College Football - Week 6 (Oct. 9th)

[EhDubya]

Cowher, admittedly, is a pipe dream. Dungy has a great relationship with PSU and would fit in with the mission and ideals. Gruden would have more interest in PSU than you would think.. Wild card is Bob Stoops.

 

Al Golden is the cheapest, most logical outside hire. But if PSU can get an alum to donate 88mil for a hockey program, and another to get Cael Sanderson for hockey (and even Tambourini for LAX), then I think we can get some money to pay NFL-type levels. Question is, will they?

 

Money isn't the issue, I don't think. Tennessee reportedly (that word being the key) had some level of interest in Gruden and Lovie Smith during their coaching search. I didn't think either were in any way realistic, but not because UT wouldn't pony up the money to get them - some booster definitely would. My skepticism there - and here - is whether the coaches would have interest in going the college route.

 

It's very different from the NFL and, whether you believe it's more or less time consuming, takes up a ton of time.

 

Tennessee did reach out to Gruden but he turned them down before it even went anywhere. There was no way he would follow the Kiffens, not after the falling out between him and Monte. You'll have to trust me (which I realize is silly, considering im anonymous on the internet, but I'll say it anyway), Gruden would listen to Penn State.

[dew1679666265]

Tennessee did reach out to Gruden but he turned them down before it even went anywhere. There was no way he would follow the Kiffens, not after the falling out between him and Monte. You'll have to trust me (which I realize is silly, considering im anonymous on the internet, but I'll say it anyway), Gruden would listen to Penn State.

 

You seem confident in that opinion. I just don't see an established NFL head coach going to the college ranks. The only ones you see going to college are the failed coaches (Wannstedt, Gailey, Carroll, Callahan, Sherman, etc). I can't think of any established, successful NFL coach going to the college ranks just for the heck of it.

[SouthSideRyan]

Dan Devine.

[jersey cubs fan]

Tennessee did reach out to Gruden but he turned them down before it even went anywhere. There was no way he would follow the Kiffens, not after the falling out between him and Monte. You'll have to trust me (which I realize is silly, considering im anonymous on the internet, but I'll say it anyway), Gruden would listen to Penn State.

 

You seem confident in that opinion. I just don't see an established NFL head coach going to the college ranks. The only ones you see going to college are the failed coaches (Wannstedt, Gailey, Carroll, Callahan, Sherman, etc). I can't think of any established, successful NFL coach going to the college ranks just for the heck of it.

 

You also didn't see a lot of guys earn FU money in just a few short years and then go into semi-retirement for extended periods of time because they didn't have to coach anymore. Not everybody is dying to do it. But guys are willing to sit out of the NFL for multiple years and work tv gigs, so obviously being an NFL head coach is not their one and only option for employment.

[Andy]

Dan Devine.

Devine was like 2 minutes away from being fired by Green Bay when Notre Dame hired him.

[dew1679666265]

You also didn't see a lot of guys earn FU money in just a few short years and then go into semi-retirement for extended periods of time because they didn't have to coach anymore. Not everybody is dying to do it. But guys are willing to sit out of the NFL for multiple years and work tv gigs, so obviously being an NFL head coach is not their one and only option for employment.

 

They go to the TV booth because it's an incredible little amount of work for really good pay and they get to spend significant portions of time with their family. Leaving the NFL to get paid well to do very little work is semi-retirement. Leaving the NFL to go coach a college team for a little less money is taking a step down in stature and something that no well-established coach has done before – and likely for a good reason.

[dew1679666265]

Dan Devine.

 

He coached four seasons and was 25-27 in those years. I wouldn't call him well-established and successful.

[jersey cubs fan]

You also didn't see a lot of guys earn FU money in just a few short years and then go into semi-retirement for extended periods of time because they didn't have to coach anymore. Not everybody is dying to do it. But guys are willing to sit out of the NFL for multiple years and work tv gigs, so obviously being an NFL head coach is not their one and only option for employment.

 

They go to the TV booth because it's an incredible little amount of work for really good pay and they get to spend significant portions of time with their family. Leaving the NFL to get paid well to do very little work is semi-retirement. Leaving the NFL to go coach a college team for a little less money is taking a step down in stature and something that no well-established coach has done before – and likely for a good reason.

 

Your arbitrary notion of what well established means is silly. The difference in stature is not what it once was.

[dew1679666265]

Your arbitrary notion of what well established means is silly. The difference in stature is not what it once was.

 

I'm talking about coaches the stature of Gruden, Dungy and Cowher. There are fringe coaches like Wannstedt and Devine who bounce around some, but a coach who has had a good deal of success at the NFL level has not made the move back to college football. If it was the easy, plum job you make it out to be, wouldn't more coaches do it?

[jersey cubs fan]

Your arbitrary notion of what well established means is silly. The difference in stature is not what it once was.

 

I'm talking about coaches the stature of Gruden, Dungy and Cowher. There are fringe coaches like Wannstedt and Devine who bounce around some, but a coach who has had a good deal of success at the NFL level has not made the move back to college football. If it was the easy, plum job you make it out to be, wouldn't more coaches do it?

 

All sorts of coaches have spent considerable amount of time in the NFL only to go back to the college ranks. Some have become established college coaches only to dip their toes in the NFL and move right back to college. Coaching is not a career that has a particularly long shelf life. The 40 year old head is kind of unique to recent times, as is the money bag college head coach. Wanny was hardly a fringe coach, he was a big name NFL coach for well over a decade. Al Groh, Nick Saban, Jim Mora, Bobby Petrino and many others have moved back to the college ranks. Others, like Kirk Ferentz, who has seen the NFL in person, has chosen to take his name out of the running of multiple NFL gigs because of the preference for NCAA life. Somebody like Mike Ditka, who spent his entire career coaching in the NFL, or Bill Parcells, who coached in the NFL and then moved into personel, or Mike Holmgren who coached/GMd until he was in his 60's were never good candidates to go into the college coaching ranks. If your only exposure to college football was the relatively laid back version of the 60's/70's, you might not see the draw. Most coaches burn out sometime in their 50's or early 60's, so the idea of building up your resume until you are an elite NFL head coach and then going back to college isn't all that realistic anyway due to time.

 

There are big name and well paid coaches who have chosen college over the NFL, either by leaving or never going in the first place. Maybe Gruden, Dungy or Cowher never will, but there's no reason why some other late 40's early 50's established NFL coach won't choose to go to college, still rake in big bucks with better stability a longer term focus and less demand on his time.

[dew1679666265]

All sorts of coaches have spent considerable amount of time in the NFL only to go back to the college ranks. Some have become established college coaches only to dip their toes in the NFL and move right back to college. Coaching is not a career that has a particularly long shelf life. The 40 year old head is kind of unique to recent times, as is the money bag college head coach. Wanny was hardly a fringe coach, he was a big name NFL coach for well over a decade. Al Groh, Nick Saban, Jim Mora, Bobby Petrino and many others have moved back to the college ranks. Others, like Kirk Ferentz, who has seen the NFL in person, has chosen to take his name out of the running of multiple NFL gigs because of the preference for NCAA life. Somebody like Mike Ditka, who spent his entire career coaching in the NFL, or Bill Parcells, who coached in the NFL and then moved into personel, or Mike Holmgren who coached/GMd until he was in his 60's were never good candidates to go into the college coaching ranks. If your only exposure to college football was the relatively laid back version of the 60's/70's, you might not see the draw. Most coaches burn out sometime in their 50's or early 60's, so the idea of building up your resume until you are an elite NFL head coach and then going back to college isn't all that realistic anyway due to time.

 

All the coaches you mentioned went back to the NCAA because they failed in the NFL – with the exception of Groh. Wanny was a bad NFL head coach with a record of 82-87 overall. Saban was at Miami for two seasons and was 15-17. Jim Mora, Jr. has never gone back to the college ranks, though he was rumored for the Washington job. Bobby Petrino was bad for a year then headed back to college.

 

I'm not talking about fringy type coaches who hang out in between the college and NFL ranks or dabble for a year in the league and then head back to college or are mediocre enough in the NFL that they can get a better job in college. I'm talking about the latter group you mentioned – Ditka, Parcells, Holmgren, Gruden, Dungy, Cowher – who are longtime, very successful NFL head coaches. There's no incentive for them to take on a similar workload in college for lesser stature and more time on the road.

 

Some coaches prefer the developmental aspect of working with young athletes as opposed to superstars. I get that. But a coach like Dungy, Gruden or Cowher likely isn't in that mold – and they are the guys we were talking about.

[EhDubya]

Again, Cowher was a pipe dream of mine, I'd put it at .05% of him coaching anywhere in college.

 

But Dungy and Gruden both seriously enjoy mentoring youth. And Penn State isn't just some regular college gig. Its a sleeping giant, with the right hire, after Joe leaves. Well over 100,000+ every Saturday, nationwide fanbase, fertile recruiting ground. Its also proven to be the most secure coaching job in ALL sports, and shown that the head coach doesn't actually have to go on the road to recruit if he doesn't want to.

 

You better believe Jim Tressel and OSU will be the most interested in who PSU brings in, because the right guy could have a huge effect on their future success. And like I said before, I have on good authority that Gruden would at least listen.

[Derwood]

I don't think the job security at PSU goes beyond Paterno. Once he's done, PSU will go through a new coach every 3-5 years just like every other school

[stuy119]

I don't think the job security at PSU goes beyond Paterno. Once he's done, PSU will go through a new coach every 3-5 years just like every other school

 

Depends on who they choose. I think Texas and FSU will have their coaches there for a while (Muschamp and Jimbo).

 

But the key is finding someone now and naming him HCIW. Someone who is younger but retains the same values as JoePa, but is more aggressive.

[jersey cubs fan]

I don't think the job security at PSU goes beyond Paterno. Once he's done, PSU will go through a new coach every 3-5 years just like every other school

 

Except for the fact that "every other school" doesn't get a new coach every 3-5 years.

[OleMissCub]

A Bear is the new Ole Miss mascot....horray

[jersey cubs fan]

Polar Bear?

[OleMissCub]

Polar Bear?

 

Black Bear. Something to do with the Teddy Bear having originated in Mississippi when Roosevelt was hunting down here and didn't want to shoot a bear cub. It's lame.

[Derwood]

I don't think the job security at PSU goes beyond Paterno. Once he's done, PSU will go through a new coach every 3-5 years just like every other school

 

Except for the fact that "every other school" doesn't get a new coach every 3-5 years.

 

most do. Outside of Paterno and (as of last year) Bowden, who is the longest tenured coach in Div 1-A? Frank Beamer (Va Tech), who was hired in 1987. Only 5 other coaches (out of 120 schools) have been at their position since the 90's.

[jersey cubs fan]

I don't think the job security at PSU goes beyond Paterno. Once he's done, PSU will go through a new coach every 3-5 years just like every other school

 

Except for the fact that "every other school" doesn't get a new coach every 3-5 years.

 

most do. Outside of Paterno and (as of last year) Bowden, who is the longest tenured coach in Div 1-A? Frank Beamer (Va Tech), who was hired in 1987. Only 5 other coaches (out of 120 schools) have been at their position since the 90's.

 

That's 10 years.

[Guest]

Polar Bear?

 

Black Bear. Something to do with the Teddy Bear having originated in Mississippi when Roosevelt was hunting down here and didn't want to shoot a bear cub. It's lame.

ha - the Ole Miss Teddy Bears.

[Derwood]

I don't think the job security at PSU goes beyond Paterno. Once he's done, PSU will go through a new coach every 3-5 years just like every other school

 

Except for the fact that "every other school" doesn't get a new coach every 3-5 years.

 

most do. Outside of Paterno and (as of last year) Bowden, who is the longest tenured coach in Div 1-A? Frank Beamer (Va Tech), who was hired in 1987. Only 5 other coaches (out of 120 schools) have been at their position since the 90's.

 

That's 10 years.

 

93 of 120 coaches have been at their school for 5 or less years

[Old Style]

how are recruiting trips nothing for head coaches? i guess i don't know how far away PSU goes for recruiting, but it's a pretty big time commitment and a lot of selling.

 

Not for the head coaches. The assistants do all the work.

 

that's just not true.

 

I wouldn't say the assistants do all the work, but at many schools they do a large majority of it. I'm sure there are some head coaches that like to be more involved than others, and for some, the level of involvement might depend on the recruit. But for the most part, there's usually an assistant coach that handles most of the legwork when it comes to recruiting.

Head coaches don't hit the road a lot in football recruiting. I think they get 1 in home visit per recruit and that is usually done with the big time recruits closer to signing day. I think they spend more time on the phones and writing letters when it comes to recruiting.

[stuy119]

how are recruiting trips nothing for head coaches? i guess i don't know how far away PSU goes for recruiting, but it's a pretty big time commitment and a lot of selling.

 

Not for the head coaches. The assistants do all the work.

 

that's just not true.

 

I wouldn't say the assistants do all the work, but at many schools they do a large majority of it. I'm sure there are some head coaches that like to be more involved than others, and for some, the level of involvement might depend on the recruit. But for the most part, there's usually an assistant coach that handles most of the legwork when it comes to recruiting.

Head coaches don't hit the road a lot in football recruiting. I think they get 1 in home visit per recruit and that is usually done with the big time recruits closer to signing day. I think they spend more time on the phones and writing letters when it comes to recruiting.

 

Writing letters? I'm guessing that's left up to the secretarial pool ...

[jersey cubs fan]

93 of 120 coaches have been at their school for 5 or less years

 

Pat Fitzgerald is in his 5th year at Northwestern and isn't going anywhere. Rich Rodriguez is in only his 3rd year, but the guy before him was there for a dozen. Virginia has a new guy but the man before him was there for 9. USC has a new guy but the man before him was there for 8 years. Derwood, you were wrong that every team gets a new coach every 3-5 years. Some organizations are in perpetual state of turnover. A lot of them have very stable situations. Also rans like Rutgers and Illinois have coaches with 6 and 10 years in their position.

 

Missed another, Bret Bielema is "only" in his fifth year, but he replaced a guy who was there for 16 years.

Edited October 14, 2010 by jersey cubs fan