So...

[moorecg]

Ronny's D will be fine. Who is saying he is an offensive stud?

 

Browse the game threads.

 

My only contention is that he is far from "crap" which is what Meat, I think unfairly, labeled him. From what I've seen of him defensively I think he'll be pretty good....Heck, Jim Edmonds has 3 errors so far this year...I don't think he'll have 50.

[MeatampPotatoesMan]

Ronny's D will be fine. Who is saying he is an offensive stud?

 

Browse the game threads.

 

My only contention is that he is far from "crap" which is what Meat, I think unfairly, labeled him. From what I've seen of him defensively I think he'll be pretty good....Heck, Jim Edmonds has 3 errors so far this year...I don't think he'll have 50.

 

Ronny easily could have had 2 more errors, but the official scorer was merciful. Even the routine throws to 1B, Lee ends up stretching for or picking out of the dirt. What's really worrying is that his throws tend to be into the runner, increasing the risk of a collision between Lee and the runner. Not cool.

 

Is Cedeno better than a 48 error SS? Of course. He gets to a lot of balls, at least knocking them down (saved us a run last game). Solid range. But if he's going to throw like crap, that opens the door for Neifi. I don't know anybody that wants that to happen. Thank God Ronny picked it up offensively after a poor beginning, or we might be seeing Neifi a lot more at SS.

[soccer10k]

It doesn't bother you that his BA = OBP? It should.

It would bother me more if his lack BB was a sign that he was swinging at bad pitches and getting himself out. He's swinging at a lot of pitches (T/S ratio of 0.62) but he's also swinging at pitches he can hit. He's making contact about 87% of the time, slightly better than Aramis but slightly worse than Lee.

 

How many pitches is he seeing per PA? I don't remember many ABs where he was even close to drawing a walk, but that's just my perception.

 

It's nice that he's making decent contact, but if he's not drawing walks (limited AB so far), he's not getting on base at a decent enough clip. He isn't going to hit .350 over the course of a full season.

2.95, vs. the team average of 3.85. As I said, he is swinging at a lot of pitches, but the good news is they're pitches he can hit.

 

As long as he isn't swinging at bad pitches (a la Corey Patterson) I think the walks will come. If pitchers are throwing it where you like it, why let the pitch go?

[CubsWin]

If Dusty is trying to help him develop as a younger player, it was odd for Pagan to hit in front of him

Pagan is a switch hitter and batting him in front of Murton broke up a string of right-handed hitters (against righty pitchers). That's all it was.

[snoodmonger]

Is there any reason to think his defensive struggles are anything more than an aberration? He's always been labeled, to my knowledge, a good-great glove with a mediocre stick. Last year, there were hopes his hitting caught up with his defense.

 

It seems to me, if you're willing to be "realistic" about his bat and how it will likely regress to the norm, you should also be willing to do so with his glove. Otherwise, you might be accused of being overly negative.

[Shilzzz]

..when he starts becoming a big enough pain that they actually scout him and encorporate that into their game plan.

 

you realize you've been saying crap like this all through the spring and the season thusfar, right?

 

why not just quit being so stubborn and admit that you just might be wrong? i realize that's difficult for you to do, but it's something to take into consideration.

 

Meat is also the guy who thinks Ronny is "crappy" so take it with a grain of salt/pessimism. :D

 

(Not to hijack the thread...but Ronny's still hitting .351)

 

When have I ever slammed Murton? I've said he deserves the starting job in LF. I was upset about the possibility of Grissom possibly taking away his playing time. He earned that spot last season in limited AB. So far he's proved that the Cubs org. did make the right decision. Somehow not dubbing him a "stud" based on limited AB makes me an idiot.

 

Ronny has been a train wreck defensively. He's on pace for 48+ errors. I do appreciate his range, but his throws leave something to be desired. It doesn't bother you that his BA = OBP? It should.

 

isn't todd walker's ba = to his obp right now too?

[TB_11]

Ronny has been a train wreck defensively. He's on pace for 48+ errors. I do appreciate his range, but his throws leave something to be desired.

 

Just as we shouldn't project Ronny's hot start with the bat to continue through September, we shouldn't expect his cold throwing start to be representative either.

[Guest]

isn't todd walker's ba = to his obp right now too?

No, he's taken a couple of walks.

[MeatampPotatoesMan]

Ronny has been a train wreck defensively. He's on pace for 48+ errors. I do appreciate his range, but his throws leave something to be desired.

 

Just as we shouldn't project Ronny's hot start with the bat to continue through September, we shouldn't expect his cold throwing start to be representative either.

 

I don't expect him to end up with 48+ errors, but that's how bad he is playing defensively. He was a lot better today. His throws were pretty much right on the money to Lee. Dude's got a cannon. Love the arm strength, but the accuracy needs a little work (a fixable problem).

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

So far his defense has reminded me a lot of Shawon Dunston.

[cjbucks]

So far his defense has reminded me a lot of Shawon Dunston.

 

I was thinking the same thing. Dunston had a cannon and every so often he would just laser one into the 1st base box seats. :)

[Fred Hornkohl]

isn't todd walker's ba = to his obp right now too?

No, he's taken a couple of walks.

 

04/03 - 04/16      AB    R    H   2B   3B   HR   TB  RBI   BB   SO     BA    OBP    SLG    OPS
Walker             30    8   13    2    1    1   20    6    2    2  0.433  0.469  0.667  1.135

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

isn't todd walker's ba = to his obp right now too?

No, he's taken a couple of walks.

 

04/03 - 04/16      AB    R    H   2B   3B   HR   TB  RBI   BB   SO     BA    OBP    SLG    OPS
Walker             30    8   13    2    1    1   20    6    2    2  0.433  0.469  0.667  1.135

 

And when you're batting 433, I don't think anyone should complain if your OBP and AVG are the same.

[brinoch]

Ronny's also batting eighth, and that has an effect of what kind of pitches he sees. There have been a couple at-bats where Ronny got a little aggressive, but it hasn't been like Pierre or Neifi when they clearly won't accept a walk.

[Fred Hornkohl]

isn't todd walker's ba = to his obp right now too?

No, he's taken a couple of walks.

 

04/03 - 04/16      AB    R    H   2B   3B   HR   TB  RBI   BB   SO     BA    OBP    SLG    OPS
Walker             30    8   13    2    1    1   20    6    2    2  0.433  0.469  0.667  1.135

 

And when you're batting 433, I don't think anyone should complain if your OBP and AVG are the same.

 

Vance, some folks would complain if you hung 'em with a new rope. Know what I mean ??

[srbin84]

It's not as if Billy Beane doesn't carry guys on the roster that aren't OBP guys...T-Long.

[Guest]

There have been a couple at-bats where Ronny got a little aggressive, but it hasn't been like Pierre or Neifi when they clearly won't accept a walk.

You'll go no argument from me on Neifi, but Pierre has been far more patient than Cedeno. (Juan has taken twice as many pitches as Ronny, with a 1.38 T/S ratio vs. Ronny's 0.62.)

[ltb]

..when he starts becoming a big enough pain that they actually scout him and encorporate that into their game plan.

 

you realize you've been saying crap like this all through the spring and the season thusfar, right?

 

why not just quit being so stubborn and admit that you just might be wrong? i realize that's difficult for you to do, but it's something to take into consideration.

 

attack the post, not the poster. :lol:

 

Anyway...the limited number of AB against ML competition makes me leary of his hot start - that's just basic statistics. You really expect him to put up those numbers in a full season? I don't. I expect decent numbers, but not great. I will be stunned if he ends up with a .900+ OPS.

 

how is this attacking you? your argument is crap, and i'm pointing that out. the comment about you being stubborn isn't an attack - it's just pointing out what you're doing.

[Shilzzz]

isn't todd walker's ba = to his obp right now too?

No, he's taken a couple of walks.

 

04/03 - 04/16      AB    R    H   2B   3B   HR   TB  RBI   BB   SO     BA    OBP    SLG    OPS
Walker             30    8   13    2    1    1   20    6    2    2  0.433  0.469  0.667  1.135

 

And when you're batting 433, I don't think anyone should complain if your OBP and AVG are the same.

 

Vance, some folks would complain if you hung 'em with a new rope. Know what I mean ??

 

my bad, i thought i saw something with this stat during the game today.

[Bull]

Ronny's also batting eighth, and that has an effect of what kind of pitches he sees. There have been a couple at-bats where Ronny got a little aggressive, but it hasn't been like Pierre or Neifi when they clearly won't accept a walk.

 

Shouldn't that have an opposite effect? Hitting in front of the pitcher, wouldn't they occasionally unintentionally/intentionally walk the guy?

[badgercub]

Ronny's also batting eighth, and that has an effect of what kind of pitches he sees. There have been a couple at-bats where Ronny got a little aggressive, but it hasn't been like Pierre or Neifi when they clearly won't accept a walk.

 

Shouldn't that have an opposite effect? Hitting in front of the pitcher, wouldn't they occasionally unintentionally/intentionally walk the guy?

 

But with guys on base in front of you, which Murton has been on base quite a bit lately. Your approach at the plate will change, you will be more aggresive and try to knock the run in with the pitcher coming up to bat.

[Nobody youd want to know]

Ronny's also batting eighth, and that has an effect of what kind of pitches he sees. There have been a couple at-bats where Ronny got a little aggressive, but it hasn't been like Pierre or Neifi when they clearly won't accept a walk.

 

Shouldn't that have an opposite effect? Hitting in front of the pitcher, wouldn't they occasionally unintentionally/intentionally walk the guy?

 

But with guys on base in front of you, which Murton has been on base quite a bit lately. Your approach at the plate will change, you will be more aggresive and try to knock the run in with the pitcher coming up to bat.

 

That would make sense, but in actuality Ronny's hitting MUCH better with the bases empty--409/409/636, 22ABs--than with runners on base: 263/263/368, 19ABs.

[UBlink]

But with guys on base in front of you, which Murton has been on base quite a bit lately. Your approach at the plate will change, you will be more aggresive and try to knock the run in with the pitcher coming up to bat.

 

That would make sense, but in actuality Ronny's hitting MUCH better with the bases empty--409/409/636, 22ABs--than with runners on base: 263/263/368, 19ABs.

 

That could be the point - being more aggressive probably doesn't make anyone, especially a virtual rookie, a better hitter. With time, and listening to the right people, Ronny may learn that.

[TheDude]

Why does usty get ridiculed for the "book" comment? It's a generally held conception all around baseball, in all organzations.

 

When teams don't know you that well, they play defense straight up and use a non-specific pitching approach geared toward any hitter. When they pick up a player's patterns and tendencies, then they adjust.

 

Why is this worth mocking?

[Chocolate Milk]

Why does usty get ridiculed for the "book" comment? It's a generally held conception all around baseball, in all organzations.

 

When teams don't know you that well, they play defense straight up and use a non-specific pitching approach geared toward any hitter. When they pick up a player's patterns and tendencies, then they adjust.

 

Why is this worth mocking?

 

I think people didn't like it because it thought to be trivializing the accomplishments of a young player and was used as justification for platooning him with inferior players. At least as far as I can remember. I don't remember exactly when he said it but I'm pretty sure he was playing only against lefties at the time the comment was made.