Barrett's Cub Days Could Be Numbered...

[Guest]

*cough* Alex Sanchez *cough*

[Careless]

How are either of Barrett or Jones an albatross??

 

Jones is still due 7.8M, including 5.6M next year. I can think of a lot better uses for 5.6M dollars player wise.

 

Barrett is a liability b/c of his defense and lack of production this season. He is a FA at seasons end and probably wont re-sign with us (thank God). We should cash in and get what we can for him now.

 

Kendall is not a long term solution. We just get by with him offensively, but he still has a better skill set defensively than Barrett. He also would likely bring us a Type B pick in next years draft when we would lose him to FA at seasons end. So in essence we lose Jones, Barrett, and a B prospect for Kendall, a Type B pick, and whatever we get for Barrett.

On top of all the other stuff, offering kendall arbitration would be one of the dumbest things Hendry ever did as GM.

[Chocolate Milk]

It's sunny...

 

Yep. The one who doesnt drink the Kool Aid. See also my CP fan club. CP was a bum then, he is a bum now.

 

Barrett needs to go somewhere where he can play first or be the DH, he is just too much of a defensive liability...almost Dunn-like. :lol:

 

If you weren't frothing at the mouth the get rid of Barrett you'd see that all your wacky trade proposals either make no sense, are totally improbable, or wouldn't improve the team.

 

Nah, your probably right. Jason Kendall is a stud and would totally improve the team. Also we can probably trade 27 year old minor leaguers for the Braves organization's top prospect. Thanks for setting us all straight.

[SouthSideRyan]

Neither Jason Kendall or Alex Sanchez have ever slept with Sunny's wife.

[Sarcastic]

It's sunny...

 

Yep. The one who doesnt drink the Kool Aid. See also my CP fan club. CP was a bum then, he is a bum now.

 

Patterson and Barrett are not comparable. Barrett has had actual sustained success (3 seasons) in the majors. Patterson had 1/2 a season before being injured. There is much more reason to think Barrett can have a decent season than there was to think Patterson was going to turn it around when he tanked last year.

[sunnydoo]

If you weren't frothing at the mouth the get rid of Barrett you'd see that all your wacky trade proposals either make no sense, are totally improbable, or wouldn't improve the team.

 

The loss of 1 WS may or may not kill us this year. Losing 5.6M next year when we have to re-sign Z, v 2.0 may for a long time kill us. Who knows what will happen with the new owners? Maybe they walk in and say 100M and thats it. You can then wave bye to Z, v 2.0 over Barrett, who by the way wont be back either.

 

Nah, your probably right. Jason Kendall is a stud and would totally improve the team. Also we can probably trade 27 year old minor leaguers for the Braves organization's top prospect. Thanks for setting us all straight.

 

For the record that was Hoffpauir (who just turned 27 and who is now up to 320/358/532), Howry, and either a prospect (other than Guzman/Marmol) or more pen help in Cotts or Cherry depending on what the Braves wanted/needed. But thanks for totally simplifying the argument and making it look ridiculous.

Edited June 19, 2007 by sunnydoo

[sunnydoo]

On top of all the other stuff, offering kendall arbitration would be one of the dumbest things Hendry ever did as GM.

 

Well they changed a bunch of stuff related to the draft. Good article here: http://www.baseballdigestdaily.com/bullpen/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=161&Itemid=39.

 

If you look towards the bottom,

Non-type A free agents also come out as winners. The penalty for signing type B and C free agents is lessened, meaning teams will most likely be more willing to sign free agents and pay them a higher salary. Plus, teams might be more disposed to re-signing their free agents if the compensation for losing them is less attractive.

 

So i dont think Kendall would want to explore any further contract and hit the market to see what he could get.

 

As a type B we would get a sandwich pick between rounds 3 and 4, so that is a little bit different too.

[Careless]

For the record that was Hoffpauir (who just turned 27 and who is now up to 320/358/532), Howry, and either a prospect (other than Guzman/Marmol) or more pen help in Cotts or Cherry depending on what the Braves wanted/needed. But thanks for totally simplifying the argument and making it ridiculous.

He's not the one who made it ridiculous.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

If you weren't frothing at the mouth the get rid of Barrett you'd see that all your wacky trade proposals either make no sense, are totally improbable, or wouldn't improve the team.

 

The loss of 1 WS may or may not kill us this year. Losing 5.6M next year when we have to re-sign Z, v 2.0 may for a long time kill us. Who knows what will happen with the new owners? Maybe they walk in and say 100M and thats it. You can then wave bye to Z, v 2.0 over Barrett, who by the way wont be back either.

 

Nah, your probably right. Jason Kendall is a stud and would totally improve the team. Also we can probably trade 27 year old minor leaguers for the Braves organization's top prospect. Thanks for setting us all straight.

 

For the record that was Hoffpauir (who just turned 27 and who is now up to 320/358/532), Howry, and either a prospect (other than Guzman/Marmol) or more pen help in Cotts or Cherry depending on what the Braves wanted/needed. But thanks for totally simplifying the argument and making it ridiculous.

 

Throwing in assorted mediocrity like middle relievers and minor league pitchers(NOT these good ones though) doesn't make it less ridiculous.

[Chocolate Milk]

But thanks for totally simplifying the argument and making it look ridiculous.

 

Oh, I didn't need to simplify anything to make it look ridiculous. You are doing a very good job of that yourself. You're right, though. I didn't include that you wanted to throw Cotts in the trade. I sold you short there. Things are looking very realistic now.

 

Keep going though. Everyone is wrong and you are the only one seeing things the way they are.

Edited June 19, 2007 by Chocolate Milk

[Rob]

On top of all the other stuff, offering kendall arbitration would be one of the dumbest things Hendry ever did as GM.

 

Well they changed a bunch of stuff related to the draft. Good article here: http://www.baseballdigestdaily.com/bullpen/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=161&Itemid=39.

 

If you look towards the bottom,

Non-type A free agents also come out as winners. The penalty for signing type B and C free agents is lessened, meaning teams will most likely be more willing to sign free agents and pay them a higher salary. Plus, teams might be more disposed to re-signing their free agents if the compensation for losing them is less attractive.

 

So i dont think Kendall would want to explore any further contract and hit the market to see what he could get.

 

As a type B we would get a sandwich pick between rounds 3 and 4, so that is a little bit different too.

 

I think the point is that he can accept the offer of arbitration. And if he does that, the lowest salary he can get is 10% less than his current one.

 

In essence, that means he'd have to decline an offer of 11.7 mil for one year in order for us to get a compensation pick... something not bloody likely. So, yeah, we wouldn't be offering him arbitration... so no comp pick.

[imb]

But thanks for totally simplifying the argument and making it look ridiculous.

 

Oh, I didn't need to simplify anything to make it look ridiculous. You are doing a very good job of that yourself. You're right, though. I didn't include that you wanted to throw Cotts in the trade. I sold you short there. Things are looking very realistic now.

 

Keep going though. Everyone is wrong and you are the only one seeing things the way they are.

 

QUIT DRINKING THE KOOL-AID, ARENT YOU FULL YET?

[Chocolate Milk]

But thanks for totally simplifying the argument and making it look ridiculous.

 

Oh, I didn't need to simplify anything to make it look ridiculous. You are doing a very good job of that yourself. You're right, though. I didn't include that you wanted to throw Cotts in the trade. I sold you short there. Things are looking very realistic now.

 

Keep going though. Everyone is wrong and you are the only one seeing things the way they are.

 

QUIT DRINKING THE KOOL-AID, ARENT YOU FULL YET?

 

Corey Patterson - Terrible

Jason Kendell - The Answer

 

I'm sure Kendall would turn down a one year deal for 11.7 million. Pretty big demand out there for catchers who swing a wiffleball bat. The shark move would be to test the market.

[sunnydoo]

He's not the one who made it ridiculous.

 

The biggest need area the Braves have is bullpen setup after Gonzales went down. We have a proven setup guy, so that is the Howry part.

 

The Braves 2nd biggest need area is 1b, where Thorman has been woeful this year. Hoffpauir wont make it with the Cubs, he is locked by position not only at 1b but in the OF. He has talent to be an average to maybe a slightly above avg. 1b. Not an All Star, not a world beater, but just an avg producer, which they arent even getting at 1b now. Since they are sending us one of the guys that may be in that mix depending if they put McCann or Salty at 1b, you want to send them something back, b/c they have nothing coming in the system for the foreseeable future in that area. It also would be nice for people to step outside of their contrived theories for a change and realize outliers sometimes exist. Just b/c a guy is 27 doesnt mean that he cant ever be productive in the major leagues or needs to be sent to outer Siberia. He isnt the focal piece of this deal.

 

The last part is up to the Braves. They dont need Pie, b/c they have a guy ready to go for CF next year when Andruw leaves. I dont think they would take Guzman b/c of his injury issues, but they might take Marmol, and that would be too much for Salty. they could have anyone else that they wanted. I would suggest Cotts or Cherry to them b/c they need pen help especially left handed b/c McBride is awful or to groom Cherry to one day take over for Wickman. But they could have any they wanted in the system except Pie, Guz, or Marmol.

 

Maybe they ask for a little more, maybe not...but its an opening offer, not a done deal. It allows them to compete for the rest of this year and addresses their need areas.

[imb]

Stick to your guns, Sunny, at least it's funny.

 

 

(Hoff is worse than Thorman, who probably just needs some time to figure out major league pitching. They could get someone like Howry or Cotts without giving up their best prospect and why would they want a B level pitching prospect from us, anyway? For fun? It makes no sense. Combined with the fact that you love to pretend like you're one of the few that is realistic, this is just non-stop comedy.)

 

Oh yeah, the Braves would just as soon make Salty a 1B than trade him for the Hoff and some potential bullpen help. Oh, and a B level prospect. The only reason they haven't yet is because they haven't had to. They're letting the situation play out a little before panicking.

 

PS

Kendall is terrible, what the hell is wrong with you? He's slightly better than Barrett with the glove, and he's basically Neifi with the bat. The mind, it boggles.

[Sarcastic]

Stick to your guns, Sunny, at least it's funny.

 

 

(Hoff is worse than Thorman, who probably just needs some time to figure out major league pitching. They could get someone like Howry or Cotts without giving up their best prospect and why would they want a B level pitching prospect from us, anyway? For fun? It makes no sense. Combined with the fact that you love to pretend like you're one of the few that is realistic, this is just non-stop comedy.)

 

Oh yeah, the Braves would just as soon make Salty a 1B than trade him for the Hoff and some potential bullpen help. Oh, and a B level prospect. The only reason they haven't yet is because they haven't had to. They're letting the situation play out a little before panicking.

 

PS

Kendall is terrible, what the hell is wrong with you? He's slightly better than Barrett with the glove, and he's basically Neifi with the bat. The mind, it boggles.

 

But you forgot to mention Cotts! Or Cherry! How could they resist a chance to put one of those guys in their pen?

[sunnydoo]

Well IMB! i disagree with you.

 

The Braves have no prospects to dangle to get Howry types. Blanco is the CF they are waiting on. Harris at 2b is 28 and has been awful in every trip to the majors (can you say AAAA). Escobar is taking over for Renteria when he leaves. Prado doesnt have + talent. Pena will be the backup for the Braves if they trade McCann or Salty.

 

http://web.minorleaguebaseball.com/milb/stats/stats.jsp?t=t_ibp&cid=431

 

Now they could go out and trade Renteria and give the job to Escobar, but that is taking quite a chance, especially with Chippers health being d to d, not to mention the difference in production. It also may end up like the Betemit trade last year. Where they could get these mystery relievers i would like to know, as would the GMs of Cleveland, Philly, NYY, Oakland, and LAA.

 

 

As for the recurring Kendall thing, think of it kind of like the deal we did with the Dodgers, having one of the teams take the financial hit one year vs. 2 years. Getting rid of Jones would be a good thing. Barrett would probably bring us a decent prospect, which we will lose when he leaves. Kendall could be a rental or we could arby depending on how the season goes. And its 1 WS currently between Barrett and Kendall.

 

Regardless of what happens with that, we have 5.6M more to spend next year on a contract extension for z, v 2.0 or to go into the FA market with.

[Guest]

Besides the words "exist" (as in "LOOGYs don't exist") and "albatross," it appears sunny also doesn't understand the concept of maximizing assets. Don't worry, Schuerholz does. He's not trading Saltalamacchia for a 27-year old AAA first baseman, a B-level pitching prospect and Neal Cotts or Bob Howry...mainly because, you know, he could get more for Saltalamacchia in other trades. Way more.

 

That's right, we're the ones drinking Cubby kool-aid.

[sunnydoo]

Besides the words "exist" (as in "LOOGYs don't exist") and "albatross," it appears sunny also doesn't understand the concept of maximizing assets. Don't worry, Schuerholz does. He's not trading Saltalamacchia for a 27-year old AAA first baseman, a B-level pitching prospect and Neal Cotts or Bob Howry...mainly because, you know, he could get more for Saltalamacchia in other trades. Way more.

 

That's right, we're the ones drinking Cubby kool-aid.

 

um, i gave you a link for albatross. you obviously have no idea on its meaning b/c it does mean what i used it for (the definition is A constant worrisome burden or an obstacle to success which fits Jones and Barrett- especially his lack of defense.) And Loogys dont exist.

 

and i said anyone in our system other than pie, guz, and marmol...epatt, veal, soto, anyone.

[Derwood]

I love this notion of "LOOGY's don't exist," when clearly many managers (including our own) utilize one. It's not like Will Ohman is the tooth fairy or the Easter Bunny.

[Pushfrog98]

maybe they are talking about the 1998 version of Jason Kendall... if that's the case, I'd make the trade!

[samhainn77]

I wouldnt settle for anything less than Hawpe, Holliday and Larry Walker in his prime. Think they might throw in Bichette, too?

 

i'd have to say no unless we also get a pre-cancer Big Cat

 

um, are we forgetting we need a catcher in return? Kirt Manwaring plz

 

Little late, but don't you think Jayhawk Owens has too much upside to pass on?

[daske17]

I love this notion of "LOOGY's don't exist," when clearly many managers (including our own) utilize one. It's not like Will Ohman is the tooth fairy or the Easter Bunny.

 

If that's true, then why does Ohman leave eggs in my front yard on Easter? :)

[Soriano12]

holy crap is someone seriously floating the idea of getting Kendell?

 

 

http://www.youthink.com/quiz_images/quiz1262outcome4.gif

[Rob]

holy crap is someone seriously floating the idea of getting Kendell?

 

 

http://www.youthink.com/quiz_images/quiz1262outcome4.gif

 

Not just getting Kendall as a replacement catcher after we use Barrett and something else to trade for a position we actually need help at... but actually trying to sell him as a straight upgrade over Barrett.

 

That's like trying to say the Phillies should trade Rollins + for Neifi since Neifi has hit .385/.429/.615 at Citizens Bank Park and he has a moderately better glove.