2007 Instructs Thread

[Guest]

Mark Gonzales | ChicagoSports.com[/url]"]Instructional League observations

By Mark Gonzales - 6:25 p.m.

 

PHOENIX - Executives and talent evalutors from several major league teams are in the Valley to watch their prospects and assess their plans for 2008.

 

Wednesday's Instructional League game between the Cubs and White Sox provided a small snapshot. The late Oscar Acosta, a pitching coach for the Cubs in 2000-01, would be proud of son Ryan Acosta.

 

Ryan Acosta displayed near-perfect mechanics while pitching a scoreless inning against the Sox. Acosta, a 12th-round pick of the Cubs out of Clearwater (Fla.) Central Catholic High School in 2006, had a 3.00 ERA in 18 innings for the Cubs' team in the Arizona League and at short-season Class-A Boise.

 

Left-handed hitting outfielder Tyler Colvin, the Cubs' No. 1 pick in 2006, broke two bats during one at-bat but could fill out as a Will Clark-David Justice type hitter.

[UK1679666180]

There's quite a diff. between Clark and Justice as far as style of hitters. Esepcially Colvin's inability to draw BBs, I find it odd to compare him to Will Clark, although they're both LH'ed. :)

[Guest]

http://mvn.com/mlb-cubs/2007/10/12/brewers-drive-cubs-to-drink/

 

Cubs commit 5 errors, 2 passed balls and 3 wild pitches in loss to Brewers. Josh Donaldson looks has a great day at a plate and an even worse day behind it defensiely. Meanwhile, Jose Ceda tops out at 98 mph. Again.

 

The big names:

 

2B T. Thomas 1/3, R, BB

DH #1 T. Colvin 1/4. 2B, RBI, BB, K

C J. Donaldson 2/2, R, 2 2B, BB

3B J. Vitters 1/3

RF C. Andersen 1/3, 2B, K

 

RP J. Ceda 1 R, 0 ER, 1 H, 1 K/1 BB, WP, 29 pitches, 1 E (fumbled throw back from catcher)

RP M. Pawelek 1 IP, 0 R, 1 H, 0 K/0 BB, 10 pitches

 

Josh Donaldson's defense: 0/2 CS, 2 PB, 3 errors (overthrow trying to throw out a SB at 2nd base, overthrow on a pickoff attempt at first base, overthrow trying to throw out runner trying to advance from 2nd to 3rd base after play at the plate)

[Guest]

Today is the last day of instructs.

 

Oneri is (excessively?) gushy about Pawelek:

 

MiLB.com[/url]"]Despite being a former first-round pick, left-hander Mark Pawelek is not the top prospect in the Chicago Cubs' Instructional League program in Mesa, Ariz. He's not the player coming off the best season. But it's unlikely that anyone has shown himself more likely to turn the corner in 2008 than the club's top pick from 2005.

 

Pawelek, who just turned 21 in August, was drafted by the Cubs out of high school in Utah. He posted a 2.72 ERA in 14 games that summer in the Arizona League, limiting hitters to a 1.70 average and a 2.51 ERA in 15 games at Class A Short-Season Boise in 2006.

 

But after pitching in just two games at Class A Peoria in April, Pawelek headed to extended Spring Training in Mesa to work on mechanics. While preparing to rejoin Boise when the Northwest League season began, he suffered a fractured right (non-throwing) elbow when he tripped over his PlayStation.

 

After six weeks of rehabbing the injury, Pawelek headed up to Boise in late July, and he pitched in eight games in relief.

 

He's been making up for the lost time back in Mesa this fall and farm director Oneri Fleita was extremely enthusiastic about what he's seen, particularly when it comes to the mechanics which had been hampered by inconsistency.

 

"We finally have a delivery that I think he can repeat and that's really what it's been all about," Fleita said. "He's having fun and he's finally got a smile on his face, and usually with that comes success. So we're hoping this is the start of a huge gain for 2008."

 

Fleita attributes much of Pawelek's progress this fall to pitching coaches Dennis Lewallyn and Tom Pratt.

 

Pratt has been with the Cubs for a long time with a lengthy record of success stories, while Lewallyn joined the organization this season after working with such pitchers as Brandon Webb and Jose Valverde in his 12 years with the Arizona Diamondbacks.

 

"Sometimes it takes awhile for someone to 'connect,'" Fleita explained. "It can be a lot of things and sometimes you don't know how the dots get connected."

 

Fleita's own enthusiasm about Pawelek's progress is off the charts.

 

"He's young and left-handed and healthy," he said. "That equation can pay big dividends."

 

Another first-rounder making a big impression in Mesa has been the Cubs' most recent top draftee, Josh Vitters. The third baseman was taken with the third overall pick this past spring out of high school.

 

Since he signed too late to play much more than a few weeks this past summer, Vitters has been getting to know his new organization and vice versa.

 

 

"Anything we do with his swing or his fielding would be very little this early on," Fleita explained. "This is just a chance for him to get to know what his plan is to prepare for Spring Training."

 

Vitters' days consist of working defensively with roving infield instructor Bobby Dickerson, base running and bunting drills and other fundamental work.

 

"We threw his feet in the fire and said, 'Here, you're baptized,'" Fleita joked. "He's a great kid and has fit in well with the other players."

 

Considered one of the most polished high school hitters in the Class of '07, Vitters' top tool is his bat.

 

But it's not just players whose seasons were abbreviated who have been spending time in Mesa. Among the prospects on hand are pitcher Donald Veal and outfielder Tyler Colvin, both of whom played full Minor League seasons in 2007.

 

Veal, who came into '07 regarded as the Cubs' top pitching prospect, had an up-and-down season at Double-A Tennessee, where he was 8-10 with a 4.97 ERA.

 

"He's just here to throw an inning, maybe two tops, in a game, with the focus more on the little things like fielding his position, holding runners and a few little mechanical things to improve on his command," said Fleita. "But they're little things that we think will pay big dividends in 2008."

 

Colvin, an outfielder who split his season between Class Advanced A Daytona and Double-A Tennessee batting close to .300 with 16 homers and 81 RBIs, is in camp to prepare for a bigger challenge.

 

"Tyler is here for a little while to get in shape because he'll join Team USA later this month to go to Taiwan to play in the World Cup," Fleita explained. "We didn't want to bring him to full-fledged instructional league so it's more geared to getting him in shape for this great honor."

[CUBZ99]

Today is the last day of instructs.

 

Oneri is (excessively?) gushy about Pawelek:

 

MiLB.com[/url]"]Despite being a former first-round pick, left-hander Mark Pawelek is not the top prospect in the Chicago Cubs' Instructional League program in Mesa, Ariz. He's not the player coming off the best season. But it's unlikely that anyone has shown himself more likely to turn the corner in 2008 than the club's top pick from 2005.

 

Pawelek, who just turned 21 in August, was drafted by the Cubs out of high school in Utah. He posted a 2.72 ERA in 14 games that summer in the Arizona League, limiting hitters to a 1.70 average and a 2.51 ERA in 15 games at Class A Short-Season Boise in 2006.

 

But after pitching in just two games at Class A Peoria in April, Pawelek headed to extended Spring Training in Mesa to work on mechanics. While preparing to rejoin Boise when the Northwest League season began, he suffered a fractured right (non-throwing) elbow when he tripped over his PlayStation.

 

After six weeks of rehabbing the injury, Pawelek headed up to Boise in late July, and he pitched in eight games in relief.

 

He's been making up for the lost time back in Mesa this fall and farm director Oneri Fleita was extremely enthusiastic about what he's seen, particularly when it comes to the mechanics which had been hampered by inconsistency.

 

"We finally have a delivery that I think he can repeat and that's really what it's been all about," Fleita said. "He's having fun and he's finally got a smile on his face, and usually with that comes success. So we're hoping this is the start of a huge gain for 2008."

 

Fleita attributes much of Pawelek's progress this fall to pitching coaches Dennis Lewallyn and Tom Pratt.

 

Pratt has been with the Cubs for a long time with a lengthy record of success stories, while Lewallyn joined the organization this season after working with such pitchers as Brandon Webb and Jose Valverde in his 12 years with the Arizona Diamondbacks.

 

"Sometimes it takes awhile for someone to 'connect,'" Fleita explained. "It can be a lot of things and sometimes you don't know how the dots get connected."

 

Fleita's own enthusiasm about Pawelek's progress is off the charts.

 

"He's young and left-handed and healthy," he said. "That equation can pay big dividends."

 

Another first-rounder making a big impression in Mesa has been the Cubs' most recent top draftee, Josh Vitters. The third baseman was taken with the third overall pick this past spring out of high school.

 

Since he signed too late to play much more than a few weeks this past summer, Vitters has been getting to know his new organization and vice versa.

 

 

"Anything we do with his swing or his fielding would be very little this early on," Fleita explained. "This is just a chance for him to get to know what his plan is to prepare for Spring Training."

 

Vitters' days consist of working defensively with roving infield instructor Bobby Dickerson, base running and bunting drills and other fundamental work.

 

"We threw his feet in the fire and said, 'Here, you're baptized,'" Fleita joked. "He's a great kid and has fit in well with the other players."

 

Considered one of the most polished high school hitters in the Class of '07, Vitters' top tool is his bat.

 

But it's not just players whose seasons were abbreviated who have been spending time in Mesa. Among the prospects on hand are pitcher Donald Veal and outfielder Tyler Colvin, both of whom played full Minor League seasons in 2007.

 

Veal, who came into '07 regarded as the Cubs' top pitching prospect, had an up-and-down season at Double-A Tennessee, where he was 8-10 with a 4.97 ERA.

 

"He's just here to throw an inning, maybe two tops, in a game, with the focus more on the little things like fielding his position, holding runners and a few little mechanical things to improve on his command," said Fleita. "But they're little things that we think will pay big dividends in 2008."

 

Colvin, an outfielder who split his season between Class Advanced A Daytona and Double-A Tennessee batting close to .300 with 16 homers and 81 RBIs, is in camp to prepare for a bigger challenge.

 

"Tyler is here for a little while to get in shape because he'll join Team USA later this month to go to Taiwan to play in the World Cup," Fleita explained. "We didn't want to bring him to full-fledged instructional league so it's more geared to getting him in shape for this great honor."

 

Nice to hear some positives about Pawelek, however, I wonder if he has rediscovered his velocity.

[CUBZ99]

Today is the last day of instructs.

 

Oneri is (excessively?) gushy about Pawelek:

 

MiLB.com[/url]"]Despite being a former first-round pick, left-hander Mark Pawelek is not the top prospect in the Chicago Cubs' Instructional League program in Mesa, Ariz. He's not the player coming off the best season. But it's unlikely that anyone has shown himself more likely to turn the corner in 2008 than the club's top pick from 2005.

 

Pawelek, who just turned 21 in August, was drafted by the Cubs out of high school in Utah. He posted a 2.72 ERA in 14 games that summer in the Arizona League, limiting hitters to a 1.70 average and a 2.51 ERA in 15 games at Class A Short-Season Boise in 2006.

 

But after pitching in just two games at Class A Peoria in April, Pawelek headed to extended Spring Training in Mesa to work on mechanics. While preparing to rejoin Boise when the Northwest League season began, he suffered a fractured right (non-throwing) elbow when he tripped over his PlayStation.

 

After six weeks of rehabbing the injury, Pawelek headed up to Boise in late July, and he pitched in eight games in relief.

 

He's been making up for the lost time back in Mesa this fall and farm director Oneri Fleita was extremely enthusiastic about what he's seen, particularly when it comes to the mechanics which had been hampered by inconsistency.

 

"We finally have a delivery that I think he can repeat and that's really what it's been all about," Fleita said. "He's having fun and he's finally got a smile on his face, and usually with that comes success. So we're hoping this is the start of a huge gain for 2008."

 

Fleita attributes much of Pawelek's progress this fall to pitching coaches Dennis Lewallyn and Tom Pratt.

 

Pratt has been with the Cubs for a long time with a lengthy record of success stories, while Lewallyn joined the organization this season after working with such pitchers as Brandon Webb and Jose Valverde in his 12 years with the Arizona Diamondbacks.

 

"Sometimes it takes awhile for someone to 'connect,'" Fleita explained. "It can be a lot of things and sometimes you don't know how the dots get connected."

 

Fleita's own enthusiasm about Pawelek's progress is off the charts.

 

"He's young and left-handed and healthy," he said. "That equation can pay big dividends."

 

Another first-rounder making a big impression in Mesa has been the Cubs' most recent top draftee, Josh Vitters. The third baseman was taken with the third overall pick this past spring out of high school.

 

Since he signed too late to play much more than a few weeks this past summer, Vitters has been getting to know his new organization and vice versa.

 

 

"Anything we do with his swing or his fielding would be very little this early on," Fleita explained. "This is just a chance for him to get to know what his plan is to prepare for Spring Training."

 

Vitters' days consist of working defensively with roving infield instructor Bobby Dickerson, base running and bunting drills and other fundamental work.

 

"We threw his feet in the fire and said, 'Here, you're baptized,'" Fleita joked. "He's a great kid and has fit in well with the other players."

 

Considered one of the most polished high school hitters in the Class of '07, Vitters' top tool is his bat.

 

But it's not just players whose seasons were abbreviated who have been spending time in Mesa. Among the prospects on hand are pitcher Donald Veal and outfielder Tyler Colvin, both of whom played full Minor League seasons in 2007.

 

Veal, who came into '07 regarded as the Cubs' top pitching prospect, had an up-and-down season at Double-A Tennessee, where he was 8-10 with a 4.97 ERA.

 

"He's just here to throw an inning, maybe two tops, in a game, with the focus more on the little things like fielding his position, holding runners and a few little mechanical things to improve on his command," said Fleita. "But they're little things that we think will pay big dividends in 2008."

 

Colvin, an outfielder who split his season between Class Advanced A Daytona and Double-A Tennessee batting close to .300 with 16 homers and 81 RBIs, is in camp to prepare for a bigger challenge.

 

"Tyler is here for a little while to get in shape because he'll join Team USA later this month to go to Taiwan to play in the World Cup," Fleita explained. "We didn't want to bring him to full-fledged instructional league so it's more geared to getting him in shape for this great honor."

 

Nice to hear some positives about Pawelek, however, I wonder if he has rediscovered his velocity.

[Guest]

Nice to hear some positives about Pawelek, however, I wonder if he has rediscovered his velocity.

 

If his mechanics are consistent, his velo will bounce back.

 

But Oneri will compliment anyone in the farm system, so I take everything he says about a prospect with a grain of salt.

[Brian]

Remember when Pawelek wanted to make the majors by his 21st birthday? oops

[craig]

It's interesting to see what Oneri is actually quoted as saying. it's not much. It isn't Oneri who says Pawelek is relatively likely to turn the corner, it's the author of the article.

 

"We finally have a delivery that I think he can repeat and that's really what it's been all about," Fleita said. "He's having fun and he's finally got a smile on his face, and usually with that comes success. So we're hoping this is the start of a huge gain for 2008."... "Sometimes it takes awhile for someone to 'connect,'" Fleita explained. "It can be a lot of things and sometimes you don't know how the dots get connected." "He's young and left-handed and healthy," he said. "That equation can pay big dividends."

 

It's the author who says Fleita's optimism is off the charts, but that's just Oneri. What did Fleita really say? 1) Pawelek is smiling 2) Pawelek is lefty 3) We think he has a delivery he can repeat. 4) Something about dots.

 

There are lots of 86 mph wild lefties who don't turn out much. And there are lots of guys with smiles that don't work out. That Fleita doesn't know how dots get connected probably means that pawelek hasn't put anything together yet, but still could.

 

Really the only thing of substance that Fleita said that the author chose to quote was that Fleita thinks Mark is perhaps starting to repeat his delivery.

 

Hopefully it's true and it will pay off. Often a prospect isn't going to make the majors doing what worked in high school. In those cases, I think it's entirely appropriate to make corrections so that eventually a guy can succeed in the majors and stay healthy besided. If so, having a struggle period during adaptation is neither surprising nor something to mock. But, whether Fleita and the staff know what's best, of course, that is not so clear.

 

The "starting to repeat his delivery" gush is also somewhat too reminiscent of what Fleita gushed about Veal shortly before he got off to his horrible start this season.

[Guest]

http://mvn.com/mlb-cubs/2007/10/13/howard-street-far-as-this-train-goes/

 

Last game of instructs:

 

Siegfried continues to shine, as he appears poised to move from the bullpen to the starting rotation next season, probably at Peoria. It might have seemed like a questionable pick at the time (he was a walk-on at the University of Portland and his college numbers weren’t pretty), by I believe the Cubs made an astute choice by selecting Siegfried in the 11th round of this past June’s draft. He is an advanced pitcher with quality stuff.

 

But Donnie Veal was “Bad Donald” today, struggling to throw his fastball for strikes. After it looked like he might not ever get out of the 2nd inning (and remember, several Cubs players had planes to catch), pitching coach Tom Pratt (he be the father of ex-Cubs pitcher Andy Pratt) signaled to catcher Carlos Perez to have Veal throw only curve balls, and just like that, Veal got himself out of the inning.

 

RHP Ryan Acosta (son of the late former Cubs pitching coach Oscar Acosta) gave up back-to-back doubles with two outs in the third, but he has an arsenal of three pitches, and he throws them all for strikes. He seems like a natural. The Rabbit may be raw, but he has a lot of potential as a rotation starter. Physically, he resembles a young Greg Maddux.

 

DH #1 D. Barney 3/3, R

C C. Peres 0/2, K - defense: 0/2 CS

3B J. Rosa 1/3, K

RF D. Rundle 1/2

SP C. Siegfried 1 IP, 0 R, 1 H, 2 K/0 BB, 14 pitches

RP D. Veal 1 IP, 2 ER, 2 H, 0 K/2 BB, 22 pitches

RP R. Acosta 1 IP, 1 ER, 2 H, 1 K/0 BB, 14 pitches

[Outshined_One]

The Rabbit?

 

That's a good nickname.

[badnews]

The last guy I remember getting the "advanced pitcher, quality stuff" billing was Mike Phelps from around the same round. Whatever happened to him?

[the splendid splinter]

It's interesting to see what Oneri is actually quoted as saying. it's not much. It isn't Oneri who says Pawelek is relatively likely to turn the corner, it's the author of the article.

 

"We finally have a delivery that I think he can repeat and that's really what it's been all about," Fleita said. "He's having fun and he's finally got a smile on his face, and usually with that comes success. So we're hoping this is the start of a huge gain for 2008."... "Sometimes it takes awhile for someone to 'connect,'" Fleita explained. "It can be a lot of things and sometimes you don't know how the dots get connected." "He's young and left-handed and healthy," he said. "That equation can pay big dividends."

 

It's the author who says Fleita's optimism is off the charts, but that's just Oneri. What did Fleita really say? 1) Pawelek is smiling 2) Pawelek is lefty 3) We think he has a delivery he can repeat. 4) Something about dots.

 

There are lots of 86 mph wild lefties who don't turn out much. And there are lots of guys with smiles that don't work out. That Fleita doesn't know how dots get connected probably means that pawelek hasn't put anything together yet, but still could.

 

Really the only thing of substance that Fleita said that the author chose to quote was that Fleita thinks Mark is perhaps starting to repeat his delivery.

 

Hopefully it's true and it will pay off. Often a prospect isn't going to make the majors doing what worked in high school. In those cases, I think it's entirely appropriate to make corrections so that eventually a guy can succeed in the majors and stay healthy besided. If so, having a struggle period during adaptation is neither surprising nor something to mock. But, whether Fleita and the staff know what's best, of course, that is not so clear.

 

The "starting to repeat his delivery" gush is also somewhat too reminiscent of what Fleita gushed about Veal shortly before he got off to his horrible start this season.

Looks to me like a little different product Fleita was handed from Stockstill as opposed to what Wilken and his staff is handing Fleita and his staff and you can see it with the production of the Wilken regimes players

[craig]

I'm somewhat encouraged about some of the developments in the low minors.

 

It seems we are now sitting with some stock of pitchers. None are remarkable prospects, at least not yet. But there seems to be some volume of guys who may be interesting.

 

The favorable news on Huseby is great. I'd like great stuff, but control is the name of the game. And he's got some stuff projection. If he can pitch with balance and control three pitches, a guy with good movement/sink on a low 90's fastball can win a lot of games.

 

Acosta sounds pretty interesting. If he can throw in the 90-93 range, and has the makings of good balance and good promise on three pitches, again that's a very nice package. Obviously not a strapping 6'5" first rounder type, but he sounds pretty interesting.

 

Rhee and Hernandez both seem pretty interesting. Again, neither projects to throw 98 like Ceda or like when Wood/Cruz/Farnsworth/Z were rising prospects. But both Rhee and hernandez sound like they've got a chance to be pretty good.

 

We'll see, of course. Lots of teens get hurt, and lots get slower rather than faster (Pawelek, apparently). But sometimes the scouts are pretty sharp at anticipating that a guy like Guzman will throw harder in time. (Even if his arm hasn't been able to sustain that...).

 

I'm not sure that any of these guys have the "WOW" factor that high-90's guys like Kerry/Kyle/Cruz/Z had in low minors. But the early impression is that they can all find the strike zone. I like that, a lot.

 

Obviously Ceda is the other extreme, his velocity is exceptional and his breaking ball seems really knockout. He's the "Wow" stuff guy.

 

Obviously there are a batch of other guys, with varying levels of interest.

James Russell: Again doesn't appear to have Wow stuff, and the scouting reports on his arm strength are variable. But his Texas results were pretty good, and his brief debut this summer in the pros was also impressive. I'm hopeful that he's going to be pretty good. Maybe Sean Marshall without all the injuries is what I'm hoping.

 

Maestri, Ruhlman, Lambert, Siegfried, each of these showed some good stuff. Maybe one or two of them will turn out to be real relief prospects?

 

I found AzPhil's comment that Siegfried might be tried as a starter both surprising and rather interesting. It's seemed that when Siegfried is on, he's on. By report he throws reasonably hard and has a breaking ball that can K people. But what was most remarkable was an extreme G/F ratio. Might seem like a guy who, if he could be consistent with his delivery and command, that he'd have the stuff and the sinker to be an ideal starter. But, both his college and his early pro results have suggested that he's pretty inconsistent, and can be a wildman sometimes. I guess we'll see.

 

Pawelek, Redmond, Hatley, Hempy, Chen, Ashwood, seems there are some other guys with a chance to be pretty interesting, too.

 

And then there is the harder-to-guess Latin prospects. Cabrera, Tolentino, who knows if they'll be healthy or have control. But prior to injuries, Cabrera sounded very interesting. And then there is a large pool of DSL pitchers. The Cubs DSL team almost never has any hitting, although this year it wasn't as below-average as usual. But after a slow start, that team really won a lot of games during the last 2/3 of the season, and had a lot of pitchers putting up interesting games. With almost no scouting information, hard to know who's who in terms of prospect-hood. But my guess is that this may be as good a crop of Latin pitchers since back in the 90's when they were signing Cruz and Z and Beltran and Felix Sanchez and Pinto within a few years of each other. Would really help if we could come up with a Rhee as a good pitcher form Asia, have Hernandez be a good pitcher from Venez, and have a couple of the Dominican kids prove to be serious besides.

 

Anyway, I'm hopeful that we may be in the process of rebuilding a strong pool of pitchers from the bottom up.

[Guest]

I agree, craig. There are a bunch of pitchers who (while still far away) have the potential to be solid starters in the bigs but not aces. And while they're still far away from the big leagues and a lot of bad things could still happen to them, maybe a few of the more projectable ones can add a few ticks to the FB, improve command or breaking pitches and become potential aces (I'd guess Huseby, Suarez and Cabrera have the most potential here). I don't remember this much depth in the low levels as in the past.

 

And I'd like to add two names that craig didn't mention in Larry Suarez and Oswaldo Martinez. And I can always hope Rafael Dolis can bounce back from his surgery. It's going to be interesting to see who ends up in the Peoria rotation (I think - if healthy - Huseby is the only lock) and which non-08 draftees end up in Boise's rotation.

[Guest]

This might be the most appropriate place to post Ryan Searle's final MLB Australian Academy stats for 2007:

 

Player        ERA  W-L  G  GS  IP   H   R   ER  BB  SO  HR  BAA  WP HBP
Ryan SEARLE  3.70  1-4  6  6  24.1  20  19  10  23  28   0 .217  7  2

[Guest]

The last guy I remember getting the "advanced pitcher, quality stuff" billing was Mike Phelps from around the same round. Whatever happened to him?

 

Injuries.

[Outshined_One]

The last guy I remember getting the "advanced pitcher, quality stuff" billing was Mike Phelps from around the same round. Whatever happened to him?

 

Injuries.

 

He hasn't been the same since he got hit in the face on a throw from his catcher back in college.

[badnews]

Looks to me like a little different product Fleita was handed from Stockstill as opposed to what Wilken and his staff is handing Fleita and his staff and you can see it with the production of the Wilken regimes players

 

I don't know. I think people may be bending over backwards a little to try and interpret things in a way more favorable to Wilken than they really are.

 

I'm somewhat encouraged about some of the developments in the low minors.

 

Craig, I'm afraid I don't agree. I can see you're not going wild with your projections and optimism but at the same time it looks to me like what you've done is make a list of warm bodies. We're not anywhere close to the farm system strength we had in the early 2000s, I think we can all agree. But most of the names you're listing are no better than some of the guys people said pretty much the same things about 2004-2006:

 

Mike Phelps

Darin Downs

Matt Weber

John Koronka

Todd Blackford

Jon Connolly

Sean Gallagher

Mitch Atkins

Angel Guzman

Matt Avery

Jerry Blevins

Grant Johnson

Jon Leicester

Billy Petrick

Chadd Blasko

Chris Shaver

Scott Taylor

Randy Wells

Frank Beltran

 

So forth.

 

I'm not trying to say one way or another, but I don't think we're in a different place than we've been pretty much, I don't see the sense of change that it seems people are trying to sell. I think every year people get overexcited about Boise prospects, I remember a lot of excitement about Dylan Johnston, Russell Canzler, Yusuf Carter, Alfred Joseph.

 

I remember the 2004 Boise team, which was the "Promising" All-Star team: Tony Richie, Ryan Norwood, Montanez, Matt Weber, Chris Shaver, J.R. Mathes, and the hard-throwing young relief trio of Jerry Blevins, Jon Hunton, and Will Fenton, throw in Ed Campusano to boot.

 

Long story short is I don't think things are a heck of a lot different. This organization has pretty much always been stuffed to the gills with middling prospects and "guys who could be interesting." Believe me, I've watched them for awhile. A bigger Darin Downs backer probably didn't exist.

 

I'd rather the Cubs were in a position like the Braves, where they could lose 5 of their best 10 prospects and still be in a pretty stable farm system position. We need prospect surplus so we can trade some of these guys off and not have to worry about filling their shoes.

[Guest]

I don't see a lot of excitement about the lower minors in this list and discussion. Maybe you're not talking about NSBB when you say there was a lot of enthusiasm, though.

[Guest]

Mike Phelps

Darin Downs

Matt Weber

John Koronka

Todd Blackford

Jon Connolly

Sean Gallagher

Mitch Atkins

Angel Guzman

Matt Avery

Jerry Blevins

Grant Johnson

Jon Leicester

Billy Petrick

Chadd Blasko

Chris Shaver

Scott Taylor

Randy Wells

Frank Beltran

 

I just don't see the comparison. Most of those guys are B-C prospects w/ average stuff at best. The only ones who were considered good prospects were Angel Guzman, Grant Johnson, Billy Petrick, Chadd Blasko and more recently Sean Gallagher. This list of "warm bodies" doesn't compare favorably to the one craig has come. Keep in mind that craig is talking about a group of guys solely in the low minors (Mesa - Peoria last season) vs. the guys in your list who were all over the place including some guys in the high minors.

 

Another difference between craig's list and yours - which he pointed out - is a greater emphasis of international signings to a time before this 2004 - 2006 gap which shows up in his crop.

 

I'm not trying to say one way or another, but I don't think we're in a different place than we've been pretty much, I don't see the sense of change that it seems people are trying to sell. I think every year people get overexcited about Boise prospects, I remember a lot of excitement about Dylan Johnston, Russell Canzler, Yusuf Carter, Alfred Joseph.

 

Again, I don't remember much excitement for those guys except Dylan Johnston (and that was more due to his draft position).

 

Long story short is I don't think things are a heck of a lot different. This organization has pretty much always been stuffed to the gills with middling prospects and "guys who could be interesting." Believe me, I've watched them for awhile. A bigger Darin Downs backer probably didn't exist.

 

I'd rather the Cubs were in a position like the Braves, where they could lose 5 of their best 10 prospects and still be in a pretty stable farm system position. We need prospect surplus so we can trade some of these guys off and not have to worry about filling their shoes.

 

The Cubs aren't the Braves, Dodgers, etc. who have great depth and top tier talent but the Cubs at least are building better depth than a few years ago.

[craig]

badnews, I think your point is well taken. There are always a crop of guys who haven't failed yet, or might project to get faster later, or whatever. Mostly they don't, and down the road we look back at them as nothign. I agree, there were times when Phelps looked very intersting, etc.

 

I don't think this is a great pool. I don't think this compares to the glory era when we had Justin Jones/Petrick/Felix Sanchez all at mesa, with Sisco at Boise. Or when Boise (or was it Eugene?) had Guzman-Dontrelle-Krawiec-Wellemeyer-Leicester, all of whom seemed to have pretty high ceiling.

 

But in Rhee-Suarez-Hernandez-Huseby-Acosta-Cabrera-Ceda I think that's a better collection of teenagers than we've had since Jones-Petrick-Sanchez-Sisco. And after years of following DSL, other than last year (Cabrera-Acosta-Tolentino-Martinez looked very intriguing), I think this is the most interesting DLS crop I've ever seen the Cubs flash. (Based only on age,size, and numbers, and results).

 

I think the Maestri-Ruhlman-Russell-Redmond-etc. types, they are more like the usual warm bodies that you always have.

 

What's different since the Guzman-Ryu-Sanchez era is a return to having some meaningful contribution of internationals. Most teams have that, but the Cubs have really been weak there since Ryu and Pie. We now konw that Suarez and Rhee got some money. And indications are that the Latin action has gotten a bit better lately, for whatever reason.

 

I don't think the position talent is looking good at all. I hope that the scouts are right and vitters works out. But early returns suggest he can't field, can't run, and can't hit. Thomas and Donaldson types, they are college guys, and both seem to have some real question marks. Other than Vitters and Castillo, not really much for teenage players to get excited about.

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[BDWeav71]

 

The Cubs aren't the Braves, Dodgers, etc. who have great depth and top tier talent but the Cubs at least are building better depth than a few years ago.

 

 

I think this is the key to most of our small levels of excitement. The fact that we are building a little bit of depth with the talent level in our lower minors is a very encouraging sign.