Last Years Cardinals or This Years Cubs

[kente777]

There are a lot of similarities between the 2006 Cardinals and the 2007 Cubs -- the chief of which is having the lowest record of any playoff team (assuming the Cubs can clinch this weekend).

 

Last year the Cardinals limped into the playoffs not only with a ML low 83 wins, but also on a nice losing streak to end the season. The Cubs, though prior to the Marlins series, had been playing pretty good baseball.

 

In your opinion, which of these two teams, both limping into the playoffs, are better? The Cards got hot at the right time. Are the Cubs capable of getting hot and beating teams outside of their own division? So far this year they only have a winning record against teams in their own division.

 

Opinions?

[C.C.]

How many times does a team with the worst record going into the playoffs win the World Series? That's your answer...

[kente777]

How many times does a team with the worst record going into the playoffs win the World Series? That's your answer...

 

OK, let me rephrase. Which of the two teams are worse going into the playoffs (ignoring the 2006 result): 2007 Cubs or the 2006 Cardinals?

[C.C.]

How many times does a team with the worst record going into the playoffs win the World Series? That's your answer...

 

OK, let me rephrase. Which of the two teams are worse going into the playoffs (ignoring the 2006 result): 2007 Cubs or the 2006 Cardinals?

 

I'll tell you after these 3 games. :wink:

[Backtobanks]

I just hope the final results are the same for the 2007 Cubs as they were for the 2006 Cards. As has been stated before, just get into the playoffs because everything after that is a crapshoot.

[Soul]

If the Cubs make the playoffs they will lose in the NLDS.

[Andy]

The 2007 Cubs are better than the 2006 Cardinals by a fairly wide margin. However, whether that will translate into getting anywhere in the playoffs is another story.

[CubinNY]

The 2007 Cubs are better than the 2006 Cardinals by a fairly wide margin. However, whether that will translate into getting anywhere in the playoffs is another story.

I don't know how you could possibly justify saying that except for blind homerism.

 

The 2007 Cubs are as mediocre as the 2006 Cardinals. I also believe they are a worse put together team.

[kente777]

The 2007 Cubs are better than the 2006 Cardinals by a fairly wide margin. However, whether that will translate into getting anywhere in the playoffs is another story.

 

Thanks for answering the question!

 

Being better doesn't necessarily translate into a championship. We'll see.

[C.C.]

The 2007 Cubs are better than the 2006 Cardinals by a fairly wide margin. However, whether that will translate into getting anywhere in the playoffs is another story.

I don't know how you could possibly justify saying that except for blind homerism.

 

The 2007 Cubs are as mediocre as the 2006 Cardinals. I also believe they are a worse put together team.

 

Why?

[CubinNY]

The 2007 Cubs are better than the 2006 Cardinals by a fairly wide margin. However, whether that will translate into getting anywhere in the playoffs is another story.

I don't know how you could possibly justify saying that except for blind homerism.

 

The 2007 Cubs are as mediocre as the 2006 Cardinals. I also believe they are a worse put together team.

 

Why?

Because they are? Last year the Cardinals won 83 games. The best the Cubs can do is win 87. There is not a whole lot of difference there.

 

In 2006 the Cardinals fifth in RS/game in the NL and 8th in pitching. In 2007 the Cubs are 8th in RS/game and 2nd in pitching. There's not a whole lot of difference there.

 

Now, on being put together worse. The Cubs spent a lot of money this offseason and at best they will have 4 more wins to show for it.

[bukie]

Now, on being put together worse. The Cubs spent a lot of money this offseason and at best they will have 4 more wins to show for it.

 

I don't remember the Cubs winning 83 games last year. At best they'll have a 21 game improvement.

[CubinNY]

Now, on being put together worse. The Cubs spent a lot of money this offseason and at best they will have 4 more wins to show for it.

 

I don't remember the Cubs winning 83 games last year. At best they'll have a 21 game improvement.

Big fricken deal. That is entirely beside the point of this conversation. We are comparing the 2006 Cards to the 2007 Cubs.

 

Anyway,

 

I have no idea why people have this mentality. The Cubs stunk last year. This year they're mediocre at best and have a top payroll. That is not something to crow about.

 

Seriously, where does this stuff come from?

[Soul]

Now, on being put together worse. The Cubs spent a lot of money this offseason and at best they will have 4 more wins to show for it.

 

I don't remember the Cubs winning 83 games last year. At best they'll have a 21 game improvement.

Big fricken deal. That is entirely beside the point of this conversation. We are comparing the 2006 Cards to the 2007 Cubs.

 

Anyway,

 

I have no idea why people have this mentality. The Cubs stunk last year. This year they're mediocre at best and have a top payroll. That is not something to crow about.

 

Seriously, where does this stuff come from?

 

The magic of "making the playoffs" makes people think their team might be better than it really is.

 

Then a lucky team like the Cards come along, win when they had no business doing so, and it just fuels the delusion.

 

You're right, this is a mediocre ballclub with a massive payroll, not getting nearly the return on investment that they should. But due to the rest of the division, people puff their chests out a little bit more than they should.

[UK1679666180]

Talentwise, I think the Cubs have more talent. Of course, I thought SD, NYM, and Det had more talent than STL last year too.

 

I don't see the Cubs getting the same starting pitching the Cards had in the posteseason last year.

 

Carpenter, Suppan, Weaver were outstanding and Reyes did well in game 1 of the WS.

 

They pitched over their heads last year and the Cubs would have to do likewise, putting odds on that are smaller rather than expected.

Edited September 28, 2007 by UK

[C.C.]

The 2007 Cubs are better than the 2006 Cardinals by a fairly wide margin. However, whether that will translate into getting anywhere in the playoffs is another story.

I don't know how you could possibly justify saying that except for blind homerism.

 

The 2007 Cubs are as mediocre as the 2006 Cardinals. I also believe they are a worse put together team.

 

Why?

Because they are? Last year the Cardinals won 83 games. The best the Cubs can do is win 87. There is not a whole lot of difference there.

 

In 2006 the Cardinals fifth in RS/game in the NL and 8th in pitching. In 2007 the Cubs are 8th in RS/game and 2nd in pitching. There's not a whole lot of difference there.

 

Now, on being put together worse. The Cubs spent a lot of money this offseason and at best they will have 4 more wins to show for it.

 

You still haven't explained why the 2006 Cardinals were a better put together team then this year Cubs?

[C.C.]

Now, on being put together worse. The Cubs spent a lot of money this offseason and at best they will have 4 more wins to show for it.

 

I don't remember the Cubs winning 83 games last year. At best they'll have a 21 game improvement.

Big fricken deal. That is entirely beside the point of this conversation. We are comparing the 2006 Cards to the 2007 Cubs.

 

Anyway,

 

I have no idea why people have this mentality. The Cubs stunk last year. This year they're mediocre at best and have a top payroll. That is not something to crow about.

 

Seriously, where does this stuff come from?

 

The magic of "making the playoffs" makes people think their team might be better than it really is.

 

Then a lucky team like the Cards come along, win when they had no business doing so, and it just fuels the delusion.

 

You're right, this is a mediocre ballclub with a massive payroll, not getting nearly the return on investment that they should. But due to the rest of the division, people puff their chests out a little bit more than they should.

 

You can basically say that about the entire National League. Every club has faults. Padres have medicore hitting, Mets are just Medicore, Phil have no pitching, etc...

 

This years playoffs are wide open.

[Soul]

Talentwise, I think the Cubs have more talent. Of course, I thought SD, NYM, and Det had more talent than STL last year too.

 

I don't see the Cubs getting the same starting pitching the Cards had in the posteseason last year.

 

Carpenter, Suppan, Weaver were outstanding and Reyes did well in game 1 of the WS.

 

They pitched over their heads last year and the Cubs would have to do likewise, putting odds on that are smaller rather than expected.

 

If we do make it, I think even with the NL as weak as it is there's a real solid chance we get swept right out without much of a thought.

[David]

The Cubs are the better team.

 

I still maintain that the Cubs are the best NL playoff team going in. Like Andy said, though, whether that translates into anything in the playoffs remains to be seen.

 

Maybe it has changed, but last I heard, since June the Cubs are second in MLB to the Yankees in wins. They've essentially played like an elite team since the terrible start, and that really accounts for for a good amount of time (4 months). In fact, the only time they really stumbled significantly was when they lost their best OF for 3 weeks.

[C.C.]

Talentwise, I think the Cubs have more talent. Of course, I thought SD, NYM, and Det had more talent than STL last year too.

 

I don't see the Cubs getting the same starting pitching the Cards had in the posteseason last year.

 

Carpenter, Suppan, Weaver were outstanding and Reyes did well in game 1 of the WS.

 

They pitched over their heads last year and the Cubs would have to do likewise, putting odds on that are smaller rather than expected.

 

If we do make it, I think even with the NL as weak as it is there's a real solid chance we get swept right out without much of a thought.

 

And there's a real solid chance we won't...

[moorecg]

ONe difference is that STL was hurt the majority of the year last year...at times losing Rolen, Edmonds, Pujols, Molina, Eckstein and Encarnacion for large stretches....I hate to admit this, but when they got to the playoffs, it really was the first time they had their full team healthy and together.

[David]

Talentwise, I think the Cubs have more talent. Of course, I thought SD, NYM, and Det had more talent than STL last year too.

 

I don't see the Cubs getting the same starting pitching the Cards had in the posteseason last year.

 

Carpenter, Suppan, Weaver were outstanding and Reyes did well in game 1 of the WS.

 

They pitched over their heads last year and the Cubs would have to do likewise, putting odds on that are smaller rather than expected.

 

If we do make it, I think even with the NL as weak as it is there's a real solid chance we get swept right out without much of a thought.

 

All it took was a sweep by the Marlins to bring the Soul we all know back. :)

[UK1679666180]

Talentwise, I think the Cubs have more talent. Of course, I thought SD, NYM, and Det had more talent than STL last year too.

 

I don't see the Cubs getting the same starting pitching the Cards had in the posteseason last year.

 

Carpenter, Suppan, Weaver were outstanding and Reyes did well in game 1 of the WS.

 

They pitched over their heads last year and the Cubs would have to do likewise, putting odds on that are smaller rather than expected.

 

If we do make it, I think even with the NL as weak as it is there's a real solid chance we get swept right out without much of a thought.

 

And there's a real solid chance we won't...

 

All comes down to Hill, Lilly, and Z. Lilly has been the most consistent, Z has been the least consistent, Hill is most likely to be fatigued, but each have the ability to shut down the opposition to under 2 runs.

 

Let's hope the Cubs are in a hot streak offensively. I hate offenses that can score 50 runs in one week and 10 the next week.

[CubinNY]

The 2007 Cubs are better than the 2006 Cardinals by a fairly wide margin. However, whether that will translate into getting anywhere in the playoffs is another story.

I don't know how you could possibly justify saying that except for blind homerism.

 

The 2007 Cubs are as mediocre as the 2006 Cardinals. I also believe they are a worse put together team.

 

Why?

Because they are? Last year the Cardinals won 83 games. The best the Cubs can do is win 87. There is not a whole lot of difference there.

 

In 2006 the Cardinals fifth in RS/game in the NL and 8th in pitching. In 2007 the Cubs are 8th in RS/game and 2nd in pitching. There's not a whole lot of difference there.

 

Now, on being put together worse. The Cubs spent a lot of money this offseason and at best they will have 4 more wins to show for it.

 

You still haven't explained why the 2006 Cardinals were a better put together team then this year Cubs?

Well they had a CFer for one. They had a SS who got on base. They had the best player in baseball at first. They had a catcher who shut down the running game and hit. Aramis and Rolen are about even. But most importantly,

 

THEY SPENT $88 M DOLLARS TO DO SO. ABOUT $40 M LESS THAN THE CUBS THIS YEAR.

 

Or to put it another way the Cards spent 1 M/win. The Cubs have spend 1.45 M/win

[Soul]

Talentwise, I think the Cubs have more talent. Of course, I thought SD, NYM, and Det had more talent than STL last year too.

 

I don't see the Cubs getting the same starting pitching the Cards had in the posteseason last year.

 

Carpenter, Suppan, Weaver were outstanding and Reyes did well in game 1 of the WS.

 

They pitched over their heads last year and the Cubs would have to do likewise, putting odds on that are smaller rather than expected.

 

If we do make it, I think even with the NL as weak as it is there's a real solid chance we get swept right out without much of a thought.

 

All it took was a sweep by the Marlins to bring the Soul we all know back. :)

 

LOL.

 

I told you, they crushed the confidence right out of me. I'm still unable to believe we just got swept by those guys.