Frank Thomas Retires

[Little Slide Rooter]

Despite playing for the wrong team, Frank was one of my favorite Chicago baseball players of the 90s. I still have a (or a couple) 1991 Upper Deck Frank Thomas card where he is allegedly flipping off someone in the dugout.

 

http://www.sox35th.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/10/frank.jpg

 

Classic.

 

Edit: Since I haven't looked at that card in years, I just noticed that apparently Sammy finds Frank's antics quite amusing. At least I think that is Sammy.

 

I remember there was contoversy over that card, just a year or 2 after the Billy Ripken [expletive] Face card and its many variations. It made the news. I also forgot about that short lived White Sox logo between the SOX and the current logo.

[Rob]

Is he really going to be held back by the steroid issue? He was basically out there in the middle of it demanding to be tested, plus he was always gigantic, even when he was a kid.

 

And what percentage of the BBWAA do you think will pause long enough to remember that before they start writing indignant articles?

[Four and Twenty]

Despite playing for the wrong team, Frank was one of my favorite Chicago baseball players of the 90s. I still have a (or a couple) 1991 Upper Deck Frank Thomas card where he is allegedly flipping off someone in the dugout.

 

http://www.sox35th.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/10/frank.jpg

 

Classic.

 

Edit: Since I haven't looked at that card in years, I just noticed that apparently Sammy finds Frank's antics quite amusing. At least I think that is Sammy.

 

I remember there was contoversy over that card, just a year or 2 after the Billy Ripken [expletive] Face card and its many variations. It made the news. I also forgot about that short lived White Sox logo between the SOX and the current logo.

 

Now that I actually take a moment to think about it, Sammy is probably laughing at the person Frank is flipping off.

 

Thanks for the information, though. I thought I remembered a big stink over the card, even as a kid in California.

[Sammy Sofa]

Is he really going to be held back by the steroid issue? He was basically out there in the middle of it demanding to be tested, plus he was always gigantic, even when he was a kid.

 

And what percentage of the BBWAA do you think will pause long enough to remember that before they start writing indignant articles?

 

He started doing it 1995 and then repeated his request to be tested every year after that. He appeared before the whole Mitchell brouhaha and flatly stated it yet again. When names have been tossed around of 90's players who people assume have juiced I never see him come up. I think his stance on the matter is pretty well known amongst the voters.

[Mark Priors Calves]

I think he'll be embraced by the BBWAA because of his steroid stance. In fact, he might get in sooner than he normally would have based on his career because he'll viewed as someone who "did it the right way". He was always outspoken about steroids and the holier than thou BBWAA will reward his views.

 

Either way, I could never stand the guy, but his numbers are shocking.

[mcgoobs]

Thomas was Pujols before Pujols out-Pujols'ed him

 

First seven full years OPS+, Thomas / Pujols listed:

 

180 / 157

174 / 151

177 / 187

211 / 172

179 / 168

178 / 178

181 / 157

[SouthSideRyan]

Thomas was Pujols before Pujols out-Pujols'ed him

 

First seven full years OPS+, Thomas / Pujols listed:

 

180 / 157

174 / 151

177 / 187

211 / 172

179 / 168

178 / 178

181 / 157

 

How is that out-Pujolsing him?

[SouthSideRyan]

By the way, keeping this man out of the Hall would be a complete travesty. Why the BBWAA continues to look down on a position created and sanctioned by Major League Baseball is beyond me. Designated Hitter is a part of the game, make it part of the Hall.

 

There's nothing wrong with holding different positions to a different offensive standard. If you're going to use 1st ballot as a special qualification, I can buy the argument that Thomas shouldn't go in his first year, and would probably support it.

[Four and Twenty]

By the way, keeping this man out of the Hall would be a complete travesty. Why the BBWAA continues to look down on a position created and sanctioned by Major League Baseball is beyond me. Designated Hitter is a part of the game, make it part of the Hall.

 

There's nothing wrong with holding different positions to a different offensive standard. If you're going to use 1st ballot as a special qualification, I can buy the argument that Thomas shouldn't go in his first year, and would probably support it.

 

I agree. Obviously we'll have to wait and see how the BBWAA reacts to the more prominent DH hitters of the last era to make statements like the one I made.

[Clem Fandango]

The fact of the matter is Frank Thomas was one of the Top 5 best players in the 90's and that was the time when he spent most of his time as a 1B, not a DH. (847 @ 1B vs. 460 @ DH). I would think because he spent his best HOF-caliber seasons as a full time 1B should count for something. He was about 1 months worth of games played away at 1B from playing in 1000 games at the position. This shouldn't be a big deal, and if people make it out to be a big deal it will be a travesty if he doesn't go in on the first ballot

[SouthSideRyan]

The fact of the matter is Frank Thomas was one of the Top 5 best players in the 90's and that was the time when he spent most of his time as a 1B, not a DH. (847 @ 1B vs. 460 @ DH). I would think because he spent his best HOF-caliber seasons as a full time 1B should count for something. He was about 1 months worth of games played away at 1B from playing in 1000 games at the position. This shouldn't be a big deal, and if people make it out to be a big deal it will be a travesty if he doesn't go in on the first ballot

 

No it won't. He was a terrible baserunner, and a terrible fielder at the easiest position on the field, which he didn't even play for half his career. He was an incredible hitter, and should be a hall of famer, but if you're going to differentiate between 1st ballot and not, then he shouldn't get in on the 1st ballot.

[Maclowery]

[expletive], if you were looking at lefties to emulate in the 90's then Bonds-Griffey-Gwynn have to be the holy trinity.

 

As a kid, I told coaches that I modeled my left-handed swing after Will Clark. Unfortunately, although I had nice enough form, I had an issue with actually making contact with the ball. And we're talking coach pitch here.

[Derwood]

Thomas' OPS is 15th best ALL TIME

 

holy [expletive]

[Guest]

Player A and Player B time:

 

A: 10074 PA; .301/.419/.555/.974; 971 games 1B, 1311 DH

B: 9431 PA: .297/.408/.540/.948; 2111 games 1B, 1 game RF (reasonable in the field, 1 GG), stole 202 bases (2 30/30 years)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

If Frank Thomas is a no-doubt HOF player (and he is), how is Jeff Bagwell not one?

[rocket]

[expletive], if you were looking at lefties to emulate in the 90's then Bonds-Griffey-Gwynn have to be the holy trinity.

 

i was will clark bitch

[bcl412]

One of the rare White Sox players that I liked. He was fun to watch hit in his prime.

[illiniguy]

Player A and Player B time:

 

A: 10074 PA; .301/.419/.555/.974; 971 games 1B, 1311 DH

B: 9431 PA: .297/.408/.540/.948; 2111 games 1B, 1 game RF (reasonable in the field, 1 GG), stole 202 bases (2 30/30 years)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

If Frank Thomas is a no-doubt HOF player (and he is), how is Jeff Bagwell not one?

He is isn't he?

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

Player A and Player B time:

 

A: 10074 PA; .301/.419/.555/.974; 971 games 1B, 1311 DH

B: 9431 PA: .297/.408/.540/.948; 2111 games 1B, 1 game RF (reasonable in the field, 1 GG), stole 202 bases (2 30/30 years)

 

Because Bagwell may have done the juice?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

If Frank Thomas is a no-doubt HOF player (and he is), how is Jeff Bagwell not one?

[Backtobanks]

I think he'll be embraced by the BBWAA because of his steroid stance. In fact, he might get in sooner than he normally would have based on his career because he'll viewed as someone who "did it the right way". He was always outspoken about steroids and the holier than thou BBWAA will reward his views.

 

Either way, I could never stand the guy, but his numbers are shocking.

 

In this age of cynicism, can we be sure Thomas (or anybody else) is absolutely clean? I'm not saying he used, but others have talked about Bagwell (who Tim mentioned). As for his "holier than thou" views, how many ultra-conservative, right-wing Republicans who speak out against gay rights have been exposed as closet homosexuals? The sad part of this whole steroid era is all of the suspicion about anybody with extraordinary stats.

[Sammy Sofa]

He wasn't just outspoken: he insisted on being tested every year for over a decade.

[Backtobanks]

He wasn't just outspoken: he insisted on being tested every year for over a decade.

 

And no results have been posted except for a few names that were leaked. Again, I'm not saying he used, I'm just saying that nobody knows anything about the results.

[NewUserName]

Player A and Player B time:

 

A: 10074 PA; .301/.419/.555/.974; 971 games 1B, 1311 DH

B: 9431 PA: .297/.408/.540/.948; 2111 games 1B, 1 game RF (reasonable in the field, 1 GG), stole 202 bases (2 30/30 years)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

If Frank Thomas is a no-doubt HOF player (and he is), how is Jeff Bagwell not one?

 

I think Bagwell should be...is he eligible yet?

[BCVM22]

I think Bagwell should be...is he eligible yet?

 

He'll be on the ballot following the 2010 season, if I have my math right.

 

...Jeff Bagwell had 202 career steals?

[Sammy Sofa]

He wasn't just outspoken: he insisted on being tested every year for over a decade.

 

And no results have been posted except for a few names that were leaked. Again, I'm not saying he used, I'm just saying that nobody knows anything about the results.

 

That would be an incredibly bizarre scenario if he was demanding that he be tested each year will using anything he shouldn't have been. I think we'd be letting the paranoid and melodramatic attitude towards steroids in baseball reach new heights of ridiculousness if we act like such a sceanrio is likely.

[Backtobanks]

He wasn't just outspoken: he insisted on being tested every year for over a decade.

 

And no results have been posted except for a few names that were leaked. Again, I'm not saying he used, I'm just saying that nobody knows anything about the results.

 

That would be an incredibly bizarre scenario if he was demanding that he be tested each year will using anything he shouldn't have been. I think we'd be letting the paranoid and melodramatic attitude towards steroids in baseball reach new heights of ridiculousness if we act like such a sceanrio is likely.

 

Again, I'm not saying he used anything, but all I'm saying is that in this age of cynicism nobody would be totally shocked if his (or anybody's name) is linked in the future. It reminds me of the 60's when all of the government lies about Viet Nam came out and we had years of not believing anything the government said.