Arrieta: Consider yourself lucky he lets you cheer for him

[Guest]

i dunno, i just feel like every time i try to make the case for arietta, grienke has the trump card. jake driving his era to within flinching distance of grienke's is really impressive, but grienke had a sub-2 era all year. blah blah era sucks, but it's a good representation of this story: jake's second half was historic, but grienke did what he did all year long. he's the cy young

 

and that in no way diminishes arietta's amazing run over these last two seasons. getting to see him win games 20 and 21 in person will be among my fondest moments as a fan

 

Meh, it's not THAT hard to make a case for Arrieta. ERA doesn't suck, there just better evaluation measures.

 

Arrieta beats Greinke in IP, Wins, hits/9, FIP, xFIP, K/9, fWAR, total strikeouts, Games Started, Complete Games, Complete Game Shutouts, HR rate. Their WHIPs are just about exactly he same.

 

I mean, what else does Greinke really have over him than a microscopic amount of ERA and a few less walks?

 

I guess I can see he consistency thing, but it's not like Arrieta's first half ERA of 2.6 was particularly bad, obviously. Greinke had a half over 2 as well, although still better than Arrieta's worse half.

 

I think you can make he case for Kershaw fairly easily, but for whatever reason I don't get the impression he will be that close in voting.

Your last sentence is the thing that gets me, though. Any argument I make for Jake over Greinke (other than second half dominance) says that Kershaw should be over both.

[seanimal]

ugh i'm flip-flopping like a mother effer over here

[weis21]

Has a club ever had both the ROY and CY in the same year?

 

I'm guessing so but surely it's rare

[Guest]

Has a club ever had both the ROY and CY in the same year?

 

I'm guessing so but surely it's rare

 

off the top of my head, i'm going to guess the 95 braves had both

 

edit - CRAP. completely forgot about nomo. chipper finished second.

[Guest]

Has a club ever had both the ROY and CY in the same year?

 

I'm guessing so but surely it's rare

Fernando?

 

eta -- Yep. He won both.

[Derwood]

Has a club ever had both the ROY and CY in the same year?

 

I'm guessing so but surely it's rare

Fernando?

 

eta -- Yep. He won both.

 

I don't think he meant both being the same player, just did one club win both awards

 

A quick search shows (since 1967):

 

1973: Baltimore Orioles (Jim Palmer, Al Bumbry)

1981: LA Dodgers (Valenzuela X2)

1983: Chicago White Sox (LaMarr Hoyt, Ron Kittle)

1994: Kansas City Royals (David Cone, Bob Hamelin)

[weis21]

Has a club ever had both the ROY and CY in the same year?

 

I'm guessing so but surely it's rare

Fernando?

 

eta -- Yep. He won both.

 

I don't think he meant both being the same player, just did one club win both awards

 

A quick search shows (since 1967):

 

1973: Baltimore Orioles (Jim Palmer, Al Bumbry)

1981: LA Dodgers (Valenzuela X2)

1983: Chicago White Sox (LaMarr Hoyt, Ron Kittle)

1994: Kansas City Royals (David Cone, Bob Hamelin)

I didn't, but I think Tim knew that, too. Thanks for the research, though. Maybe a little bit more common than I would have thought, but still not very often.

[Guest]

Has a club ever had both the ROY and CY in the same year?

 

I'm guessing so but surely it's rare

Fernando?

 

eta -- Yep. He won both.

 

I don't think he meant both being the same player, just did one club win both awards

 

A quick search shows (since 1967):

 

1973: Baltimore Orioles (Jim Palmer, Al Bumbry)

1981: LA Dodgers (Valenzuela X2)

1983: Chicago White Sox (LaMarr Hoyt, Ron Kittle)

1994: Kansas City Royals (David Cone, Bob Hamelin)

I didn't, but I think Tim knew that, too. Thanks for the research, though. Maybe a little bit more common than I would have thought, but still not very often.

I figured you didn't want that exclusively, but that such an occurrence would meet your criteria.

 

Plus he immediately leaped into mind as the only rookie Cy Young winner I can recall.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

I forgot Bob Hamelin was a thing.

[Guest]

I forgot Bob Hamelin was a thing.

 

since i had no idea who he was, i was so convinced that he was some old pitcher i had never heard of for whatever reason that i actually had the thought "i thought david cone was much older than that" cross my mind for a second

[weis21]

I forgot Bob Hamelin was a thing.

I have a bob hamelin signed baseball somewhere at my parent's house. i can't remember where it was bought, but it was basically a deal where you spend 20ish bucks and you get a box containing an MLB player signed ball. I think they advertised it as a chance to get a Cal Ripken/Griffey/Frank Thomas, etc. but I'm sure it was mostly bums like hamelin. Still somewhat cool, I guess. I think I got it at a place like K Mart or Wal Mart but that doesn't seem possible. Anybody else remember these??

[davell]

I remember some sort of cards you could buy at Walmart and there was an autographed one on top for like 10 bucks or so. I think I got a Carlos Delgado that way.

[Guest]

i dunno, i just feel like every time i try to make the case for arietta, grienke has the trump card. jake driving his era to within flinching distance of grienke's is really impressive, but grienke had a sub-2 era all year. blah blah era sucks, but it's a good representation of this story: jake's second half was historic, but grienke did what he did all year long. he's the cy young

 

and that in no way diminishes arietta's amazing run over these last two seasons. getting to see him win games 20 and 21 in person will be among my fondest moments as a fan

 

Meh, it's not THAT hard to make a case for Arrieta. ERA doesn't suck, there just better evaluation measures.

 

Arrieta beats Greinke in IP, Wins, hits/9, FIP, xFIP, K/9, fWAR, total strikeouts, Games Started, Complete Games, Complete Game Shutouts, HR rate. Their WHIPs are just about exactly he same.

 

I mean, what else does Greinke really have over him than a microscopic amount of ERA and a few less walks?

 

I guess I can see he consistency thing, but it's not like Arrieta's first half ERA of 2.6 was particularly bad, obviously. Greinke had a half over 2 as well, although still better than Arrieta's worse half.

 

I think you can make he case for Kershaw fairly easily, but for whatever reason I don't get the impression he will be that close in voting.

Your last sentence is the thing that gets me, though. Any argument I make for Jake over Greinke (other than second half dominance) says that Kershaw should be over both.

 

Yeah, it's going to be a fascinating vote. Definitely going to be the closest since the 2009 NL vote. Wainwright actually had the most 1st place votes but finished 3rd. A great case can be made for all three guys so it's not like we're going to hear the winner and wonder how the hell pitcher X won.

[Old Style]

Great Grantland piece on Arrieta & Bosio today.

 

http://grantland.com/the-triangle/2015-mlb-playoffs-jake-arrieta-dominance-chicago-cubs/

[Sammy Sofa]

That stupid question mark in the title makes me want to roll over in my grave.

[seanimal]

That stupid question mark in the title makes me want to roll over in my grave.

 

oh, sorry for your loss

[seanimal]

of being alive

[imb]

arrieta: good or?????

[Omar]

Bosio: Another Arrieta success story?

[Tracer Bullet]

better?

[Banedon]

http://i.imgur.com/PfRHlpI.jpg

[Guest]

[tweet]

[/tweet]

[seanimal]

is that a nicotine patch emoji?

[mul21]

is that a nicotine patch emoji?

 

If you hover over it, it says light brown skin. Not that that makes any more sense than a nicotine patch.

[biittner77]

I went to Mt. Vernon on a field trip on Friday. I saw a guy with an Orioles Arrieta shersey. I need to get one of those. The locals assume I'm an O's fan since I live here. Or maybe I'll wait for the Cubs to sign Weiters.