Re: College Basketball 2008-2009

[fromthestretch]

they showed the replay and it was the correct call, the announcers gushed about the call for like 5 minutes.

 

Just curious, but did they show a different angle of that play? Everytime I saw the replay, it was from the original angle, from which it looked like it should have been Purdue's ball. That is pretty much the same angle the broadcasters had, so they didn't really have a better view of things than anyone watching the game on TV.

 

I'm open to the idea that it may have been the right call, but from the one view they kept showing, it certainly looked like it should have been Purdue's ball.

 

i never saw the ball hit mccamey at all.

 

The original angle showed Johnson throw it off his leg. The only question I had was whether it then hit Johnson again before it landed out of bounds.

 

iirc, neither angle shows it actually hit mccamey, you just assume that it did. however, johnson's legs were all flailed out, so there's no way to be sure. even if it goes back to purdue, they were still down.

 

Well, it hit something, because Johnson threw it at him, the ball hit something and then clearly changed direction to head back toward Johnson. To me there was no question about that. From the angle, I just couldn't tell if the ball hit Johnson again before hitting the floor. There's a possibility that it did, which would explain why they gave the ball back to Illinois.

[NeifiIsMyHomeBoy]

Frazier

 

5.9ppg, 6.5apg, 4.7rpg, 1.4spg

 

Kramer

 

3.7ppg, 2.7apg, 2.9rpg, 2.2spg

 

Kramer is averaging less minutes and is a better defender, but Chester is great on defense and makes the offense run. In terms of his value to the team he is pretty much not replaceable. I hope that he is on the Illinois bench one day.

[rchap24]

Frazier

 

5.9ppg, 6.5apg, 4.7rpg, 1.4spg

 

Kramer

 

3.7ppg, 2.7apg, 2.9rpg, 2.2spg

 

Kramer is averaging less minutes and is a better defender, but Chester is great on defense and makes the offense run. In terms of his value to the team he is pretty much not replaceable. I hope that he is on the Illinois bench one day.

 

Wait who do you want on the Illinois bench?

They're both pretty much irreplaceable though...Also Kramer's numbers are down this year, I think he might have taken a step down while Frasier took one up

[bukie]

Illinois has been shockingly good the past two big games now (yeah, EMU was in the middle there, textbook definition of a "coasting" game), and they have pretty much the same talent as they did last year. Their major improvement has apparently been the ability to get shots to actually go in the basket, both from the field and at the FT line. Their major weakness, though, is rebounding, which can and will be exploited by any team that crashes the offensive boards at the expense of surrendering transition points (read: nobody in the Big Ten!).

[NeifiIsMyHomeBoy]

Chester is going to be a great coach some day. I would love to have him on the Illinois bench. I think Kramer may have a future in coaching as well.

[bukie]

Frazier

 

5.9ppg, 6.5apg, 4.7rpg, 1.4spg

 

Kramer

 

3.7ppg, 2.7apg, 2.9rpg, 2.2spg

 

Kramer is averaging less minutes and is a better defender, but Chester is great on defense and makes the offense run. In terms of his value to the team he is pretty much not replaceable. I hope that he is on the Illinois bench one day.

 

Wait who do you want on the Illinois bench?

They're both pretty much irreplaceable though...Also Kramer's numbers are down this year, I think he might have taken a step down while Frasier took one up

I'm pretty sure he means after this year, as a coach.

[rchap24]

Frazier

 

5.9ppg, 6.5apg, 4.7rpg, 1.4spg

 

Kramer

 

3.7ppg, 2.7apg, 2.9rpg, 2.2spg

 

Kramer is averaging less minutes and is a better defender, but Chester is great on defense and makes the offense run. In terms of his value to the team he is pretty much not replaceable. I hope that he is on the Illinois bench one day.

 

Wait who do you want on the Illinois bench?

They're both pretty much irreplaceable though...Also Kramer's numbers are down this year, I think he might have taken a step down while Frasier took one up

I'm pretty sure he means after this year, as a coach.

 

Yeah agree with both....People are saying Kramer should go play football ha...He wouldn't be to bad I think guess he was a top recruit for our football team too, but yeah both have the mindset you want to coach a team

[CubbieBum]

I think Illinois won last night because they took extremely good care of the ball and did a great job on Hummel defensively. Both of those occurrences had a lot to do with Chester Frazier.

 

kramer's still better.

 

And he is, but that's besides the point

 

I'd just like to point out that Chester has been playing hurt for four years. I don't think he has ever been 100% healthy for any game. He is a warrior and I am glad the fan base is finally embracing him. I really like Kramer's game also, what is the latest on his injury, Purdue is not the same without him. I also read that Hummel is banged up, anyone have news on that?

 

And so has Kramer.

[rchap24]

I think Illinois won last night because they took extremely good care of the ball and did a great job on Hummel defensively. Both of those occurrences had a lot to do with Chester Frazier.

 

kramer's still better.

 

And he is, but that's besides the point

 

I'd just like to point out that Chester has been playing hurt for four years. I don't think he has ever been 100% healthy for any game. He is a warrior and I am glad the fan base is finally embracing him. I really like Kramer's game also, what is the latest on his injury, Purdue is not the same without him. I also read that Hummel is banged up, anyone have news on that?

 

And so has Kramer.

 

This year he has and a little bit at the end of last season, but I don't remember him being hurt freshman year?

[CubbieBum]

Nice job Boilers. :clapping:

 

Thank you. If you go to Mackey you can probably say that to them in person because they are likely shooting free throws right now.

 

yeah, because the refs are still calling fouls on the illini.

 

The game was called fairly.

 

not really.

 

Eh, there were some questionable calls both ways. The only really bad call was the foul at the end of regulation on Davis. Typical B10 game other than that.

 

i was just making a comment on how many more free throws purdue shot than the illini. the fouls looked even at the end because of the 7 fouls purdue had in the ot period.

 

plus, purdue didn't lose the game, they were beaten.

 

Just because one team shoots 10-15 more free throws doesn't mean the reffing was bad. Watch the game with open eyes and you will see the game was reffed well. Purdue shot more free throws because they had their guards driving a lot and JaJuan was getting great position. Ilinois was getting open jump shots from 10-15 feet out all game. Those are great scoring opportunities but you won't get a lot of free throws with jump shots.

 

you should take your own advice, your one of the biggest homers here. purdue would get the ball on the block and get the foul every time, regardless of if they were touched or not. tisdale gets pushed and his hand gets tangled up in someone's baggy jersey and he gets called for a foul for grabbing. the free throws really speak for themselves.

 

i think they just called another foul on tisdale, really.

 

it's awesome though, if someone disagrees with you, that's generally your only response. just because no one agrees with you doesn't mean they aren't "looking at it with open eyes".

 

It's unlucky but its a foul. Just because the guy didn't mean to doesn't mean its not a foul. Most fouls the players doesn't mean to foul. This one is a bit different but its a foul nonetheless.

 

Same goes for the play Kramer got hurt on. The guy was trying to get past Kramer but in the end he ran over Kramer. Its a foul.

 

Again watch the game and you will see Purdue doing a lot of guard driving from the key which in general leads to a lot of free throws while Illinois passes it around and if it goes into the post its from a pass. JaJuan Johnson also drew a lot of fouls because he would either get prime position and the only option was to foul or would get an offensive rebound and be fouled to avoid an easy putback.

 

Were there bad calls? Sure like in every game there were but both teams had bad calls go against them. Remember the 20-30 second period where there were three straight no calls (two fouls and one traveling). Painter almost got T-ed up for that and he very rather gets a technical.

[CubbieBum]

I think Illinois won last night because they took extremely good care of the ball and did a great job on Hummel defensively. Both of those occurrences had a lot to do with Chester Frazier.

 

kramer's still better.

 

And he is, but that's besides the point

 

I'd just like to point out that Chester has been playing hurt for four years. I don't think he has ever been 100% healthy for any game. He is a warrior and I am glad the fan base is finally embracing him. I really like Kramer's game also, what is the latest on his injury, Purdue is not the same without him. I also read that Hummel is banged up, anyone have news on that?

 

And so has Kramer.

 

This year he has and a little bit at the end of last season, but I don't remember him being hurt freshman year?

 

You should read about him then. He has constant pain that he has to play through in every game because of his shins. He essentially has severe shinsplints nonstop. After his freshman year is when he had the surgery on both shins.

 

http://blogs.indystar.com/purdue/2008/09/false_alarm_on_chris_kramer.html

 

That shows what he deals with. He wears a protective air cast on days he has to walk around campus a lot. The kid is always injured he just plays through it.

[rchap24]

By the way how much better has Johnson gotten this year? He's looking awesome this year and looks better rebounding and much better defensively (Has a block in every game)

[CubbieBum]

By the way how much better has Johnson gotten this year? He's looking awesome this year and looks better rebounding and much better defensively (Has a block in every game)

 

Well he's a well above average player now much improved from last year but still has a way to go. There's a reason most experts said he had the most potential of anyone in that recruiting class. He's beginning to show it this year.

 

He has got smarter about getting good position down low which has led to a lot more scoring. Last year he settled for a lot of jump shots hence why he shot only 42 percent. This year he is getting mainly dunks/easy lay-ins hence why he is shooting55 percent.

 

Last year he was already a very good shot blocker (1.0 blocks in 16 minutes per game) but it was in the Josh Smith kind of way where he always goes for the block at the sacrifice of playing good defense. He would get the block occasionally but a lot of times his man would fake him out or Johnson would have let him go by so he could try and block from behind. For the most part Johnson has stopped doing that and has turned into one of the best blockers. He's averaging 2.2 blocks a game in 24 minutes a game.

 

He still needs to add more muscle and when he does he could be unstoppable. He's extremely athletic for his size and can shoot the jumper well for a center. So when he adds muscle, even 15 pounds of it, he can be strong enough to hold his position and athletic enough to beat his man down the court and get that position.

[rchap24]

By the way how much better has Johnson gotten this year? He's looking awesome this year and looks better rebounding and much better defensively (Has a block in every game)

 

Well he's a well above average player now much improved from last year but still has a way to go. There's a reason most experts said he had the most potential of anyone in that recruiting class. He's beginning to show it this year.

 

He has got smarter about getting good position down low which has led to a lot more scoring. Last year he settled for a lot of jump shots hence why he shot only 42 percent. This year he is getting mainly dunks/easy lay-ins hence why he is shooting55 percent.

 

Last year he was already a very good shot blocker (1.0 blocks in 16 minutes per game) but it was in the Josh Smith kind of way wear he always goes for the block at the sacrifice of playing good defense. He would get the block occasionally but a lot of times his man would fake him out or Johnson would have let him go by so he could try and block from behind. For the most part Johnson has stopped doing that and has turned into one of the best blockers. He's averaging 2.2 blocks a game in 24 minutes a game.

 

He still needs to add more muscle and when he does he could be unstoppable. He's extremely athletic for his size and can shoot the jumper well for a center. So when he adds muscle, even 15 pounds of it, he can be strong enough to hold his position and athletic enough to beat his man down the court and get that position.

 

Yeah that was the thing...Although everyone loved up Hummel last year Johnson and Moore were the ones with the most potential and there both showing it this year...He definitely needs to put on some weight though the guys like a twig

[Derwood]

the reason that play was Illinois ball was because McCamey was out of bounds when he threw the ball off of him. you can't do the "jump and bounce it off the other team to retain possession" thing if the other team's player is also out of bounds

[rchap24]

the reason that play was Illinois ball was because McCamey was out of bounds when he threw the ball off of him. you can't do the "jump and bounce it off the other team to retain possession" thing if the other team's player is also out of bounds

 

Oh wow guess I didn't realize that...Well than there's our answer and it makes a lot of sense now

[fromthestretch]

the reason that play was Illinois ball was because McCamey was out of bounds when he threw the ball off of him. you can't do the "jump and bounce it off the other team to retain possession" thing if the other team's player is also out of bounds

 

I could be wrong, but I don't think that's necessarily accurate. Johnson would be deemed in bounds when he threw the ball, since the last spot on the floor he touched prior to throwing the ball at McCamey was in bounds. I would imagine the out-of-bounds rule from the NBA also applies to college ball, and the NBA rule is that:

 

The ball is out-of-bounds when it touches a player who is out-of-bounds or any other person, the floor, or any object on, above or outside of a boundary or the supports or back of the backboard.

 

If Johnson was deemed in-bounds when he threw the ball at McCamey, and the ball hit McCamey while he was standing out-of-bounds, wouldn't it be Purdue ball at the moment it touched McCamey?

 

I'm not saying you're wrong, but I'm just curious where you heard that you can't throw it off someone when they are standing out-of-bounds.

[rchap24]

the reason that play was Illinois ball was because McCamey was out of bounds when he threw the ball off of him. you can't do the "jump and bounce it off the other team to retain possession" thing if the other team's player is also out of bounds

 

I could be wrong, but I don't think that's necessarily accurate. Johnson would be deemed in bounds when he threw the ball, since the last spot on the floor he touched prior to throwing the ball at McCamey was in bounds. I would imagine the out-of-bounds rule from the NBA also applies to college ball, and the NBA rule is that:

 

The ball is out-of-bounds when it touches a player who is out-of-bounds or any other person, the floor, or any object on, above or outside of a boundary or the supports or back of the backboard.

 

If Johnson was deemed in-bounds when he threw the ball at McCamey, and the ball hit McCamey while he was standing out-of-bounds, wouldn't it be Purdue ball at the moment it touched McCamey?

 

I'm not saying you're wrong, but I'm just curious where you heard that you can't throw it off someone when they are standing out-of-bounds.

 

Regardless in either case we still had a horrible view on if it hit Johnson's foot and I'm not gonna lose sleep over it

[bukie]

I'm actually a little geeked about the Illini's chances of winning the Big Ten. Up-to-date Pomeroy projections have Illinois winning the conference by 2 games now.

[rchap24]

I'm actually a little geeked about the Illini's chances of winning the Big Ten. Up-to-date Pomeroy projections have Illinois winning the conference by 2 games now.

 

Ha well see how we play from here on out...plus I still wanna see Ohio St. and Minnesota in league play...Don't get to ahead of yourself

[fromthestretch]

the reason that play was Illinois ball was because McCamey was out of bounds when he threw the ball off of him. you can't do the "jump and bounce it off the other team to retain possession" thing if the other team's player is also out of bounds

 

I could be wrong, but I don't think that's necessarily accurate. Johnson would be deemed in bounds when he threw the ball, since the last spot on the floor he touched prior to throwing the ball at McCamey was in bounds. I would imagine the out-of-bounds rule from the NBA also applies to college ball, and the NBA rule is that:

 

The ball is out-of-bounds when it touches a player who is out-of-bounds or any other person, the floor, or any object on, above or outside of a boundary or the supports or back of the backboard.

 

If Johnson was deemed in-bounds when he threw the ball at McCamey, and the ball hit McCamey while he was standing out-of-bounds, wouldn't it be Purdue ball at the moment it touched McCamey?

 

I'm not saying you're wrong, but I'm just curious where you heard that you can't throw it off someone when they are standing out-of-bounds.

 

Regardless in either case we still had a horrible view on if it hit Johnson's foot and I'm not gonna lose sleep over it

 

Well, it's obviously not the reason Purdue lost the game, but I would like some clarification on the rule (knowledge is power :wink: ). If what I indicated above holds true, it wouldn't matter if it hit Johnson's foot, since it would have been deemed out-of-bounds the moment it touched McCamey, if he was standing out-of-bounds when it hit him.

[rchap24]

the reason that play was Illinois ball was because McCamey was out of bounds when he threw the ball off of him. you can't do the "jump and bounce it off the other team to retain possession" thing if the other team's player is also out of bounds

 

I could be wrong, but I don't think that's necessarily accurate. Johnson would be deemed in bounds when he threw the ball, since the last spot on the floor he touched prior to throwing the ball at McCamey was in bounds. I would imagine the out-of-bounds rule from the NBA also applies to college ball, and the NBA rule is that:

 

The ball is out-of-bounds when it touches a player who is out-of-bounds or any other person, the floor, or any object on, above or outside of a boundary or the supports or back of the backboard.

 

If Johnson was deemed in-bounds when he threw the ball at McCamey, and the ball hit McCamey while he was standing out-of-bounds, wouldn't it be Purdue ball at the moment it touched McCamey?

 

I'm not saying you're wrong, but I'm just curious where you heard that you can't throw it off someone when they are standing out-of-bounds.

 

Regardless in either case we still had a horrible view on if it hit Johnson's foot and I'm not gonna lose sleep over it

 

Well, it's obviously not the reason Purdue lost the game, but I would like some clarification on the rule (knowledge is power :wink: ). If what I indicated above holds true, it wouldn't matter if it hit Johnson's foot, since it would have been deemed out-of-bounds the moment it touched McCamey, if he was standing out-of-bounds when it hit him.

 

Cool

[illiniguy]

the reason that play was Illinois ball was because McCamey was out of bounds when he threw the ball off of him. you can't do the "jump and bounce it off the other team to retain possession" thing if the other team's player is also out of bounds

 

I could be wrong, but I don't think that's necessarily accurate. Johnson would be deemed in bounds when he threw the ball, since the last spot on the floor he touched prior to throwing the ball at McCamey was in bounds. I would imagine the out-of-bounds rule from the NBA also applies to college ball, and the NBA rule is that:

 

The ball is out-of-bounds when it touches a player who is out-of-bounds or any other person, the floor, or any object on, above or outside of a boundary or the supports or back of the backboard.

 

If Johnson was deemed in-bounds when he threw the ball at McCamey, and the ball hit McCamey while he was standing out-of-bounds, wouldn't it be Purdue ball at the moment it touched McCamey?

 

I'm not saying you're wrong, but I'm just curious where you heard that you can't throw it off someone when they are standing out-of-bounds.

 

Regardless in either case we still had a horrible view on if it hit Johnson's foot and I'm not gonna lose sleep over it

 

Well, it's obviously not the reason Purdue lost the game, but I would like some clarification on the rule (knowledge is power :wink: ). If what I indicated above holds true, it wouldn't matter if it hit Johnson's foot, since it would have been deemed out-of-bounds the moment it touched McCamey, if he was standing out-of-bounds when it hit him.

I think the reason you lost is because we scored more points than you. I also think we are a lot closer to you than you may want to admit. After splitting the last 4 games I think that should be pretty obvious to anyone watching.

[fromthestretch]

[Well, it's obviously not the reason Purdue lost the game, but I would like some clarification on the rule (knowledge is power :wink: ). If what I indicated above holds true, it wouldn't matter if it hit Johnson's foot, since it would have been deemed out-of-bounds the moment it touched McCamey, if he was standing out-of-bounds when it hit him.

I think the reason you lost is because we scored more points than you. I also think we are a lot closer to you than you may want to admit. After splitting the last 4 games I think that should be pretty obvious to anyone watching.

 

I haven't disputed any of that. I believe you're confusing me with some other Purdue fans here. I have no problem admitting that Purdue was outplayed last night.

[SouthSideRyan]

I think Illinois won last night because they took extremely good care of the ball and did a great job on Hummel defensively. Both of those occurrences had a lot to do with Chester Frazier.

 

kramer's still better.

 

And he is, but that's besides the point

 

I'd just like to point out that Chester has been playing hurt for four years. I don't think he has ever been 100% healthy for any game. He is a warrior and I am glad the fan base is finally embracing him. I really like Kramer's game also, what is the latest on his injury, Purdue is not the same without him. I also read that Hummel is banged up, anyone have news on that?

 

And so has Kramer.

 

Tell me of Kramer's high school injuries. Years are counted differently at Purdue apparently.