1969 in reverse?

[NCCubFan]

I started following baseball in 1969, the year of the infamous Cubs' collapse. This year is very much starting to remind me of that year, but with the roles reversed. The Brewers this year are much like the Cubs in 1969, opening up a huge lead by early summer but then frettering it away. And the Cubs' recent surge reminds me very much of the Mets' surge in 1969. The tide seems to have started turning earlier this year (it was August that the Mets started making their move in 1969). And it's an interesting sidebar that 1969 was the Brewers' (then Seattle Pilots) expansion year.

[Soul]

Interesting.

 

In 1984, though, we paid back the Mets by overtaking them in August (I believe - ?, or did we overtake them actually in late July), so I haven't thought much about the Cubs sort of re-living '69 in reverse this year.

 

1984 was incredible. I was at the double-header in August when we swept the Mets and pretty much sealed the deal. I believe there were two bench-clearing brawls, tons of big-time moments......just a legendary day at Wrigley.

[Roast]

So, what you're saying is, the cubs are going to win the world series for sure?

 

awesome. :lol:

[anabiono]

So, what you're saying is, the cubs are going to win the world series for sure?

 

awesome. :lol:

 

super awesome...it is about time we had some conformation on this

[NCCubFan]

Interesting.

 

In 1984, though, we paid back the Mets by overtaking them in August (I believe - ?, or did we overtake them actually in late July), so I haven't thought much about the Cubs sort of re-living '69 in reverse this year.

 

1984 was incredible. I was at the double-header in August when we swept the Mets and pretty much sealed the deal. I believe there were two bench-clearing brawls, tons of big-time moments......just a legendary day at Wrigley.

It was Aug. 1 in 1984 that the Cubs took over first place for good, and the Cardinals also overtook the Mets for 2nd place. The pattern was a bit different, though; the Cubs spent much of the first part of the season in first place (a few days in April, all but 7 days in May, and about half of June). It was really just the second half of June and the last three weeks of July that the Cubs were continuously out of first.

[chuckywang]

I know that some of us were around in 1969 and how we felt with this Cubs collapse, but the "Miracle Mets" that year have become a part of baseball folklore. Can you imagine what would be different had they not won the WS that year. The movie Frequency would not have been made, for example.

[shnsajax]

I am hoping we can catch them by the end of next week and open up a big lead come September and I can see them clinch in Houston :-).

[abuck1220]

i don't know why everyone is making this out to be about the brewers choking it away. they were up just 8 1/2 games in june. it's not like they were up 14 games on sept 1 and then went on to lose like 15 of 16 or something. aren't they around .500 since the cubs went on their crazy tear?

[Shavo]

i don't know why everyone is making this out to be about the brewers choking it away. they were up just 8 1/2 games in june. it's not like they were up 14 games on sept 1 and then went on to lose like 15 of 16 or something. aren't they around .500 since the cubs went on their crazy tear?

 

I think it's more like 5-6+ games under .500 since the recent Cubs streak.

[Bote McBoteface]

The Brewers aren't playing all that badly at home. On the road, yeah..they're terrible.

 

The Cubs are going to overtake first place soon. Whether or not they finish the season that way, I'm not sure.

[shnsajax]

The Brewers aren't playing all that badly at home. On the road, yeah..they're terrible.

 

The Cubs are going to overtake first place soon. Whether or not they finish the season that way, I'm not sure.

 

If the Cubs over take soon its going to be interesting to see the way they respond. You have to think that they are really feeling the pressure right now.

[Bote McBoteface]

Yeah, the brewers have to be feeling a LOT of pressure after having an 8.5 game lead not too long ago and today having it trimmed to 1.5 (when they could have built it back up to 4.5)

 

When the Cubs take over first, it could take the pressure off and they might start playing like they did at the beginning of the year. You never know.

[Bote McBoteface]

And on the other hand, they could respond negatively to it, feeling even more pressure to get 1st place back, then they might really crumble. It'll be fun either way.

 

^^Especially if that happens.

[RynoRules]

i don't know why everyone is making this out to be about the brewers choking it away. they were up just 8 1/2 games in june. it's not like they were up 14 games on sept 1 and then went on to lose like 15 of 16 or something. aren't they around .500 since the cubs went on their crazy tear?

 

Holy cow, you are the King of Hyperbole lately.

 

I think the reason it doesn't seem like the Brewers are choking is that they do not have much credibility or history of winning. If the Yanks had been up 8 games and lost the lead it would be a choke. Same for the Red Sox, Braves, Mets, etc. But when the Brewers do it they are just regressing back to where they should be (at least that is the perception).

[Derwood]

Yeah, the brewers have to be feeling a LOT of pressure after having an 8.5 game lead not too long ago and today having it trimmed to 1.5 (when they could have built it back up to 4.5)

 

When the Cubs take over first, it could take the pressure off and they might start playing like they did at the beginning of the year. You never know.

 

if you're referring to the doubleheader, they could only have built it to 3.5 games with the Cubs win

[Texasflood]

As someone who lived it and remembers it vividly there are a few parallels. However, if memory serves the Cubs were up about 9-1/2 games in the middle of August after the Kenny Holtzman no-hitter. That just illustrates the time frame reference of the magnitude of the Cubs collapse. The Mets had much better starting pitching than the Brewers do. A young Tom Seaver, Jerry Koosman, Nolan Ryan, and Gary Gentry if memory serves. This would be akin to the Brewers having three or four healthy Ben sheets type starters.

 

One thing Lou is doing which Leo Durocher did not do was to give his starters periodic rest as witnessed by Ramirez and Floyd getting days off. However, in Leo's defense, his bench was not nearly as strong as Piniella's.The top five EVERYDAY in the lineup was Kessinger, Beckert, Williams, Santo and Banks. Also, Randy Hundley was going to catch about 156 games on average.

 

The Brewers have a much better starting line-up than the Mets did and probably a superior bullpen. However, their starting pitching can't come close to the Mets of 69 nor the magnitude of their losing their lead.

 

Sorry to bring up such painful memories of 1969 for those of us who went through it. I've always believed that because of that season, the mind-set of Cub fans was set. That being, things are going well now, how will it collapse soon? Unfortunately, that was reaffirmed in the 1984 play-offs against the Padres.

[NCCubFan]

The Mets had much better starting pitching than the Brewers do. A young Tom Seaver, Jerry Koosman, Nolan Ryan, and Gary Gentry if memory serves.

Ryan was actually more of a reliever that year (he only started 10 games). Don Cardwell (who threw a no-hitter for the Cubs several years earlier) and Jim McAndrew were swingmen, both starting 21 games in addition to several relief appearances.

[Magnetic Curses]

Yeah, the brewers have to be feeling a LOT of pressure after having an 8.5 game lead not too long ago and today having it trimmed to 1.5 (when they could have built it back up to 4.5)

 

When the Cubs take over first, it could take the pressure off and they might start playing like they did at the beginning of the year. You never know.

 

if you're referring to the doubleheader, they could only have built it to 3.5 games with the Cubs win

 

i think he's talking best case scenrio for the brewers. if it had gone the other way, it could have been 4.5. but you know that.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

i don't know why everyone is making this out to be about the brewers choking it away. they were up just 8 1/2 games in june. it's not like they were up 14 games on sept 1 and then went on to lose like 15 of 16 or something. aren't they around .500 since the cubs went on their crazy tear?

 

I think it's more like 5-6+ games under .500 since the recent Cubs streak.

 

if we go by the June 3 date that everyone keeps throwing around, they're actually 2 over 500

[E.J.]

I started following baseball in 1969, the year of the infamous Cubs' collapse. This year is very much starting to remind me of that year, but with the roles reversed. The Brewers this year are much like the Cubs in 1969, opening up a huge lead by early summer but then frettering it away. And the Cubs' recent surge reminds me very much of the Mets' surge in 1969. The tide seems to have started turning earlier this year (it was August that the Mets started making their move in 1969). And it's an interesting sidebar that 1969 was the Brewers' (then Seattle Pilots) expansion year.

 

Man you're old. :wink:

[abuck1220]

i don't know why everyone is making this out to be about the brewers choking it away. they were up just 8 1/2 games in june. it's not like they were up 14 games on sept 1 and then went on to lose like 15 of 16 or something. aren't they around .500 since the cubs went on their crazy tear?

 

Holy cow, you are the King of Hyperbole lately.

 

I think the reason it doesn't seem like the Brewers are choking is that they do not have much credibility or history of winning. If the Yanks had been up 8 games and lost the lead it would be a choke. Same for the Red Sox, Braves, Mets, etc. But when the Brewers do it they are just regressing back to where they should be (at least that is the perception).

 

but it was an 8 game lead in june. teams make up that kind of deficit all the time, i would guess.

 

and sorry i said everyone. i should have counted how many people said it and rephrased what i said as "don't know why 47 people out of 68 are making this out to be about the brewers choking it away."

[RynoRules]

i don't know why everyone is making this out to be about the brewers choking it away. they were up just 8 1/2 games in june. it's not like they were up 14 games on sept 1 and then went on to lose like 15 of 16 or something. aren't they around .500 since the cubs went on their crazy tear?

 

Holy cow, you are the King of Hyperbole lately.

 

I think the reason it doesn't seem like the Brewers are choking is that they do not have much credibility or history of winning. If the Yanks had been up 8 games and lost the lead it would be a choke. Same for the Red Sox, Braves, Mets, etc. But when the Brewers do it they are just regressing back to where they should be (at least that is the perception).

 

but it was an 8 game lead in june. teams make up that kind of deficit all the time, i would guess.

 

and sorry i said everyone. i should have counted how many people said it and rephrased what i said as "don't know why 47 people out of 68 are making this out to be about the brewers choking it away."

 

I dunno about that. Anyone know where we can find out?

[CubmanPi]

i don't know why everyone is making this out to be about the brewers choking it away. they were up just 8 1/2 games in june. it's not like they were up 14 games on sept 1 and then went on to lose like 15 of 16 or something. aren't they around .500 since the cubs went on their crazy tear?

 

I think it's more like 5-6+ games under .500 since the recent Cubs streak.

 

if we go by the June 3 date that everyone keeps throwing around, they're actually 2 over 500

I thought it was closer to this. It can hardly be classified as choking to play barely over .500 while watching your lead shrink from 8.5 to 1.5 (or 0.5?? ). Obviously the Brewers haven't been as hot, but the Cubs took it upon themselves to close the gap. At the start of that stretch, the Cubs were also major underachievers in terms of XW-L, so if there's any choke job to talk about, it's the Cubs prior to 3 June.

[abuck1220]

i don't know why everyone is making this out to be about the brewers choking it away. they were up just 8 1/2 games in june. it's not like they were up 14 games on sept 1 and then went on to lose like 15 of 16 or something. aren't they around .500 since the cubs went on their crazy tear?

 

Holy cow, you are the King of Hyperbole lately.

 

I think the reason it doesn't seem like the Brewers are choking is that they do not have much credibility or history of winning. If the Yanks had been up 8 games and lost the lead it would be a choke. Same for the Red Sox, Braves, Mets, etc. But when the Brewers do it they are just regressing back to where they should be (at least that is the perception).

 

but it was an 8 game lead in june. teams make up that kind of deficit all the time, i would guess.

 

and sorry i said everyone. i should have counted how many people said it and rephrased what i said as "don't know why 47 people out of 68 are making this out to be about the brewers choking it away."

 

I dunno about that. Anyone know where we can find out?

 

i mean, they made up 8 games in 32 games or something. that's not that like end of the world remarkable or anything.

[RynoRules]

i don't know why everyone is making this out to be about the brewers choking it away. they were up just 8 1/2 games in june. it's not like they were up 14 games on sept 1 and then went on to lose like 15 of 16 or something. aren't they around .500 since the cubs went on their crazy tear?

 

Holy cow, you are the King of Hyperbole lately.

 

I think the reason it doesn't seem like the Brewers are choking is that they do not have much credibility or history of winning. If the Yanks had been up 8 games and lost the lead it would be a choke. Same for the Red Sox, Braves, Mets, etc. But when the Brewers do it they are just regressing back to where they should be (at least that is the perception).

 

but it was an 8 game lead in june. teams make up that kind of deficit all the time, i would guess.

 

and sorry i said everyone. i should have counted how many people said it and rephrased what i said as "don't know why 47 people out of 68 are making this out to be about the brewers choking it away."

 

I dunno about that. Anyone know where we can find out?

 

i mean, they made up 8 games in 32 games or something. that's not that like end of the world remarkable or anything.

 

Again, its difficult to respond to hyperbole.

 

No, its not "end of the world remarkable"; curing famine would be "end of the world remarkable."

 

Making up 8 games in 32, however, is a pretty big swing in the baseball universe. That's only 4 less than Seattle made up in about the same period of time to catch the Angels in 95', an all-time record iirc.

 

BTW, anyone recall who managed that Mariners squad?