Which '06 Rookies make the cut in '07?

[Knyption]

Hey guys.

 

Despite the cubs poor performance as a team, its good to see many young guys get a long look this year.

 

I have watched games where most of the young guys have played multiple times and was thinking about which should be given a good shot at full time play in '07

 

Murton: I think he has grown a lot as a big leager this year. He had bumps in the road, but his great approach at the plate cannot be ignored.

OBP, Contact is solid. Sure, he does not have a ton of power and average defense, but guys like him should bat 2nd imo.

 

He will prolly end up platoon role like this year, but I think he should be given the starting job outright. You can never have too many high obp guys right?

 

Cedeno: I do not think he will ever develop into an All Star Caliber IF. He reminds seems to be a mini Julio Lugo. Lugo is good, but a Mini Lugo does not really say much... Cedeno should be traded or turned into the Neifi / Macias role as the super backup. The cubs should look for a solid offensive 2b (i know walker is gone tho) with a lil speed and all.

 

Pagan: Pagan looks bad at the plate, he has speed and good moments, but I don't know if he should be given a full blown shot over Murton. Pagan would be a good pinch hitter / runner type and a good backup. I don't think he has the moxy of a starter. Surely he does not have the plate discipline.

 

Marshall: Marshall had some bad outings and some good ones, overall i think he would be a good spot starter / middle relief type of pitcher. Perhaps he should take Rusch role for next year.

 

Guzman: Guzman always had one bad inning, but even that said, I can see why he has been hyped up... When he is on, his stuff truely is filthy. Problem is can he be consistent?

 

Mateo: For some reason, if he can harness his control, I see Closer or Setup man for him in the future. Something about his bulldog face... i dunno

 

Hill: Hill has not really impressed at all, I have seen a couple of good hooks, but he may end up bieng one of those AAAA players.

 

Im sure there others like that one guy who pitched against houston, but i don't think they are really starter material.

 

what do you guys and gals think?

[Drew Doughty]

Murton -- has the potential to be a good -- or at least serviceable in a good lineup -- LF. Should be given the nod in LF if we get Soriano

 

Cedeno -- sucks, get Soriano and trade him for whatever you can get. Either that or make him super-util

 

Hill -- I like Hill. He needs to put it together though. 4th starter next year if we get a pitcher like Zito or Schimdt

 

Guzman -- I like Guzman. Could be 5th starter next year if he's healthy

 

Marmol -- Needs to get control. Needs some AAA-experience next year

 

Mateo -- Meh, mid-relief/swing man at best.

 

O'Malley -- Same as above. I think he compares to Koronka.

 

Pagan -- 4th OF at best. Power this year has been a fluke, IMO

 

Marshall -- I like him, but I think he needs some minor-league seasoning still.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Murton is a possible LF solution, whether that's full time or a platoon.

 

Cedeno should be a backup middle infielder now that we are guaranteeing Izturis SS.

 

Pagan is a good candidate for a backup OF spot, I wouldn't want to count on him to be part of a platoon.

 

Marshall, Marmol, Hill: IMO 2 of these 3 should be in the rotation, the other probably should be dealt. Hill especially should be dealt if he gets left off.

 

Guzman is insurance in the rotation, I've liked him for a bullpen role for some time.

 

Mateo goes to AAA.

 

O'Malley is hopefully never heard from again.

 

Theriot could be in the mix for a backup IF spot. Can't have him and Cedeno on the same team though.

[Derwood]

Pagan looks bad at the plate? What part of .300 with almost as many HR as Murton doesn't make sense to you?

[Sammy Sofa]

As many as possible.

 

The writing's on the wall with the money for the parking garage not being there. Don't expect any big signings short of re-upping with in-house studs...the belt's about to be a-tightened!

[CubColtPacer]

I agree with much that has been said here already. First, the pitching. I believe that the two lefties (Marshall and Hill) have the inside track on possible rotation spots, with Guzman a little behind. I think Marmol could really use some more seasoning-he has a lot of great potential and this is still early in his actual pitching career. I think he should start in the minors next year, and would come up when he has some more command than he showed for much of his time in Wrigley. O'Malley will be sent back to Triple A-the injury probably ruined his one chance he had with the luck of the way he was able to be brought up. Mateo should head back to the minors at the start of next year also-although he has the most ability to change that opinion with a great end to the year, because of the lack of evidence at the major league level for him either way.

 

For the hitters-we should improve at 2B (hopefully Soriano) and start Murton on a regular basis in LF. I don't mind playing Pagan against some of the tougher right handed hitters though-right now Murton is playing about 2 out of every 3 games, and I think he should be playing at least 5 out of every 6 nex t year in LF if we don't sign anybody else to play LF.

Pagan-4th OF, 5th if we do what we need to do and sign a platoon partner for Jacque-if we don't, we need to use him as that platoon partner sometimes, even though that would not be his best use or anywhere close to ideal.

Cedeno-backup at the SS and 2B positions, traded if we can get any decent value for him-Theriot would then become our backup at both positions, otherwise I can't see him having a place on the team-for the simple fact that the bench will probably be 5 players again, and that should be backup catcher/platoon partner/Pagan/Cedeno-Theriot/?. Both slots cannot be filled by Theriot and Cedeno-we need someone who can back up at the corner infield positions.

[Electron Blue]

Murton is a possible LF solution, whether that's full time or a platoon.

 

Cedeno should be a backup middle infielder now that we are guaranteeing Izturis SS.

 

Pagan is a good candidate for a backup OF spot, I wouldn't want to count on him to be part of a platoon.

 

Marshall, Marmol, Hill: IMO 2 of these 3 should be in the rotation, the other probably should be dealt. Hill especially should be dealt if he gets left off.

 

Guzman is insurance in the rotation, I've liked him for a bullpen role for some time.

 

Mateo goes to AAA.

 

O'Malley is hopefully never heard from again.

 

Theriot could be in the mix for a backup IF spot. Can't have him and Cedeno on the same team though.

 

not really a big deal, but why the strong wording here?

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Murton is a possible LF solution, whether that's full time or a platoon.

 

Cedeno should be a backup middle infielder now that we are guaranteeing Izturis SS.

 

Pagan is a good candidate for a backup OF spot, I wouldn't want to count on him to be part of a platoon.

 

Marshall, Marmol, Hill: IMO 2 of these 3 should be in the rotation, the other probably should be dealt. Hill especially should be dealt if he gets left off.

 

Guzman is insurance in the rotation, I've liked him for a bullpen role for some time.

 

Mateo goes to AAA.

 

O'Malley is hopefully never heard from again.

 

Theriot could be in the mix for a backup IF spot. Can't have him and Cedeno on the same team though.

 

not really a big deal, but why the strong wording here?

 

Not really intentional. O'Malley isn't good, and with as many options as we have at our disposal, we're in trouble if we're forced to give him any more time on the major league level.

[sweetpeteman]

I wonder how O'Malley would do as a loogy type player...

[Ding Dong Johnson]

Pagan looks bad at the plate? What part of .300 with almost as many HR as Murton doesn't make sense to you?

 

The part that's actually hitting 276 with an OBP barely over 300.

[Handlebar McSkullet]

Pagan looks bad at the plate? What part of .300 with almost as many HR as Murton doesn't make sense to you?

 

The part that's actually hitting 276 with an OBP barely over 300.

 

Funny.

 

I like murton to platoon with jones and be a fourth of.

 

Sadly we havent produced any howie kendricks, josh johnsons, or andre eithers to jump out and say "pencil him" in for next year.

 

My god Guzman has talent though.

[RichHillIsABeast]

Murton: Dude is raking since the ASB. If the power and XBH outburst continues, he should get the nod in LF next season. The biggest difference I've seen in the second half is his lack of hitting into DPs and more flyballs than groundouts. Murton's defense is above average for ML LF (only because some truly awful players patrol LF), but is by no means a GGer.

 

Cedeno: It's surprising to me that he isn't walking more like he did in the minors. Well, we have Clines and Baker whispering in his ear, so maybe it isn't so surprising. His D has been surprisingly overrated. Great range, but sloppy footwork at times and everchanging arm angle. His D isn't so great that he'll make up for Neifi-like offense. Maybe he'll turn it around before the end of the season.

 

Pagan: Did this guy bulk up in the offseason? Great job scouting by the Cubs organization. Is this power outburst a fluke? He went deep to straightaway CF today, so I don't know. He should definitely make the bench if only because of his speed and power in limited ABs.

 

Marshall: I'd like to see him in AAA next season. He's done a great job, but let's not forget that he was only supposed to be in the bigs until our horses got healthy, which never happened. Put him in AAA to get his body used to the innings and call him up next season if any of our starters goes down. He's got the stuff to win some games in the bigs right now, no doubt, but let's not ruin a good pitcher by putting too many innings on it with a notorious arm abuser like Baker calling the shots.

 

Guzman: Great outting today, but that's only one. I'd like to see more domination before penciling him into the starting rotation. Putting him in the pen is a waste. You don't stick a guy with 3 plus pitches in the rotation unless you don't have a choice. He may be trade bait.

 

Mateo: He needs another out pitch to remain a starter.

 

Hill: Dude is a stud. S T U D. Those minor league numbers will translate to the bigs. He just had to get over the hump mentally. He can be an innings eater for us next season, hopefully as a 4 or 5 starter. You don't trade a guy like Hill. Let him flop or flourish, but don't watch him dominate on another team. If he improves his change up or cutter, watch out. His ceiling has got to be at least a 2 starter.

 

 

Our farm system isn't great, but if even one of Hill, Marshall, or Guzman reaches his ceiling, we're going to have a great rotation for the playoffs, assuming Z sticks around.

[sweetpeteman]

Murton: Right now he is my left fielder. However, if a true power hitter is available, having him platoon with Jones is an option.

 

Cedeno: Back in AAA probably for the beginning, if he starts to return to the form of last year, then bring him up, other than that, he doesn't look to have much of a future except off the bench, which is a shame. I also believe that Clines and Baker probably have had a huge negative effect on Ronny, as he now seems to fear walking. Several times has he swung at pitches that are clearly going to be ball 4. Therefore, maybe if he gets back under Von Joshua or any hitting coach that empahsizes patience his swing can be salvaged, if not, I don't see him ever being a productive major leaguer, and won't be around for long, unless he pulls a Neifi.

 

Pagan: 4th outfielder right now. He can play all three positions, can bring good speed and defense in the late innings. Only 11 PH at bats, however, so hard to judge on that.

 

Marshall: Definitely my 4th/5th starter going into next year.

 

Guzman: Behind Marshall and Hill in the depth chart, but very close which will probably lead to him seeing some starts next year, but still needs time. Injuries are always a concern for him. I want him to start in AAA however, and continue to build arm strength/stamina.

 

Mateo: AAA for the beginning of the year, long relief possible. A move to the bullpen is more than likely due to depth.

 

Hill: He is starting to become the pitcher we all hoped he would be, however I am still not confident in him. I have him penciled in as the 5th starter, but is on the edge, with Guzman and Marmol ready to push him off. He will need a strong finish and a good spring training to hold on.

 

Marmol: Tied with Guzman, he can easily find himself back in the rotation with either Hill or Marshall struggling or injuries. Start him at AAA however, as I don't want him sitting in the bullpen.

 

Bynum: Gone. I hate this guy, he seems lazy and doesn't care about his game. He can go any be Baker's new toy where ever Dusty ends up.

 

O'Malley: AAA, maybe be brought up for a spot start. Not likely to be around much longer. Try him in the bullpen, might be a servicable loogy to some teams. Possibly trade high?

[A New Era]

I just want to really see Hill and Murton as starters next year. With Cedeno replaced with someone better. I like Marshall as well.

 

That is all.

[seattlecub]

murton: lf

 

cedeno: myh pref would be to keep him at ss, but with izturis here next year, he's best as trade bait.

 

hill: #5 starter. i think he has little trade value still, he's too old for anything but 25 man role or trade. and i think he'll be pretty good.

 

guzman: first one outta AAA

 

marmol: in AAA

 

marshall: trade, prolly w/ ronny. i don't have a problem with him, but i don't see him as special, and those are the guys to trade. plus he has, i think better value on market than hill. i think another team can be suckered for him.

[NorthsideAvenger]

Pagan looks bad at the plate? What part of .300 with almost as many HR as Murton doesn't make sense to you?

 

The part that's actually hitting 276 with an OBP barely over 300.

 

Funny.

 

I like murton to platoon with jones and be a fourth of.

 

Sadly we havent produced any howie kendricks, josh johnsons, or andre eithers to jump out and say "pencil him" in for next year.

 

My god Guzman has talent though.

 

Both Kendrick and Johnson had been coming on strong the last couple of yrs, neither were still counted on to be even decent contributors this yr. And Andre Either....before the season people---excluding the Dodgers----were saying WHO? None of those players scream ready to contribute as much as they have. So you can say....all three were pleasants surprises for their clubs.

 

I fully believe of all the youngsters that the Cubs have called up, Guzman is going to contribute the most, and take a big step forward in 2007.

[illiniguy]

Guzman is the nest great Cubs starter to ruin. I am sure Dusty is up to the task.

[soapy]

I'll prefes this by saying that this scenario assumes that Baker is not the Manager.

 

Start Murton in LF next year. Cedeno would be my choice at SS, but with Izturis there I basically choose between Cedeno and Theriot for a utility player next year. Theriot can play 3B, which might give him a slight advantage. I wouldn't be against keeping Pagan as a 4th or 5th OFer but I'd like to see him concentrate on playing CF in the offseason. I'm wondering if a bench like this might work out:

 

Catcher

Cedeno

Theriot

Restovich (platoon w/ Jones)

Pagan

LH Power Bat?

 

If nothing else, it's cheap :?

 

That is assuming that the Cubs would actually go with 11 pitchers next season instead of 12. If they have 12 pitchers, one of Cedeno or Theriot is left out. It's also banking a lot on finding a LH "power" bat for the bench who can also play 1B. I don't really have any ideas in that department off the top of my head (Conine? Klesko? Yuck on both). The other option of course is to bring Nevin back, but I'm assuming he can find more playing time elsewhere and I'm not willing to pay him what he'll likely be seeking.

[CubColtPacer]

Pagan: Did this guy bulk up in the offseason? Great job scouting by the Cubs organization. Is this power outburst a fluke? He went deep to straightaway CF today, so I don't know. He should definitely make the bench if only because of his speed and power in limited ABs.

 

It is certainly possible that Pagan has started to develop some power. Here are his numbers in the minors:

2000: 0 HR in 72 AB's

2001: 0 HR in 295 AB's

2002: 2 HR in 525 AB's

2003: 1 HR in 441 AB's

2004: 4 HR in 494 AB's

2005: 8 HR in 516 AB's

2006: 5 HR in 116 AB's

 

Before the year, I probably would have said that the 8 HR year was just a fluke..now he really appears to be developing some power with the jumps he has had in HR per at bat each of the last 3 years, especially since most if not all of his home runs as a Cub have not been cheap (at least 2-3 to straightaway center). I think he's a guy who would probably hit 15-20 in a full-time role, and might still be developing even more power. Murton is still the better player for now though, as he is farther along with his power than Pagan has shown with his OBP and is a year younger than Pagan (although with his limited AB's, Pagan's OBP numbers have bounced around wildly these last few weeks and might still the next few weeks).

[wastra]

Does ti seem to anyone else that Murton has actually tweaked his swing a bit? The first half, he seemed to be taking a huge upper-cut swing where he was almost coming out of his shoes. that caused him to come over the top o hte ball and hit those weak choopers too often.

 

When I watch him now, he keeps his back shoulder up, and takes a level, smoother cut. It looks like he's swinging easier, but the level controlled swing allows him to elevate the ball a bit more and make better contact.

 

I think that's leading to his resurgence.

[CubColtPacer]

Does ti seem to anyone else that Murton has actually tweaked his swing a bit? The first half, he seemed to be taking a huge upper-cut swing where he was almost coming out of his shoes. that caused him to come over the top o hte ball and hit those weak choopers too often.

 

When I watch him now, he keeps his back shoulder up, and takes a level, smoother cut. It looks like he's swinging easier, but the level controlled swing allows him to elevate the ball a bit more and make better contact.

 

I think that's leading to his resurgence.

 

I think his swing has changed a little bit too-that's why I'm glad they gave him the time off in June, where he was able to stop and figure out what he was doing wrong and correct it. It certainly has paid off for him since.

[Backtobanks]

The real question might be which rookies make the cut and for which teams. Hendry will have to make at least one trade for an impact bat over the winter and the package would probably include some of the pitchers (Marmol/Hill/Marshall/Mateo/Guzman) and possibly Cedeno. Of course, after the Cubs trade them they will all be 20 games winners and Cedeno will be the starting SS in the All-Star game.

[Soriano12]

Fearless Predicition

 

IF given the chance to start everday in LF in 07...

 

Murton will hit 320 with 20HR's and 85 RBI's.

[RynoRules]

Fearless Predicition

 

IF given the chance to start everday in LF in 07...

 

Murton will hit 320 with 20HR's and 85 RBI's.

 

 

:!:

[wastra]

Fearless Predicition

 

IF given the chance to start everday in LF in 07...

 

Murton will hit 320 with 20HR's and 85 RBI's.

 

The 20 homers is the one I would most question. I think he has the ability to be a batting-title type of hitter, but I think he looks more like a 10-15 homer type of guy with more doubles.