All Time All-Star Argument Starter

[OleMissCub]

There was a piece published in the 70's in Esquire magazine by a sportswriter who broke all-time players up into ethnic groups, such as Irish, Italian, etc...but the game is definitely, and thankfully, more demographically expansive these days.

 

So let's go with Anglos, African-Americans, and Hispanics. (would include Asians but there isn't enough of a player pool out there as of yet...wouldn't want So Taguchi going up against Roberto Clemente.)

 

Each team gets 3 pitchers, all the position players, plus 2 utility men, one from the OF and one from IF

 

I'll start my list in a few minutes.

[OleMissCub]

Whites

 

P - Walter Johnson

P - Roger Clemens

P - Greg Maddux

 

C - Johnny Bench

1B - Lou Gehrig

2B - Rogers Hornsby

SS - Honus Wagner

3B - Mike Schmidt

OF - Babe Ruth

OF - Ty Cobb

OF - Ted Williams

Uti OF - Mickey Mantle

Uti IF - Ryne Sandberg :-)

 

Blacks

 

P - Bob Gibson

P - Satchel Paige

P - Fergie Jenkins

 

C - Roy Campanella

1B - Eddie Murray

2B - Jackie Robinson

SS - Ernie Banks

3B - Judy Johnson

OF - Willie Mays

OF - Hank Aaron

OF - Ken Griffey Jr

Uti OF - Barry Bonds

Uti IF - Derek Jeter

 

Hispanics

 

P - Juan Marichal

P - Pedro Martinez

P - Luis Tiant

 

C - Pudge Rodriguez

1B - Albert Pujols

2B - Roberto Alomar

SS - Luis Aparicio

3B - Alex Rodriguez

OF - Sammy Sosa

OF - Roberto Clemente

OF - Manny Ramirez

Uti OF - Vladimir Guerrero

Uti IF - Rod Carew

[UK1679666180]

Gibson is the greatest C of all-time, regardless of race.

[Skyballer]

I don't think I put Aaron or Griffey over Bonds.

[OleMissCub]

I don't think I put Aaron or Griffey over Bonds.

 

What about Chad Kroeger. Put him in the OF over Ruth?

[OleMissCub]

Gibson is the greatest C of all-time, regardless of race.

 

You're probably right on that.

[Handlebar McSkullet]

I don't think I put Aaron or Griffey over Bonds.

 

What about Chad Kroeger. Put him in the OF over Ruth?

 

OMG!!!!

 

But you are right about Griffey > Bonds. Aaron wasnt a better fielder than either of them.

[Skyballer]

I don't think I put Aaron or Griffey over Bonds.

 

What about Chad Kroeger. Put him in the OF over Ruth?

Now you're being silly.

Keep this thread on track please.

[Handlebar McSkullet]

Hispanics

 

P - Juan Marichal

P - Pedro Martinez

P - Luis Tiant

 

C - SANDY MARTINEZ

1B - Albert Pujols

2B - Roberto Alomar

SS - Luis Aparicio

3B - Alex Rodriguez

OF - Sammy Sosa

OF - Roberto Clemente

OF - Manny Ramirez

Uti OF - Vladimir Guerrero

Uti IF - Rod Carew

 

Fixed! P.S. According to racial expert Gary Sheffield, Derek Jeter isnt Black.

[OleMissCub]

I don't think I put Aaron or Griffey over Bonds.

 

What about Chad Kroeger. Put him in the OF over Ruth?

Now you're being silly.

Keep this thread on track please.

 

You're right, I was just messing with you.

[TruffleShuffle]

I don't think I put Aaron or Griffey over Bonds.

 

What about Chad Kroeger. Put him in the OF over Ruth?

 

OMG!!!!

 

But you are right about Griffey > Bonds. Aaron wasnt a better fielder than either of them.

 

Bonds has a career 241.6 WARP3 and .357 (!!) EqA

 

Griffey has a 137.5 WARP3 and .314 EqA

 

 

so unless you're penalizing Bonds for using roids, there's no way in hell he belongs below Aaron or Griffey, possibly Mays too.

 

 

Oh and Derek Jeter is half white, so I don't think he should be included on any of the lists.

[fromthestretch]

I'd probably take McCovey over Eddie Murray.

[DiamondMind]

Asians

 

P - Daisuke Matsuzaka

P - Masaichi Kaneda

P - Chien Ming Wang

 

C - Kenji Johjima

1B - Sadaharu Oh

2B - Hiromitsu Ochiai

SS - Yasumitsu Toyoda

3B - Shigeo Nagashima

OF - Isao Harimoto

OF - Ichiro Suzuki

OF - Hiromitsu Kadota

DH - Nobuhiko Matsunaka

Uti IF - Lee Seung Yeop

[bukie]

I know Sandberg is in there for mostly sentimental reasons, but I'd probably have Musial or DiMaggio in there before Sandberg. Maybe Rose, too, except I just don't like Rose.

 

EDIT: Joe Jackson also.

[ctcf]

Asians

 

P - Daisuke Matsuzaka

P - Masaichi Kaneda

P - Chien Ming Wang

 

C - Kenji Johjima

1B - Sadaharu Oh

2B - Hiromitsu Ochiai

SS - Yasumitsu Toyoda

3B - Shigeo Nagashima

OF - Isao Harimoto

OF - Ichiro Suzuki

OF - Hiromitsu Kadota

DH - Nobuhiko Matsunaka

Uti IF - Lee Seung Yeop

 

I recognize 4 people there.

[bukie]

Joe Morgan should probably be on the blacks team also, possibly even starting at 2nd.

 

He should never be allowed to speak, though.

[bukie]

And I can think of 5-6 pitchers that would probably be better on the team than Maddux. Grover Cleveland Alexander, Christy Mathewson, Lefty Grove, Mordecai Brown, Warren Spahn, Tom Seaver...it's debatable, though.

 

Clemens definitely deserves to be on there, though, as disappointing as that may seem.

[TruffleShuffle]

Whites

 

P - Walter Johnson

P - Roger Clemens

P - Lefty Grove

Closer - Trevor Hoffman

 

C - Johnny Bench

1B - Lou Gehrig

2B - Rogers Hornsby

SS - Honus Wagner

3B - Mike Schmidt

OF - Babe Ruth

OF - Ty Cobb

OF - Ted Williams

Uti OF - Mickey Mantle

Uti IF - Tris Speaker

 

Blacks

 

P - Satchel Paige

P - Bob Gibson

P - Fergie Jenkins

Closer - Lee Smith

 

C - Josh Gibson

1B - Buck Leonard

2B - Joe Morgan (sorry)

SS - Ernie Banks

3B - Judy Johnson

OF - Willie Mays

OF - Barry Bonds

OF - Oscar Charleston

Uti OF - Hank Aaron

Uti IF - Jackie Robinson

 

Hispanics

 

P - Juan Marichal

P - Pedro Martinez

P - Luis Tiant (eventually replaced by Johan Santana)

Closer - Mariano Rivera

 

C - Pudge Rodriguez

1B - Rafael Palmeiro, for now

2B - Roberto Alomar

SS - Miguel Tejada

3B - Alex Rodriguez (eventually, might put A-Ram at third and A-rod at 2nd)

OF - Sammy Sosa

OF - Roberto Clemente

OF - Manny Ramirez

Uti OF - Vladimir Guerrero

Uti IF - Rod Carew (eventually David Ortiz)

[DiamondMind]

Asians

 

P - Daisuke Matsuzaka

P - Masaichi Kaneda

P - Chien Ming Wang

 

C - Kenji Johjima

1B - Sadaharu Oh

2B - Hiromitsu Ochiai

SS - Yasumitsu Toyoda

3B - Shigeo Nagashima

OF - Isao Harimoto

OF - Ichiro Suzuki

OF - Hiromitsu Kadota

DH - Nobuhiko Matsunaka

Uti IF - Lee Seung Yeop

 

I recognize 4 people there.

 

Most of them are all-time record holders or setters, ie, Harimoto had 3,000 hits.

[Pushfrog98]

Asians

 

P - Daisuke Matsuzaka

P - Masaichi Kaneda

P - Chien Ming Wang

 

C - Kenji Johjima

1B - Sadaharu Oh

2B - Hiromitsu Ochiai

SS - Yasumitsu Toyoda

3B - Shigeo Nagashima

OF - Isao Harimoto

OF - Ichiro Suzuki

OF - Hiromitsu Kadota

DH - Nobuhiko Matsunaka

Uti IF - Lee Seung Yeop

 

I recognize 4 people there.

 

Most of them are all-time record holders or setters, ie, Harimoto had 3,000 hits.

Was Nomo better than Wang?

[TruffleShuffle]

btw, i remember that once upon a time i started doing a historical top 10 list by position, but it kinda fell off because the season was still going on... would anyone be interested if i revived this in the offseason (since there's not much else to talk about, other than hot stove)

[Electron Blue]

Asians

 

P - Daisuke Matsuzaka

P - Masaichi Kaneda

P - Chien Ming Wang

 

C - Kenji Johjima

1B - Sadaharu Oh

2B - Hiromitsu Ochiai

SS - Yasumitsu Toyoda

3B - Shigeo Nagashima

OF - Isao Harimoto

OF - Ichiro Suzuki

OF - Hiromitsu Kadota

DH - Nobuhiko Matsunaka

Uti IF - Lee Seung Yeop

 

I recognize 4 people there.

 

Most of them are all-time record holders or setters, ie, Harimoto had 3,000 hits.

Was Nomo better than Wang?

 

depends on how much you like wang . . .

 

 

 

 

 

i actually have no serious answer for your question :oops:

[Electron Blue]

btw, i remember that once upon a time i started doing a historical top 10 list by position, but it kinda fell off because the season was still going on... would anyone be interested if i revived this in the offseason (since there's not much else to talk about, other than hot stove)

 

i think that's always interesting... i say go for it.

[TruffleShuffle]

btw, i remember that once upon a time i started doing a historical top 10 list by position, but it kinda fell off because the season was still going on... would anyone be interested if i revived this in the offseason (since there's not much else to talk about, other than hot stove)

 

i think that's always interesting... i say go for it.

 

i think i'll go make a poll to gauge interest

[SouthSideRyan]

btw, i remember that once upon a time i started doing a historical top 10 list by position, but it kinda fell off because the season was still going on... would anyone be interested if i revived this in the offseason (since there's not much else to talk about, other than hot stove)

 

I remember doing research on catchers to contribute to that. I enjoyed it.