2013

[sneakypower]

Hendry ran the team into the ground in a desperate attempt to keep his job.

That or when the Trib/Zell finally allowed him (or even forced him) to spend money there weren't great options on the market for the long term deals. It's been put out there that the trib was more behind signing Soriano than Hendry, or at least forced him to add some years/$$. In no way am I a Hendry apologist but I think part of the awful contracts was him being forced to spend money by ownership.

 

I always get accused of bringing Hendry's name into these discussions and being a Hendry apologist, but many of you can't seem to discuss anything without bringing up Hendry As I've pointed out many times before that the situation was completely different because ownership gave Hendry the money and told him to buy a winning team. Theo has been given complete autonomy to spend money or cut payroll as he pleases. As for bloated contracts on a underperforming team, you might look at $262 million in contracts that the Red Sox are sending to the Dodgers and guess who negotiated those deals.

http://synthesis.net/wp-content/uploads/2008/01/emperor.jpg

[davell]

Hendry ran the team into the ground in a desperate attempt to keep his job.

That or when the Trib/Zell finally allowed him (or even forced him) to spend money there weren't great options on the market for the long term deals. It's been put out there that the trib was more behind signing Soriano than Hendry, or at least forced him to add some years/$$. In no way am I a Hendry apologist but I think part of the awful contracts was him being forced to spend money by ownership.

 

I always get accused of bringing Hendry's name into these discussions and being a Hendry apologist, but many of you can't seem to discuss anything without bringing up Hendry As I've pointed out many times before that the situation was completely different because ownership gave Hendry the money and told him to buy a winning team. Theo has been given complete autonomy to spend money or cut payroll as he pleases. As for bloated contracts on a underperforming team, you might look at $262 million in contracts that the Red Sox are sending to the Dodgers and guess who negotiated those deals.

 

 

BOY GENIUS!!!!!!!!! And you know what? That's not even a given. Lucchino wanted to compete so badly, they veered off the path Theo had put into place previously. Theo surely had something to do with signing those guys, but where he's learned and isn't making the same mistake twice, good ole Jimbo wouldn't have a single issue with giving Pujols 250 mill and probably a big name pitcher as well and we'd be right back to being a longterm 75 win team that needed a lot to go right to even sniff the playoffs.

 

Wait. That's not fair. Perhaps the owners of the Cubs pushed Jimbo into signing the same contracts that Theo did. And what path did Theo put into place? He already had his core before he took over.

 

It IS fair, because I won't even deny that Hendry may have had pressure to do those contracts. But he blamed Theo, therefore blaming Jimbo is fair game too. Theo's path was always build thru the system and add when it made sense to do so. Same thing he's starting out here doing. I listed reasons as to why Hendry was NOT a good GM and never did mention FA contracts.

[Sammy Sofa]

Stop saying Jimbo.

[davell]

Stop saying Jimbo.

 

Fine, but I'm thinking it.

[C.C.]

What did he draft that made a impact. Sorry guys I'm behind on following baseball with a divorce, marriage, law suits, and whatever else.

[Guest]

What did he draft that made a impact. Sorry guys I'm behind on following baseball with a divorce, marriage, law suits, and whatever else.

Pedroia, Ellsbury, Lester, Buccholz and Papelbon - a lot of the core players who were on their second WS team. He also drafted Rizzo, Casey Kelly and Reymond Fuentes and turned them into Adrian Gonzalez.

 

Also acquired their current top 3 prospects, Xander Bogaerts, Jackie Bradley and Matt Barnes.

[dew1679666265]

He was too player friendly in giving out NTC's.

 

This is the only thing I disagree with in your post. Hendry's penchant for giving NTCs has been massively overstated. The only oddball one he gave out was to Shark and I'm almost positive not one single NTC came back to bite us. By the time it made sense to trade any of the players with NTCs, I'm pretty sure their 10/5 rights had kicked in.

 

Used intelligently, NTCs can be an excellent way to bring down the total price of a contract, even slightly, and that's a good thing when you're wading out into the FA market.

[davell]

I didn't see discounts on Z or Soriano though. I see your overall point though with Lee and Aramis.

[dew1679666265]

I didn't see discounts on Z or Soriano though. I see your overall point though with Lee and Aramis.

 

Why do you think Hendry gave the players NTCs if it wasn't a necessary part of the contract? Just for the heck of it?

 

A GM doesn't give a player anything in a contract that isn't necessary to get the deal done - either he got the player to take a little less money (almost definitely the case with Aramis and Lee) or the player simply wouldn't sign the deal without the NTC. It may be either case with Z and Soriano, but I strongly doubt that Hendry offered them the NTC out of the goodness of his heart. The question then becomes, was inclusion of the NTC enough to make you want to not sign that player? On Z I'd say absolutely no - the contract was generally considered good at the time and it worked out pretty well for us overall - and with Soriano I'd say the NTC was the least of the problems with that contract - the NTC is irrelevant because nobody will trade for him anyway.

[davell]

Something I have no clue on, but wouldn't mind finding out is how many players were getting NTC's and what caliber of players were getting them. It certainly seemed like we had more than our fair share, considering we didn't have any teue superstars.

[Backtobanks]

[That or when the Trib/Zell finally allowed him (or even forced him) to spend money there weren't great options on the market for the long term deals. It's been put out there that the trib was more behind signing Soriano than Hendry, or at least forced him to add some years/$$. In no way am I a Hendry apologist but I think part of the awful contracts was him being forced to spend money by ownership.

 

I always get accused of bringing Hendry's name into these discussions and being a Hendry apologist, but many of you can't seem to discuss anything without bringing up Hendry As I've pointed out many times before that the situation was completely different because ownership gave Hendry the money and told him to buy a winning team. Theo has been given complete autonomy to spend money or cut payroll as he pleases. As for bloated contracts on a underperforming team, you might look at $262 million in contracts that the Red Sox are sending to the Dodgers and guess who negotiated those deals.

 

 

BOY GENIUS!!!!!!!!! And you know what? That's not even a given. Lucchino wanted to compete so badly, they veered off the path Theo had put into place previously. Theo surely had something to do with signing those guys, but where he's learned and isn't making the same mistake twice, good ole Jimbo wouldn't have a single issue with giving Pujols 250 mill and probably a big name pitcher as well and we'd be right back to being a longterm 75 win team that needed a lot to go right to even sniff the playoffs.

 

Wait. That's not fair. Perhaps the owners of the Cubs pushed Jimbo into signing the same contracts that Theo did. And what path did Theo put into place? He already had his core before he took over.

 

It IS fair, because I won't even deny that Hendry may have had pressure to do those contracts. But he blamed Theo, therefore blaming Jimbo is fair game too. Theo's path was always build thru the system and add when it made sense to do so. Same thing he's starting out here doing. I listed reasons as to why Hendry was NOT a good GM and never did mention FA contracts.

 

It's impossible for some of you to admit that Theo has any faults. Theo's record is that he took a team that averaged 89 wins per season for 5 years and turned it into a team that averaged 93 wins per season for the next 9 years. That is very impressive and he did it by drafting and developing young players and spending a ton of money on contracts. He now has complete autonomy to do and spend whatever he wants - something Hendry never had. I think he will improve the system and develop some young players, but if the Cubs win the WS it will be with a payroll that would make Hendry blush. The CBA and starting with 100 losses for a year or two will eventually make him get back into buying a winner.

[Guest]

I always get accused of bringing Hendry's name into these discussions and being a Hendry apologist, but many of you can't seem to discuss anything without bringing up Hendry As I've pointed out many times before that the situation was completely different because ownership gave Hendry the money and told him to buy a winning team. Theo has been given complete autonomy to spend money or cut payroll as he pleases. As for bloated contracts on a underperforming team, you might look at $262 million in contracts that the Red Sox are sending to the Dodgers and guess who negotiated those deals.

 

 

BOY GENIUS!!!!!!!!! And you know what? That's not even a given. Lucchino wanted to compete so badly, they veered off the path Theo had put into place previously. Theo surely had something to do with signing those guys, but where he's learned and isn't making the same mistake twice, good ole Jimbo wouldn't have a single issue with giving Pujols 250 mill and probably a big name pitcher as well and we'd be right back to being a longterm 75 win team that needed a lot to go right to even sniff the playoffs.

 

Wait. That's not fair. Perhaps the owners of the Cubs pushed Jimbo into signing the same contracts that Theo did. And what path did Theo put into place? He already had his core before he took over.

 

It IS fair, because I won't even deny that Hendry may have had pressure to do those contracts. But he blamed Theo, therefore blaming Jimbo is fair game too. Theo's path was always build thru the system and add when it made sense to do so. Same thing he's starting out here doing. I listed reasons as to why Hendry was NOT a good GM and never did mention FA contracts.

 

It's impossible for some of you to admit that Theo has any faults. Theo's record is that he took a team that averaged 89 wins per season for 5 years and turned it into a team that averaged 93 wins per season for the next 9 years. That is very impressive and he did it by drafting and developing young players and spending a ton of money on contracts. He now has complete autonomy to do and spend whatever he wants - something Hendry never had. I think he will improve the system and develop some young players, but if the Cubs win the WS it will be with a payroll that would make Hendry blush. The CBA and starting with 100 losses for a year or two will eventually make him get back into buying a winner.

 

Are you saying Hendry never had complete autonomy on his decisions? It's hilarious you say others can't admit Theo has faults when you've decided Hendry can't be blamed for problems during his tenure.

[Guest]

I think it's a testament to how good Theo is that he's been able to almost turn the MLB team over in so short a time. Now if he can find a taker for Soriano this off season it would be great.

 

Building from within has been pretty freaking hard with the collection of talent that Theo inherited from Hendry, Wilken, and Felita. However, his crew has already acquired a lot. My main complaint is that they aren't doing more spending to try to win today, but I think the Ricketts are banking money for the renovations.

[Beer Kaese]

My prediction for 2013 opening day lineup.

 

RF DeJesus

SS Castro

1B Rizzo

LF Soriano

3B Stewart

C Castillo

CF Jackson

2B Barney

P Garza

 

Soriano: This year his OPS by month was 500, 950, 900, 800. If next year it's 800, 850, 825 he can be traded in July. It will cost 10-12 mil but if he's packaged with say Clevenger or Wood the return will be better than trading Sori alone.

 

Stewart: If the broken bone in his hand was an issue, the Cubs would be stupid not to guarantee a couple mil to bring him back. 3B is a black hole and competition is a good thing.

 

Castillo: In my opinion, he makes Clevenger a nice piece to put in a deal.

 

Garza: If the Cubs believe he still has a career they need to bring him back.

[Little Slide Rooter]

I didn't see discounts on Z or Soriano though. I see your overall point though with Lee and Aramis.

 

Soriano was the opposite of a discount. If my memory serves, both the Angels and Phillies had similar 5-6 year offers on the table before Hendry outbid them and himself with the 8 year deal. And to be honest, as ugly as the contract was, I don't think that anyone could have predicted him to decline as quickly as he did after 2009. Anytime you give a 30 something a deal of that length, you're basically paying for 4-6 prime years if your lucky, and then the hope that they don't fall too far off a cliff after that.

[Backtobanks]

[

 

 

BOY GENIUS!!!!!!!!! And you know what? That's not even a given. Lucchino wanted to compete so badly, they veered off the path Theo had put into place previously. Theo surely had something to do with signing those guys, but where he's learned and isn't making the same mistake twice, good ole Jimbo wouldn't have a single issue with giving Pujols 250 mill and probably a big name pitcher as well and we'd be right back to being a longterm 75 win team that needed a lot to go right to even sniff the playoffs.

 

Wait. That's not fair. Perhaps the owners of the Cubs pushed Jimbo into signing the same contracts that Theo did. And what path did Theo put into place? He already had his core before he took over.

 

It IS fair, because I won't even deny that Hendry may have had pressure to do those contracts. But he blamed Theo, therefore blaming Jimbo is fair game too. Theo's path was always build thru the system and add when it made sense to do so. Same thing he's starting out here doing. I listed reasons as to why Hendry was NOT a good GM and never did mention FA contracts.

 

It's impossible for some of you to admit that Theo has any faults. Theo's record is that he took a team that averaged 89 wins per season for 5 years and turned it into a team that averaged 93 wins per season for the next 9 years. That is very impressive and he did it by drafting and developing young players and spending a ton of money on contracts. He now has complete autonomy to do and spend whatever he wants - something Hendry never had. I think he will improve the system and develop some young players, but if the Cubs win the WS it will be with a payroll that would make Hendry blush. The CBA and starting with 100 losses for a year or two will eventually make him get back into buying a winner.

 

Are you saying Hendry never had complete autonomy on his decisions? It's hilarious you say others can't admit Theo has faults when you've decided Hendry can't be blamed for problems during his tenure.

 

If you have read my posts you will see that I admitted that Hendry had faults and it was time to move on. Now that Theo has purged the organization of anything having to do with Hendry, I wonder how long it will take some posters to move on. Hendry never had complete autonomy like Theo has now. I'm still waiting for the Koolaide drinkers to admit that Theo has any faults or has ever made a mistake.

[davell]

Good God, can you honestly not see that Theo's track record has EARNED him complete control? Hendry had the exact same ability as Theo did. He had tons of advantages over the vast majority of the NL and instead of averaging 93 wins, he put together short runs of semi success, followed by periods of awfulness. He showed ZERO ability to change in the way the game dictated. He did not do a good job whatsoever. No GM is perfect, Theo included. What's happening there right now has his fingerprints all over it. But he has already admitted he made mistakes and took shortcuts during his final years there. Cutting corners. And yet, because he's admitted that and is taking the slower, more cautious approach here, you're upset with it. It's obvious you'd have jumped right back into FA in a big way, just as Hendry would have. Theo has made mistakesvin the past and will make them again. But I have no doubt he won't make the SAME mistakes over and over and that's what separates him from a Jim Hendry, with [expletive] ease. Edited August 26, 2012 by davell

[davell]

As for Theo mistakes since he's been here, the only ones I hold him accountable for are not signing Cespedes and relenting to the 4 year deal and not trading Garza last offseason, when it appears the plan all along was to trade him and they got burned. That's it. I've been OK with everything else, considering the plan has been to rebuild the mess that he inherited.

[Backtobanks]

Good God, can you honestly not see that Theo's track record has EARNED him complete control? Hendry had the exact same ability as Theo did. He had tons of advantages over the vast majority of the NL and instead of averaging 93 wins, he put together short runs of semi success, followed by periods of awfulness. He showed ZERO ability to change in the way the game dictated. He did not do a good job whatsoever. No GM is perfect, Theo included. What's happening there right now has his fingerprints all over it. But he has already admitted he made mistakes and took shortcuts during his final years there. Cutting corners. And yet, because he's admitted that and is taking the slower, more cautious approach here, you're upset with it. It's obvious you'd have jumped right back into FA in a big way, just as Hendry would have. Theo has made mistakesvin the past and will make them again. But I have no doubt he won't make the SAME mistakes over and over and that's what separates him from a Jim Hendry, with [expletive] ease.

 

I agree that Theo's track record has earned him complete control. Hendry did not have the same ability as Theo because he didn't inherit a consistent 89 win team. Theo's track record has no experience at taking a bad team and making them contenders. Theo's track record has no experience at selling off all assets and starting from scratch. As I've posted before, Theo will improve the system over the long haul, but I think the timeline is going to be much longer than anticipated. Two years of 90-105 losses isn't going to magically turn around without signing multiple FAs to fill all of the holes. As for jumping back into FA, yes starting with Cespedes and Darvish who are both young enough to plan for the future.

[davell]

You're right. Hendry didn't inherit an 89 win team. He inherited a team that had a damn good foundation that made the playoffs in year 2 for him. He fucked that team up within an extremely short time, spent wildly to get good again, had no plan whatsoever to stay good, and this is why Theo was brought in. To clean up a [expletive] mess. Sorry, but Theo was the right hire, whether he's managed a rebuild or not. You could quit bitching, try to see things how he's looking at it, or you can continue to moan and groan about what it is we're NOT doing. But you need to figure out the reason we're NOT spending big right now is because a very well thought of GM took a look at the roster he had inherited and saw that it was SO fucked up, a complete teardown was the best way to go.

[Irrelevant Dude]

This reminds of the bulls suck decade. Fool the fans into thinking that we'll suck for a couple years draft well and be awesome again. How'd that work out.

 

drose

Rose is not a good example of draft strategy because the Bulls were only able to draft him as a result of an extremely lucky bounce of a ping pong ball. If you remember, the Bulls only had a 1.7% chance of getting the first pick. Without that lucky bounce, they likely would have been stuck as a borderline playoff/lottery team for many more years.

[El Duderino]

You're right. Hendry didn't inherit an 89 win team. He inherited a team that had a damn good foundation that made the playoffs in year 2 for him. He [expletive] that team up within an extremely short time, spent wildly to get good again, had no plan whatsoever to stay good, and this is why Theo was brought in. To clean up a [expletive] mess. Sorry, but Theo was the right hire, whether he's managed a rebuild or not. You could quit bitching, try to see things how he's looking at it, or you can continue to moan and groan about what it is we're NOT doing. But you need to figure out the reason we're NOT spending big right now is because a very well thought of GM took a look at the roster he had inherited and saw that it was SO [expletive] up, a complete teardown was the best way to go.

 

http://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/well_done_sir.gif

[Guest]

Theo is really, really smart. Hendry isn't.

 

That's all that really matters to me.

[Backtobanks]

Theo is really, really smart. Hendry isn't.

 

That's all that really matters to me.

 

Yeah it's great that all of us smart people can post on message boards while the not-so-smart can be special assistant to the GM of the most successful franchise in the history of team sports.

[davell]

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