Did I Hear Correctly? Ryan Dempster to the Rotation

[Exile on Waveland]

I support it. Thus, you should support it.

 

Sell me on it. I'm open to being swayed.

 

Frees up Marshall to be traded with Murton for real OF/SS. We have righty bullpen depth (expecially if we resign Woody). Or, if Prior comes back and is useful. It kicks Marquis out of the rotation. Demp > Marquis you know. The hit to our bullpen would be minimal. It'd help our rotation. He's no less valuable as a starter than Marshall, but Marshall has a lot more trade value. Thus trade him on the market.

 

OK, I'll bite. Even if Dempster is a better starter than Marquis, this is the Cubs and Jim Hendry we're talking about. You're assuming it will be Dempster replacing Marquis, I think it's more likely Dempster joins Marquis and replaces Marshall.

 

Now, I'm sure you're going to say there are better stats to judge them by, and, if so, fine, I'm open to being persuaded/proven wrong here. But last five years as starters in ERA+: Marquis: 115, 102, 74, 101; Dempster: 120, 86, 77, 63.

[Lefty]

Let's hope it's someone else's rotation.

 

Amen!

[USSoccer]

I support it. Thus, you should support it.

 

Sell me on it. I'm open to being swayed.

 

Frees up Marshall to be traded with Murton for real OF/SS. We have righty bullpen depth (expecially if we resign Woody). Or, if Prior comes back and is useful. It kicks Marquis out of the rotation. Demp > Marquis you know. The hit to our bullpen would be minimal. It'd help our rotation. He's no less valuable as a starter than Marshall, but Marshall has a lot more trade value. Thus trade him on the market.

 

OK, I'll bite. Even if Dempster is a better starter than Marquis, this is the Cubs and Jim Hendry we're talking about. You're assuming it will be Dempster replacing Marquis, I think it's more likely Dempster joins Marquis and replaces Marshall.

 

Now, I'm sure you're going to say there are better stats to judge them by, and, if so, fine, I'm open to being persuaded/proven wrong here. But last five years as starters in ERA+: Marquis: 115, 102, 74, 101; Dempster: 120, 86, 77, 63.

 

I think Meph is saying the return on dealing Marshall could outweigh the drop from Marquis to Dempster.

[Guest]

Here's how I look at it... if it puts Marmol in the closer role than why not?

 

If Dempster struggles, Lou won't leave him in the rotation.

 

I hope Marmol is either traded, goes to the rotation, or stays in his current role as a high leverage reliever.

 

And if he stays in his high leverage role, it'd be great if he had more high leverage opportunities next season than he had in 2007.

[Exile on Waveland]

I support it. Thus, you should support it.

 

Sell me on it. I'm open to being swayed.

 

Frees up Marshall to be traded with Murton for real OF/SS. We have righty bullpen depth (expecially if we resign Woody). Or, if Prior comes back and is useful. It kicks Marquis out of the rotation. Demp > Marquis you know. The hit to our bullpen would be minimal. It'd help our rotation. He's no less valuable as a starter than Marshall, but Marshall has a lot more trade value. Thus trade him on the market.

 

OK, I'll bite. Even if Dempster is a better starter than Marquis, this is the Cubs and Jim Hendry we're talking about. You're assuming it will be Dempster replacing Marquis, I think it's more likely Dempster joins Marquis and replaces Marshall.

 

Now, I'm sure you're going to say there are better stats to judge them by, and, if so, fine, I'm open to being persuaded/proven wrong here. But last five years as starters in ERA+: Marquis: 115, 102, 74, 101; Dempster: 120, 86, 77, 63.

 

I think Meph is saying the return on dealing Marshall could outweigh the drop from Marquis to Dempster.

 

I agree with that. I just fear that Dempster to the rotation means a rotation with him and Marquis. Which isn't good.

[GoCubsGo1679625768]

I will consider suicide with a rotation of Dempster and Marquis. I will.

[USSoccer]

Here's how I look at it... if it puts Marmol in the closer role than why not?

 

If Dempster struggles, Lou won't leave him in the rotation.

 

I hope Marmol is either traded, goes to the rotation, or stays in his current role as a high leverage reliever.

 

And if he stays in his high leverage role, it'd be great if he had more high leverage opportunities next season than he had in 2007.

 

As opposed to being used in 5 run games in the 8th for no apparent reason?

[Abe Frohman]

Does Kerry Wood even want to be the closer, or would he prefer starting?

[CuseCubFan69]

I suppose Dempster at 6 and around the same numbers as Marquise would be a better way to go and it saves you 4 if you do get rid of Marquis but I see the Cubs paying salary relief if they do deal Marquis so I may not really improve anything. It might be easier to name Dempster a starter/closer and then deal him depending on what type of role closer/starter the team he is going to wants him to be.

[Mephistopheles]

For the record Dempsters DERA is a full quarter of a run better than Marquis' over their career and it isn't because of Dempster being in the bullpen for a couple seasons. Of course I'm including the value gotten with Marshall traded. Youre all just looking at Dempster in the rotation without the gains elsewhere. It's not a simple replace Marshall with Dempster and X happens. We get value for Marshall. We get value for Marmol in late games. Edited November 6, 2007 by Mephistopheles

[anabiono]

seriously...did anyone else hear this?

 

](*,)

[GoCubsGo1679625768]

Also consider this...More than likely Sean Marshall will be exiled to AAA instead of package in a trade. Just the "Cubs" way.

[CuseCubFan69]

For the record Dempsters DERA is a full quarter of a run better than Marquis' over their career and it isn't because of Dempster being in the bullpen for a couple seasons. Of course I'm including the value gotten with Marshall traded. Youre all just looking at Dempster in the rotation without the gains elsewhere. It's not a simple replace Marshall with Dempster and X happens. We get value for Marshall. We get value for Marmol in late games.

 

It may be a moot point due to not being able to unload Marquis though. That's a pretty big X Meph.

[Guest]

Was this actually what was said? Has anyone heard anything else?

 

I know NSBB is not a place where speculation can get out of control or anything... :wink:

 

Looks like a few other people heard it and mentioned it at a few other Cubs blogs.

[Derwood]

the gains made by trading marshall would have to be pretty substantial in order to offset how completely awful Dempster would be in the rotation

[Mephistopheles]

Was this actually what was said? Has anyone heard anything else?

 

I know NSBB is not a place where speculation can get out of control or anything... :wink:

 

Looks like a few other people heard it and mentioned it at a few other Cubs blogs.

 

its on mlbtraderumors.com so it must be true

[USSoccer]

the gains made by trading marshall would have to be pretty substantial in order to offset how completely awful Dempster would be in the rotation

 

He's not light years worse than Marquis. There would have to be a gain, but we're not talking like a Miguel Cabrera type gain to have a net improvement.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

the gains made by trading marshall would have to be pretty substantial in order to offset how completely awful Dempster would be in the rotation

 

He's not light years worse than Marquis. There would have to be a gain, but we're not talking like a Miguel Cabrera type gain to have a net improvement.

 

The comparison is Marshall to Dempster, not Marquis to Dempster.

[USSoccer]

the gains made by trading marshall would have to be pretty substantial in order to offset how completely awful Dempster would be in the rotation

 

He's not light years worse than Marquis. There would have to be a gain, but we're not talking like a Miguel Cabrera type gain to have a net improvement.

 

The comparison is Marshall to Dempster, not Marquis to Dempster.

 

Even so, it's not like a Hill for Dempster replacement or something.

[Bruce Miles]

seriously...did anyone else hear this?

 

](*,)

 

'Twould be true. I talked to both Hendry and Dempster about it. Ryan is excited about the resurgent Blackhawks, I might add.

[Tracer Bullet]

seriously...did anyone else hear this?

 

](*,)

 

'Twould be true. I talked to both Hendry and Dempster about it. Ryan is excited about the resurgent Blackhawks, I might add.

 

So he's going to be in the 'Hawks frontline rotation?

[USSoccer]

seriously...did anyone else hear this?

 

](*,)

 

'Twould be true. I talked to both Hendry and Dempster about it. Ryan is excited about the resurgent Blackhawks, I might add.

 

At the expense of whom?

[Bruce Miles]

seriously...did anyone else hear this?

 

](*,)

 

'Twould be true. I talked to both Hendry and Dempster about it. Ryan is excited about the resurgent Blackhawks, I might add.

 

So he's going to be in the 'Hawks frontline rotation?

 

Yeah, I guess that's what it all meant. :D

[Bruce Miles]

seriously...did anyone else hear this?

 

](*,)

 

'Twould be true. I talked to both Hendry and Dempster about it. Ryan is excited about the resurgent Blackhawks, I might add.

 

At the expense of whom?

 

Don't know yet. Stay tuned.

[GoCubsGo1679625768]

Zambrano, Lily, and Hill are cemented in. Marquis and his contract probably are not going anywhere as well. Adios Sean Marshall.