Keener98

Hey Z, lets have a Sept-Oct like you June-July ok?

No he doesnt OK, then tell me what is his problem he looks terrible. A rest may give hiom some mental relief as well as physical. He has the highest pitch count on the team. he looked terrible at the beginning of the season too and i doubt it was because he needed a rest. he's just a terribly inconsistent pitcher. Bingo

Marshall has only broke 100 innings once in his career (last year when he threw 147 1/3 innings combined). He clearly wore down last year after he had reached innings pitched that his arm had never experienced before. This year, he's already at 128 innings with a month to go. If he starts all of September, he would already be at 160 innings going into the playoffs plus all the extra he would throw there, which would be complete uncharted territory for him and possibly cause more injuries. If they are looking at this as demotion for him because he is supposedly not pitching well, then I'm not happy. If it's an attempt to try to limit his innings because of his injury history, I think it's a good move. While I understand what you are saying, and agree this better not be a demotion, if we make the playoffs Marshall is very unlikely to get more than probably 10 innings Id guess. He might pitch out of the bullpen as a long man(which you really hope we wont need) and other than that I dont see him pitching. There is noway he'd start in the playoffs.

For even more Maroth fun, we can do some selective endpointing and just look at his line as a Cardinal. That's a 7.70 FIP and 13.36 RA. Reyes hasn't been good this year, but he's also been somewhat unlucky by component measures. This move, coupled with Mulder getting a start without ever facing a single ML hitter, is beyond me. Good thing the Cardinals are going to a six-man rotation of mostly terrible pitchers as the rosters are expanding. *throws chair* Yea, Reyes numbers arent good, but Maroth has been pathetic. I really dont understand how any Stl fans can be behind this move.

I know he has slipped back a little in the last week+, but does anyone know how many at bats he has gotten against lefties in the last 10 days. It seems like he has gotten several starts and at bats against lefties in that time period. I dont know but looking back through the game log, he has only had 1 day off that wasnt a team day off since Aug 1. I wonder if hes a little gassed right now. I really hope Lou will play Monroe in CF against lefties from here on out.

For all this talk of needing to rest Marshall, you people do realize he hasnt even pitched 100 innings in the Majors this year, right? We are talking about resting a guy who has only allowed more than 3 earned runs in 2 of his last 10 starts, in place of a guy who has allowed more than 3 runs in 4 of his last 10 starts, granted they were in the 1st 4 games of the 10 game stretch. I just dont see where starting Trachsel in place of Marshall makes any sense at all. All the numbers point at Marshall being better than Trachsel this year, so why do it?

No he doesnt

I dont think bringing it back after him forgetting to bring his bat this weekend is such a good idea. His numbers the last 10 days have basically fallen back to below average. Lets hope its just a bump, but it probably hasnt helped facing lefties. We really need Monroe to start hitting lefties and let him start in CF and Murton in RF against all lefties. And the catch was nice, but for the love of God, would he and Soriano freaking talk for once! They are going to kill each other.

Isnt stud a word for a horse? And dont they give HGH to horses? Hmmmmmmm

Umm if you read the 1st post it says Mulder is starting vs Pitt this week lol. I know hes had at least 2 maybe more rehab outings as well. 6.79 ERA 1.83 WHIP 5.63 ERA 1.34 WHIP Guess which stat line is Reyes, and which is Maroth?

We basically are going to a 6 man rotation. However, while rest is good, I prefer that out best pitchers pitch as often as possible these last 30 days so we can make the playoffs.

Yeah, to the best of my knowledge, that's been the only knock on Wuertz all along; his command. I dont think he trusts his fastball enough. I understand his slider is his "out" pitch, but he gets way to slider happy. Its usually not a strike so I think alot of smarter hitters go up there basically with no intention to swing knowing that the slider wont be a strike.

When a guy has a .372 OBP.... well.... he ain't strugglin' much !! Yea Murtons obp over his entire Major and Minor league career, goes against him struggling deep in counts.

Ouch Wuertz really needs to work on that bb/9 stat. If he could get that under control, hed be just as nasty as Marmol.

Why are you citing what is essentially a meaningless stat? It has no predictive value and only tells you how lucky the hitter has been in the past. Meaningless to you, not to me. I like guys who hit well with men on base. Murton's BA with RISP has been much worse than his BA for his entire MLB career. That siad, I support Matt to play in front of Floyd. I like his hot bat now. It's meaningless because all it tells you is that that player has happened to have runners on base when he's gotten his hits. On top of that, rarely do you ever have enough of a sample size with RISP stats to conclude anything meaningful. When the guy has a drop of more the 200 OPS points with RISP, this is certainly worth taking a closer look at, rather than the ostrich approach you seem to advocate. One possible answer, especially in the case of a guy like Murton, is to move him up to the #2 slot, where there will be less pressure on him to drive in runs. People here have been advocating Murton for the 2 slot for over 2 years now, and for some reason, our managers just wont put him there and let him play for an extended amount of time. I really wonder if its because he isnt a "bunter" which we all know, alot of old school managers like in the 2 spot. However, Lous put Jones and Floyd there this year so that goes against that as well.

Hey you have to be careful going deep into the county, it could be dangerous depending on where you are lol.

Agreed. Murton should be getting the PT because he is doing well, just like Floyd got the PT deservedly when he was doing better than Murton in the first half of the season. Murton's nobody on and runners on situation just keeps getting stranger and stranger. Here are his career numbers: Nobody on (464 AB's): .330/.385/.526 Runners on (321 AB's): .246/.335/.346 Now, it's still only 785 at-bats, and it still has plenty of time to turn around. 230 points is still an absolutely massive difference for that number of at-bats. Maybe he is too patient with runners on? (his walk rate and strikeout rate on his career are both up with runners on, while his BA and power are way down. That suggests too much patience in those situations). Like I've said before, that still doesn't mean that you don't start Murton. Even if you believe these numbers won't turn around, that just means you have to put him in a spot in the batting order that will come up the most times without runners on. Good post CCP. For all the talk of all the Murton love supposedly here, I remember alot of people who agreed with sending him down to get right. And its quite obvious that he has gotten back to being 06 Matt Murton, and not the guy we seen at the beginning of the year. There really is no justification on not playing Murton right now. Floyd hasnt had a 2 month long stretch showing what Murton has shown, the entire season. For the final 30 days of the season, I think its obvious Murton gives us the best chance at winning, which is what everybody here wants.

Feel free. This one might fit better.... 07/27 - 09/02 AB R H RBI BA OBP SLG OPS BABIP Murton 71 11 22 9 0.310 0.372 0.549 0.921 0.309 Floyd 57 5 14 6 0.246 0.338 0.333 0.672 0.283 Thanks Fred, now lets see if Im smart enough to figure out how to do it lol

My agenda is to play the player who will most likely help us win. For the reasons you stated, I agree that man is Floyd. But some say recent trends mean nothing, but that season long or career trends mean everything. Then they change that tune when it suits their purpose and use only recent trends. Me, I like going with the hot hand unless the long-term trent is overwhelming. LOL

I agree with everything you said Ping. I really wouldnt care who it was putting up the numbers Murton has for the last 2 months, but whoever that person is should be starting everyday. Floyd hasnt had a 2 month stretch like this of Murtons all year. It is pretty safe to say, Floyds days as an everyday starter are over, and all the numbers prove this.

These are totals since 27 July..... I don't have L/R splits; I gotta look them up , too !! 07/27 - 09/02 AB R H 2B 3B HR TB RBI BB SO BA OBP SLG OPS BABIP Murton 71 11 22 2 0 5 39 9 7 11 0.310 0.372 0.549 0.921 0.309 Floyd 57 5 14 2 0 1 19 6 6 10 0.246 0.338 0.333 0.672 0.283 Does more really need to be said on this subject? Care if I sig this fred?

what are the sample sizes here? comparing murton's handful of plate appearances to floyd's wealth of them doesn't exactly paint an accurate picture. 190 ab's for Murton and 243 for Floyd. that's what i get for speaking without looking. Floyd has 100 more ab's against righties than Murton

what are the sample sizes here? comparing murton's handful of plate appearances to floyd's wealth of them doesn't exactly paint an accurate picture. 190 ab's for Murton and 243 for Floyd. These are season totals, not rightie splits...... 04/02 - 09/02 AB R H 2B 3B HR TB RBI BB SO BA OBP SLG OPS BABIP Murton 190 27 52 9 0 6 79 17 21 29 0.274 0.346 0.416 0.762 0.297 Floyd 244 32 69 9 0 5 93 39 24 42 0.283 0.354 0.381 0.735 0.325 Fred, do you have those splits since Murton came back up against righties?

Floyd OPS 735 and Murton OPS is 723 against rightys on the year. Like you said there is a slight advantage for Floyd, but Floyd has done that with consistent starting time against righties, whereas Murtons ab's against righties is sporadic. Murton since coming back up has shown very good power, against righties and lefties, he should be the guy starting for us down the stretch run. The Floyd experiment should be over, except for late in game PH situations.

Hopefully this means Pitt will have a snowball's chance today. Pitt should have a chance this series when looking at who Stl is starting Wells, Pinero, Mulder, and Maroth. The Pirates should score some runs, lets hope they can stop Stl(Ankiel and Pujols) from scoring runs