not imply that any of us want Lester to get rocked the next 5 years.

 

You are being dramatic.. which I guess is your nsbb persona of the last 2 years.

[Sammy Sofa]

Because I was pretty obviously talking about him being more likely to leave Chicago a la his flaming parachute jump from Boston as opposed to him being able to spend the rest of his time with the Cubs in a victory lap or resting on his laurels; the state of both the team and the farm system are clearly demonstrating that the former are obviously not the case. The Cubs haven't been operating from a position of strength for some time on either level, so to trot out that they're still run by a "top 3 FO" just because someday people will look fondly on Old Man Boy Genius going into the Hall doesn't mean a whole heck of a lot right now.

 

This whole, "I don't care how things go going forward because of the past" shtick is pretty goofy. That you think anyone here was arguing against Epstein's overall legacy or that it needed defending is even goofier.

Edited August 21, 2019 by Sammy Sofa

[squally1313]

 

You are being dramatic.. which I guess is your nsbb persona of the last 2 years.

 

Oh, just the last two years?

[Gmoney08]

 

It wasn't a debate or discussion anyone was actually having; it was an odd non-sequitur reply to people pointing out that the job Epstein and co. are currently doing is looking pretty shaky at best.

 

Let's not ignore the weirder part that multiple people would apparently be fine with their favorite baseball team being terrible for years because their favorite baseball executive is HoF-worthy.

 

You were the one with the stupid comment implying he cant rest on his "laurels."

 

I simply replied, that yes.. yes he can. His career speaks for himself..

 

No I dont want him to, nor does any Cubs fan but he clearly can easily never do a positive thing in baseball again and have had an amazing career.

 

Yes, that's accurate. The same goes for Jon Lester. Do you think Jon Lester is one of the best pitchers in baseball right now?

 

The game caught up to Theo.

 

I still dont think the game has caught up to Theo. He has evolved before. I think there is ebbs and flows to building a franchise and all FO will make some mistakes. If we have a few year spiral where Theo and company add on with even more mistakee then Ill agree that maybe be lost it.

 

Only time.will tell.

[squally1313]

 

You were the one with the stupid comment implying he cant rest on his "laurels."

 

I simply replied, that yes.. yes he can. His career speaks for himself..

 

No I dont want him to, nor does any Cubs fan but he clearly can easily never do a positive thing in baseball again and have had an amazing career.

 

Yes, that's accurate. The same goes for Jon Lester. Do you think Jon Lester is one of the best pitchers in baseball right now?

 

The game caught up to Theo.

 

I still dont think the game has caught up to Theo. He has evolved before. I think there is ebbs and flows to building a franchise and all FO will make some mistakes. If we have a few year spiral where Theo and company add on with even more mistakee then Ill agree that maybe be lost it.

 

Only time.will tell.

 

So you need a few more years AFTER the last two years? And I thought we were the idiots talking about him being terrible for five years in a row.

[Gmoney08]

That you think anyone here was arguing against Epstein's overall legacy or that it needed defending is even goofier.

 

Well you have plenty of goofy takes so why would I assume otherwise.

 

Also considering Laurel is synomous with past achievements and awards, aka legacy in baseball.. it would seem your quote was in direct argument to his overall legacy?

[CyHawk_Cub]

You guys are selling mojo short. He's been insufferable for way longer than 2 years.

 

 

 

 

 

just kidding, mojo

[Gmoney08]

 

Yes, that's accurate. The same goes for Jon Lester. Do you think Jon Lester is one of the best pitchers in baseball right now?

 

The game caught up to Theo.

 

I still dont think the game has caught up to Theo. He has evolved before. I think there is ebbs and flows to building a franchise and all FO will make some mistakes. If we have a few year spiral where Theo and company add on with even more mistakee then Ill agree that maybe be lost it.

 

Only time.will tell.

 

 

So you need a few more years AFTER the last two years? And I thought we were the idiots talking about him being terrible for five years in a row.

 

Yeah call me crazy for not wanting to kick him to the curb after an injury riddled 95 win season.

 

I trust his track record and his general intelligence. He has built at 3 to 4 phenomenal cores in 17 years. Even if this one tanks I would give the dude another shot to build another core.

[Sammy Sofa]

That you think anyone here was arguing against Epstein's overall legacy or that it needed defending is even goofier.

 

Well you have plenty of goofy takes so why would I assume otherwise.

 

Also considering Laurel is synomous with past achievements and awards, aka legacy in baseball.. it would seem your quote was in direct argument to his overall legacy?

 

Yes, again, I'm saying Epstein is in a position where he can't effectively just ride out his success to the end of his tenure with the Cubs. The moves his FO have made have left the team and farm system in shaky positions where they're seemingly constantly having to patch holes and fill pretty urgent needs and work off of their heels. All of their talk was like they were setting up a player drafting and development system that was going to keep them flush, and that has most certainly not even remotely come to pass after the main surge that led to the WS win. Couple that with some key bust/disappointing trades and FA signings and we're looking at an org that is on a downward trend without much relief in sight.

[Gmoney08]

That you think anyone here was arguing against Epstein's overall legacy or that it needed defending is even goofier.

 

Well you have plenty of goofy takes so why would I assume otherwise.

 

Also considering Laurel is synomous with past achievements and awards, aka legacy in baseball.. it would seem your quote was in direct argument to his overall legacy?

 

Yes, again, I'm saying Epstein is in a position where he can't effectively just ride out his success to the end of his tenure with the Cubs. The moves his FO have made have left the team and farm system in shaky positions where they're seemingly constantly having to patch holes and fill pretty urgent needs and work off of their heels. All of their talk was like they were setting up a player drafting and development system that was going to keep them flush, and that has most certainly not even remotely come to pass after the main surge that led to the WS win. Couple that with some key bust/disappointing trades and FA signings and we're looking at an org that is on a downward trend without much relief in sight.

 

Sure that isnt how you phrased it. I agree they need to retool a bit and the farm hasnt been incredibly impressive since the Eloy, Gleyber, Cease crop was moved.

 

I still trust Epstein to right the ship. Maybe you dont.. guess we will have to agree to disagree.

[Sammy Sofa]

 

I still dont think the game has caught up to Theo. He has evolved before. I think there is ebbs and flows to building a franchise and all FO will make some mistakes. If we have a few year spiral where Theo and company add on with even more mistakee then Ill agree that maybe be lost it.

 

Only time.will tell.

 

 

So you need a few more years AFTER the last two years? And I thought we were the idiots talking about him being terrible for five years in a row.

 

Yeah call me crazy for not wanting to kick him to the curb after an injury riddled 95 win season.

 

I trust his track record and his general intelligence. He has built at 3 to 4 phenomenal cores in 17 years. Even if this one tanks I would give the dude another shot to build another core.

 

Who was saying fire him after last year?

 

Though that said, you put the caveat of last season being the result of injuries, and now they're cruising in for about an 88 win season.

 

And the guy is signed with the Cubs for, what, 2 more seasons? All of his talk is how he's likely outta here after 10 years. He's going to need to stumble on a LOT of good picks and international signings in short order to right the ship before he goes.

[Sammy Sofa]

 

Well you have plenty of goofy takes so why would I assume otherwise.

 

Also considering Laurel is synomous with past achievements and awards, aka legacy in baseball.. it would seem your quote was in direct argument to his overall legacy?

 

Yes, again, I'm saying Epstein is in a position where he can't effectively just ride out his success to the end of his tenure with the Cubs.

 

Sure that isnt how you phrased it.

 

Theo's much closer to making yet another costumed getaway than being able to do some laurel-resting.

[squally1313]

 

I still dont think the game has caught up to Theo. He has evolved before. I think there is ebbs and flows to building a franchise and all FO will make some mistakes. If we have a few year spiral where Theo and company add on with even more mistakee then Ill agree that maybe be lost it.

 

Only time.will tell.

 

 

So you need a few more years AFTER the last two years? And I thought we were the idiots talking about him being terrible for five years in a row.

 

Yeah call me crazy for not wanting to kick him to the curb after an injury riddled 95 win season.

 

I trust his track record and his general intelligence. He has built at 3 to 4 phenomenal cores in 17 years. Even if this one tanks I would give the dude another shot to build another core.

 

Well I think the bigger picture that was touched on briefly is that people around here have grown a lot less fond of the guy who has brought in Chapman, Murphy, and kept Russell around.

 

Beyond that, you can't really point to a lot that he's done in the last couple years that have added to the short term or long term success of this club. The Darvish signing remains a miss, as was the Chatwood signing, as was the Morrow signing. Going into this season with that bullpen, with that bench, was a miss. He came through and got Castellanos, which is looking like a big pickup, but we're going to have to keep the pedal down through the end of September just to make the playoffs.

[Gmoney08]

 

 

So you need a few more years AFTER the last two years? And I thought we were the idiots talking about him being terrible for five years in a row.

 

Yeah call me crazy for not wanting to kick him to the curb after an injury riddled 95 win season.

 

I trust his track record and his general intelligence. He has built at 3 to 4 phenomenal cores in 17 years. Even if this one tanks I would give the dude another shot to build another core.

 

Who was saying fire him after last year?

 

Though that said, you put the caveat of last season being the result of injuries, and now they're cruising in for about an 88 win season.

 

And the guy is signed with the Cubs for, what, 2 more seasons? All of his talk is how he's likely outta here after 10 years. He's going to need to stumble on a LOT of good picks and international signings in short order to right the ship before he goes.

 

I said Id need a few more years to make a statement the game has caught up to Theo. Id still bet money on him being elite. If we dont have any influx of talent the next few years then I might jump aboard the "game caught up" quote.