Biggio...first ballot HoFer?

[imb]

New question on HOF. I was reading in GQ this month about Sheffield. What about his HOF chances?

 

.297 BA, 472 HR, 2457 hits, 1544 RBI, 145 OPS+

 

Seems like one to me, although his jerky persona and some BALKO stuff is probably going to hurt him big time.

 

He really isnt tied up in the Balco stuff.

 

You mean, like, besides admitting to using a cream supplied by BALCO?

[sunnydoo]

You mean, like, besides admitting to using a cream supplied by BALCO?

 

You make it sound positively Machiavellian.

 

Here is the excerpt to which you are referring:

 

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2004/magazine/10/04/sheffield_bonds1011/index.html

 

 

Shef as i stated earlier is not a rocket scientist. He believed what he got to be something that would help his injury heal. He didnt ask the ? what it had in it which he probably should have. Accidents like this happen all the time for example look at what the Oklahoma football program admitted yesterday with amino acids. Its not like he went out and was actively looking for the stuff.

 

He also quit using it after his tendon had fully healed and his numbers didnt take off for the season. In fact if you look it up, he had one of his worst career years with only 25 HRs and 84 RBIs.

 

He has been a staunch advocate against Steroid use and one of the few guys that has testified in all the hearings, trials, and gone on the record for the public to see. Something that Sosa, McGwire, and certainly Bonds wont ever do.

 

He made a mistake. He admitted it. MLB didnt punish him for it. And he volunteered to take more tests if they wanted him too. What can you ask from him?

 

But whatever man.

[SouthSideRyan]

Sunny, you of all people on this board should know you can't tie HRs to steroid use after your boy got busted for it.

[Derwood]

Schoendienst is a name I'm unfamiliar with,

 

that's because he doesn't deserve to be in the Hall of Fame whatsoever. just like Maz. no hit, good glove, one famous play = HOF by vets committee...until it came to be Ron Santo's turn when lots of hit, lots of glove and a career of class suddenly wasn't good enough.

 

i love how many Cubs fans conveniently forget how many people hated Santo when he was a player. Many other players didn't like him. Personally, I think he' borderline for the Hall. Nice guy and all, but being a nice guy and leading a charity aren't high considerations for candidacy

[Rob]

You mean, like, besides admitting to using a cream supplied by BALCO?

 

You make it sound positively Machiavellian.

 

Here is the excerpt to which you are referring:

 

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2004/magazine/10/04/sheffield_bonds1011/index.html

 

 

Shef as i stated earlier is not a rocket scientist. He believed what he got to be something that would help his injury heal. He didnt ask the ? what it had in it which he probably should have. Accidents like this happen all the time for example look at what the Oklahoma football program admitted yesterday with amino acids. Its not like he went out and was actively looking for the stuff.

 

He also quit using it after his tendon had fully healed and his numbers didnt take off for the season. In fact if you look it up, he had one of his worst career years with only 25 HRs and 84 RBIs.

 

He has been a staunch advocate against Steroid use and one of the few guys that has testified in all the hearings, trials, and gone on the record for the public to see. Something that Sosa, McGwire, and certainly Bonds wont ever do.

 

He made a mistake. He admitted it. MLB didnt punish him for it. And he volunteered to take more tests if they wanted him too. What can you ask from him?

 

But whatever man.

 

Irregardless, he is tied to the BALCO stuff... which was the entire point, wasn't it?

[sunnydoo]

Sunny, you of all people on this board should know you can't tie HRs to steroid use after your boy got busted for it.

 

Ha ha, thats a pretty good one. :lol: It did help his Batting Avg. though. He didnt make it with the Marlins this year out of ST, was hoping he would, but despite that fact, probably had just as a productive season as CP, who is now hitting a robust .208/.264 in 192 ABs. (And Peter Angelos deserves every one of those ABs).

 

 

Irregardless, he is tied to the BALCO stuff... which was the entire point, wasn't it?

 

Depends on how you mean that.

 

Was he involved with Balco? Yes, as a bystander.

Was he an active participant in a steroid plot like Sosa, McGwire, or Bonds? No, he was a bystander.

 

I really think if Mitchell went to Shef sensibly and asked him for clubhouse details, he would provide them minus the names.

 

And irregardless is not a word. Its Boston-speak.

[Careless]

Sunny, you of all people on this board should know you can't tie HRs to steroid use after your boy got busted for it.

 

Ha ha, thats a pretty good one. :lol: It did help his Batting Avg. though. He didnt make it with the Marlins this year out of ST, was hoping he would, but despite that fact, probably had just as a productive season as CP, who is now hitting a robust .208/.264 in 192 ABs. (And Peter Angelos deserves every one of those ABs).

 

 

Irregardless, he is tied to the BALCO stuff... which was the entire point, wasn't it?

 

Depends on how you mean that.

 

Was he involved with Balco? Yes, as a bystander.

Was he an active participant in a steroid plot like Sosa, McGwire, or Bonds? No, he was a bystander.

 

I really think if Mitchell went to Shef sensibly and asked him for clubhouse details, he would provide them minus the names.

...

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

yep, you've crossed the line and shown that you're trolling. sorry, sunny, you made it too obvious

[Rob]

Sunny, you of all people on this board should know you can't tie HRs to steroid use after your boy got busted for it.

 

Ha ha, thats a pretty good one. :lol: It did help his Batting Avg. though. He didnt make it with the Marlins this year out of ST, was hoping he would, but despite that fact, probably had just as a productive season as CP, who is now hitting a robust .208/.264 in 192 ABs. (And Peter Angelos deserves every one of those ABs).

 

 

Irregardless, he is tied to the BALCO stuff... which was the entire point, wasn't it?

 

Depends on how you mean that.

 

Was he involved with Balco? Yes, as a bystander.

Was he an active participant in a steroid plot like Sosa, McGwire, or Bonds? No, he was a bystander.

 

I really think if Mitchell went to Shef sensibly and asked him for clubhouse details, he would provide them minus the names.

 

And irregardless is not a word. Its Boston-speak.

 

And with that, you show you haven't been paying attention at all.

 

Sosa has never been implicated in any steroid scandal, BALCO included... and McGwire has only been implicated by Jose Canseco. Besides, if you read Game of Shadows, you'd know that there's much more to Shef's situation than the crap in the SI article. There were actual drugging schedules for Sheffield found in the BALCO office.

 

Did you just take up the viewpoint cause you like arguing? Cause I can't think of any reason to be a Sheffield apologist and assume he had no idea what was going on, but to crucify Sosa and McGwire who have no evidence whatsoever against them. And their personalities can't be the deciding factor, cause Shef is a horse's ass. I really can't figure it out.

[sunnydoo]

And with that, you show you haven't been paying attention at all.

 

You must have missed C-Span the week of the Congressional Baseball Testimonies.

 

And no, i havent read Shadows. I disagree with the premise. Breaking the law to expose someone else breaking the law is distasteful to me. Those guys should have any profits they made from that book taken away and donated to a charity.

[sunnydoo]

yep, you've crossed the line and shown that you're trolling. sorry, sunny, you made it too obvious

 

I have no idea what you mean.

 

I like Sheff, i always have. I especially liked it when he was a Yankee. And i get sick of everyone else ragging on him b/c they think he is an easy target. Its akin to people poking a large circus animal with a stick to provoke a response. Shef isnt smart enough to get away from it and it gives him a bad black eye in the media.

 

Sorry if you think he is a bum, but i disagree.

[soccer10k]

he's 16 hits away. why to people keep saying 'if he makes it to 3000?'

 

What if he suffers a career ending injury? Until he gets there it will always be an if.

[sunnydoo]

AB/HR	ML	Sosa	 Mac	  Bonds	   Sheff
1987	36.34	xxxx	 11.37	xxxx	xxxx
1988	51.26	xxxx	 17.19	22.42	xxxx
1989	48.22	xxxx	 14.85	30.53	xxxx
1990	43.37	xxxx	 13.41	15.73	xxxx
1991	45.71	xxxx	 21.95	20.40	xxxx
1992	52.10	xxxx	 11.12	13.91	16.88
1993	39.62	18.12	 9.33	11.72	24.70
1994	35.95	17.04	15.00	10.57	11.93
1995	36.02	15.67	 8.13	15.33	13.31
1996	35.00	12.45	 8.13	12.31	12.36
1997	35.69	17.83	 9.31	13.30	21.14
1998	34.58	9.74	  7.27	14.92	19.86
1999	30.77	9.92	  8.02	10.44	16.15
2000	29.53	12.08	 7.38	9.80	11.65
2001	29.84	9.02	 10.31	6.52	14.31
2002	33.83	11.35	xxxx	 8.76	19.68
2003	32.65	12.93	xxxx	 8.67	 14.77
2004	31.14	13.66	xxxx	 8.29	 15.92
2005	34.16	27.14	xxxx	 8.40	 17.18
2006	31.28	xxxxx	xxxx	 14.12	 25.17
2007	37.02	21.8	xxxx	 12.15	 14.06
Mean    37.33   14.38	11.51 13.41 16.99
Variance	47.1  24.0  17.8	32.29	18.73
Adjusted	08.37 xxxxx xxxx	 xxxx	 7.79

 

 

Now tell me who is on drugs?

 

ABs from all 4 sluggers from 23 onward (went with 24 on sammy cuz he only hit 8 when he was 23). I also did not count 2007, b/c i know some of you dont like split seasons.

 

You may wonder about the adjusted under Sheff. That discounts the 93 season when he had a Shoulder injury and played through it (eventually leading to his move to the OF), 97 when he had hammy problems all year and played through it, and last season with the broken wrist. You can decide for yourself what you think. Both #s are there.

 

The adjusted total under the MLB column is for 1993 to present. Again, do with it what you want.

Edited June 15, 2007 by sunnydoo

[Rob]

And with that, you show you haven't been paying attention at all.

 

You must have missed C-Span the week of the Congressional Baseball Testimonies.

 

And no, i havent read Shadows. I disagree with the premise. Breaking the law to expose someone else breaking the law is distasteful to me. Those guys should have any profits they made from that book taken away and donated to a charity.

 

The government asking you to testify is not the same thing as being guilty. If memory serves, they asked a few others like Frank Thomas, who have never been connected. They were just wondering about the drug culture, not indicting them. To connect that with some sort of guilt is just irresponsible.

[soccer10k]

Now tell me who is on drugs?

 

All of the above?