Do we have any position players worth a darn?

[Hacking Out Machine]

I don't know if anyone else feels this way, but I cannot for the life of me find a position player in this system who has any potential to be an impact player in the majors. Perhaps I'm being short sighted? Over at least the past two drafts, and maybe more, we have been drafting players with no ability to get on base, and certainly no power. I looked at the college stats of a lot of the guys the Cubs have drafted over the past two years, and even in college, all they did was hit singles. Why does this regime feel that things like athleticism, hustle, character and overall red-ass-ness should take precedent over an ability to actually hit?

 

This organization is littered with guys who slug .275-.375. I seriously can't find anyone worth getting excited about.

 

Pie is tanking, and in my opinion has always been less than a complete prospect due to his on-base issues. He's also been caught stealing more than he has been suceesful, so even his speed is raw. Right now, he's a poor man's Corey Patterson (circa 2005). With the current staff's track record, let's just say assuming he would improve is a stretch.

 

Ryan Harvey is helpless in high A ball. He had a sub .300 OBP in the Midwest League. But he's athletic!! Good thing we passed on Maholm, Danks, Ian Stewart, Milledge, Brian Anderson, Quentin, Conor Jackson, Chad Cordero, Chad Billingsley, Daric Barton, David Murphy and Saltalamacchia(not to mention Murton and Aardsma) to take this kid.

 

Seriously, are there any position players in the system worth getting excited about? Fuld and Fox are doing ok in Daytona, but they are old for that league. I won't even bring up Dopirak, MontanezMaybe I'm being too harsh, but this organization's bass-ackward approach to offense has rendered it's system devoid of any impact players. If anyone needs organizational soldiers who slug .275, make outs at a record pace, but really really have a desire to win, I guess we've got the market cornered on those guys. If we don't draft them, we trade once marketable major leaguers for them (Spears, Lewis) Viva Hendry!!

[Transmogrified Tiger]

EPatt

[Guest]

Jake Fox!

[Handlebar McSkullet]

Good thing we passed on Maholm, Danks, Ian Stewart, Milledge, Brian Anderson, Quentin, Conor Jackson, Chad Cordero, Chad Billingsley, Daric Barton, David Murphy and Saltalamacchia(not to mention Murton and Aardsma) to take this kid. !

 

That makes me vomit!

[texascub]

Dopirak was excellent in spring training with the big club, but he broke a bone in his foot/ankle in the first game of the year I believe. He's back playing now but Ron has said that he's still not able to generate any power off of it.

 

Scott Moore has also showed a good bat at 3B, but his defense is still quite shaky. Ryan Theriot, Micah Hoffpauir, and Mike Fontenot have all had nice seasons at AAA but they're also all 26. Soto was up at the end of Barrett's suspension but never got an AB but he's looking good too.

[CaliforniaRaisin]

Jake Fox!

 

EPatt

 

...Scott Moore...

 

And don't forget about Mark Reed.

 

(Though I think Moore has some major holes in his game of concern.)

[CaliforniaRaisin]

Good thing we passed on Maholm, Danks, Ian Stewart, Milledge, Brian Anderson, Quentin, Conor Jackson, Chad Cordero, Chad Billingsley, Daric Barton, David Murphy and Saltalamacchia(not to mention Murton and Aardsma) to take this kid. !

 

And how many teams passed on Albert Pujols how many times?

 

The MLB draft, moreso than any other draft, is extremely difficult to get right.

 

Yes, I've been disappointed in the Cubs player development, especially at the offensive end. But Harvey was the consensus choice amongst scouts and others at the time of the pick.

[Outshined_One]

There are a number of interesting guys, but none of them are currently A-level due to injuries, lack of professional experience, and so on.

 

The landscape could look quite different in a year or two. We'll see how some guys pan out.

[mg420]

yeah, lets give up on pie at the ripe old age of 21 because he's struggling in his first year in aaa. that would be sound baseball logic.

[CaliforniaRaisin]

yeah, lets give up on pie at the ripe old age of 21 because he's struggling in his first year in aaa. that would be sound baseball logic.

 

And he only had 2 months worth of AA experience.

[Hacking Out Machine]

yeah, lets give up on pie at the ripe old age of 21 because he's struggling in his first year in aaa. that would be sound baseball logic.

 

Combine his current major weaknesses with the philosophy of this organization, and you have a young kid with the odds stacked against him. The organization doesn't exactly have a good track record of encouraging plate discipline. If you don't think it's "sound logic" to come up with that assertion, then I guess we'll disagree.

[Hacking Out Machine]

Good thing we passed on Maholm, Danks, Ian Stewart, Milledge, Brian Anderson, Quentin, Conor Jackson, Chad Cordero, Chad Billingsley, Daric Barton, David Murphy and Saltalamacchia(not to mention Murton and Aardsma) to take this kid. !

 

And how many teams passed on Albert Pujols how many times?

 

The MLB draft, moreso than any other draft, is extremely difficult to get right.

 

Yes, I've been disappointed in the Cubs player development, especially at the offensive end. But Harvey was the consensus choice amongst scouts and others at the time of the pick.

 

Not a good excuse, in my opinion. If the draft is a crapshoot, the Cubs are definitely coming up with much more than their share of misses, and I think it has everything to do with their overvaluing of athleticism and raw tools.

 

Just because a kid can hit a ball 450 feet in battting practice and throw a ball on a line from right field doesn't mean he's worthy of the 5th or 6th pick in the draft, especially when he's coming off major surgery and had a tendency to get fooled on bad pitches in high school.

[CaliforniaRaisin]

Not a good excuse, in my opinion. If the draft is a crapshoot, the Cubs are definitely coming up with much more than their share of misses, and I think it has everything to do with their overvaluing of athleticism and raw tools.

 

I agree that the Cubs overvalue athleticisim and raw tools.

 

Just because a kid can hit a ball 450 feet in battting practice and throw a ball on a line from right field doesn't mean he's worthy of the 5th or 6th pick in the draft, especially when he's coming off major surgery and had a tendency to get fooled on bad pitches in high school.

 

Well, the Cubs weren't the only team to consider Harvey a top-5 pick.

[Monco]

E Patt , Jake Fox,Felix Pie. Patt and Pie strikeout too much though. I always thought Pie would be a leadoff type. But they keep talking about his power potential. His average is down and his k's are up.Could they be messing with him ?

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Pie career prior to this year K'ed in 20% of his PA's. This year so far it's just under 22%, not a huge difference. He was never supposed to be a leadoff hitter.

[TXCubsFan]

Good thing we passed on Maholm, Danks, Ian Stewart, Milledge, Brian Anderson, Quentin, Conor Jackson, Chad Cordero, Chad Billingsley, Daric Barton, David Murphy and Saltalamacchia(not to mention Murton and Aardsma) to take this kid. !

 

And how many teams passed on Albert Pujols how many times?

 

The MLB draft, moreso than any other draft, is extremely difficult to get right.

 

Yes, I've been disappointed in the Cubs player development, especially at the offensive end. But Harvey was the consensus choice amongst scouts and others at the time of the pick.

 

Hear, hear! He still might be converted to a pitcher.

[TXCubsFan]

E Patt , Jake Fox,Felix Pie. Patt and Pie strikeout too much though. I always thought Pie would be a leadoff type. But they keep talking about his power potential. His average is down and his k's are up.Could they be messing with him ?

 

They appear to be teaching him the value of clogging the bases wtih walks. Better late than never, I suppose. :roll:

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

I'm still holding out hope for Scott Moore.

[CaliforniaRaisin]

Good thing we passed on Maholm, Danks, Ian Stewart, Milledge, Brian Anderson, Quentin, Conor Jackson, Chad Cordero, Chad Billingsley, Daric Barton, David Murphy and Saltalamacchia(not to mention Murton and Aardsma) to take this kid. !

 

And how many teams passed on Albert Pujols how many times?

 

The MLB draft, moreso than any other draft, is extremely difficult to get right.

 

Yes, I've been disappointed in the Cubs player development, especially at the offensive end. But Harvey was the consensus choice amongst scouts and others at the time of the pick.

 

Hear, hear! He still might be converted to a pitcher.

 

May!? It's going to happen.

 

I have him getting converted before the 08 season, Outshined says it will happen before next season.

[Monco]

E Patt , Jake Fox,Felix Pie. Patt and Pie strikeout too much though. I always thought Pie would be a leadoff type. But they keep talking about his power potential. His average is down and his k's are up.Could they be messing with him ?

 

They appear to be teaching him the value of clogging the bases wtih walks. Better late than never, I suppose. :roll:

 

.251 ave

.316 OBP

28 BB

319 AB

 

They're not teaching him that well.

[Hacking Out Machine]

Good thing we passed on Maholm, Danks, Ian Stewart, Milledge, Brian Anderson, Quentin, Conor Jackson, Chad Cordero, Chad Billingsley, Daric Barton, David Murphy and Saltalamacchia(not to mention Murton and Aardsma) to take this kid. !

 

And how many teams passed on Albert Pujols how many times?

 

The MLB draft, moreso than any other draft, is extremely difficult to get right.

 

Yes, I've been disappointed in the Cubs player development, especially at the offensive end. But Harvey was the consensus choice amongst scouts and others at the time of the pick.

 

Hear, hear! He still might be converted to a pitcher.

 

May!? It's going to happen.

 

I have him getting converted before the 08 season, Outshined says it will happen before next season.

 

Not a bad idea. He certainly can't hit, and he's got a rocket arm. If they do in fact do this, kudos to the Cubs for realizing it isn't working and trying something else.

[CubsWin]

E Patt , Jake Fox,Felix Pie. Patt and Pie strikeout too much though. I always thought Pie would be a leadoff type. But they keep talking about his power potential. His average is down and his k's are up.Could they be messing with him ?

His walks are up too.

 

Maybe they are messing with him.

[sporrer17]

My favorite position prospects:

 

Patterson-Speed and decent power for 2b.

Fox- great bat for C

Reed - great bat for whatever position, good average, developing power.

Pie - speed, great D, good hitting potential.

Moore - power, speed, decent OBP

 

Honorable Mention:

-Miguel Negron has been great since being picked up from the Blue Jays system.

-Yusuf Carter has been getting on track for Peoria lately, and even with the low batting average (.245) he's taking a good amount of walks (11 in <100 ABs) and hitting HRs (6 in <100 ABs). He's got good speed (3 SB, 0 CS) and he's capable of playing catcher, although that seems to have been eliminated as I don't think he's seen any time there this year.

 

My sleeper pick for positional player:

Alfred Joseph. He's small but he's got good speed and the power he lacked last year is showing up this year. He just turned 20, so he's still fairly young. I don't know why, but I like him.

[goonys evil twin]

The answer to the question is no, there aren't any position players that are worth a darn. Combine the players' own weaknesses with the inept development team and you can make a ton of money betting against any of these guys doing anything good for the Cubs.

 

 

There's a couple of guys who could make nice bench players, but the Cubs will just their option clocks start early, then never let them play because they are too young for such a role. And maybe 1 or 2 of these guys will actually develop into decent major leaguers, but it won't be for the Cubs.

 

 

For an administration that focused so heavily on overhauling the minor league system, the Cubs have done, and continue to do a horrible job of getting any value whatsoever out of hitting prospects.

[Hacking Out Machine]

The answer to the question is no, there aren't any position players that are worth a darn. Combine the players' own weaknesses with the inept development team and you can make a ton of money betting against any of these guys doing anything good for the Cubs.

 

 

There's a couple of guys who could make nice bench players, but the Cubs will just their option clocks start early, then never let them play because they are too young for such a role. And maybe 1 or 2 of these guys will actually develop into decent major leaguers, but it won't be for the Cubs.

 

 

For an administration that focused so heavily on overhauling the minor league system, the Cubs have done, and continue to do a horrible job of getting any value whatsoever out of hitting prospects.

 

This is pretty much the conclusion I had come to when I asked the question. With the way that they've drafted lately and they guys they are acquiring, it doesn't look like it's going to change anytime soon, either. Like I said in my original post, they have a multitude of guys who can fill the role of hard working organizational soldier, but nothing else.