Cedeno Regressing

Irrelevant Dude · July 20, 2006

Recently Ronny Cedeno has looked completely lost, both at the plate and in the field. His performance has been really disappointing considering the promising start to the season. I'm torn on this one because I really think he needs to sit down for a few games, but that would mean more starts for Neifi. What does everyone think the Cubs should do at SS, both for this season and next?

Matt Murton on the other hand should be playing every day, but we can see how well that's going...

LuckyPup · July 20, 2006

I think the CUbs will deal Maddux to LA for Izturis-granted not the perfect move but, its a Cub move. Now if we could get them to include some other players cough*Drew*cough for Walker and Williamson with Maddux then maybe. I think the Cedeno experiment is losing steam right now, he really looked bad on the pitch out steal tonight, almost looked afraid-not good for a rookie to look scared to stay in and place a tag at 2nd-

CUBZ99 · July 20, 2006

There goes the couldn't be much worse than Niefi logic. Cedeno's numbers this year are below Neifi's career avg's. And most people on this board have argued that Neifi is one of the worst hitters ever.

I'm hoping that he finds his stroke again, and gets his overall game together.

badger1679666666 · July 20, 2006

There goes the couldn't be much worse than Niefi logic. Cedeno's numbers this year are below Neifi's career avg's. And most people on this board have argued that Neifi is one of the worst hitters ever.

I'm hoping that he finds his stroke again, and gets his overall game together.

Tell me again how many years Cedeno has played? Not even one you say?

And how many years has Neifi sucked complete balls? Enough to qualify as the worst hitter of all time?

Thanks.

Banedon · July 20, 2006

Recently Ronny Cedeno has looked completely lost, both at the plate and in the field. His performance has been really disappointing considering the promising start to the season. I'm torn on this one because I really think he needs to sit down for a few games, but that would mean more starts for Neifi. What does everyone think the Cubs should do at SS, both for this season and next?

Matt Murton on the other hand should be playing every day, but we can see how well that's going...

I'm not saying that you posted it or anything, but I really seem to recall a "Matt Murton is regressing" thread, or something similar. Might just need to the let the guy fight his way out of it, ya know? What's to lose this season? No reason to sit him at all IMO.

rocket · July 20, 2006

Considering his minor league numbers, this might be the real Ronnie Cedeno.

vance_the_cubs_fan · July 20, 2006

There's no doubt that Cedeno is in a slump. And considering his OBP is so closely tied to his BA and that he doesn't have much power, he has to hit for a good clip to be useful at the plate.

He's still young enough to work through this.

I'm not sure he's the answer at short or not, but since we're not contending this year, there's nothing wrong with letting him try to work through it.

Dirt Dog Sparly · July 20, 2006

I have really enjoyed my time here at NSBB. As soon as my paperwork for this year becomes official I am going premium to help support all the great work Tim and company have done for us.

That said I am so happy that NSBB wasnt around when a kid named Sandberg and another named Sosa played for the Cubs at the start of thier time here.

Sandberg was lost at the plate and field and Sosa, well lets just say that he took intersting routes to the ball sometimes. Not to mention that he might have single handedly contributed to the wind blowing out at least five miles an hour faster when he swung at the third stike 100+ times a year.

Give Cedeno a break, he has played since winterball and is probably a bit tired. He should get a second wind to finish out the year and lets see how he does.

On second thought lets throw in a new hitting coach pretty soon...

texascub · July 20, 2006

I think that Cedeno is bringing alot of this on himself right now. He started out pretty good and then went into a slump, and now I think he's just pressuring himself too much to get back out of it. He started out more patient but his strike zone seems to expand with each passing game. The thing I like though is that he still shows passion every game unlike alot of other players when they're struggling.

CUBZ99 · July 20, 2006

There goes the couldn't be much worse than Niefi logic. Cedeno's numbers this year are below Neifi's career avg's. And most people on this board have argued that Neifi is one of the worst hitters ever.

I'm hoping that he finds his stroke again, and gets his overall game together.

Tell me again how many years Cedeno has played? Not even one you say?

And how many years has Neifi sucked complete balls? Enough to qualify as the worst hitter of all time?

Thanks.

Did you care to dispute anything in the post or just take another shot at Neifi? Sure the year is not over yet, but Cedeno is sucking worse than an average year by Neifi. A feat that many have said could never happen.

There is no way that Hendry can go into next year with a $95+ payroll and Neifi and Neifi-light at SS.

CUBZ99 · July 20, 2006

I have really enjoyed my time here at NSBB. As soon as my paperwork for this year becomes official I am going premium to help support all the great work Tim and company have done for us.

That said I am so happy that NSBB wasnt around when a kid named Sandberg and another named Sosa played for the Cubs at the start of thier time here.

Sandberg was lost at the plate and field and Sosa, well lets just say that he took intersting routes to the ball sometimes. Not to mention that he might have single handedly contributed to the wind blowing out at least five miles an hour faster when he swung at the third stike 100+ times a year.

Give Cedeno a break, he has played since winterball and is probably a bit tired. He should get a second wind to finish out the year and lets see how he does.

On second thought lets throw in a new hitting coach pretty soon...

Niefi-light was never projected to be a Sandberg/Sosa type player. I agree the Cubs should let him try to work his way out of it, but if he doesn't improve drastically over the last few months of the season, Hendry has got to acquire a real SS for next season.

jjgman21 · July 20, 2006

I know Cedeno will never become, but this is all kind of funny after just pouring over Sosa's stats to comment in other threads.

not Sosa, and probably not likely either, but would you give up on this player?

age 22, games 105, .233/.298/.384/.681, Errors 26

barryfoote · July 20, 2006

I have really enjoyed my time here at NSBB. As soon as my paperwork for this year becomes official I am going premium to help support all the great work Tim and company have done for us.

That said I am so happy that NSBB wasnt around when a kid named Sandberg and another named Sosa played for the Cubs at the start of thier time here.

Sandberg was lost at the plate and field and Sosa, well lets just say that he took intersting routes to the ball sometimes. Not to mention that he might have single handedly contributed to the wind blowing out at least five miles an hour faster when he swung at the third stike 100+ times a year.

Give Cedeno a break, he has played since winterball and is probably a bit tired. He should get a second wind to finish out the year and lets see how he does.

On second thought lets throw in a new hitting coach pretty soon...

Niefi-light was never projected to be a Sandberg/Sosa type player. I agree the Cubs should let him try to work his way out of it, but if he doesn't improve drastically over the last few months of the season, Hendry has got to acquire a real SS for next season.

I dont recall that Sandberg himself was projected to be a Sandberg type player at first. My bigger concern is that this coaching staff is unable to develop young players. Theriot starts and can't even be left in for the whole game tonight? We aren't going anywhere so play the kids. Wins and losses are meaningless now, player development is.

Outshined_One · July 20, 2006

Here's the bottom line, to me.

This season is lost. This team isn't making a playoff run and it's been a really disappointing and agonizing year for most Cub fans. However, there is a shining light in the form of the young guys in this organization who could be good players for this team for years to come. Granted, the current coaching staff is absolutely abysmal when it comes to teaching these guys, but I'm guessing they'll all be out the door by August 15th.

Who cares if Cedeno, Murton, and Theriot struggle? What's the point of playing guys like Nevin and Neifi when it's clear this season is lost? The only reason I can see for Baker playing those veterans is to make some feeble attempt at getting the team back to .500 at the end of the year, thereby saving his job and giving him a fat contract extension that goes straight to the IRS.

Let them play through their struggles is what I'm suggesting. Throw them into the fire and evaluate them at the end of the season. If they struggle, boohoo, no big deal, let them work through it. If they don't fit into the Cubs' plans in 2007, then they can trade them for somebody who could help in 2007.

vance_the_cubs_fan · July 20, 2006

Here's the bottom line, to me.

This season is lost. This team isn't making a playoff run and it's been a really disappointing and agonizing year for most Cub fans. However, there is a shining light in the form of the young guys in this organization who could be good players for this team for years to come. Granted, the current coaching staff is absolutely abysmal when it comes to teaching these guys, but I'm guessing they'll all be out the door by August 15th.

Who cares if Cedeno, Murton, and Theriot struggle? What's the point of playing guys like Nevin and Neifi when it's clear this season is lost? The only reason I can see for Baker playing those veterans is to make some feeble attempt at getting the team back to .500 at the end of the year, thereby saving his job and giving him a fat contract extension that goes straight to the IRS.

Let them play through their struggles is what I'm suggesting. Throw them into the fire and evaluate them at the end of the season. If they struggle, boohoo, no big deal, let them work through it. If they don't fit into the Cubs' plans in 2007, then they can trade them for somebody who could help in 2007.

I agree with you. I have some doubts about Cedeno and to a lesser extent Murton. Since this is a lost season, we have nothing to lose in continuing to throw them out there and see what happens.

soapy · July 20, 2006

Cedeno's offensive number where never outstanding in the minors either, save for maybe one year. I don't expect a great deal from him offensively and I wouldn't be completely shocked if he just turns out to be a poor offensive performer at the MLB level.

Having said that, I'd echo what most people have said above. a) Cedeno has played half a season, let him try to adjust; and b) The season is lost anyway, you can afford to be patient with him.

The same should/could be applied to Murton, IMO.

TheDude · July 20, 2006

I don't think Cedeno looks lost at plate, just frustrated . Last night against Roger future-hall-of-famer-living-baseball-legend Clemens he put a lot good swings on the ball. Lots of fouled off pitches. His trouble with Clemens was the shoulder high fastball, but Clemens has half the league swinging at that pitch.

The trouble he is having is count related. I find Cedeno in more 0-2 counts than any other Cub hitter. But, pitchers are throwing strikes to him as well. If he doesn't swing at those first two pitches, odds are pretty high the count is still 0-2, maybe 1-1, because pitchers are challenging him in and around the strike zone.

Everytime I watched Cedeno take a close borderline pitch the last two weeks (usually the first pitch on the inside or outside corner), it was called a strike. If he swings at it because it's a strike, he will get criticized for not being patient. If he takes it, he's down in the count and in trouble already.

He might have it in his head right now that the strike zone is big, and that all corners and corners+ pitches are strikes, so when he gets 0-2 or 1-2, he feels he has to swing.

The season is lost. Let the kid try to work it out.

goonys evil twin · July 20, 2006

That said I am so happy that NSBB wasnt around when a kid named Sandberg and another named Sosa played for the Cubs at the start of thier time here..

People have been giving up on young players long before NSBB, or the internet was around.

Soul · July 20, 2006

Doesn't sound like most people are giving up on Ronny...

bleedcubbieblue · July 20, 2006

There is no way that Hendry can go into next year with a $95+ payroll and Neifi and Neifi-light at SS.

I certianly hope you are right, but right now, somehow I think he will pull this feat off without any kind of problem. I don't think he has a clue.

BCB

RynoRules · July 20, 2006

He might be regressing, but might as well let him play this year and find out if he is capable of getting better. If not, perhaps we can trade him while he still has some value. He does look a lot like Royce Clayton to me.

Chocolate Milk · July 20, 2006

I don't think Cedeno looks lost at plate, just frustrated . Last night against Roger future-hall-of-famer-living-baseball-legend Clemens he put a lot good swings on the ball. Lots of fouled off pitches. His trouble with Clemens was the shoulder high fastball, but Clemens has half the league swinging at that pitch.

The trouble he is having is count related. I find Cedeno in more 0-2 counts than any other Cub hitter. But, pitchers are throwing strikes to him as well. If he doesn't swing at those first two pitches, odds are pretty high the count is still 0-2, maybe 1-1, because pitchers are challenging him in and around the strike zone.

Everytime I watched Cedeno take a close borderline pitch the last two weeks (usually the first pitch on the inside or outside corner), it was called a strike. If he swings at it because it's a strike, he will get criticized for not being patient. If he takes it, he's down in the count and in trouble already.

He might have it in his head right now that the strike zone is big, and that all corners and corners+ pitches are strikes, so when he gets 0-2 or 1-2, he feels he has to swing.

The season is lost. Let the kid try to work it out.

I agree with most of this. He looks really frustrated out there.

goonys evil twin · July 20, 2006

There is no way that Hendry can go into next year with a $95+ payroll and Neifi and Neifi-light at SS.

I certianly hope you are right, but right now, somehow I think he will pull this feat off without any kind of problem. I don't think he has a clue.

BCB

There's no reason why he can't have a $95+ million payroll with Cedeno at SS next year, if he spends the rest of the money on good players. You can deal with an unproductive player or two in the lineup, you just have to pay them the minimum and spend wisely on your regulars.