7/15 Cubs(Wood) vs. Pirates(Fogg) 1:20 CSN. Puhleeze

[jjgman21]

Didn't Williams win 10 games last season as a rookie? I may be wrong, but he's been a starter for his short MLB career. That's where he should stay, because he has the potential to be a good #4-5 starter for us.

 

He was a rookie in 2003. Yes, he won 10 last year, but he didn't pitch particularly well. He stunk earlier this year and hasn't been impressive as a Cub.

 

 

Don't know if you are mixing up your years, but Williams was outstanding in 2003. 3.30 ERA, OPS against of .668.

 

Since joining the Cubs this year, his ERA is 3.68. granted that is in 22 innings, but that puts him between Prior and Z in terms of starters ERA. and you know the facts about earlier this year, so can't you make an exception?

 

go ahead and prefer one guy over the other, but don't diminish the guys accomplishments and adversity to make your point.

 

I don't believe I confused a thing. 2003 was his rookie year. Last year was 2004, when he won 10, but had an ERA well over 4, a WHIP of about 1.3, a k/bb under 2, a k/9 under 6. What exception am I supposed to make? The guy doesn't impress me. He hasn't been a bad pitcher. I'm just not impressed with him. I don't have to diminish his accomplishments to feel that way.

 

I read that post wrong.

 

but perhaps an exception should be made when using a pitchers early season performance as a tool to predict performance when that pitcher missed most of ST, and when that pitcher missed most of ST because his father was getting kidney and liver transplants and year after his mother died of cancer and when that pitcher, who has 13 innings in ST is run out on April 9 for 7 innings and 90 pitches. not quite a shock that after being skipped the next time throught the rotation he had two rough starts.

 

I didn't say you diminished his accomplishments to form your opinion of him. I said you diminished his accomplishments to make your point, ie. that Mitre should be the starter and by extension that you think he is better.

 

and what's funny about that is you tend to be a moneyballer but your lack of faith in Williams and your preference for Mitre seems to be based on your observations of the two, when Williams has clearly outperformed by any statistical measurement. all the ratios are about even, but favor Williams. all the raw stats favor Williams by far. but hey, you saw him give up alot of hard hit balls, so maybe he's not as good as some of us thing he is.

 

I personally like both. they are in different molds (Wrigley plays bigger than PacBell for half the season). I could easily see either being with a ceiling around the border of #2-3 if things click for them. think maybe Livan Hernandez for Williams and maybe Matty Clement for Mitre. as for right now, I have to go with the guy likely to keep you in each game instead of the one likely to dominate two starts and stink the next three. that being the case, gotta go with Williams right now.