How much trade value does Ronny Cedeno have?

[UMFan83]

I was thinking about Minor League assets that we have available for trades, and one name kept coming up. Ronny Cedeno. He has one (bad) year of major league experience under his belt (which may or may not hurt his value), he is tearing it up in AAA right now at a defensive position and showing power. He is obviously in a AAAA/MLB position right now. He doesn't need much more grooming.

 

I would think that given his AAA numbers, he is looking very attractive for some seller out there. Given that Lou has stated that there is no room for him on the roster right now, and given that the experiment of him as a starter did not work out so well and probably gave the Cubs management a bad impression of him, what kinda value would he possess as a trading chip for other teams?

 

Maybe I'm delirious but I'd think he'd have a decent amount of value (obviously no where close to "top prospect" status), as long as he's packaged with someone else. However, there are much much more knowledgeable talent evaluators on this board than I, so I will leave it up to you guys.

[fromthestretch]

I was thinking about Minor League assets that we have available for trades, and one name kept coming up. Ronny Cedeno. He has one (bad) year of major league experience under his belt (which may or may not hurt his value), he is tearing it up in AAA right now at a defensive position and showing power. He is obviously in a AAAA/MLB position right now. He doesn't need much more grooming.

 

I would think that given his AAA numbers, he is looking very attractive for some seller out there. Given that Lou has stated that there is no room for him on the roster right now, and given that the experiment of him as a starter did not work out so well and probably gave the Cubs management a bad impression of him, what kinda value would he possess as a trading chip for other teams?

 

Maybe I'm delirious but I'd think he'd have a decent amount of value (obviously no where close to "top prospect" status), as long as he's packaged with someone else. However, there are much much more knowledgeable talent evaluators on this board than I, so I will leave it up to you guys.

 

Considering the Cubs' current situation at SS, he may have more value starting for the Cubs than he would in a trade.

[UMFan83]

I was thinking about Minor League assets that we have available for trades, and one name kept coming up. Ronny Cedeno. He has one (bad) year of major league experience under his belt (which may or may not hurt his value), he is tearing it up in AAA right now at a defensive position and showing power. He is obviously in a AAAA/MLB position right now. He doesn't need much more grooming.

 

I would think that given his AAA numbers, he is looking very attractive for some seller out there. Given that Lou has stated that there is no room for him on the roster right now, and given that the experiment of him as a starter did not work out so well and probably gave the Cubs management a bad impression of him, what kinda value would he possess as a trading chip for other teams?

 

Maybe I'm delirious but I'd think he'd have a decent amount of value (obviously no where close to "top prospect" status), as long as he's packaged with someone else. However, there are much much more knowledgeable talent evaluators on this board than I, so I will leave it up to you guys.

 

Considering the Cubs' current situation at SS, he may have more value starting for the Cubs than he would in a trade.

 

Agreed (if he can stop making terrible mental mistakes). But I think the Cubs impression of him isn't that great, so I think as trade bait he'd be valuable.

[jersey cubs fan]

I would say very little by himself. He may have elevated himself to the level of being part of a package of 3-4 others that nets a quality bat, but the others would have to be quite good.

[fromthestretch]

I was thinking about Minor League assets that we have available for trades, and one name kept coming up. Ronny Cedeno. He has one (bad) year of major league experience under his belt (which may or may not hurt his value), he is tearing it up in AAA right now at a defensive position and showing power. He is obviously in a AAAA/MLB position right now. He doesn't need much more grooming.

 

I would think that given his AAA numbers, he is looking very attractive for some seller out there. Given that Lou has stated that there is no room for him on the roster right now, and given that the experiment of him as a starter did not work out so well and probably gave the Cubs management a bad impression of him, what kinda value would he possess as a trading chip for other teams?

 

Maybe I'm delirious but I'd think he'd have a decent amount of value (obviously no where close to "top prospect" status), as long as he's packaged with someone else. However, there are much much more knowledgeable talent evaluators on this board than I, so I will leave it up to you guys.

 

Considering the Cubs' current situation at SS, he may have more value starting for the Cubs than he would in a trade.

 

Agreed (if he can stop making terrible mental mistakes). But I think the Cubs impression of him isn't that great, so I think as trade bait he'd be valuable.

 

Is he still making those mistakes at Iowa? I'm honestly curious because I haven't seen him play since being sent down.

 

The Cubs have some decisions to make really soon. They aren't getting any offense whatsoever from the catcher position, and outside of Theriot's last 10 games or so, the production from SS has been terrible overall. If they could somehow find room on the roster for Soto and Cedeno, the next couple weeks would be a good time to see what those guys can do.

Edited July 9, 2007 by grassbass

[Ding Dong Johnson]

Is he still making those mistakes at Iowa?

 

he's still racking up the E totals, 8 in 52 games

[craig]

Good question, and I can't really answer it.

 

I do think that trading him would probably be a mistake. For two reasons.

 

1st, I doubt that Cedeno is going to nab us the part that puts us over the top this year.

 

2nd, after this year comes next year. This year, Cedeno is blocked by Izturis, for contractual reasons.

 

After this season Izturis's contract expires. That will unblock Cedeno and provide room for him. If you trade Cedeno now, then this winter we'll be sitting with Theriot and nobody else. Theriot has looked surprisingly acceptable as a share-time SS, but I don't want to count on him being a 160-start guy, either offensively or defensively.

 

So if you trade Cedeno, then the GM will need to go outside to acquire a SS this winter. Good SS's are expensive and hard to find. That will be expensive, very possibly frustrating/disappointing, and we may end up with a Neifi-type being the best we can get.

 

If you keep Cedeno, I think a GM could figure that Theriot/Cedeno together might cover SS. Can save his time/money/prospects to spend on other needs. (Catcher, CF, RF, relief, rotation...)

 

It's also possible that Cedeno won't need to wait till Iz's contract expires for the Cubs to make a change.

[Guest]

Dude, gotta go with some proven veterans for the stretch run. You know, when you go fishing and you want to catch some fish, it's not the right time to try out new bait. It's when you're not trying to catch anything that you try new things. Get it?

 

 

 

 

 

 

Oh wait, Dusty's not in charge anymore.

[NewUserName]

I think Murton and Cedeno got in Lou's doghouse and are going to have a long haul to get out.

 

I dont think Cedeno alone nets us anything we could use for this season. Couple him with a pitcher and maybe.

[Skyballer]

 

If you keep Cedeno, I think a GM could figure that Theriot/Cedeno together might cover SS. Can save his time/money/prospects to spend on other needs. (Catcher, CF, RF, relief, rotation...)

Might, it would be very good situation at SS, so DFA iz and make your SS situation theriot and cedeno.

[fromthestretch]

Is he still making those mistakes at Iowa?

 

he's still racking up the E totals, 8 in 52 games

 

True, but he was talking about mental mistakes. I think Cedeno's glovework will be fine. Offensively, the guy has nothing left to prove in the minors.

[biittner77]

Considering the Cubs' current situation at SS, he may have more value starting for the Cubs than he would in a trade.

 

I agree. Bring him up and if he doesn't perform sell him to Japan in the off season.

[don_kessinger_was_good]

If Cedeno had never played in the big leagues and he was posting his AAA numbers that he's doing this year--he would have ENORMOUS trade value. Unfortunately, everyone knows what he's done at the big league level in his two stints with the Cubs, that tags him as a "4-A" player. Net result-->very little trade value.

 

If he can get to the majors and have a strong run for two-three months, then things will change; he is still very young, and SS is a need position for half the teams in baseball. The best scenario is for the Cubs to leave Cedeno in Iowa all year, let him put a full season of good numbers on the board, then call him up in September and see if he can translate the success to some big league pitching.

 

If so, he may become a valuable trading chip in the offseason. Or maybe the Cubs will even choose to stick with him.

[CUBZ99]

The Cubs can live with Theriot's .338 OBP at SS. No need to try the Cedeno experiment all over again, when you got a guy that is already performing at an acceptable level in the Majors.

[CyHawk_Cub]

Given the hitters' paradise that is the PCL, I am personally not buying into Ronny's numbers at Iowa. With that said, he surely can't be worse than Izzy production wise... Just my 2 cents..

[shnsajax]

He can go to New York in the package for Arod :-).

[fromthestretch]

The Cubs can live with Theriot's .338 OBP at SS. No need to try the Cedeno experiment all over again, when you got a guy that is already performing at an acceptable level in the Majors.

 

You're assuming he'll stay at that level, which isn't a safe assumption.

 

If you can improve an area where you're getting mediocre to poor production, you do it. I'm not saying Cedeno is guaranteed to perform, but it's worth a shot. He has nothing left to prove in the minors.

[Skyballer]

The Cubs can live with Theriot's .338 OBP at SS. No need to try the Cedeno experiment all over again, when you got a guy that is already performing at an acceptable level in the Majors.

 

You're assuming he'll stay at that level, which isn't a safe assumption.

 

If you can improve an area where you're getting mediocre to poor production, you do it. I'm not saying Cedeno is guaranteed to perform, but it's worth a shot. He has nothing left to prove in the minors.

Yeah he should get a shot, i'd be all for a cedeno/theriot SS

[Amazing_Grace]

If Theriot can keep his OBP above .330 the rest of the year as the full-time SS, I have no problem going into next year with him as the full-time SS (provided we find a decent backup). Speaking realistically, an OBP above .330 is pretty good out of the SS position. If you're not paying over 10M per year for the likes of Furcal, Tejada, Jeter, etc., this is not a bad situation to be in.

 

Theriot also seems to fit in well at the 2 hole. He's a disciplined enough hitter to take strikes when Soriano steals and move the runner along by hitting to RF. He also gets on base at a reasonable clip. As long as that continues, there's no reason to switch. He definitely has had his hot and cold streaks, and that's to be expected from an inexperienced player. However, his overall numbers are not bad for a SS. In fact, his OPS is only 3 points lower than the 12M per year Furcal. The Cubs can live with Theriot at SS if they improve at other positions offensively, notably CF and RF.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

If Theriot can keep his OBP above .330 the rest of the year as the full-time SS, I have no problem going into next year with him as the full-time SS (provided we find a decent backup). Speaking realistically, an OBP above .330 is pretty good out of the SS position. If you're not paying over 10M per year for the likes of Furcal, Tejada, Jeter, etc., this is not a bad situation to be in.

 

Theriot also seems to fit in well at the 2 hole. He's a disciplined enough hitter to take strikes when Soriano steals and move the runner along by hitting to RF. He also gets on base at a reasonable clip. As long as that continues, there's no reason to switch. He definitely has had his hot and cold streaks, and that's to be expected from an inexperienced player. However, his overall numbers are not bad for a SS. In fact, his OPS is only 3 points lower than the 12M per year Furcal. The Cubs can live with Theriot at SS if they improve at other positions offensively, notably CF and RF.

 

a 330 OBP does not fit well in the 2 hole, unless by "above 330" you mean 370

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

I'm not sure Cedeno has enough value to trade him. If he makes a big deal possible, sure. I think he would have more value on the team than he would in a trade.

[Amazing_Grace]

If Theriot can keep his OBP above .330 the rest of the year as the full-time SS, I have no problem going into next year with him as the full-time SS (provided we find a decent backup). Speaking realistically, an OBP above .330 is pretty good out of the SS position. If you're not paying over 10M per year for the likes of Furcal, Tejada, Jeter, etc., this is not a bad situation to be in.

 

Theriot also seems to fit in well at the 2 hole. He's a disciplined enough hitter to take strikes when Soriano steals and move the runner along by hitting to RF. He also gets on base at a reasonable clip. As long as that continues, there's no reason to switch. He definitely has had his hot and cold streaks, and that's to be expected from an inexperienced player. However, his overall numbers are not bad for a SS. In fact, his OPS is only 3 points lower than the 12M per year Furcal. The Cubs can live with Theriot at SS if they improve at other positions offensively, notably CF and RF.

 

a 330 OBP does not fit well in the 2 hole, unless by "above 330" you mean 370

 

Well, ideally, you have a lineup with guys that hit .300, have a .400 OBP, and hit 40 HR a season, but even teams with unlimited resources (Yankees) don't have that. No, .330 is not ideal for a 2 hitter, but it's not horrible either. You have to make choices about where you can make the most improvement with the money that you actually have. There just aren't a lot of good SS in baseball. Theriot's OPS is 18th in MLB out of SS with at least 200 ABs. That's just average, but he's only making league minimum and likely will continue to do so a couple more years. It will cost a LOT to sign a better FA SS. Heck, to get Furcal and his 3 more points of OPS costs 10M more dollars. If we're going to spend that money, why not spend it on Cabrera and move him to right, setting up one of the best offensive outfields in baseball.

 

As far as Cedeno goes, he should be given plenty of attempts once we dump Izturis. We can let Theriot/Cedeno battle for the position for the rest of this season up through next ST. Cedeno has so little value in trade, I'd rather see the Cubs hang on to him.

[Rob]

No, .330 is not ideal for a 2 hitter, but it's not horrible either. You have to make choices about where you can make the most improvement with the money that you actually have.

 

It absolutely is horrible. It's a horribly inefficient use of available resources. Why on earth would we ever want to bat a man with a .330 OBP in the 2 hole? You move Theriot to 7th or 8th and move everybody else up one slot, and we'd be much better for it.

 

I think that would be the definitition of "most improvement with the money that you actually have." If memory serves, tangotiger's numbers implied a team could gain about 2 games in the standings with an optimized lineup. If we tacked that whole total on Theriot's shoulders, it'd be effectively turning him into JJ Hardy or Jimmy Rollins this season (based on Win Shares). Just for shedding preconceived notions about lineup construction... pretty good deal if you ask me.

[Mephistopheles]

Given the hitters' paradise that is the PCL, I am personally not buying into Ronny's numbers at Iowa. With that said, he surely can't be worse than Izzy production wise... Just my 2 cents..

 

For a Cubs' prospect the PCL really isn't all that great for hitters. It's good, no doubt, but not nearly in the Albuquerque level.

[jersey cubs fan]

No, .330 is not ideal for a 2 hitter, but it's not horrible either.

 

Yes it is horrible. 10 NL teams have an OBP above .330 from the 2 spot. Including the Cubs at .353. If they put up a .330 OBP in the 2 spot the offense would be worse than it is, and it's already not very good.