Prior on an "accelerated" schedule

[srbin84]

I don't see other pitchers in the league having these kinds of problems.

 

Yeah, you never see pitchers hurt a muscle in their shoulder. Ever. It's nigh impossible for a pitcher to strain a shoulder muscle. I mean, how could that even happen?

 

Name me other pitchers that have been on the DL 4 or 5 times for strains and the like in 4 years.

 

Prior's not on that list.

 

1. http://espn.go.com/mlb/news/2002/0902/1426202.html

 

2. http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=1783863

 

3. http://cbs.sportsline.com/mlb/story/7502140

 

4. http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2012934

 

5. http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/wire?section=mlb&id=2388000

 

He only missed one start in No. 3 though.

[goonys evil twin]

Why can't the guy just learn to pitch with a compression fracture for pete's sake????

 

Cause he's a freaking coddled momma's boy who probably doesn't even have input on 80% of his household expenses.

[David]

Prior was out in 2003 after collision with Marcus Giles...not a strain.

 

Prior was out in 2004 due to an inflamed achilles tendon.

 

Prior was out in 2005 because of a ball lined off his elbow causing a compression fracture...not a strain.

 

He's now out with a shoulder strain, though that's apparently gone.

 

2 freak injuries, 2 "strains". Why can't the guy just learn to pitch with a compression fracture for pete's sake????

 

Oh, but wait.. he did...

 

Doesn't matter, though. He's "soft." :roll:

[srbin84]

Prior was out in 2003 after collision with Marcus Giles...not a strain.

 

Prior was out in 2004 due to an inflamed achilles tendon.

 

Prior was out in 2005 because of a ball lined off his elbow causing a compression fracture...not a strain.

 

He's now out with a shoulder strain, though that's apparently gone.

 

2 freak injuries, 2 "strains". Why can't the guy just learn to pitch with a compression fracture for pete's sake????

 

Oh, but wait.. he did...

 

Doesn't matter, though. He's "soft." :roll:

 

I gave you both the 5 examples you claimed didn't exist. I'm not saying he's definitely soft. He's either soft or has a very weak body. Either way, it's pretty much the same thing.

Edited April 6, 2006 by srbin84

[A New Era]

Prior was out in 2003 after collision with Marcus Giles...not a strain.

 

Prior was out in 2004 due to an inflamed achilles tendon.

 

Prior was out in 2005 because of a ball lined off his elbow causing a compression fracture...not a strain.

 

He's now out with a shoulder strain, though that's apparently gone.

 

2 freak injuries, 2 "strains". Why can't the guy just learn to pitch with a compression fracture for pete's sake????

 

What about in the beggining of 2005? Didn't Mark and Kerry start out on the DL last year too? If so what was the problem in Spring Training 2005 for Mark Prior?

[srbin84]

 

What about in the beggining of 2005? Didn't Mark and Kerry start out on the DL last year too? If so what was the problem in Spring Training 2005 for Mark Prior?

 

I linked the 5 injuries above that don't include the Giles collision or the ball to the elbow, which were both freak injuries he had no control over.

[A New Era]

 

What about in the beggining of 2005? Didn't Mark and Kerry start out on the DL last year too? If so what was the problem in Spring Training 2005 for Mark Prior?

 

I linked the 5 injuries above that don't include the Giles collision or the ball to the elbow, which were both freak injuries he had no control over.

 

I know, I saw them (but you didn't have them labeled). I was kind of asking that to hint why he is leaving out certain "strains" or "injuries" to make his arguement look better. Or if he just forgot that Prior started last year on the DL too.

[Jon]

This was from before the MRI:

Cubs.com[/url]"]Asked if the soreness was normal, Rothschild said no.

 

"I would say it seems like it's a little more than that," he said. "If [it were normal], we'd go a day and see how it is tomorrow. We won't know until he gets checked out."

That was the quote that worried me originally. If the soreness wasn't normal, would anyone here not have been outraged if they didn't get it checked out?

 

From after the MRI:

Cubs.com[/url]"]"He had no complaints until he came off the field the other day, and the complaints were significant enough," O'Neal said. "He was telling us he was definitely in pain making some of his throws, and that's when we decided to progress the way we did. I can't answer why it started the other day, and it hadn't prior."

Again, would anyone here not have been outraged if they didn't get it checked out?

 

Lo and behold, the tests showed that the injury was something that required Prior to be shut down.

[Banedon]

 

What about in the beggining of 2005? Didn't Mark and Kerry start out on the DL last year too? If so what was the problem in Spring Training 2005 for Mark Prior?

 

I linked the 5 injuries above that don't include the Giles collision or the ball to the elbow, which were both freak injuries he had no control over.

 

I know, I saw them (but you didn't have them labeled). I was kind of asking that to hint why he is leaving out certain "strains" or "injuries" to make his arguement look better. Or if he just forgot that Prior started last year on the DL too.

 

Mine was from memory. I had forgotten both the hamstring from his rookie season and the injury from the start of last season. There was no intent to leave out info.

 

The hamstring is one that I'm inclined to not include though, because he was a prized rookie that had some pain toward the end of a lost season. No reason to keep him out there and risk something further. Some of these you have to pin on the Cubs rather than Mark. Mark may have been willing to pitch through some things that the Cubs didn't want him to, and we have no way to know which ones are which.

[srbin84]

 

What about in the beggining of 2005? Didn't Mark and Kerry start out on the DL last year too? If so what was the problem in Spring Training 2005 for Mark Prior?

 

I linked the 5 injuries above that don't include the Giles collision or the ball to the elbow, which were both freak injuries he had no control over.

 

I know, I saw them (but you didn't have them labeled). I was kind of asking that to hint why he is leaving out certain "strains" or "injuries" to make his arguement look better. Or if he just forgot that Prior started last year on the DL too.

 

Yeah, I don't know. It's not a question of anybody not wanting Prior to do well. We all want that. But when you imply he isn't normal and is soft or weak bodied, no matter what evidence you provide, it's like trying to argue with someone who thinks the world is flat.

[A New Era]

I would be upset if he wasn't checked out. I'm more complaining about the fact that Prior seems to have these "minor" troubles the last couple of years and it always leaves us without him early and depending on pitchers like Rusch and Williams. .

[Banedon]

 

What about in the beggining of 2005? Didn't Mark and Kerry start out on the DL last year too? If so what was the problem in Spring Training 2005 for Mark Prior?

 

I linked the 5 injuries above that don't include the Giles collision or the ball to the elbow, which were both freak injuries he had no control over.

 

I know, I saw them (but you didn't have them labeled). I was kind of asking that to hint why he is leaving out certain "strains" or "injuries" to make his arguement look better. Or if he just forgot that Prior started last year on the DL too.

 

Yeah, I don't know. It's not a question of anybody not wanting Prior to do well. We all want that. But when you imply he isn't normal and is soft or weak bodied, no matter what evidence you provide, it's like trying to argue with someone who thinks the world is flat.

 

You're arguing something that can't be proven or disproven, so I'm not sure what you're expecting. "Mark Prior is soft" isn't a fact that has a hard and fast "true/false" answer. It's an opinion.

 

The world is not flat, and that was something that could be proven.

[Jon]

This is likely in response to how he felt after he was shut down. Rothschild was quoted as saying that he didn't lose any arm strength and was surprisingly responding really well to throwing probably a little too much. I'm not sure about why they're calling it that, but he was pretty close to throwing off the mound, anyways. Hopefully they don't push it too much, though they may be feeling that taking it too slowly before was the wrong approach.

 

I would rather have Prior sit out a couple extra weeks to guarantee his health than have him get rushed back and get injured again. I just hope this "acceleration" doesn't lead to a setback.

I would think that they're still being cautious, though the article doesn't imply that. We'll see.

[srbin84]

 

What about in the beggining of 2005? Didn't Mark and Kerry start out on the DL last year too? If so what was the problem in Spring Training 2005 for Mark Prior?

 

I linked the 5 injuries above that don't include the Giles collision or the ball to the elbow, which were both freak injuries he had no control over.

 

I know, I saw them (but you didn't have them labeled). I was kind of asking that to hint why he is leaving out certain "strains" or "injuries" to make his arguement look better. Or if he just forgot that Prior started last year on the DL too.

 

Yeah, I don't know. It's not a question of anybody not wanting Prior to do well. We all want that. But when you imply he isn't normal and is soft or weak bodied, no matter what evidence you provide, it's like trying to argue with someone who thinks the world is flat.

 

You're arguing something that can't be proven or disproven, so I'm not sure what you're expecting. "Mark Prior is soft" isn't a fact that has a hard and fast "true/false" answer. It's an opinion.

 

The world is not flat, and that was something that could be proven.

 

Well, I offered the alternative conclusion that he is weak bodied. The proof is that you cannot find one pitcher who has pitched during Prior's career that has had 5 similar injuries to the ones I linked.

[Banedon]

Well, I offered the alternative conclusion that he is weak bodied. The proof is that you cannot find one pitcher who has pitched during Prior's career that has had 5 similar injuries to the ones I linked.

 

Well I haven't even tried yet! :P

 

I'm at work at while I'm willing to have this site open, scouring the web for pitching injuries isn't exactly how I should probably be spending my time.

 

But what would that really prove anyway? Is it possible that it's just plain old bad luck? What about a mechanical problem?

 

Until you eliminate every other possiblity, nothing is proven. It's opinion.

[Omar]

"The faster he returns... the faster he can go back on the DL... and the faster he'll return!"

[bc2k]

 

What about in the beggining of 2005? Didn't Mark and Kerry start out on the DL last year too? If so what was the problem in Spring Training 2005 for Mark Prior?

 

I linked the 5 injuries above that don't include the Giles collision or the ball to the elbow, which were both freak injuries he had no control over.

 

I think the Giles collision is also an indication of Prior's frail, injury-prone body based on the frequency he's been hurt from simply pitching. If the Giles collision and liner off his elbow were Prior's only two injuries, I would not cite his body as frail, but with the knowledge of his other body breakdowns, it's hard not to.

 

Like the movie Unbreakable, Prior is more Elijah Prince than David Dunn.

 

That said, he's still our best pitcher and Hendry shouldn't even consider trading him while under our control.

[noisesquared]

 

What about in the beggining of 2005? Didn't Mark and Kerry start out on the DL last year too? If so what was the problem in Spring Training 2005 for Mark Prior?

 

I linked the 5 injuries above that don't include the Giles collision or the ball to the elbow, which were both freak injuries he had no control over.

 

I think the Giles collision is also an indication of Prior's frail, injury-prone body based on the frequency he's been hurt from simply pitching. If the Giles collision and liner off his elbow were Prior's only two injuries, I would not cite his body as frail, but with the knowledge of his other body breakdowns, it's hard not to.

 

Like the movie Unbreakable, Prior is more Elijah Prince than David Dunn.

 

That said, he's still our best pitcher and Hendry shouldn't even consider trading him while under our control.

 

I see it as the inverse - the Giles collision and the broken elbow actually show how 'tough' he is. When I saw the Giles collision, I assumed he broke his collarbone and would be done for the year. Same thing with the liner off the elbow, I thought it was a season ending injury. In both cases, he was able to come back faster than most expected, and I don't recall anyone calling him soft after returning from those injuries. I wonder if trying to pitch too soon after these incidents caused mechanicial problems that led to some of the other problems.

[SouthSideRyan]

Prior's arm could fall off and people would rip on him for not sewing it back on and pitching the next day. It's nobody's business but Prior's and his doctor's to tell whether he's truly injured or not.

 

How anyone can call him soft after taking that line drive off his elbow and not being done for the year just blows my mind.

[A New Era]

Prior's arm could fall off and people would rip on him for not sewing it back on and pitching the next day. It's nobody's business but Prior's and his doctor's to tell whether he's truly injured or not.

 

How anyone can call him soft after taking that line drive off his elbow and not being done for the year just blows my mind.

 

Sure, throw in the ball to his elbow when we're trying to complain about Prior!! :lol:

[XZero771679666304]

Prior's arm could fall off and people would rip on him for not sewing it back on and pitching the next day. It's nobody's business but Prior's and his doctor's to tell whether he's truly injured or not.

 

How anyone can call him soft after taking that line drive off his elbow and not being done for the year just blows my mind.

 

There is a distinction that is not being made here. The ability to sustain and heal injuries quickly and the ability to endure and manage pain are two very different things. I have never, nor would I question the former in Prior's case. What I am questioning is Prior's constitution, not his physical endurance.

 

I just find it odd that he reacted in a sudden and alrming way to what amounted to one total non injury and one very minor one. After Prior cut his seesion short last month, no one said "this is minor pain" or "we think is just a strain". There was a very serious air. I am no professional athlete, but I know the difference between a strain, sprain or irritation and something serious like a tear when I get hurt, and I have been hurt a fair bit.

 

I don't know if some people, including myself, are reacting this way to Prior's injuries because he really can't manage his pain, or because the cloak and dagger way the Cubs deal with injuries always has us primed for something far worse.

 

Regardless, it is getting old.

[Jon]

Prior's arm could fall off and people would rip on him for not sewing it back on and pitching the next day. It's nobody's business but Prior's and his doctor's to tell whether he's truly injured or not.

 

How anyone can call him soft after taking that line drive off his elbow and not being done for the year just blows my mind.

 

There is a distinction that is not being made here. The ability to sustain and heal injuries quickly and the ability to endure and manage pain are two very different things. I have never, nor would I question the former in Prior's case. What I am questioning is Prior's constitution, not his physical endurance.

 

I just find it odd that he reacted in a sudden and alrming way to what amounted to one total non injury and one very minor one. After Prior cut his seesion short last month, no one said "this is minor pain" or "we think is just a strain". There was a very serious air. I am no professional athlete, but I know the difference between a strain, sprain or irritation and something serious like a tear when I get hurt, and I have been hurt a fair bit.

 

I don't know if some people, including myself, are reacting this way to Prior's injuries because he really can't manage his pain, or because the cloak and dagger way the Cubs deal with injuries always has us primed for something far worse.

 

Regardless, it is getting old.

Of course not. That's what the tests are for. They correctly recognized it was not normal soreness and took the proper precautions. The tests confirmed that it was not normal. It turned out to absolutely be the right thing to do. How can he be criticized for doing the right thing?

 

Pitching through pain is almost always a pretty bad idea. Don't forget what trying to pitch through such an injury could do. If they didn't shut him down, he'd be putting his rotator cuff in danger and at the very least would almost certainly be behind where he is now.

[badger1679666666]

Mark Prior is scheduled to throw off the mound on Friday for the first time since March 12. Two days after that March session, Prior felt pain in the back of his right shoulder and had to be shut down. He was diagnosed with a moderate strain in one of his rotator cuff muscles. Rothschild wanted to wait and see how Prior responds after the session before announcing the next step.

 

 

Cubs.com

[srbin84]

Of course not. That's what the tests are for. They correctly recognized it was not normal soreness and took the proper precautions. The tests confirmed that it was not normal. It turned out to absolutely be the right thing to do. How can he be criticized for doing the right thing?

 

Pitching through pain is almost always a pretty bad idea. Don't forget what trying to pitch through such an injury could do. If they didn't shut him down, he'd be putting his rotator cuff in danger and at the very least would almost certainly be behind where he is now.

 

Well, I think it has been made pretty clear that Prior misses more time to minor injuries than any other pitcher in the league. Until someone can present a pitcher who has had 5 injuries like Prior had, I conclude it to be true because I have a pretty good memory of every player and MLB season I've watched and I can't think of any. So whether it is right for the Cubs to shut him down each time he gets one of these injuries or he could have just played through some of them and never had any problems, there is a problem. He doesn't pitch enough.

[XZero771679666304]

Prior's arm could fall off and people would rip on him for not sewing it back on and pitching the next day. It's nobody's business but Prior's and his doctor's to tell whether he's truly injured or not.

 

How anyone can call him soft after taking that line drive off his elbow and not being done for the year just blows my mind.

 

There is a distinction that is not being made here. The ability to sustain and heal injuries quickly and the ability to endure and manage pain are two very different things. I have never, nor would I question the former in Prior's case. What I am questioning is Prior's constitution, not his physical endurance.

 

I just find it odd that he reacted in a sudden and alrming way to what amounted to one total non injury and one very minor one. After Prior cut his seesion short last month, no one said "this is minor pain" or "we think is just a strain". There was a very serious air. I am no professional athlete, but I know the difference between a strain, sprain or irritation and something serious like a tear when I get hurt, and I have been hurt a fair bit.

 

I don't know if some people, including myself, are reacting this way to Prior's injuries because he really can't manage his pain, or because the cloak and dagger way the Cubs deal with injuries always has us primed for something far worse.

 

Regardless, it is getting old.

Of course not. That's what the tests are for. They correctly recognized it was not normal soreness and took the proper precautions. The tests confirmed that it was not normal. It turned out to absolutely be the right thing to do. How can he be criticized for doing the right thing?

 

Pitching through pain is almost always a pretty bad idea. Don't forget what trying to pitch through such an injury could do. If they didn't shut him down, he'd be putting his rotator cuff in danger and at the very least would almost certainly be behind where he is now.

 

I have no problem with him being checked out, none whatsoever. I have no problem with him being shut down for 10 days. But as someone with a fair bit of experience with these types of injuries, I know you have some idea of what the problem is before you go to the doctor.

 

What I am sick of is the fact that we are never given an indication of the severity. Even immediately after an injury, most athletes can tell between "not normal, but probably minor" and "not normal, and possibly serious". That early differentiation is absolutely not unreasonable to expect.