2010 World Cup Thread

[Magnetic Curses]

What, people watching soccer? It's the [expletive] World Cup and the American team isn't bad. What do you expect? A lot of you were turding it up over curling some months ago.

 

The U.S. qualifiers and the European leagues on cable both got solid ratings well before this World Cup came around.

 

There is a solid fan base here, no doubt. It will never be what its fans want it to be though. We will never embrace it for the reasons that have been mentioned.

[chuckywang]

The NFL sucks and football in general is a horrible sport.

[bukie]

Soccer has several quality TV deals.

 

Soccer matches draw ratings comparable to the other "major" sports outside of the NFL, often better.

 

MLS attendance is averaging 16k across a 16-team league.

 

Soccer highlights routinely appear on major sports news shows, and the scores appear right alongside every other major sport in the score tickers.

 

It'll never be the NFL, but nothing is ever going to be the NFL. There is no "big four."

 

There's the NFL.

 

Then there's the NBA and MLB.

 

Then there's a tier that includes a lot of ish, and soccer is in that tier. And really, MLB and NBA are a lot closer to this tier than they are the NFL.

I'm not even sure I'd still list the NBA on the second tier, either. Third tier is catching NBA fast, if they haven't already.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

 

There is a solid fan base here, no doubt. It will never be what its fans want it to be though. We will never embrace it for the reasons that have been mentioned.

 

I don't like the NBA. I generally find basketball to be boring and frequently unwatchable.

 

I don't go around making pronouncements that the NBA hasn't made it in this country. I'll never understand why people who feel about soccer the way I do about basketball can't acknowledge that they don't speak for everyone.

[Exile on Waveland]

the best soccer club leagues are played overseas, and the majority of American sports fans are provincial. casual fans aren't going to start flocking to mls games. I really don't see how soccer has arrived any more than in any previous cup year, apart from the fact that espn3 provides a wonderful way to waste time at work.

 

A league that is not the best in the world will never see mainstream success in this country. I'm loving the world cup now, though.

 

Then you're ignoring what's right in front of you.

 

What, people watching soccer? It's the [expletive] World Cup and the American team isn't bad. What do you expect? A lot of you were turding it up over curling some months ago.

 

Yes, that soccer's popularity has increased from four years ago. The US television rights to this World Cup went for $425 million, compared to $40 million for 2002 only after the MLS paid so the games weren't only on Spanish language channels (sorry, haven't found 2006 numbers). US, our poster, talked about the increase in MLS attendance. The send-away game for the US drew 55,000 fans (wish I could find the same number for 2006, I'm certain it would be much less). As a nation we purchased more tickets for this World Cup than any country besides South Africa. The Champions League final was televised on broadcast television (Fox) on Saturday afternoon -- bumping the Yankees-Mets game (though the ratings were disappointing -- club soccer has a long way to go here). In 2004, you had to pay-per-view to watch the Euros, in 2008 every game was on ESPN/ABC. The popularity of the sport has empirically increased, and I don't think it's my rose-colored glasses that feels the increase is palpable too.

[Magnetic Curses]

Soccer has several quality TV deals.

 

Soccer matches draw ratings comparable to the other "major" sports outside of the NFL, often better.

 

MLS attendance is averaging 16k across a 16-team league.

 

Soccer highlights routinely appear on major sports news shows, and the scores appear right alongside every other major sport in the score tickers.

 

It'll never be the NFL, but nothing is ever going to be the NFL. There is no "big four."

 

There's the NFL.

 

Then there's the NBA and MLB.

 

Then there's a tier that includes a lot of ish, and soccer is in that tier. And really, MLB and NBA are a lot closer to this tier than they are the NFL.

 

Soccer has a small but solid base of dedicated fans. I am a huge football fan but I went to 1 bears game last season. The average fire fan went to a much higher percentage than that. Same goes for me and baseball and basketball too.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

Soccer has a small but solid base of dedicated fans. I am a huge football fan but I went to 1 bears game last season. The average fire fan went to a much higher percentage than that. Same goes for me and baseball and basketball too.

 

Well, if soccer isn't measuring up on the Sulleymon Index, I guess all those other points I made are meaningless.

Edited June 24, 2010 by Hairyducked Idiot

[Exile on Waveland]

Why couldn't you have just said I was right?

 

I generally don't like doing that.

 

But, in this case, you were right. Soccer has some hurdles here in the States that it very possibly will never clear. But that doesn't mean soccer isn't popular or isn't increasing in popularity.

[Magnetic Curses]

Soccer has a small but solid base of dedicated fans. I am a huge football fan but I went to 1 bears game last season. The average fire fan went to a much higher percentage than that. Same goes for me and baseball and basketball too.

 

Well, if soccer isn't measuring up on the Sulleymon Index, I guess all those other points I made are meaningless.

 

So you disagree?

[Hairyducked Idiot]

Soccer has a small but solid base of dedicated fans. I am a huge football fan but I went to 1 bears game last season. The average fire fan went to a much higher percentage than that. Same goes for me and baseball and basketball too.

 

Well, if soccer isn't measuring up on the Sulleymon Index, I guess all those other points I made are meaningless.

 

So you disagree?

 

With which part?

 

That specific post? How many games of any sport you personally went to is pretty irrelevant to the discussion, though I don't specifically disagree with you. I'm sure you have a pretty good grasp on how many games you went to.

 

On your assessment of the size of soccer's fanbase in the U.S.? Yes. You are underestimating it by quite a bit.

[Magnetic Curses]

the best soccer club leagues are played overseas, and the majority of American sports fans are provincial. casual fans aren't going to start flocking to mls games. I really don't see how soccer has arrived any more than in any previous cup year, apart from the fact that espn3 provides a wonderful way to waste time at work.

 

A league that is not the best in the world will never see mainstream success in this country. I'm loving the world cup now, though.

 

Then you're ignoring what's right in front of you.

 

What, people watching soccer? It's the [expletive] World Cup and the American team isn't bad. What do you expect? A lot of you were turding it up over curling some months ago.

 

Yes, that soccer's popularity has increased from four years ago. The US television rights to this World Cup went for $425 million, compared to $40 million for 2002 only after the MLS paid so the games weren't only on Spanish language channels (sorry, haven't found 2006 numbers). US, our poster, talked about the increase in MLS attendance. The send-away game for the US drew 55,000 fans (wish I could find the same number for 2006, I'm certain it would be much less). As a nation we purchased more tickets for this World Cup than any country besides South Africa. The Champions League final was televised on broadcast television (Fox) on Saturday afternoon -- bumping the Yankees-Mets game (though the ratings were disappointing -- club soccer has a long way to go here). In 2004, you had to pay-per-view to watch the Euros, in 2008 every game was on ESPN/ABC. The popularity of the sport has empirically increased, and I don't think it's my rose-colored glasses that feels the increase is palpable too.

 

What was the proportion of tickets purchased to population?

 

And why on earth would joe sports fan watch the champions league final?

[Hairyducked Idiot]

What was the proportion of tickets purchased to population?

 

Probably pretty tiny. What percentage of the population attended an NFL or NBA game this year?

 

And why on earth would joe sports fan watch the champions league final?

 

Because they like soccer. That's what you aren't getting. A lot of sports fans have decided in the last 4-5 years that they like soccer.

[USSoccer]

Off topic, but Ian Darke has just been outstanding the past two games. I sincerely hope that Martin Tyler doesn't do another of our games the rest of the way.

 

Also, Harkes' rant on blown calls against the USA after he saw the replay of Dempsey's goal was probably the best commentary he's had this cycle.

[Exile on Waveland]

the best soccer club leagues are played overseas, and the majority of American sports fans are provincial. casual fans aren't going to start flocking to mls games. I really don't see how soccer has arrived any more than in any previous cup year, apart from the fact that espn3 provides a wonderful way to waste time at work.

 

A league that is not the best in the world will never see mainstream success in this country. I'm loving the world cup now, though.

 

Then you're ignoring what's right in front of you.

 

What, people watching soccer? It's the [expletive] World Cup and the American team isn't bad. What do you expect? A lot of you were turding it up over curling some months ago.

 

Yes, that soccer's popularity has increased from four years ago. The US television rights to this World Cup went for $425 million, compared to $40 million for 2002 only after the MLS paid so the games weren't only on Spanish language channels (sorry, haven't found 2006 numbers). US, our poster, talked about the increase in MLS attendance. The send-away game for the US drew 55,000 fans (wish I could find the same number for 2006, I'm certain it would be much less). As a nation we purchased more tickets for this World Cup than any country besides South Africa. The Champions League final was televised on broadcast television (Fox) on Saturday afternoon -- bumping the Yankees-Mets game (though the ratings were disappointing -- club soccer has a long way to go here). In 2004, you had to pay-per-view to watch the Euros, in 2008 every game was on ESPN/ABC. The popularity of the sport has empirically increased, and I don't think it's my rose-colored glasses that feels the increase is palpable too.

 

What was the proportion of tickets purchased to population?

 

And why on earth would joe sports fan watch the champions league final?

 

1. I don't see how this matters much for this line of post (i.e., has soccer's popularity increased over the past four years in the US). You're shifting the argument -- though my point wasn't exactly on point with no baseline comparison. No one is arguing soccer is more popular here than in other countries or that it's more popular here than football/baseball/basketball. However, if the sport wasn't popular here, I have a difficult time believing we'd have the most fans attending over countries that live the sport.

 

2. Well, it's great soccer at an elite level. But that's also besides the point. In fact, joe sports fan didn't watch it as I said. However, he could have on a weekend without cable for the first time ever. That's progress.

[Magnetic Curses]

Soccer has a small but solid base of dedicated fans. I am a huge football fan but I went to 1 bears game last season. The average fire fan went to a much higher percentage than that. Same goes for me and baseball and basketball too.

 

Well, if soccer isn't measuring up on the Sulleymon Index, I guess all those other points I made are meaningless.

 

So you disagree?

 

With which part?

 

That specific post? How many games of any sport you personally went to is pretty irrelevant to the discussion, though I don't specifically disagree with you. I'm sure you have a pretty good grasp on how many games you went to.

 

On your assessment of the size of soccer's fanbase in the U.S.? Yes. You are underestimating it by quite a bit.

 

You disagree with the idea that soccer is the frank zappa of sports.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

I'm not entirely sure who Frank Zappa is, to be perfectly honest.

[Magnetic Curses]

Off topic, but Ian Darke has just been outstanding the past two games. I sincerely hope that Martin Tyler doesn't do another of our games the rest of the way.

 

Also, Harkes' rant on blown calls against the USA after he saw the replay of Dempsey's goal was probably the best commentary he's had this cycle.

 

I was hoping he'd go farther than what he did.

[bcl412]

I've always loved watching World Cup soccer since we hosted in 94. It is even more fun to watch when you have a rooting interest, I couldn't watch the end today but I watched the first half and I was pissed about the offsides call today.

 

I would love to watch more of the sport (I catch games when they were on but have never looked at a schedule or anything to see when matches are on). I would love to find a way to have a rooting interest outside of the World Cup and the few qualifiers i've seen.

 

It's hard for me to figure out how to do this with the structure of the club leagues and what not.

Edited June 24, 2010 by bcl412

[Hairyducked Idiot]

Okay, here's another fun fact.

 

In total U.S. TV viewers, USA-England in an afternoon slot beat out the first four games of the NBA Finals in primetime.

[Magnetic Curses]

I'm not entirely sure who Frank Zappa is, to be perfectly honest.

 

He was the guy who disagreed with tipper.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

I'm not entirely sure who Frank Zappa is, to be perfectly honest.

 

He was the guy who disagreed with tipper.

 

I thought that was Al.

[Exile on Waveland]

I've always loved watching World Cup soccer since we hosted in 94. It is even more fun to watch when you have a rooting interest, I couldn't watch the end today but I watched the first half and I was pissed about the offsides call today.

 

I would love to watch more of the sport (I catch games when they were on but have never looked at a schedule or anything to see when matches are on). I would love to find a way to have a rooting interest outside of the World Cup and the few qualifiers i've seen.

 

It's hard for me to figure out how to do this with the structure of the club leagues and what not.

 

I find this entirely reasonable and understandable. It's a bit unfortunate that the club structure makes it more difficult for fans in the States to relate and thus follow. It's certainly not as simple as flipping on CBS/Fox on a Sunday to watch the NFL, clearly the one top league in the world.

[Magnetic Curses]

I'm not entirely sure who Frank Zappa is, to be perfectly honest.

 

He was the guy who disagreed with tipper.

 

I thought that was Al.

 

No, he disagreed with the environment

[Exile on Waveland]

Okay, here's another fun fact.

 

In total U.S. TV viewers, USA-England in an afternoon slot beat out the first four games of the NBA Finals in primetime.

 

I believe the 2006 World Cup Final drew a bigger television audience in the States than the NBA and NHL finals that year, and ostensibly equaled the World Series and Final Four/National Championship game. A bit apples-to-oranges because of the four-year cycle, but pretty compelling stuff for the popularity of soccer.

 

So, basically, what I'm saying is this: when Frank Zappa outsells the Stones or Zeppelin, then maybe soccer is the Zappa of sports.*

 

 

 

 

*Frank Zappa is pretty damned good, heady stuff, by the way.

Edited June 24, 2010 by Exile on Waveland

[bcl412]

The sport that it seems closest to is college football with every club league acting as a conference.