Chicago Bulls Playoff Thread

[UMFan83]

Coincidentally, tonight's win clinched the Central Division.

 

Hang another banner at the UC.

 

On a related note: NBA division titles might be the stupidest thing you can raise a banner for.

 

What makes it different than the NHL?

 

You play a higher proportion of games in your own division. 6 in division vs. 4 in rest of conference vs. 1-2 in other conference. Nba Is 4 in division, 3-4 in rest of conference and 2 in other conference.

[Sammy Sofa]

I have to say wolf and SSR had me rolling all night.

 

 

What a fun game. Enjoyed it, however this team needs to gel ASAP because the 2011 ECF do matter a hell of a lot more then the 2012 regular season.

 

It's SCIENCE.

[bcl412]

The main reason that I'm worried about playoff Heat is that Lebron and Wade will get to be on the floor a lot, and yes, that is a big deal, but we've defended them well. They aren't getting to the hoop and thus are taking a lot of jump shots so if that holds up, while they are capable of making a bunch of them, I still think we beat them. I also think that it will be a deep series and if that is the case, our depth will help wear them down a little.

 

There are plenty of other reasons that last years series really doesn't mean much. Rip>Bogans, the role players have gotten a lot of playing down without Rose so they may be better fit to hit shots they need to hit, Boozer and Noah are healthy, Asik is healthy too and I think that will mean something (we take at least one of those games that we lost if he's healthy I think), Rose, as long as he can get healthy, will have plenty of rest and I feel like Thibs has been preparing most of the season, at least in some capacity, to beat the Heat. I feel like with a mind as strong as his, he'll figure out a way to control them.

 

Also, all of last years playoff games were close. One was an OT game, pretty much a toss up. And in two of our losses, one was a fluky blown lead late and the other one Udanis Haslem got red hot out of nowhere and was a major reason that they won. I don't think that happens again. That series just showed me the two teams are evenly matched.

[DivineBovine]

The main reason that I'm worried about playoff Heat is that Lebron and Wade will get to be on the floor a lot, and yes, that is a big deal, but we've defended them well. They aren't getting to the hoop and thus are taking a lot of jump shots so if that holds up, while they are capable of making a bunch of them, I still think we beat them. I also think that it will be a deep series and if that is the case, our depth will help wear them down a little.

 

There are plenty of other reasons that last years series really doesn't mean much. Rip>Bogans, the role players have gotten a lot of playing down without Rose so they may be better fit to hit shots they need to hit, Boozer and Noah are healthy, Asik is healthy too and I think that will mean something (we take at least one of those games that we lost if he's healthy I think), Rose, as long as he can get healthy, will have plenty of rest and I feel like Thibs has been preparing most of the season, at least in some capacity, to beat the Heat. I feel like with a mind as strong as his, he'll figure out a way to control them.

 

Also, all of last years playoff games were close. One was an OT game, pretty much a toss up. And in two of our losses, one was a fluky blown lead late and the other one Udanis Haslem got red hot out of nowhere and was a major reason that they won. I don't think that happens again. That series just showed me the two teams are evenly matched.

 

 

Miami was not great in the half court last year in the playoffs against the Bulls. They killed the Bulls with transition points. And a lot of this was because the Bulls couldn't score.

 

Nobody on the Bulls were making any shots. Korver, Boozer, Deng, nobody. Miami was playing great defense, but the Bulls were not making anything. If Korver and Boozer played like they did last night, the Bulls probably win the series.

 

And let's not hear any more arguments that Miami will just turn it up in the playoffs. They wanted it as badly as the Bulls did and they couldn't win with Rose having his worst game ever. The ECF will be the best I can remember in years.

[wolf stansson]

And let's not hear any more arguments that Miami will just turn it up in the playoffs.

This drives me nuts. Why? Why can't we look at last year and see that they did exactly that? Sweeping them in the regular season and then losing 4-1 in the playoffs wasn't a fluke and it did actually happen, so no offense, but saying we aren't allowed to make that argument or expect the same outcome is stupid.

 

Hey guys! You know that thing that definitely already happened? It's definitely not going to happen again so don't even bring it up, k?

[bcl412]

They went from losing close games to winning them. I don't see how that's evidence that they turned it on. To me it's more evidence that luck went their way in the playoffs than in the regular season, of course having really good players helps create some luck (we have those too) but still.

[bcl412]

I don't though, why some Bulls fans are obsessed with the idea that they have no chance. What's the [expletive] point?

[cubbyvirus00]

I don't though, why some Bulls fans are obsessed with the idea that they have no chance. What's the [expletive] point?

 

Wolf sounds more logical and realistic then you do. The Bulls have more question marks then they do answers. There is no solid rotation, as of right now you don't know what Derrick Rose is going to show up and you don't know if Hamilton can stay healthy because sadly, history says no. Are you really going to rely on Korver and Watson to hit huge shots after they no showed last year in the ECF? Do you feel comfortable rolling with them down the stretch with Gibson against Miami's big 3 in the ECF?

 

Stop ripping on Bulls fans that have legit concerns about their team. I for one am not intoxicated with the regular season wins and they top seeded finish. What can this team do come playoff time is the only thing that matters.

[C.C.]

They went from losing close games to winning them. I don't see how that's evidence that they turned it on. To me it's more evidence that luck went their way in the playoffs than in the regular season, of course having really good players helps create some luck (we have those too) but still.

 

They didn't win on luck last year. We were pretty much dominated by them last year.

 

Bulls might make it a bit closer this year, but in the end Heat will win.

[SpongeWorthy]

I don't though, why some Bulls fans are obsessed with the idea that they have no chance. What's the [expletive] point?

 

Wolf sounds more logical and realistic then you do. The Bulls have more question marks then they do answers. There is no solid rotation, as of right now you don't know what Derrick Rose is going to show up and you don't know if Hamilton can stay healthy because sadly, history says no. Are you really going to rely on Korver and Watson to hit huge shots after they no showed last year in the ECF? Do you feel comfortable rolling with them down the stretch with Gibson against Miami's big 3 in the ECF?

 

Stop ripping on Bulls fans that have legit concerns about their team. I for one am not intoxicated with the regular season wins and they top seeded finish. What can this team do come playoff time is the only thing that matters.

 

No one is suggesting the Bulls are going to make a run in the playoffs if Rose is a question mark or if they have to rely heavily on Watson and Korver.

[bcl412]

I don't though, why some Bulls fans are obsessed with the idea that they have no chance. What's the [expletive] point?

 

Wolf sounds more logical and realistic then you do. The Bulls have more question marks then they do answers. There is no solid rotation, as of right now you don't know what Derrick Rose is going to show up and you don't know if Hamilton can stay healthy because sadly, history says no. Are you really going to rely on Korver and Watson to hit huge shots after they no showed last year in the ECF? Do you feel comfortable rolling with them down the stretch with Gibson against Miami's big 3 in the ECF?

 

Stop ripping on Bulls fans that have legit concerns about their team. I for one am not intoxicated with the regular season wins and they top seeded finish. What can this team do come playoff time is the only thing that matters.

 

There's a difference between acknowledging flaws and remaining spastically, hellbent in disproving any notion that the team with the best record in the NBA may actually be able to win a tournament consisting of NBA teams.

[rawaction]

A friend of mine made an interesting comparison to me a few months ago. After Sunday's Knicks game and last night's game, it got me thinking if there may be something to it.

 

He compared DRose to Allen Iverson from his days in Philly. MVP caliber player, who's undersized. His point was that he doesn't think a team can win championships running all it's offense thru the PG. Case in point, in the Knicks game, DRose, despite not being 100% was taking every big shot. I don't know that anyone else took a shot in the last 3 minutes of that game besides Rose. While Rose is fully capable, it's a lot different than someone like Lebron or Melo who have the height to shoot over defenders or drive to the hoop and score. When everyone knows Rose is going to take the shot, defenses can either put a bigger man on him (can't shoot over) or put a similar sized player on him and help with any of 4 players who are all going to have 4-10 inches on him.

 

Last night, in regulation, Rose was taking shots down the stretch again, and they weren't falling. Rust or not, he wasn't and doesn't typically take very makeable shots late in games when the defense is keyed on him. He simply is not given those shots. But in OT, with Watson out there, the Bulls moved the ball around in OT. Nobody was sitting around watching Derrick. 4 players were legit options to take a shot each time down the court (Asik was in there). Needless to say, the end result was a lot better than the Knicks game was.

 

I know the Bulls can't win games consistently in the first place without Rose, but could they close out close games better without him? Or at least not running the offense exclusively thru him? And if the answer to the previous question is YES (and I know DRose is a humble superstar) but is he OK with not taking the late shots? It's not like he has a DWade with him, the player taking the shot, if not him, will be a much lesser player. How would it look if he's not the one taking the shots down the stretch?

[C.C.]

I don't though, why some Bulls fans are obsessed with the idea that they have no chance. What's the [expletive] point?

 

Wolf sounds more logical and realistic then you do. The Bulls have more question marks then they do answers. There is no solid rotation, as of right now you don't know what Derrick Rose is going to show up and you don't know if Hamilton can stay healthy because sadly, history says no. Are you really going to rely on Korver and Watson to hit huge shots after they no showed last year in the ECF? Do you feel comfortable rolling with them down the stretch with Gibson against Miami's big 3 in the ECF?

 

Stop ripping on Bulls fans that have legit concerns about their team. I for one am not intoxicated with the regular season wins and they top seeded finish. What can this team do come playoff time is the only thing that matters.

 

There's a difference between acknowledging flaws and remaining spastically, hellbent in disproving any notion that the team with the best record in the NBA may actually be able to win a tournament consisting of NBA teams.

 

The regular season doesn't mean squat.

[DivineBovine]

And let's not hear any more arguments that Miami will just turn it up in the playoffs.

This drives me nuts. Why? Why can't we look at last year and see that they did exactly that? Sweeping them in the regular season and then losing 4-1 in the playoffs wasn't a fluke and it did actually happen, so no offense, but saying we aren't allowed to make that argument or expect the same outcome is stupid.

 

Hey guys! You know that thing that definitely already happened? It's definitely not going to happen again so don't even bring it up, k?

 

 

Because the whole argument is based on Miami not caring about regular season games as much as the Bulls do. They cared about yesterday's game. And Bulls have lost plenty of games this year they had no business losing.

 

And another basis for the argument is that the Bulls played like they did in the regular season during the playoffs. The fact is that the Bulls sucked against Miami. Guys continually missed shots they normally make. And Miami played very well.

 

If the Heat beat the Bulls year after year in the playoffs, then I'll buy the argument. But it was one series.

[bcl412]

They went from losing close games to winning them. I don't see how that's evidence that they turned it on. To me it's more evidence that luck went their way in the playoffs than in the regular season, of course having really good players helps create some luck (we have those too) but still.

 

They didn't win on luck last year. We were pretty much dominated by them last year.

 

Bulls might make it a bit closer this year, but in the end Heat will win.

 

I'd say any win in OT involves a measure of luck as does Udanis Haslem randomly getting hot.

 

Plus, no, we were not dominated.

[SpongeWorthy]

A friend of mine made an interesting comparison to me a few months ago. After Sunday's Knicks game and last night's game, it got me thinking if there may be something to it.

 

He compared DRose to Allen Iverson from his days in Philly. MVP caliber player, who's undersized. His point was that he doesn't think a team can win championships running all it's offense thru the PG. Case in point, in the Knicks game, DRose, despite not being 100% was taking every big shot. I don't know that anyone else took a shot in the last 3 minutes of that game besides Rose. While Rose is fully capable, it's a lot different than someone like Lebron or Melo who have the height to shoot over defenders or drive to the hoop and score. When everyone knows Rose is going to take the shot, defenses can either put a bigger man on him (can't shoot over) or put a similar sized player on him and help with any of 4 players who are all going to have 4-10 inches on him.

 

Last night, in regulation, Rose was taking shots down the stretch again, and they weren't falling. Rust or not, he wasn't and doesn't typically take very makeable shots late in games when the defense is keyed on him. But in OT, with Watson out there, the Bulls moved the ball around in OT. Nobody was sitting around watching Derrick. 4 players were legit options to take a shot each time down the court (Asik was in there). Needless to say, the end result was a lot better than the Knicks game was.

 

I know the Bulls can't win games consistently in the first place without Rose, but could they close out close games better without him? Or at least not running the offense exclusively thru him? And if the answer to the previous question is YES (and I know DRose is a humble superstar) but is he OK with not taking the late shots? It's not like he has a DWade with him, the player taking the shot, if not him, will be a much lesser player. How would it look if he's not the one taking the shots down the stretch?

 

NBA teams in general scrap the playbook and try to win with hero ball in the end. It's not just the Bulls and the Bulls wouldn't be the only team well served by sticking with what's presumably kept them in the game until crunch time. I'm not sure why teams do that but one I reason is because it's easier to milk clock and grind possessions with ISO ball.

 

We dominated in OT because Lebron and Bosh played every second in the 2nd half and while Thibs kept rotating fresh defenders on the Big 3. It worked beautifully.

Edited April 13, 2012 by SpongeWorthy

[bcl412]

I don't though, why some Bulls fans are obsessed with the idea that they have no chance. What's the [expletive] point?

 

Wolf sounds more logical and realistic then you do. The Bulls have more question marks then they do answers. There is no solid rotation, as of right now you don't know what Derrick Rose is going to show up and you don't know if Hamilton can stay healthy because sadly, history says no. Are you really going to rely on Korver and Watson to hit huge shots after they no showed last year in the ECF? Do you feel comfortable rolling with them down the stretch with Gibson against Miami's big 3 in the ECF?

 

Stop ripping on Bulls fans that have legit concerns about their team. I for one am not intoxicated with the regular season wins and they top seeded finish. What can this team do come playoff time is the only thing that matters.

 

There's a difference between acknowledging flaws and remaining spastically, hellbent in disproving any notion that the team with the best record in the NBA may actually be able to win a tournament consisting of NBA teams.

 

The regular season doesn't mean squat.

 

I know. The guy who talks about sports on the radio says that so it must be true.

[C.C.]

They went from losing close games to winning them. I don't see how that's evidence that they turned it on. To me it's more evidence that luck went their way in the playoffs than in the regular season, of course having really good players helps create some luck (we have those too) but still.

 

They didn't win on luck last year. We were pretty much dominated by them last year.

 

Bulls might make it a bit closer this year, but in the end Heat will win.

 

I'd say any win in OT involves a measure of luck as does Udanis Haslem randomly getting hot.

 

Plus, no, we were not dominated.

 

It wasn't luck. The Heat beat us with defense and offense. No luck was involved and the better team won. It's really that simple. You don't lose 4-1 and say Miami was lucky.

[SpongeWorthy]

I don't though, why some Bulls fans are obsessed with the idea that they have no chance. What's the [expletive] point?

 

Wolf sounds more logical and realistic then you do. The Bulls have more question marks then they do answers. There is no solid rotation, as of right now you don't know what Derrick Rose is going to show up and you don't know if Hamilton can stay healthy because sadly, history says no. Are you really going to rely on Korver and Watson to hit huge shots after they no showed last year in the ECF? Do you feel comfortable rolling with them down the stretch with Gibson against Miami's big 3 in the ECF?

 

Stop ripping on Bulls fans that have legit concerns about their team. I for one am not intoxicated with the regular season wins and they top seeded finish. What can this team do come playoff time is the only thing that matters.

 

There's a difference between acknowledging flaws and remaining spastically, hellbent in disproving any notion that the team with the best record in the NBA may actually be able to win a tournament consisting of NBA teams.

 

The regular season doesn't mean squat.

 

In what sense?

 

The NBA champion is almost always one of the teams with the 3 or 4 best records in the NBA.

[SpongeWorthy]

And teams that are feared as much as the Heat seem to be ALWAYS have put up a kick ass regular season or two. Miami has put up two very good, but not spectacular regular seasons.

 

They are what they are. A very good team with a reasonable chance of winning the title. There isn't this mythical gear they turn on where they'll rampage through the playoffs. It would've manifested itself by now.

 

Edit: They could become that scary-ass team if they added the right pieces but it sure as [expletive] didn't happen this offseason. Norris Cole is out of the rotation, Haslem and Miller are shells of their former selves, Battier is hot garbage, etc.

Edited April 13, 2012 by SpongeWorthy

[wolf stansson]

I don't though, why some Bulls fans are obsessed with the idea that they have no chance. What's the [expletive] point?

It's about understanding the game, not just being fatalistic for the sake of it. I don't sit around watching Bulls games thinking, "oh this sucks, why am I wasting my time?" I watch Bulls games thinking, "I sure do love NBA basketball and the Bulls." Just like I did when Kirk Hinrich was our best player and just like I did when Jalen Rose was our best player and just like I did when Elton Brand was our best player and just like I did when Michael Jordan was our best player.

 

Thinking this roster is good enough as is to win a championship is fine as a fan, I guess. I certainly hope the Bulls front office doesn't share those beliefs. I think this roster is good enough to conceivably win it all, but it's not good enough to more than likely win it all. I want my team to be the best, and I guess I just remember the Knicks, Jazz, Suns and Pacers in the 90's too well to be ok with my favorite team following in their footsteps. Obviously parity is better now because Michael Jordan isn't in his prime, but being the third or fourth best team at the end of the playoffs sucks compared to being the best.

 

Understanding the difference between someone saying they're probably not going to win it and they're definitely not going to win it is maybe a subtlety that is lost on you, so I'm going to go ahead and speak for everyone in this thread who thinks the Heat and Thunder are a better constructed team for a playoff run and say explicitly: The Bulls, as currently constructed, are probably not going to win the NBA Championship. Because their two direct competitors are still in their prime and will be for some time, the Bulls need to upgrade their roster.

[rawaction]

NBA teams in general scrap the playbook and try to win with hero ball in the end. It's not just the Bulls and the Bulls wouldn't be the only team well served by sticking with what's presumably kept them in the game until crunch time. I'm not sure why teams do that but one I reason is because it's easier to milk clock and grind possessions with ISO ball.

 

Agreed. But it's a lot easier to do so when your hero is 6'6" - 6'9", can outjump everyone on the floor and is quicker than anyone that could possibly be guarding him. If Rose has the ball, it's going to be a contested jumper. If LBJ or 90s Jordan have the ball, it can be a jumpshot against someone that's either smaller, less athletic, or can't jump high enough to contest (or all of the above in most cases) or its a drive to the hoop against a player only 3-6 inches taller instead of 6 to 9 inches.

[C.C.]

I don't though, why some Bulls fans are obsessed with the idea that they have no chance. What's the [expletive] point?

 

Wolf sounds more logical and realistic then you do. The Bulls have more question marks then they do answers. There is no solid rotation, as of right now you don't know what Derrick Rose is going to show up and you don't know if Hamilton can stay healthy because sadly, history says no. Are you really going to rely on Korver and Watson to hit huge shots after they no showed last year in the ECF? Do you feel comfortable rolling with them down the stretch with Gibson against Miami's big 3 in the ECF?

 

Stop ripping on Bulls fans that have legit concerns about their team. I for one am not intoxicated with the regular season wins and they top seeded finish. What can this team do come playoff time is the only thing that matters.

 

There's a difference between acknowledging flaws and remaining spastically, hellbent in disproving any notion that the team with the best record in the NBA may actually be able to win a tournament consisting of NBA teams.

 

The regular season doesn't mean squat.

 

In what sense?

 

The NBA champion is almost always one of the teams with the 3 or 4 best records in the NBA.

 

Sure, but all because you have the best record in the NBA doesn't mean you will win it all. I just think that you shouldn't place all that much importance on the regular season.

[SpongeWorthy]

I don't though, why some Bulls fans are obsessed with the idea that they have no chance. What's the [expletive] point?

It's about understanding the game, not just being fatalistic for the sake of it. I don't sit around watching Bulls games thinking, "oh this sucks, why am I wasting my time?" I watch Bulls games thinking, "I sure do love NBA basketball and the Bulls." Just like I did when Kirk Hinrich was our best player and just like I did when Jalen Rose was our best player and just like I did when Elton Brand was our best player and just like I did when Michael Jordan was our best player.

 

Thinking this roster is good enough as is to win a championship is fine as a fan, I guess. I certainly hope the Bulls front office doesn't share those beliefs. I think this roster is good enough to conceivably win it all, but it's not good enough to more than likely win it all. I want my team to be the best, and I guess I just remember the Knicks, Jazz, Suns and Pacers in the 90's too well to be ok with my favorite team following in their footsteps. Obviously parity is better now because Michael Jordan isn't in his prime, but being the third or fourth best team at the end of the playoffs sucks compared to being the best.

 

Understanding the difference between someone saying they're probably not going to win it and they're definitely not going to win it is maybe a subtlety that is lost on you, so I'm going to go ahead and speak for everyone in this thread who thinks the Heat and Thunder are a better constructed team for a playoff run and say explicitly: The Bulls, as currently constructed, are probably not going to win the NBA Championship. Because their two direct competitors are still in their prime and will be for some time, the Bulls need to upgrade their roster.

 

I wouldn't have taken any NBA team over the field in the playoffs since the Shaq-Kobe Lakers.

[DivineBovine]

I don't though, why some Bulls fans are obsessed with the idea that they have no chance. What's the [expletive] point?

It's about understanding the game, not just being fatalistic for the sake of it. I don't sit around watching Bulls games thinking, "oh this sucks, why am I wasting my time?" I watch Bulls games thinking, "I sure do love NBA basketball and the Bulls." Just like I did when Kirk Hinrich was our best player and just like I did when Jalen Rose was our best player and just like I did when Elton Brand was our best player and just like I did when Michael Jordan was our best player.

 

Thinking this roster is good enough as is to win a championship is fine as a fan, I guess. I certainly hope the Bulls front office doesn't share those beliefs. I think this roster is good enough to conceivably win it all, but it's not good enough to more than likely win it all. I want my team to be the best, and I guess I just remember the Knicks, Jazz, Suns and Pacers in the 90's too well to be ok with my favorite team following in their footsteps. Obviously parity is better now because Michael Jordan isn't in his prime, but being the third or fourth best team at the end of the playoffs sucks compared to being the best.

 

Understanding the difference between someone saying they're probably not going to win it and they're definitely not going to win it is maybe a subtlety that is lost on you, so I'm going to go ahead and speak for everyone in this thread who thinks the Heat and Thunder are a better constructed team for a playoff run and say explicitly: The Bulls, as currently constructed, are probably not going to win the NBA Championship. Because their two direct competitors are still in their prime and will be for some time, the Bulls need to upgrade their roster.

 

 

Tell me. How do you build a team that is a sure thing to win the championship? I just don't get this argument at all. Some people think its as simple as "getting Dwight Howard", or "getting LeBron James". This is absurd. And even when teams seem to do it, like by getting Carmelo Anthony and Amare Stoudamire, they fall on their face.

 

The Bulls have done a pretty good job with personnel and coaching. Why don't you give them a freaking chance. The team has had the best record in the league for 2 years, and lost one series. Let them at least lose again before calling for dismantling the team. I just don't get people calling for this before this team has even had a chance to prove they can't win.

 

The way you're talking, you would've called for the dismantling of the Mavs last year before the playoffs. Don't tell me you thought the Mavs had a chance in hell of winning going into the playoffs.