Cubs and Rays swap minor leaguers

[Brock Beauchamp]

 

[jersey cubs fan]

I don’t like trading away IFA money 

 

between this site crashing during half my replies and apples obnoxiously inaccurate auto fill, words are being put into my mouth 

Edited August 1, 2023 by jersey cubs fan

[Tim]

Just looking at the numbers for Roberson...I hate this trade. We've got a ton of IFA money in the next window tied up in the top player. Manny has shown signs at times and has flashed recently. Roberson is 27, can't find the strike zone consistently, has lousy results, and can't seem to stay healthy.

It's obviously a pure scouting play, but what are the odds we're seeing something that the Rays aren't?

[craig]

Sampson's has a $1.9 guaranteed contract. This frees the remaining $600K.  

I think the IFO money is for the current year, not next year's class?  

Manny's been very good lately.  May finally be healthy and settling in, perhaps years of D+D ready to finally bear fruit?  Obviously Manny is more desirable than Roberson.  But I think that was the price to free the extra $600K for whatever deadline pickup(s) Hoyer may be hoping to complete.  

[CaliforniaRaisin]

I’m with Craig, this feels more like making sure the Cubs are under the first luxury tax threshold after adding Jeimer and possibly making another move today.

[CubinNY]

10 minutes ago, craig said:

Sampson's has a $1.9 guaranteed contract. This frees the remaining $600K.  

I think the IFO money is for the current year, not next year's class?  

Manny's been very good lately.  May finally be healthy and settling in, perhaps years of D+D ready to finally bear fruit?  Obviously Manny is more desirable than Roberson.  But I think that was the price to free the extra $600K for whatever deadline pickup(s) Hoyer may be hoping to complete.  

I agree. They made this trade for two reasons 1) to free up some cash and 2) to free up the 40 man. I don't know if the cost is in line with the benefit, but relievers appear to be a dime a dozen.

[jersey cubs fan]

13 minutes ago, craig said:

Sampson's has a $1.9 guaranteed contract.  

How did that happen?

[Transmogrified Tiger]

7 minutes ago, jersey cubs fan said:

How did that happen?

Arb eligible and was good in 100 MLB innings last year

[craig]

Neither Manny nor Sampson were on the 40-man.  It was the $600K.  

[Tim]

So can we start complaining about PTR (Poor Tom Ricketts for those unacquainted with the acronym) again?

[CubinNY]

2 minutes ago, Tim said:

So can we start complaining about PTR (Poor Tom Ricketts for those unacquainted with the acronym) again?

It kind of sounds like they are trying to find enough cash to make a bigger trade and not go over the luxury tax. 

[craig]

Well, my save lux-tax motivation logic did not play out into an actual trade.  Maybe they had some trades they were talking on, that didn't play out.  Or, maybe my rationale was faulty?  

I heard that there was also some information reported counter to the initial report.  Initial report had us sending them International cash. 

Other thing I heard, third hand, was that we receive the international cash, plus that we sent some money over in the deal.  If the latter were true, that would argue against the motivation being saving lux space.  

Question:  Is it even possible to acquire IFA money for the upcoming year?  Or, is any cash that they got only usable for the present year?  In which obviously all of the main guys have already been signed, so what value is there in getting more now?  

[Tim]

4 hours ago, craig said:

Well, my save lux-tax motivation logic did not play out into an actual trade.  Maybe they had some trades they were talking on, that didn't play out.  Or, maybe my rationale was faulty?  

I heard that there was also some information reported counter to the initial report.  Initial report had us sending them International cash. 

Other thing I heard, third hand, was that we receive the international cash, plus that we sent some money over in the deal.  If the latter were true, that would argue against the motivation being saving lux space.  

Question:  Is it even possible to acquire IFA money for the upcoming year?  Or, is any cash that they got only usable for the present year?  In which obviously all of the main guys have already been signed, so what value is there in getting more now?  

If we're receiving the international cash, that makes me feel much better about the deal. I'm not sure if it would be for only this year or if it could be for next year. As for remaining targets, there was a very recent report of a Korean (iirc) high schooler skipping their draft to become eligible for MLB.

[CaliforniaRaisin]

13 hours ago, craig said:

Well, my save lux-tax motivation logic did not play out into an actual trade.  Maybe they had some trades they were talking on, that didn't play out.  Or, maybe my rationale was faulty?  

I heard that there was also some information reported counter to the initial report.  Initial report had us sending them International cash. 

Other thing I heard, third hand, was that we receive the international cash, plus that we sent some money over in the deal.  If the latter were true, that would argue against the motivation being saving lux space.  

Question:  Is it even possible to acquire IFA money for the upcoming year?  Or, is any cash that they got only usable for the present year?  In which obviously all of the main guys have already been signed, so what value is there in getting more now?  

Per Fangraphs, the Cubs did send Tampa $220k in IFA pool space (they didn’t actually send money; the Cubs pool is just reduced by that amount and Tampa’s increased by that amount): https://blogs.fangraphs.com/rays-add-depth-without-using-40-man-space-seattle-scoops-dfad-bazardo/ 

This was a trade for the 1/15/23 IFA pool space. You can only trade current year pool money and this period goes through 12/15. By my notes, after the just announced signing of Dayan Rivero, the Cubs had $270k before this trade with Tampa unless I missed a bonus besides Derniche Valdez, Ludwing Espinoza, Ángel Cepeda, Eriandys Ramón, Alexey Lumpoy and Dayan Rivero.

FYI, they were close to some reliever trades when time ran out yesterday. I thought we were on the right track thinking the Cubs were just getting lower on their 2023 CBT commitment in advance of acquiring a reliever with this Sampson trade but they also got the Nationals to pay down Jeimer’s salary so I’m not quite as sure now.

[Tim]

2 minutes ago, CaliforniaRaisin said:

Per Fangraphs, the Cubs did send Tampa $220k in IFA pool space (they didn’t actually send money; the Cubs pool is just reduced by that amount and Tampa’s increased by that amount): https://blogs.fangraphs.com/rays-add-depth-without-using-40-man-space-seattle-scoops-dfad-bazardo/ 

This was a trade for the 1/15/23 IFA pool space. I don’t believe you can trade for next year’s pool yet. By my notes, after the just announced signing of Dayan Rivero, the Cubs had $270k before this trade with Tampa unless I missed a bonus besides Derniche Valdez, Ludwing Espinoza, Ángel Cepeda, Eriandys Ramón, Alexey Lumpoy and Dayan Rivero.

FYI, they were close to some reliever trades when time ran out yesterday. I thought we were on the right track thinking the Cubs were just getting lower on their 2023 CBT commitment in advance of acquiring a reliever with this Sampson trade but they also got the Nationals to pay down Jeimer’s salary so I’m not quite as sure now.

Thanks for the clarification!

[CaliforniaRaisin]

8 hours ago, Tim said:

If we're receiving the international cash, that makes me feel much better about the deal. I'm not sure if it would be for only this year or if it could be for next year. As for remaining targets, there was a very recent report of a Korean (iirc) high schooler skipping their draft to become eligible for MLB.

The top Korean prep pitcher in the 2023 class got $750k and it sounds like the kid you're referring to - Jang Hyun-seok - is better so I think Hyun-seok will wait till the 2024 signing period and get 7 figures.

The Cubs are tied to Fernando Cruz for either "around" $4 million (per BA) or "about" $4.5 million (per FanGraphs) with a pool space of $5,152,000 so they have somewhere from $652k to $1.152 million remaining. Admittedly they might have already tied that money up with someone else who hasn't been reported.

[Tim]

More confirmation about the IFA space:

https://www.marqueesportsnetwork.com/cubs-kick-off-trade-deadline-day-with-a-minor-move-per-reports/