MacPhail: Deal is dead (p. 297), stop posting, go outside

[C.C.]

How is it not? After 3 months, name other possible scenarios. Hendry wants him, Macphail is asking for more than hendry currently wants to give. Whether or not somebody else on the O's side (PGA) is holding it up and wanting more doesn't matter. Hendry needs to decide one way or another, because it's just a distraction.

 

It's clearly not distracting Roberts, so who is it distracting?

 

Me - I spend at least 2 minutes a day checking SI.com to see of any announcement or the latest Roberts/Cubs rumor.

 

(I'm sorry, I just really wanted to join the club of those who were a part of this legendary thread).

 

2 Minutes per day? That's it? If you want part of this club you have to up your daily dosage...

[Moonshot]

Now, I would agree that the discussions should be tabled for a while if we hit Opening Day with no deal. I just don't really care if there's a small distraction over the team in Spring Training.

 

You should have stopped after "tabled". You would have had me on board. These discussions need to stop, period. No more talking, it's time for MacPhail to put up or shut up. If some of these "insiders" information is correct, and Hendry has offered some of the names being mentioned, then he has offered a more than fair deal in my eyes.

 

Roberts is a good player, he's not a superstar, just because he's got sentimental value to PGA doesn't make him worth a king's ransom to another team, contrary to what Orioles fans seem to think.

 

If MacPhail isn't happy with the offer from Hendry, then it's time for Hendry to walk away....not for a while, but for good. Period.

has Hendry offered or has MacPhail requested?

 

That's a good point. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the rumors I have read say that Hendry has offered Gallagher, Cedeno, and then possibly two more players. Names linked to that pool have been Patterson, Ceda, Veal, Colvin, Marquis, Murton, maybe a couple others. I'm not even counting the puds that seem to think they can get Pie, Hill, or Marmol out of this deal. I would say Gallagher, Cedeno and two players out of the pool above (assuming that those two players are not BOTH Ceda AND Veal) would be a steep price to pay, and more than fair to the O's in my opinion.

 

If MacPhail is demanding Pie, Marmol, Hill or some other ridiculous package, then I don't even know why Hendry hasn't come out and said, we're through negotiating with the O's. Table the talks permanently.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

That's a good point. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the rumors I have read say that Hendry has offered Gallagher, Cedeno, and then possibly two more players. Names linked to that pool have been Patterson, Ceda, Veal, Colvin, Marquis, Murton, maybe a couple others. I'm not even counting the puds that seem to think they can get Pie, Hill, or Marmol out of this deal. I would say Gallagher, Cedeno and two players out of the pool above (assuming that those two players are not BOTH Ceda AND Veal) would be a steep price to pay, and more than fair to the O's in my opinion.

 

If MacPhail is demanding Pie, Marmol, Hill or some other ridiculous package, then I don't even know why Hendry hasn't come out and said, we're through negotiating with the O's. Table the talks permanently.

I don't recall reading anything that says Hendry offered or MacPhail requested. Everything I've seen to this point is speculation as to the names involved. Who point those names in there, I don't know.

[CubbieSouthpaw II]

For KingCub:

 

Link to where he did or didn't say this? We don't really know what the negotiations have sounded like.

 

What do you mean, link to where he didn't he say this? Can I link to where he "didn't say this?" Yeah, I can. What does that prove though? What direct quote did I attribute to Hendry that you're asking for a link? Personally, to me, it looks like you're trying to bail Hendry out so you're pedantically asking for documentation when it isn't necessary. Do you honestly need a link to show that the Cubs have been talking about Roberts for 3 or more months?

 

All we know is that the Orioles take forever to complete a trade, and that Angelos is probably meddling in some way. The Roberts trade isn't any different than anything else the Orioles have ever done.

 

Wrong. The Orioles did not take 3 months to trade for Jaret Wright, they did not take 3 months to trade for Kris Benson, and so forth. Whenever the Orioles try to play this game with GMs who actually own a pair, they don't get anywhere. It's only in the desperate weaklings who tip their hands that they can get away with this. So it's not like every other Orioles trade really.

 

For Wrigley23:

 

Oh...and brian roberts just got his 7th steal to lead the spring trainers.

 

Okay, I'm convinced now... Spring Training numbers? Remember when Garciaparra was among the leaders in ST in 2005 in everything and started out the season horribly? If he had 0 steals it would mean as much as leading everyone on Spring Training.

 

Thank you!!! I believe Bruce said it best. It takes two teams to make a trade. Quit bashing Hendry when no one here knows what is being discussed.

 

To CubbieSouthpaw:

 

I will not quit bashing Hendry. Any GM with self-respect would've called for a curtailing of the discussion by now.

 

I'm not in total disagreement with you at all. But I'm sure the M's are glad they waited for the O's to decide so they could get Bedard. Hopefully (withfingers crossed) that Roberts will be worth the wait.

 

I don't think the Mariners even talked about Bedard for over three months. Furthermore, it's Bill Bavasi we're talking about, the guy who overpays for mediocrity even worse than Hendry. Bill "Hey, Asdrubal Cabrera for Eduardo Perez seems like a fair deal" Bavasi. The point is, no good GMs let their chain get yanked by a crackpot organization for this long.

 

There is no reason not to table talks with a "I'll make my best offer, you take it or leave it" demand after all of this time. But Hendry has been too weak to do that.

 

 

OMG, you've sat at the desk with Hendry and know exactly what has been said? Wow, you're in a great position and must know some very important people. I wish I could sit in on some of those talks to know how its actually done.

[Moonshot]

That's a good point. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the rumors I have read say that Hendry has offered Gallagher, Cedeno, and then possibly two more players. Names linked to that pool have been Patterson, Ceda, Veal, Colvin, Marquis, Murton, maybe a couple others. I'm not even counting the puds that seem to think they can get Pie, Hill, or Marmol out of this deal. I would say Gallagher, Cedeno and two players out of the pool above (assuming that those two players are not BOTH Ceda AND Veal) would be a steep price to pay, and more than fair to the O's in my opinion.

 

If MacPhail is demanding Pie, Marmol, Hill or some other ridiculous package, then I don't even know why Hendry hasn't come out and said, we're through negotiating with the O's. Table the talks permanently.

I don't recall reading anything that says Hendry offered or MacPhail requested. Everything I've seen to this point is speculation as to the names involved. Who point those names in there, I don't know.

 

Fair enough. My point is this though, if Hendry feels that he has put his best foot forward and MacPhail is the one jerking him around, then walk away. If Hendry is jerking around MacPhail, then he needs to pull his head out and get on with it.

[UBlink]

There is no reason not to table talks with a "I'll make my best offer, you take it or leave it" demand after all of this time. But Hendry has been too weak to do that.

 

How is that stronger than "you know what I'm willing to offer, call me back when you're ready to deal"?

[CubinNY]

There is no reason not to table talks with a "I'll make my best offer, you take it or leave it" demand after all of this time. But Hendry has been too weak to do that.

 

How is that stronger than "you know what I'm willing to offer, call me back when you're ready to deal"?

I want to tell my family that I have let them down and apologize for posting in this thread. I have violated your trust and for that I am truly sorry.

------

 

I think all this is speculation. The Cubs and Os might already have a basic deal in place, but the Os want to wait until ST is close to over to decide what they need in terms of players. On the other hand maybe talks haven't been serious at all and the media are making wild guess because that is what ST is for.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

That's a good point. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the rumors I have read say that Hendry has offered Gallagher, Cedeno, and then possibly two more players. Names linked to that pool have been Patterson, Ceda, Veal, Colvin, Marquis, Murton, maybe a couple others. I'm not even counting the puds that seem to think they can get Pie, Hill, or Marmol out of this deal. I would say Gallagher, Cedeno and two players out of the pool above (assuming that those two players are not BOTH Ceda AND Veal) would be a steep price to pay, and more than fair to the O's in my opinion.

 

If MacPhail is demanding Pie, Marmol, Hill or some other ridiculous package, then I don't even know why Hendry hasn't come out and said, we're through negotiating with the O's. Table the talks permanently.

I don't recall reading anything that says Hendry offered or MacPhail requested. Everything I've seen to this point is speculation as to the names involved. Who point those names in there, I don't know.

 

Fair enough. My point is this though, if Hendry feels that he has put his best foot forward and MacPhail is the one jerking him around, then walk away. If Hendry is jerking around MacPhail, then he needs to pull his head out and get on with it.

I'm in agreement. I'm no Hendry apologist, I just don't think there's enough evidence to suggest that he's guilty of a lot of the accusations that have been flying around. If there is hard evidence that he's offering way too much or that MacPhail is trying to screw him and he doesn't have the sense to walk away, so be it. I haven't seen it yet.

[Moonshot]

That's a good point. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the rumors I have read say that Hendry has offered Gallagher, Cedeno, and then possibly two more players. Names linked to that pool have been Patterson, Ceda, Veal, Colvin, Marquis, Murton, maybe a couple others. I'm not even counting the puds that seem to think they can get Pie, Hill, or Marmol out of this deal. I would say Gallagher, Cedeno and two players out of the pool above (assuming that those two players are not BOTH Ceda AND Veal) would be a steep price to pay, and more than fair to the O's in my opinion.

 

If MacPhail is demanding Pie, Marmol, Hill or some other ridiculous package, then I don't even know why Hendry hasn't come out and said, we're through negotiating with the O's. Table the talks permanently.

I don't recall reading anything that says Hendry offered or MacPhail requested. Everything I've seen to this point is speculation as to the names involved. Who point those names in there, I don't know.

 

Fair enough. My point is this though, if Hendry feels that he has put his best foot forward and MacPhail is the one jerking him around, then walk away. If Hendry is jerking around MacPhail, then he needs to pull his head out and get on with it.

I'm in agreement. I'm no Hendry apologist, I just don't think there's enough evidence to suggest that he's guilty of a lot of the accusations that have been flying around. If there is hard evidence that he's offering way too much or that MacPhail is trying to screw him and he doesn't have the sense to walk away, so be it. I haven't seen it yet.

 

Bottom line is that Hendry has to know that the reporters are all over his players getting their opinions on Roberts and the potential trade. He also has to see that his team is 5-10 in the spring so far. Are those two things connected? I don't know.

 

But I know that if I were the GM and I saw the players' (especially DeRo's) reactions to these questions, and saw how my team was performing, I would do something as soon as possible to put that to rest. Either make the trade, or come out publicly and say we are not pursuing Roberts anymore.

[brinoch]

The spring training record should have less than zero impact on whether or not to make a trade.

[CubColtPacer]

That's a good point. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the rumors I have read say that Hendry has offered Gallagher, Cedeno, and then possibly two more players. Names linked to that pool have been Patterson, Ceda, Veal, Colvin, Marquis, Murton, maybe a couple others. I'm not even counting the puds that seem to think they can get Pie, Hill, or Marmol out of this deal. I would say Gallagher, Cedeno and two players out of the pool above (assuming that those two players are not BOTH Ceda AND Veal) would be a steep price to pay, and more than fair to the O's in my opinion.

 

If MacPhail is demanding Pie, Marmol, Hill or some other ridiculous package, then I don't even know why Hendry hasn't come out and said, we're through negotiating with the O's. Table the talks permanently.

I don't recall reading anything that says Hendry offered or MacPhail requested. Everything I've seen to this point is speculation as to the names involved. Who point those names in there, I don't know.

 

Fair enough. My point is this though, if Hendry feels that he has put his best foot forward and MacPhail is the one jerking him around, then walk away. If Hendry is jerking around MacPhail, then he needs to pull his head out and get on with it.

I'm in agreement. I'm no Hendry apologist, I just don't think there's enough evidence to suggest that he's guilty of a lot of the accusations that have been flying around. If there is hard evidence that he's offering way too much or that MacPhail is trying to screw him and he doesn't have the sense to walk away, so be it. I haven't seen it yet.

 

Bottom line is that Hendry has to know that the reporters are all over his players getting their opinions on Roberts and the potential trade. He also has to see that his team is 5-10 in the spring so far. Are those two things connected? I don't know.

 

But I know that if I were the GM and I saw the players' (especially DeRo's) reactions to these questions, and saw how my team was performing, I would do something as soon as possible to put that to rest. Either make the trade, or come out publicly and say we are not pursuing Roberts anymore.

 

Considering the starters have left several of these games with a lead, I really doubt that the Roberts trade is causing the Cubs minor leaguers and NRI's to be terrible and lose games.

 

And I haven't seen a ton of interviews dealing with Roberts with the Cubs players. There have been a few, but not too many. Besides, most of the starters have been hitting the ball well in ST. Where's the distraction?

[UBlink]

Where's the distraction?

 

I think I know, but I hope certain employers of message board posters don't find out.

 

:wink:

[17 Seconds]

It's pretty obvious what is going on.

no, it's really not

 

How is it not? After 3 months, name other possible scenarios. Hendry wants him, Macphail is asking for more than hendry currently wants to give. Whether or not somebody else on the O's side (PGA) is holding it up and wanting more doesn't matter. Hendry needs to decide one way or another, because it's just a distraction.

 

So you'd rather Hendry give up more than he needs to in the trade?

 

No, I'd rather him walk away.

[17 Seconds]

From The Baltimore Sun

 

The Cubs have offered a four-player package that includes pitching prospects Sean Gallagher and Donald Veal and infielder Ronny Cedeno. Jose Ceda, the Cubs' top pitching prospect, has also been discussed as the potential fourth player.

[Post Count Padder]

From The Baltimore Sun

 

The Cubs have offered a four-player package that includes pitching prospects Sean Gallagher and Donald Veal and infielder Ronny Cedeno. Jose Ceda, the Cubs' top pitching prospect, has also been discussed as the potential fourth player.

I really don't want Ceda in that deal

[dew1679666265]

It's pretty obvious what is going on.

no, it's really not

 

How is it not? After 3 months, name other possible scenarios. Hendry wants him, Macphail is asking for more than hendry currently wants to give. Whether or not somebody else on the O's side (PGA) is holding it up and wanting more doesn't matter. Hendry needs to decide one way or another, because it's just a distraction.

 

So you'd rather Hendry give up more than he needs to in the trade?

 

No, I'd rather him walk away.

 

What if the current trade on the table is Roberts for Gallagher and a minor leaguer with the only holdup being the O's want to decide if said minor leaguer is Ceda, Cedeno or Veal?

 

Perhaps all these "names tossed around" were mostly bogus and for the past month or two it's been Roberts for Gallagher and one of Ceda/Cedeno/Veal. Maybe the current holdup is that MacPhail wants his scouts to evaluate the three minor leaguers in spring training and, towards the end, they'll make their decision between the three.

 

If that's the case and Hendry tabled talks permanently because it's taking too long would you congratulate him for passing on a great trade simply because he was impatient?

[mdwilla]

Ceda remind me a lot of Francis Beltran, Roberto Nova, but then again the guy could turn into Bobby Jenks.

[17 Seconds]

It's pretty obvious what is going on.

no, it's really not

 

How is it not? After 3 months, name other possible scenarios. Hendry wants him, Macphail is asking for more than hendry currently wants to give. Whether or not somebody else on the O's side (PGA) is holding it up and wanting more doesn't matter. Hendry needs to decide one way or another, because it's just a distraction.

 

So you'd rather Hendry give up more than he needs to in the trade?

 

No, I'd rather him walk away.

 

What if the current trade on the table is Roberts for Gallagher and a minor leaguer with the only holdup being the O's want to decide if said minor leaguer is Ceda, Cedeno or Veal?

 

Perhaps all these "names tossed around" were mostly bogus and for the past month or two it's been Roberts for Gallagher and one of Ceda/Cedeno/Veal. Maybe the current holdup is that MacPhail wants his scouts to evaluate the three minor leaguers in spring training and, towards the end, they'll make their decision between the three.

 

If that's the case and Hendry tabled talks permanently because it's taking too long would you congratulate him for passing on a great trade simply because he was impatient?

 

Haha. Sorry, but I find that EXTREMELY hard to believe. If it turns out that was the case, I'll glady come on here to apologize to Hendry, but come on man. We all know that's not true.

[dew1679666265]

It's pretty obvious what is going on.

no, it's really not

 

How is it not? After 3 months, name other possible scenarios. Hendry wants him, Macphail is asking for more than hendry currently wants to give. Whether or not somebody else on the O's side (PGA) is holding it up and wanting more doesn't matter. Hendry needs to decide one way or another, because it's just a distraction.

 

So you'd rather Hendry give up more than he needs to in the trade?

 

No, I'd rather him walk away.

 

What if the current trade on the table is Roberts for Gallagher and a minor leaguer with the only holdup being the O's want to decide if said minor leaguer is Ceda, Cedeno or Veal?

 

Perhaps all these "names tossed around" were mostly bogus and for the past month or two it's been Roberts for Gallagher and one of Ceda/Cedeno/Veal. Maybe the current holdup is that MacPhail wants his scouts to evaluate the three minor leaguers in spring training and, towards the end, they'll make their decision between the three.

 

If that's the case and Hendry tabled talks permanently because it's taking too long would you congratulate him for passing on a great trade simply because he was impatient?

 

Haha. Sorry, but I find that EXTREMELY hard to believe. If it turns out that was the case, I'll glady come on here to apologize to Hendry, but come on man. We all know that's not true.

 

Given what you posted two posts up from mine, I'm also betting it's not.

 

The point is, though, what if the media is simply wrong and the deal is currently set up in our favor (less so than my post, but moreso than the Sun article)? However likely it is, it's certainly possible and I'm not going to crucify the man when none of us truly know for sure the exact deal on the table.

 

If the Sun article is correct and that's the trade that goes through after all this time, I'm not going to be happy at all. But, if the Sun is a little off and it's in fact only the first three (Gallagher, Cedeno, Veal), I'll be ok with it.

[17 Seconds]

I wouldn't even do Gallagher, Veal, and Cedeno.

[dew1679666265]

I wouldn't even do Gallagher, Veal, and Cedeno.

 

I would. I'm not convinced at all that Cedeno will ever be much of a hitter and Veal has some very serious question marks.

 

Gallagher is a big loss, but Roberts helps this team quite a bit too. I wouldn't be dancing in the street over the trade, but I think it would be a net improvement for the Cubs.

[17 Seconds]

I wouldn't even do Gallagher, Veal, and Cedeno.

 

I would. I'm not convinced at all that Cedeno will ever be much of a hitter and Veal has some very serious question marks.

 

Gallagher is a big loss, but Roberts helps this team quite a bit too. I wouldn't be dancing in the street over the trade, but I think it would be a net improvement for the Cubs.

 

I just think out limited valuable trading assets need to be saved or used to fill actual holes. I think we're certainly going to need other upgrades at the deadline.

[Post Count Padder]

I wouldn't even do Gallagher, Veal, and Cedeno.

 

I would. I'm not convinced at all that Cedeno will ever be much of a hitter and Veal has some very serious question marks.

 

Gallagher is a big loss, but Roberts helps this team quite a bit too. I wouldn't be dancing in the street over the trade, but I think it would be a net improvement for the Cubs.

After what we've seen from Cedeno, I'm not entirely convinced that he'd produce well at the major league level. Sure he's young and his minor league numbers are tremendous. But he hasn't hit in the majors when given the opportunity. Veal wasn't great last year and though I'd include him in the trade, I did want to see what he was capable of this season. Gallagher I got over awhile ago because I assumed he was always going to be included.

[CubsGM]

From The Baltimore Sun

 

The Cubs have offered a four-player package that includes pitching prospects Sean Gallagher and Donald Veal and infielder Ronny Cedeno. Jose Ceda, the Cubs' top pitching prospect, has also been discussed as the potential fourth player.

:shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:

[wrigley23]

leadoff is a hole for the cubs. Before theriot moved into the spot & after. Roberts is one of the best in the game.