Lou's Learning? Fukudome to bat 2nd

[frostwyrm]

i like how the guy has had 7 ABs (plus a few walks and a couple of HBP) and this has sold lou on the fact that maybe kosuke is not cut out to be a #3 hitter. this is spring training. lou is like a little kid with ADD.

 

I think this is kinda ridiculous. You wrote it yourself-this is Spring Training. The whole point, especially with players a manager has never seen before, is to try various things out and see if they work. Piniella said himself: "I might drop him back down to the two-spot and see what happens." It sounds like he's tinkering with things to see what works best. The last time I checked, that's the point of practice games.

 

Why not? I'd much rather have a manager who tries things (ESPECIALLY in Spring Training) to see what might work best over a manager who is so wedded to his stupid philosophies that he refuses to try anything new.

 

I think his quote here is telling: "Maybe the three-hole might be asking a little much too soon. We might drop him to the two-hole, and he might be more comfortable there." I don't think this has anything to do with "protection," or anything else we flippantly label "old school." I think it has more to do with the fact that Piniella probably believes that Fukudome is trying to drive the ball too much, thus expanding his strike zone, instead of remaining patient and trying to simply get on base. Putting him in the #2 hole might be a way to allow Fukudome to re-establish those facets that make him a good hitter.

 

 

Most importantly, however, I think an Allen Iverson quote is probably the most important to remember for some perspective here.

 

Practice? You're talking about Practice... Not the games. Practice...

 

That's all well and good, except for the fact that he apparantly tried the 3 spot for all of 7 AB and was able to determine that Fukudome in the 3 spot didn't work.

 

Spring training should not be about trying things. Spring training should be about getting in game shape. If you want to throw guys into different defensive positions, just to get them some experience, fine, but spring training is a horrible place to "see if things work". Nothing that happens in spring training should determine who plays, and where people hit, in the regular season - with the exception of injuries or trades.

 

Maybe with a familiar vet but Fukudome is like a rookie and Lou has to get a read on him.

 

Lou makes me a little nervous regarding Fukudome. I've seen Lou quoted on two different occasions as saying Fuku is like a cross between Ichiro and Hideki Matsui. Can he only fathom Fuku's skillset by comparing him to other players in his ethnic group? I would hate to think that Lou can't figure out what to do with Fuku because he can't find any other yellow-skinned player to equate him with.

[CuseCubFan69]

i like how the guy has had 7 ABs (plus a few walks and a couple of HBP) and this has sold lou on the fact that maybe kosuke is not cut out to be a #3 hitter. this is spring training. lou is like a little kid with ADD.

 

I think this is kinda ridiculous. You wrote it yourself-this is Spring Training. The whole point, especially with players a manager has never seen before, is to try various things out and see if they work. Piniella said himself: "I might drop him back down to the two-spot and see what happens." It sounds like he's tinkering with things to see what works best. The last time I checked, that's the point of practice games.

 

Why not? I'd much rather have a manager who tries things (ESPECIALLY in Spring Training) to see what might work best over a manager who is so wedded to his stupid philosophies that he refuses to try anything new.

 

I think his quote here is telling: "Maybe the three-hole might be asking a little much too soon. We might drop him to the two-hole, and he might be more comfortable there." I don't think this has anything to do with "protection," or anything else we flippantly label "old school." I think it has more to do with the fact that Piniella probably believes that Fukudome is trying to drive the ball too much, thus expanding his strike zone, instead of remaining patient and trying to simply get on base. Putting him in the #2 hole might be a way to allow Fukudome to re-establish those facets that make him a good hitter.

 

 

Most importantly, however, I think an Allen Iverson quote is probably the most important to remember for some perspective here.

 

Practice? You're talking about Practice... Not the games. Practice...

 

That's all well and good, except for the fact that he apparantly tried the 3 spot for all of 7 AB and was able to determine that Fukudome in the 3 spot didn't work.

 

Spring training should not be about trying things. Spring training should be about getting in game shape. If you want to throw guys into different defensive positions, just to get them some experience, fine, but spring training is a horrible place to "see if things work". Nothing that happens in spring training should determine who plays, and where people hit, in the regular season - with the exception of injuries or trades.

 

Maybe with a familiar vet but Fukudome is like a rookie and Lou has to get a read on him.

 

Lou makes me a little nervous regarding Fukudome. I've seen Lou quoted on two different occasions as saying Fuku is like a cross between Ichiro and Hideki Matsui. Can he only fathom Fuku's skillset by comparing him to other players in his ethnic group? I would hate to think that Lou can't figure out what to do with Fuku because he can't find any other yellow-skinned player to equate him with.

 

I hear he's a Joe Morgan with an arm!

 

I have no idea how Lou is thinking regarding this race thing. Maybe his son will give him some comparisons to all the players for Lou to use when he's asked that question again.

[TruffleShuffle]

Lou makes me a little nervous regarding Fukudome. I've seen Lou quoted on two different occasions as saying Fuku is like a cross between Ichiro and Hideki Matsui. Can he only fathom Fuku's skillset by comparing him to other players in his ethnic group? I would hate to think that Lou can't figure out what to do with Fuku because he can't find any other yellow-skinned player to equate him with.

 

people do this all the time. in the nba, do you ever see a white guy's game compared to a black guy? don't think so. if he's white, plays small forward but has pretty good height, not terribly athletic, but can shoot well, he's automatically compared to larry bird.

[frostwyrm]

i like how the guy has had 7 ABs (plus a few walks and a couple of HBP) and this has sold lou on the fact that maybe kosuke is not cut out to be a #3 hitter. this is spring training. lou is like a little kid with ADD.

 

I think this is kinda ridiculous. You wrote it yourself-this is Spring Training. The whole point, especially with players a manager has never seen before, is to try various things out and see if they work. Piniella said himself: "I might drop him back down to the two-spot and see what happens." It sounds like he's tinkering with things to see what works best. The last time I checked, that's the point of practice games.

 

Why not? I'd much rather have a manager who tries things (ESPECIALLY in Spring Training) to see what might work best over a manager who is so wedded to his stupid philosophies that he refuses to try anything new.

 

I think his quote here is telling: "Maybe the three-hole might be asking a little much too soon. We might drop him to the two-hole, and he might be more comfortable there." I don't think this has anything to do with "protection," or anything else we flippantly label "old school." I think it has more to do with the fact that Piniella probably believes that Fukudome is trying to drive the ball too much, thus expanding his strike zone, instead of remaining patient and trying to simply get on base. Putting him in the #2 hole might be a way to allow Fukudome to re-establish those facets that make him a good hitter.

 

 

Most importantly, however, I think an Allen Iverson quote is probably the most important to remember for some perspective here.

 

Practice? You're talking about Practice... Not the games. Practice...

 

That's all well and good, except for the fact that he apparantly tried the 3 spot for all of 7 AB and was able to determine that Fukudome in the 3 spot didn't work.

 

Spring training should not be about trying things. Spring training should be about getting in game shape. If you want to throw guys into different defensive positions, just to get them some experience, fine, but spring training is a horrible place to "see if things work". Nothing that happens in spring training should determine who plays, and where people hit, in the regular season - with the exception of injuries or trades.

 

Maybe with a familiar vet but Fukudome is like a rookie and Lou has to get a read on him.

 

Lou makes me a little nervous regarding Fukudome. I've seen Lou quoted on two different occasions as saying Fuku is like a cross between Ichiro and Hideki Matsui. Can he only fathom Fuku's skillset by comparing him to other players in his ethnic group? I would hate to think that Lou can't figure out what to do with Fuku because he can't find any other yellow-skinned player to equate him with.

 

I hear he's a Joe Morgan with an arm!

 

I have no idea how Lou is thinking regarding this race thing. Maybe his son will give him some comparisons to all the players for Lou to use when he's asked that question again.

 

Corey Patterson is a cross between Gary Sheffield and Kenny Lofton.

[David]

I didn't mind the idea of Fuku hitting 3rd, but what I really like about this is that it means Theriot would not be at the top of the lineup.

[CuseCubFan69]

Lou makes me a little nervous regarding Fukudome. I've seen Lou quoted on two different occasions as saying Fuku is like a cross between Ichiro and Hideki Matsui. Can he only fathom Fuku's skillset by comparing him to other players in his ethnic group? I would hate to think that Lou can't figure out what to do with Fuku because he can't find any other yellow-skinned player to equate him with.

 

people do this all the time. in the nba, do you ever see a white guy's game compared to a black guy? don't think so. if he's white, plays small forward but has pretty good height, not terribly athletic, but can shoot well, he's automatically compared to larry bird.

 

I'd never compare you to Al Roker.

[WilcoFan]

That's all well and good, except for the fact that he apparantly tried the 3 spot for all of 7 AB and was able to determine that Fukudome in the 3 spot didn't work.

 

Spring training should not be about trying things. Spring training should be about getting in game shape. If you want to throw guys into different defensive positions, just to get them some experience, fine, but spring training is a horrible place to "see if things work". Nothing that happens in spring training should determine who plays, and where people hit, in the regular season - with the exception of injuries or trades.

 

That's utterly ridiculous. If you want to argue that spring training should be cancelled, that's one thing. But players come into spring training in shape-this isn't 1934 where they're pulling a double shift at the factory in the offseason. The only thing that can be accomplished during Spring Training is for management to get a feel for the team, especially new players.

 

Aside from that, you're taking the quote waaaaaaaaay too far. In no way, shape, or form did he state that a decision had been made. He simply stated that he MAY make a change TO SEE WHAT HAPPENS. That's about as noncommital as possible. To imply that he simply made a snap decision and has completely made up his mind is dishonest. If anything, Piniella has shown a penchant to think out loud with reporters, and speculate as to some possible changes that, realistically, won't come to pass nearly as quickly as he states (see Dempster situation last season).

 

This is a non-story.

[jersey cubs fan]

That's all well and good, except for the fact that he apparantly tried the 3 spot for all of 7 AB and was able to determine that Fukudome in the 3 spot didn't work.

 

Spring training should not be about trying things. Spring training should be about getting in game shape. If you want to throw guys into different defensive positions, just to get them some experience, fine, but spring training is a horrible place to "see if things work". Nothing that happens in spring training should determine who plays, and where people hit, in the regular season - with the exception of injuries or trades.

 

That's utterly ridiculous. If you want to argue that spring training should be cancelled, that's one thing. But players come into spring training in shape-this isn't 1934 where they're pulling a double shift at the factory in the offseason. The only thing that can be accomplished during Spring Training is for management to get a feel for the team, especially new players.

 

Aside from that, you're taking the quote waaaaaaaaay too far. In no way, shape, or form did he state that a decision had been made. He simply stated that he MAY make a change TO SEE WHAT HAPPENS. That's about as noncommital as possible. To imply that he simply made a snap decision and has completely made up his mind is dishonest. If anything, Piniella has shown a penchant to think out loud with reporters, and speculate as to some possible changes that, realistically, won't come to pass nearly as quickly as he states (see Dempster situation last season).

 

This is a non-story.

 

Game shape wilco, I'm not talking about guys doing laps. It's about getting pitchers arms stretched out, for starters to get ready to throw 100+ pitches, for relievers to get ready for back to back days. It's for hitters to get their timing ready. I didn't say anything about cancelling spring training. It serves a purpose. Unfortunately, some people think it's capable of serving more than it's purpose.

 

Lou experimented with a guy hitting third and didn't like what he saw after 7 ABs, and now he wants to change things up. I'm not taking anything too far. Managers have a horribly inflated ego with regards to their ability to "get a read on guys". Lou is no different. They can't learn squat from a handful of at bats. Thankfully, in the grand scheme of things, whether Fukudome hits 3rd or 2nd probably will not make a lick of difference with how well he hits and how well the team performs, so this sort of tinkering won't hurt too bad. But it won't help either.

[CuseCubFan69]

That's all well and good, except for the fact that he apparantly tried the 3 spot for all of 7 AB and was able to determine that Fukudome in the 3 spot didn't work.

 

Spring training should not be about trying things. Spring training should be about getting in game shape. If you want to throw guys into different defensive positions, just to get them some experience, fine, but spring training is a horrible place to "see if things work". Nothing that happens in spring training should determine who plays, and where people hit, in the regular season - with the exception of injuries or trades.

 

That's utterly ridiculous. If you want to argue that spring training should be cancelled, that's one thing. But players come into spring training in shape-this isn't 1934 where they're pulling a double shift at the factory in the offseason. The only thing that can be accomplished during Spring Training is for management to get a feel for the team, especially new players.

 

Aside from that, you're taking the quote waaaaaaaaay too far. In no way, shape, or form did he state that a decision had been made. He simply stated that he MAY make a change TO SEE WHAT HAPPENS. That's about as noncommital as possible. To imply that he simply made a snap decision and has completely made up his mind is dishonest. If anything, Piniella has shown a penchant to think out loud with reporters, and speculate as to some possible changes that, realistically, won't come to pass nearly as quickly as he states (see Dempster situation last season).

 

This is a non-story.

 

Game shape wilco, I'm not talking about guys doing laps. It's about getting pitchers arms stretched out, for starters to get ready to throw 100+ pitches, for relievers to get ready for back to back days. It's for hitters to get their timing ready. I didn't say anything about cancelling spring training. It serves a purpose. Unfortunately, some people think it's capable of serving more than it's purpose.

 

Lou experimented with a guy hitting third and didn't like what he saw after 7 ABs, and now he wants to change things up. I'm not taking anything too far. Managers have a horribly inflated ego with regards to their ability to "get a read on guys". Lou is no different. They can't learn squat from a handful of at bats. Thankfully, in the grand scheme of things, whether Fukudome hits 3rd or 2nd probably will not make a lick of difference with how well he hits and how well the team performs, so this sort of tinkering won't hurt too bad. But it won't help either.

 

If Fukudome is hitting second instead of Theriot you don't see that as a good thing?

[frostwyrm]

Lou makes me a little nervous regarding Fukudome. I've seen Lou quoted on two different occasions as saying Fuku is like a cross between Ichiro and Hideki Matsui. Can he only fathom Fuku's skillset by comparing him to other players in his ethnic group? I would hate to think that Lou can't figure out what to do with Fuku because he can't find any other yellow-skinned player to equate him with.

 

people do this all the time. in the nba, do you ever see a white guy's game compared to a black guy? don't think so. if he's white, plays small forward but has pretty good height, not terribly athletic, but can shoot well, he's automatically compared to larry bird.

 

All I know is that after the Ichiro/Matsui comments I'm going be pissed if Lou is quoted as saying Fukudome could be as good a basestealer as Kaz Matsui.

[Elrhino]

Larry Hughes was on XM Radio's baseball channel on Sunday and said there is even a chance Fukudome could bat leadoff. He said Soriano isn't absolutely entrenched there. They're going to evaluate and play around with the top of the lineup in spring training.

[BCVM22]

Seems to have helped a little bit (yeah yeah, I know, sample size), he's 3-3, HR, 2 RBI today.

[WilcoFan]

Larry Hughes was on XM Radio's baseball channel on Sunday and said there is even a chance Fukudome could bat leadoff. He said Soriano isn't absolutely entrenched there. They're going to evaluate and play around with the top of the lineup in spring training.

 

Tell Larry Hughes to stop shooting the ball so much...

[CuseCubFan69]

Larry Hughes was on XM Radio's baseball channel on Sunday and said there is even a chance Fukudome could bat leadoff. He said Soriano isn't absolutely entrenched there. They're going to evaluate and play around with the top of the lineup in spring training.

 

Tell Larry Hughes to stop shooting the ball so much...

 

He's a chucker, eh?

[WilcoFan]

Larry Hughes was on XM Radio's baseball channel on Sunday and said there is even a chance Fukudome could bat leadoff. He said Soriano isn't absolutely entrenched there. They're going to evaluate and play around with the top of the lineup in spring training.

 

Tell Larry Hughes to stop shooting the ball so much...

 

He's a chucker, eh?

 

And not quite a good of a scout as Cubs head scout Gary Hughes.

[CuseCubFan69]

Larry Hughes was on XM Radio's baseball channel on Sunday and said there is even a chance Fukudome could bat leadoff. He said Soriano isn't absolutely entrenched there. They're going to evaluate and play around with the top of the lineup in spring training.

 

Tell Larry Hughes to stop shooting the ball so much...

 

He's a chucker, eh?

 

And not quite a good of a scout as Cubs head scout Gary Hughes.

 

I'd like to watch a game and listen to Hughes talk about the players, just to hear what he has to say and how he approaches scouting them.

[TruffleShuffle]

Seems to have helped a little bit (yeah yeah, I know, sample size), he's 3-3, HR, 2 RBI today.

 

looks like he has enough power after all. move him back to the #3 spot.

[killthegoat06]

Seems to have helped a little bit (yeah yeah, I know, sample size), he's 3-3, HR, 2 RBI today.

 

looks like he has enough power after all. move him back to the #3 spot.

Most likely what will happen. :banghead:

[JGalt73]

Fukudome 2nd is a must! And who would believe that Sullivan reads BP? Link to the free BP article - here.

 

Paul Sullivan[/url]"]If Fukudome bats second during the season, where does that put Ryan Theriot?

 

"He's going to have to go to the No. 8 hole or the 7 hole," manager Lou Piniella said. "See, the way we're put together, if that were the case, we have to hit Soto sixth, Theriot seventh and our centerfielder (Pie or Sam Fuld) eighth.

 

"I don't think we have many choices in that regard, so if we were to hit Fukudome second, (Mark) DeRosa would hit fifth and Soto sixth. You can see why I've been trying to stretch the lineup a little, trying to get deeper into the lineup.

 

"Let's just take a look at it here in spring training. Believe me, we're not going to play around with it too much. As soon as we get people healthy and see what it looks like and put it together, we can make a determination really quick."

...

Anyway, the Cubs lineup will always be scrutinized, and Baseball Prospectus had an interesting article yesterday by Joe Sheehan.

[jersey cubs fan]

http://www.dailyherald.com/story/?id=147165&src=152

 

"I told you we were going to move him around a little bit in the spring, just to see" Piniella said.

 

Fukudome seems OK with that.

 

"I will play wherever Lou puts me in," Fukudome said through his translator. "I don't feel any pressure hitting third in the lineup. Still, I'm trying to get used to American baseball. I couldn't care less about where I bat."

 

Moving Fukudome up has a chain reaction on the rest of the order. Specifically, the Cubs would have to move shortstop Ryan Theriot from second to seventh. Derrek Lee would move from fourth to third and Aramis Ramirez from fifth to cleanup.

 

"If that were the case, with the way we're put together, we'd have to hit (catcher Geovany) Soto sixth, Theriot seventh and our center fielder eighth," Piniella said. "I don't think we have many choices in that regard.

 

This is just silly. Why does Lou think he'd have to hit Soto, Theriot, CF 6, 7, 8 with Fukudome 2? Why can't Theriot hit 8? Why is this a problem? Why must the CF hit 8th?

[Derwood]

http://www.dailyherald.com/story/?id=147165&src=152

 

"I told you we were going to move him around a little bit in the spring, just to see" Piniella said.

 

Fukudome seems OK with that.

 

"I will play wherever Lou puts me in," Fukudome said through his translator. "I don't feel any pressure hitting third in the lineup. Still, I'm trying to get used to American baseball. I couldn't care less about where I bat."

 

Moving Fukudome up has a chain reaction on the rest of the order. Specifically, the Cubs would have to move shortstop Ryan Theriot from second to seventh. Derrek Lee would move from fourth to third and Aramis Ramirez from fifth to cleanup.

 

"If that were the case, with the way we're put together, we'd have to hit (catcher Geovany) Soto sixth, Theriot seventh and our center fielder eighth," Piniella said. "I don't think we have many choices in that regard.

 

This is just silly. Why does Lou think he'd have to hit Soto, Theriot, CF 6, 7, 8 with Fukudome 2? Why can't Theriot hit 8? Why is this a problem? Why must the CF hit 8th?

 

likewise, why is DeRosa locked into the #5 spot instead of Soto?

[abuck1220]

nice stereotyping, theriot.

 

And if it means Theriot loses his No. 2 spot to Fukudome?

 

''I'm not karate-fighting him, that's for sure,'' he said. ''I could care less where I hit.''

 

wow.

[C.C.]

nice stereotyping, theriot.

 

And if it means Theriot loses his No. 2 spot to Fukudome?

 

''I'm not karate-fighting him, that's for sure,'' he said. ''I could care less where I hit.''

 

wow.

 

Perhaps Fuk is a bad-ass at Karate.

[Sammy Sofa]

nice stereotyping, theriot.

 

And if it means Theriot loses his No. 2 spot to Fukudome?

 

''I'm not karate-fighting him, that's for sure,'' he said. ''I could care less where I hit.''

 

wow.

 

Perhaps Fuk is a bad-ass at Karate.

 

Perhaps Ryan Theriot is an idiot.

[CubColtPacer]

nice stereotyping, theriot.

 

And if it means Theriot loses his No. 2 spot to Fukudome?

 

''I'm not karate-fighting him, that's for sure,'' he said. ''I could care less where I hit.''

 

wow.

 

I'm willing to give Theriot the benefit of the doubt on this one that Kosuke has already told him that's one of his interests. That's the impression I get from the story anyway.