Laughably bad "25 players that shouldn't be in the HOF" list

[OleMissCub]

OK, this thing needs to be dissected by FJM it's so terrible.

 

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/789983-phil-rizzuto-and-25-players-who-should-not-be-in-the-hall-of-fame

 

First take note of one of his opening lines and also consider that this guy loves to take into account precisely some of the worst things to take into account when evaluating a ballplayer such as BA and a pitcher's winning percentage.

 

That being said, here are 25 Hall of Fame players who, after extensive research, I believe unworthy to be enshrined in Cooperstown.

 

Some of the notable stupid isht he says:

 

Ozzie Smith

He never hit for power (his career high for home runs was six in 1983) and was never one to blow anybody away with his offense. In 19 years, Smith only hit above .300 once. After his retirement in 1996, Smith's career batting average was a modest .262.

Yeah, so? He was a middle infielder for the 1990's. I guess this mugwump forgot that "fielding" is part of the age old equation of what it takes to win a ballgame: "pitching, fielding, and timely hitting".

 

Harmon Killebrew

"Killer" slugged 573 home runs and drove in 1,584 RBI while also making 13 All-Star teams. In 1969, he was named the American League MVP.

Wow, that's a damn good career!

Still, and I don't mean to disrespect the man in any way, Killebrew shouldn't be in the Hall of Fame. In his 22 seasons, his lifetime batting average was a mediocre .256....He hit home runs, drew walks and not much else. Keep in mind, Killebrew never hit .300 once in his career and struck out a total of 1,699 times.

Aye Carumba. I don't even know what to say about that.

 

Bert Blyleven

Despite an average career record of 287-250 (.534 winning percentage), Blyleven finished his 22-season career with an impressive career ERA of 3.31. Adding to his case are his 3,701 career strikeouts, which rank fifth in baseball history.

 

Throw in a no-hitter, two All-Star berths and two World Series rings, and Bert Blyleven sounds like a Hall of Fame pitcher.

Yes, he sure does. Should just stop right there.

However, Blyleven exhibited one trait throughout his career that, in this writer's eyes, should be heavily considered when considering anyone for the Hall of Fame, regardless of career statistics. You see, for much of his career, Blyleven was an arrogant player whose negative behavior made him fall out of favor with a number of teams.

Yeah, Cobb, Bonds, and Rose were douchebags as well, but I'd still want them on my team.

 

Mickey Cochrane

He won two AL MVP awards, made two All-Star teams, and won three World Series. He finished his career with a .320 average and was elected to the Hall of Fame in 1947.

Wow, and as a catcher he had a career OPS+ of 128 and OBP of .419 all the while being one of the greatest defensive catchers in history? Sounds solid to me.

While he was a good player, Cochrane still doesn't have enough to be in Cooperstown. In his 13 seasons, he only amassed 832 RBI. That is simply unacceptable considering how he played on some great teams. On top of that, despite being on three World Series-winning teams, Cochrane's playoff performance was less than average. In 31 games, he hit .245 with two home runs and seven RBI.

Seriously, just stop. For one thing, Cochrane doesn't have the "stats" that you want him to have because his career ended suddently a month after he turned 34 when he was hit in the head with a pitch.

 

Freddie Lindstrom

In 13 seasons, he hit .311 with 103 home runs and just 779 RBI before retiring at age 30....On top of that, Lindstrom never won a World Series nor did he play in any All-Star games.

I guess during his "extensive" research he didn't realize that they didn't EVEN HAVE All-Star games when he was playing!!

 

Apparently, someone on Bleacher Report has written some good retort articles about this dumb list about why Cochrane and Smith definitely belong in the hall.

 

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/790172-ozzie-smith-does-belong-in-the-hall-of-fame-plain-and-simple

 

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/790202-mickey-cochrane-does-belong-in-the-hall-of-fame-plain-and-simple

[Tarver]

Well, it is Bleacher Report. 95% of the "articles" are pure [expletive].

[Hairyducked Idiot]

Why would anyone take the time to debunk something written by a Bleacher Report "writer"? That's for wannabes who can't even get hired by the Williston (N.D.) Herald.

[jersey cubs fan]

Yeah, so? He was a middle infielder for the 1990's. I guess this mugwump forgot that "fielding" is part of the age old equation of what it takes to win a ballgame: "pitching, fielding, and timely hitting".

 

Why is hitting the only one qualified with timely?

[CubmanPi]

Yeah, so? He was a middle infielder for the 1990's. I guess this mugwump forgot that "fielding" is part of the age old equation of what it takes to win a ballgame: "pitching, fielding, and timely hitting".

 

Why is hitting the only one qualified with timely?

 

Teams can go several entire innings with zero success in hitting and still have a very successful offensive game. Can't say the same for pitching or fielding. You can also have quality hitting without much success (this year's Cubs are probably a decent example).

 

ETA - Not sticking up for clutchiness or whether or not such a thing should merit HOF consideration, just saying the wording isn't unreasonable.

Edited August 4, 2011 by CubmanPi

[OleMissCub]

Yeah, so? He was a middle infielder for the 1990's. I guess this mugwump forgot that "fielding" is part of the age old equation of what it takes to win a ballgame: "pitching, fielding, and timely hitting".

 

Why is hitting the only one qualified with timely?

 

just what I've always heard.

[jersey cubs fan]

Yeah, so? He was a middle infielder for the 1990's. I guess this mugwump forgot that "fielding" is part of the age old equation of what it takes to win a ballgame: "pitching, fielding, and timely hitting".

 

Why is hitting the only one qualified with timely?

 

Teams can go several entire innings with zero success in hitting and still have a very successful offensive game. Can't say the same for pitching or fielding. You can also have quality hitting without much success (this year's Cubs are probably a decent example).

 

ETA - Not sticking up for clutchiness or whether or not such a thing should merit HOF consideration, just saying the wording isn't unreasonable.

 

Really? You could go innings without any good defense. You could actually have bad defense and not suffer.

[CubmanPi]

I just think it makes more sense to say that poorly-timed lack of defense or pitching will lose games. (Edit: If Brant Brown had caught that ball, I wouldn't call it timely defense.)

[Rob]

I don't have a problem with him being in the Hall of Fame (I'm a big Hall guy, personally), but there is a legitimate argument to be made that Ozzie Smith doesn't belong in the Hall. And Lindstrom doesn't exactly stand up to the Hall of Fame 3B standard... though I would certainly agree that standard is way higher than it should be.

[OleMissCub]

I don't have a problem with him being in the Hall of Fame (I'm a big Hall guy, personally), but there is a legitimate argument to be made that Ozzie Smith doesn't belong in the Hall. And Lindstrom doesn't exactly stand up to the Hall of Fame 3B standard... though I would certainly agree that standard is way higher than it should be.

 

Well Lindstrom's career ended abruptly at 30 when he was injured in a collision. The mugwump that wrote the article talks about how he thinks Kirby should be in the HOF because of a "Kirby Puckett Discount" regarding injuries yet ignores the fact that Lindstrom and Cochrane were both victims of untimely injuries.

[javy knows my name]

The Harmon Killebrew article is amazing. "All the guy did is hit an ungodly amount of HRs and take walks, and not much else." The hell else is there to do? Edited August 4, 2011 by Castro's Spray Chart

[CubmanPi]

Opposite field bloop singles. It's an important part of the game.

[CyHawk_Cub]

The Harmon Killebrew article is amazing. "All the guy did is hit an ungodly amount of HRs and take walks, and not much else." The hell else is there to do?

 

Obviously bunting. Not nearly enough of that from Killebrew

[rocket]

I don't have a problem with him being in the Hall of Fame (I'm a big Hall guy, personally), but there is a legitimate argument to be made that Ozzie Smith doesn't belong in the Hall.

 

there is?

 

he's 4th all time in defensive WAR, and in the top 100 for WAR for position players.

[TruffleShuffle]

the funny part is that he bashes killebrew for only walking and hitting home runs, but then also bashes ozzie smith, who did pretty much everything the "play the game the right way" crowd loves except for being white.

[OleMissCub]

The Harmon Killebrew article is amazing. "All the guy did is hit an ungodly amount of HRs and take walks, and not much else." The hell else is there to do?

 

Obviously bunting. Not nearly enough of that from Killebrew

 

fun fact:

 

He finished his career with the record of having the most plate appearances, 9,831, without a sacrifice hit. Big Hurt is the current holder of that record with 10,074.

[Tarver]

the funny part is that he bashes killebrew for only walking and hitting home runs, but then also bashes ozzie smith, who did pretty much everything the "play the game the right way" crowd loves except for being white.

 

No, the funny part is taking anything on Bleacher Report this seriously. This "article" was a troll post worked to perfection. This guy's laughing his ass off somewhere because of all the fuss he's caused.

[OleMissCub]

the funny part is that he bashes killebrew for only walking and hitting home runs, but then also bashes ozzie smith, who did pretty much everything the "play the game the right way" crowd loves except for being white.

 

No, the funny part is taking anything on Bleacher Report this seriously. This "article" was a troll post worked to perfection. This guy's laughing his ass off somewhere because of all the fuss he's caused.

 

I disagree. He's trying, rather poorly, to defend his positions in the comments section.

[TruffleShuffle]

the funny part is that he bashes killebrew for only walking and hitting home runs, but then also bashes ozzie smith, who did pretty much everything the "play the game the right way" crowd loves except for being white.

 

No, the funny part is taking anything on Bleacher Report this seriously. This "article" was a troll post worked to perfection. This guy's laughing his ass off somewhere because of all the fuss he's caused.

 

you're confusing "troll" with "moron"

[Tarver]

the funny part is that he bashes killebrew for only walking and hitting home runs, but then also bashes ozzie smith, who did pretty much everything the "play the game the right way" crowd loves except for being white.

 

No, the funny part is taking anything on Bleacher Report this seriously. This "article" was a troll post worked to perfection. This guy's laughing his ass off somewhere because of all the fuss he's caused.

 

I disagree. He's trying, rather poorly, to defend his positions in the comments section.

 

The better trolls will always attempt a defense. Sauce for the goose.

 

I'd be pissing my pants after writing this:

 

Dave- I'm going to have to disagree with you. I met him on more than one occasion at events where he was the keynote speaker and to this day he was one of the friendliest people I have ever met.

 

or this:

 

I disagree with you regarding Dean. He belongs on what I like to call the Kirby Puckett Clause. He had a great career, but was forced to retire early due to injury

 

I give this guy credit. I wish I'd written it.

[TruffleShuffle]

yeah you're giving him way too much credit. he's an abject moron.

[Tarver]

yeah you're giving him way too much credit. he's an abject moron.

 

He rated the John Tudor/Pedro Guerrero trade as the worst in MLB history. No way I can take this guy seriously.

[Rob]

I don't have a problem with him being in the Hall of Fame (I'm a big Hall guy, personally), but there is a legitimate argument to be made that Ozzie Smith doesn't belong in the Hall.

 

there is?

 

he's 4th all time in defensive WAR, and in the top 100 for WAR for position players.

 

http://www.fangraphs.com/graphsw.aspx?playerid2=1012186&playerid3=1013157&playerid4=335&playerid5=

 

If you don't believe Trammell and Larkin belong in the Hall (and plenty don't), it's pretty easy to make the case Ozzie doesn't either... especially if you want to cast doubt on defensive metrics in general.

 

Like I said, I'm a big hall guy and would have all of them in there. But there's a case.

[rocket]

I don't have a problem with him being in the Hall of Fame (I'm a big Hall guy, personally), but there is a legitimate argument to be made that Ozzie Smith doesn't belong in the Hall.

 

there is?

 

he's 4th all time in defensive WAR, and in the top 100 for WAR for position players.

 

http://www.fangraphs.com/graphsw.aspx?playerid2=1012186&playerid3=1013157&playerid4=335&playerid5=

 

If you don't believe Trammell and Larkin belong in the Hall (and plenty don't), it's pretty easy to make the case Ozzie doesn't either... especially if you want to cast doubt on defensive metrics in general.

 

Like I said, I'm a big hall guy and would have all of them in there. But there's a case.

 

i believe trammell and larkin should be in the hall

[Little Slide Rooter]

While I do believe Ozzie belongs in the hall, but does this mean that Omar Vizquel belongs as well? While Omar has 11 GGs to Ozzies 13, Omar also has a slightly better offensive line as well, and could potentially end up in the exclusive 3000 hits club, although hes probably have to stick it out for another 2+ years. Ozzie is somewhat of a household name, while to many, Omars just a guy, despite the fact that their careers are almost parrallel, in fact, it seems as though Omar was the overall better player.

 

Omar .272/.337/.353/.691 80 HR

Ozzie .262/.337/.328/.666 28 HR