What will the reaction be when McGwire hits Wrigley?

Sammy Sofa · March 15, 2010

Your assesment of McGwire as a hitter never fails to be hilariously wrong.

Roast · March 16, 2010

Why are you guys so hung up on who he roots for? I say who cares to each his own. I'm more hung up on hm saying McGwire is a horrible hitting coach because he was a limited player in his career. Show me where being a great hitter is a prerequsite. Was Rudy Jaramilo an allstar before becoming a coach, how about Von Joshua? It's easier to understand and be able to teach a concept than it is to actually employ it succssfully into your own game.
I'm not saying a man had to be a great hitter to instruct it. But I DO question the choice of such a one demensional type hitter to be chosen over all others, especially concidering the obvious controversy.

If you could just take a second to explain to me how a "one dimensional hitter" racks up a career OBP of almost .400 that'd be spectacular.

Magdal · March 16, 2010

Why are you guys so hung up on who he roots for? I say who cares to each his own. I'm more hung up on hm saying McGwire is a horrible hitting coach because he was a limited player in his career. Show me where being a great hitter is a prerequsite. Was Rudy Jaramilo an allstar before becoming a coach, how about Von Joshua? It's easier to understand and be able to teach a concept than it is to actually employ it succssfully into your own game.
I'm not saying a man had to be a great hitter to instruct it. But I DO question the choice of such a one demensional type hitter to be chosen over all others, especially concidering the obvious controversy.

If you could just take a second to explain to me how a "one dimensional hitter" racks up a career OBP of almost .400 that'd be spectacular.

Pretty easy...being pitched around and intentional walks...is he gonna teach 'em how to get intentional walks? He DAM sure can't teach them how to shorten up to push runners over, or how to drag bunt for a hit. Tell me again why he will be a better hitting coach than say, Sandberg or Hernandez.

Sammy Sofa · March 16, 2010

Who said he'd be better than either of those guys?

And you do realize that the things you're harping on are taught in the minors, right? Do you actually think guys have no idea how to do things like drag bunt or shorten their swing until they encounter a hitting coach in the majors? What the [expletive] do you think a hitting coach in the majors does?

Formerly Snayke · March 16, 2010

Who said he'd be better than either of those guys?

And you do realize that the things you're harping on are taught in the minors, right? Do you actually think guys have no idea how to do things like drag bunt or shorten their swing until they encounter a hitting coach in the majors? What the [expletive] do you think a hitting coach in the majors does?

Teach the drag bunt and how to shorten their swing.

Sammy Sofa · March 16, 2010

I confused myself with my own rage and bile.

NonProfitCow · March 16, 2010

I've been griping for years about the Cardinals coaches. Dave Duncan is the pitching coach. HE WASN'T EVEN A PITCHER! How is he supposed to help guys with their mechanics or game plans? He DAM sure can't teach them a pickoff move or slide step.

Magdal · March 17, 2010

Who said he'd be better than either of those guys?

And you do realize that the things you're harping on are taught in the minors, right? Do you actually think guys have no idea how to do things like drag bunt or shorten their swing until they encounter a hitting coach in the majors? What the [expletive] do you think a hitting coach in the majors does?

Those things I'm harping on were taught from LITTLE league on! Frankly besides possibly spotting a hitch in a swing or something like that, that any other observant player on the team could also spot, the hitting coach is a waste of salary. In this case a high profile, distracting waste of salary.

Sammy Sofa · March 17, 2010

So then why do you keep bringing up the idea of him teaching guys how to bunt?

Roast · March 17, 2010

Why are you guys so hung up on who he roots for? I say who cares to each his own. I'm more hung up on hm saying McGwire is a horrible hitting coach because he was a limited player in his career. Show me where being a great hitter is a prerequsite. Was Rudy Jaramilo an allstar before becoming a coach, how about Von Joshua? It's easier to understand and be able to teach a concept than it is to actually employ it succssfully into your own game.
I'm not saying a man had to be a great hitter to instruct it. But I DO question the choice of such a one demensional type hitter to be chosen over all others, especially concidering the obvious controversy.

If you could just take a second to explain to me how a "one dimensional hitter" racks up a career OBP of almost .400 that'd be spectacular.
Pretty easy...being pitched around and intentional walks...is he gonna teach 'em how to get intentional walks? He DAM sure can't teach them how to shorten up to push runners over, or how to drag bunt for a hit. Tell me again why he will be a better hitting coach than say, Sandberg or Hernandez.

If you take away the 150 IBB he received in his career he'd still have a .374 career OBP. Pretty DAM good for a "one dimensional hitter." As a matter of fact, that's a full 30 points higher than Sandberg's career OBP of .344. Which, by the way, if you take out HIS IBB, drops all the way down to .333.

Oh, and as for the "going the other way" thing, while he was very much a "pull" hitter in his career:

I          Split    G   PA     AB   H    2B 3B  HR RBI
I     Pulled-RHB   870 1160  1150  600  78  0 233  518
I    Up Mdle-RHB   981 1409  1387  496  61  0 194  449
I    Opp Fld-RHB   442  499   488  112  18  2  28   85
I    Unknown Loc   754 1135  1105  247  66  0  76  209

Sandberg wasn't much different:

I          Split    G   PA     AB  H    2B 3B  HR RBI
I     Pulled-RHB   736 1042  1037  502  81  1 111  250
I    Up Mdle-RHB   888 1529  1515  498  63 13  70  248
I    Opp Fld-RHB   392  459   453  146  21  7   2  49   
I    Unknown Loc   621 1003   977  184  60 14   9  109

Maclowery · March 17, 2010

Quickly, Magdal! Move on to something else! McGwire's hitting and Pujols' slump were unsuccessful! I'd recommend the Holiday contract, as that one you're less likely to be made a fool of for several years yet!

Clem Fandango · March 17, 2010

Why has this thread reached 5 pages?

Magdal · March 18, 2010

Quickly, Magdal! Move on to something else! McGwire's hitting and Pujols' slump were unsuccessful! I'd recommend the Holiday contract, as that one you're less likely to be made a fool of for several years yet!

I don't mind being made a fool of, really....but when everyone gangs up on me I begin to doubt myself. Maybe I am stupid, with no real slant on the game.

NonProfitCow · March 19, 2010

Quickly, Magdal! Move on to something else! McGwire's hitting and Pujols' slump were unsuccessful! I'd recommend the Holiday contract, as that one you're less likely to be made a fool of for several years yet!
I don't mind being made a fool of, really....but when everyone gangs up on me I begin to doubt myself. Maybe I am stupid, with no real slant on the game.

At least you're coming around.

Magdal · March 22, 2010

Quickly, Magdal! Move on to something else! McGwire's hitting and Pujols' slump were unsuccessful! I'd recommend the Holiday contract, as that one you're less likely to be made a fool of for several years yet!
I don't mind being made a fool of, really....but when everyone gangs up on me I begin to doubt myself. Maybe I am stupid, with no real slant on the game.
At least you're coming around.

You thought I was serious? :-))

NonProfitCow · April 5, 2010

I gotta tell you, today's McGwire hysteria was too much. Every channel was like, McGwire this and McGwire that. It's pretty clear that he has not only ruined the St Louis Cardinals, but baseball as well.

baseballfan50 · April 6, 2010

He's a hitting coach, so I doubt the fans will even see him.

I can't say for sure about the media, though.

I think most people have gotten over it. He did something horrible, he sincerely apologized, he is not making money off of it (though his brother is trying to). Time to move on from the steroid era, in my opinion.

Formerly Snayke · April 6, 2010

He's a hitting coach, so I doubt the fans will even see him.

I can't say for sure about the media, though.

I think most people have gotten over it. He did something horrible, he sincerely apologized, he is not making money off of it (though his brother is trying to). Time to move on from the steroid era, in my opinion.

Should we just move on from Pearl Harbor as well? I couldn't enjoy today's game because I knew McLiar helped the Cardinals.

NonProfitCow · April 6, 2010

He's a hitting coach, so I doubt the fans will even see him.

I can't say for sure about the media, though.

I think most people have gotten over it. He did something horrible, he sincerely apologized, he is not making money off of it (though his brother is trying to). Time to move on from the steroid era, in my opinion.

Yeah, lets just move on from 9/11 too.

baseballfan50 · April 6, 2010

I don't think the steroids era is quite the same as Pearl Harbor or 9/11. Thousands of people died in those horrible acts. The steroid era was bad, and it broke the hearts of a lot of people, but it was not Pearl Harbor or 9/11.

And McGwire's hardly the only one who did steroids. And, even if they don't want to admit, most baseball fans who remember the 1998 race (especially Cubs and Cardinals fans) probably enjoyed it at the time.

Besides, players in the '80s snorted coke, and players of all decades have abused amphetamines. Drug abuse and cheating are hardly anything new in baseball.

Edited April 6, 2010 by baseballfan50

Formerly Snayke · April 6, 2010

I don't think the steroids era is quite the same as Pearl Harbor or 9/11. Thousands of people died in those horrible acts. The steroid era was bad, and it broke the hearts of a lot of people, but it was not Pearl Harbor or 9/11.

And McGwire's hardly the only one who did steroids. And, even if they don't want to admit, most baseball fans who remember the 1998 race (especially Cubs and Cardinals fans) probably enjoyed it at the time.

Besides, players in the '80s snorted coke, and players of all decades have abused amphetamines. Drug abuse and cheating are hardly anything new.

We're both being sarcastic, but yes, you're absolutely right.

UK1679666180 · April 6, 2010

Depends on your definition of a one-dimensional hitter as to whether or not he was one-dimensional.

He wasn't one-dimensional in the fact that he could hit breaking-balls and off-speed pitches as well as fastballs and could hit to RF with power.

He was one-dimensional in the fact that he never shortened his swing with two strikes and had an uppercut swing which was never going to allow him to hit for a higher avg. nor change his approach ala Dunn/Thome.

The ability to draw BBs/OBP is equally dependent on his well-defined strike zone judgement and the plan of the pitcher, both are independent of one's ability to put the bat on the ball.

As far as whether or not that will make him a good or bad hitting coach, it matters very little what he did as a player compared to how he treats the players, how well he observes flaws/correctable points, pitchers tipping, and most importantly how well he communicates with them. You can line up 30 hitting coaches all watching the same batter and they will all likely pick up on the absolutes and flaws of that batter, the separation will be how well they communicate that flaw via discussion, drill, etc. to correct it.