Who do we trade and what do we expect in return?

[mookie]

We have a lot of money to spend and have shown ourselves at being fairly adept at navigating the mid-level FA market. We'll find out who is going to hit. They don't have to already be in place.

 

And some of them are

 

To the tune of an about league average offense (8th in wOBA 9th in R) and that's WITH fairly to hugely disappointing seasons out of Rizzo and Castro.

 

I don't understand why so many people think this team is so much worse than it is. It's not bereft of talent.

 

There is no doubt there is talent. The reality is that talent still needs to maturate.

[Guest]

We have a lot of money to spend and have shown ourselves at being fairly adept at navigating the mid-level FA market. We'll find out who is going to hit. They don't have to already be in place.

 

And some of them are

 

To the tune of an about league average offense (8th in wOBA 9th in R) and that's WITH fairly to hugely disappointing seasons out of Rizzo and Castro.

 

I don't understand why so many people think this team is so much worse than it is. It's not bereft of talent.

 

well before it was OMG WE'LL NEVER BE GOOD WITH SORIANO'S BURDEN OF A CONTRACT COMPLETELY DESTROYING THE TEAM, so now it has to be something else.

 

I think some of it is that... and some of it is how many people still haven't adjusted to what offenses in baseball look like now.

[jersey cubs fan]

We have a lot of money to spend and have shown ourselves at being fairly adept at navigating the mid-level FA market. We'll find out who is going to hit. They don't have to already be in place.

 

And some of them are

 

To the tune of an about league average offense (8th in wOBA 9th in R) and that's WITH fairly to hugely disappointing seasons out of Rizzo and Castro.

 

I don't understand why so many people think this team is so much worse than it is. It's not bereft of talent.

 

There is no doubt there is talent. The reality is that talent still needs to maturate.

 

I don't care what they do in their down time, I just want them to be better at playing baseball.

[Guest]

We have a lot of money to spend and have shown ourselves at being fairly adept at navigating the mid-level FA market. We'll find out who is going to hit. They don't have to already be in place.

 

And some of them are

 

To the tune of an about league average offense (8th in wOBA 9th in R) and that's WITH fairly to hugely disappointing seasons out of Rizzo and Castro.

 

I don't understand why so many people think this team is so much worse than it is. It's not bereft of talent.

 

There is no doubt there is talent. The reality is that talent still needs to maturate.

 

To the point that they're an above average offense? Sure. But right now they're about average. Not terrible or anything close to having no hitting.

[Guest]

We have a lot of money to spend and have shown ourselves at being fairly adept at navigating the mid-level FA market. We'll find out who is going to hit. They don't have to already be in place.

 

And some of them are

 

To the tune of an about league average offense (8th in wOBA 9th in R) and that's WITH fairly to hugely disappointing seasons out of Rizzo and Castro.

 

I don't understand why so many people think this team is so much worse than it is. It's not bereft of talent.

 

There is no doubt there is talent. The reality is that talent still needs to maturate.

 

I don't care what they do in their down time, I just want them to be better at playing baseball.

 

LOL

[Guest]

We have a lot of money to spend and have shown ourselves at being fairly adept at navigating the mid-level FA market. We'll find out who is going to hit. They don't have to already be in place.

 

And some of them are

 

To the tune of an about league average offense (8th in wOBA 9th in R) and that's WITH fairly to hugely disappointing seasons out of Rizzo and Castro.

 

I don't understand why so many people think this team is so much worse than it is. It's not bereft of talent.

 

Yeah, we're basically a crappy bullpen (and bullpen management) away from being .500. If one blown game a month on average goes differently (and there are many to choose from), the Cubs are 52-52 right now.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

Yeah, we're basically a crappy bullpen (and bullpen management) away from being .500. If one blown game a month on average goes differently (and there are many to choose from), the Cubs are 52-52 right now.

 

You don't get it so much at NSBB, but there's a serious notion among Cubs fans on the internet that going into a season with a .500 projection is undesirable because you can't be a contender but you'll ruin your draft position.

 

It's so wrong, and so frustrating.

[Guest]

We have a lot of money to spend and have shown ourselves at being fairly adept at navigating the mid-level FA market. We'll find out who is going to hit. They don't have to already be in place.

 

And some of them are

 

To the tune of an about league average offense (8th in wOBA 9th in R) and that's WITH fairly to hugely disappointing seasons out of Rizzo and Castro.

 

I don't understand why so many people think this team is so much worse than it is. It's not bereft of talent.

 

Yeah, we're basically a crappy bullpen (and bullpen management) away from being .500. If one blown game a month on average goes differently (and there are many to choose from), the Cubs are 52-52 right now.

 

And I'm not even referring to NSBB. NSBB actually has a fairly decent grasp. The media and fans locally are the worst offenders. Terrible baseball this and don't bother watching for 3 years that.

 

I mean, christ. They're not good but they're not THAT [expletive] bad. Certainly a watchable baseball team if you like watching baseball.

[Guest]

Yeah, we're basically a crappy bullpen (and bullpen management) away from being .500. If one blown game a month on average goes differently (and there are many to choose from), the Cubs are 52-52 right now.

 

You don't get it so much at NSBB, but there's a serious notion among Cubs fans on the internet that going into a season with a .500 projection is undesirable because you can't be a contender but you'll ruin your draft position.

 

It's so wrong, and so frustrating.

 

Especially in this sport where the draft position is almost meaningless (although more meaningful now than before).

 

Also, you just demonstrated more of the PSD = dumb, NSBB = smart that we were talking about.

[jersey cubs fan]

Yeah, we're basically a crappy bullpen (and bullpen management) away from being .500. If one blown game a month on average goes differently (and there are many to choose from), the Cubs are 52-52 right now.

 

You don't get it so much at NSBB, but there's a serious notion among Cubs fans on the internet that going into a season with a .500 projection is undesirable because you can't be a contender but you'll ruin your draft position.

 

It's so wrong, and so frustrating.

 

I don't see what's wrong or frustrating about that mindset. Projecting to mediocrity is a bummer. Theo and Co. obviously believed in one end of that spectrum last season.

[Guest]

Yeah, we're basically a crappy bullpen (and bullpen management) away from being .500. If one blown game a month on average goes differently (and there are many to choose from), the Cubs are 52-52 right now.

 

You don't get it so much at NSBB, but there's a serious notion among Cubs fans on the internet that going into a season with a .500 projection is undesirable because you can't be a contender but you'll ruin your draft position.

 

It's so wrong, and so frustrating.

 

I don't see what's wrong or frustrating about that mindset. Projecting to mediocrity is a bummer. Theo and Co. obviously believed in one end of that spectrum last season.

 

He means that you shouldn't try to avoid projecting to be .500 because a team that projects to be .500 has higher odds to surprise contend. If you end up not contending, there's plenty of time to blow it up. No reason to just go into the season trying to lose 90 just because you don't think you can win over 85.

[jersey cubs fan]

Yeah, we're basically a crappy bullpen (and bullpen management) away from being .500. If one blown game a month on average goes differently (and there are many to choose from), the Cubs are 52-52 right now.

 

You don't get it so much at NSBB, but there's a serious notion among Cubs fans on the internet that going into a season with a .500 projection is undesirable because you can't be a contender but you'll ruin your draft position.

 

It's so wrong, and so frustrating.

 

I don't see what's wrong or frustrating about that mindset. Projecting to mediocrity is a bummer. Theo and Co. obviously believed in one end of that spectrum last season.

 

He means that you shouldn't try to avoid projecting to be .500 because a team that projects to be .500 has higher odds to surprise contend. If you end up not contending, there's plenty of time to blow it up. No reason to just go into the season trying to lose 90 just because you don't think you can win over 85.

You should avoid projecting to .500 because you should try to be better. Not because, "hey .500 can sometimes be good enough if things work out well for you."

[Hairyducked Idiot]

I don't see what's wrong or frustrating about that mindset. Projecting to mediocrity is a bummer. Theo and Co. obviously believed in one end of that spectrum last season.

 

Projecting to mediocrity is better than projecting to awfulness.

 

I was looking today at Replacement Level Yankees Weblog's March 27th post, where they averaged out five major projection systems' standings.

 

Pirates: 79 wins

Red Sox: 82 wins

Diamondbacks: 84 wins

[Guest]

Yeah, we're basically a crappy bullpen (and bullpen management) away from being .500. If one blown game a month on average goes differently (and there are many to choose from), the Cubs are 52-52 right now.

 

You don't get it so much at NSBB, but there's a serious notion among Cubs fans on the internet that going into a season with a .500 projection is undesirable because you can't be a contender but you'll ruin your draft position.

 

It's so wrong, and so frustrating.

 

I don't see what's wrong or frustrating about that mindset. Projecting to mediocrity is a bummer. Theo and Co. obviously believed in one end of that spectrum last season.

 

He means that you shouldn't try to avoid projecting to be .500 because a team that projects to be .500 has higher odds to surprise contend. If you end up not contending, there's plenty of time to blow it up. No reason to just go into the season trying to lose 90 just because you don't think you can win over 85.

You should avoid projecting to .500 because you should try to be better. Not because, "hey .500 can sometimes be good enough if things work out well for you."

 

Well, of course. If you can improve enough to project to better than that, that's great and even better.

 

That's not what we're talking about, though. We're talking about people who would rather not bother trying and "securing a draft pick" than to project to being .500.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

You should avoid projecting to .500 because you should try to be better. Not because, "hey .500 can sometimes be good enough if things work out well for you."

 

That's completely different than what I said I was talking about. These fans think that if a projection of.500 is the best you can do, you should instead try to get worse rather than better.

[mookie]

Who wants to not bother trying? I don't think I have ever heard a fan express that opinion.

[Guest]

Who wants to not bother trying? I don't think I have ever heard a fan express that opinion.

 

Go to PSD.

 

Or listen to all the people who think it's pointless to sign free agents because it's not time to compete.

[jersey cubs fan]

You should avoid projecting to .500 because you should try to be better. Not because, "hey .500 can sometimes be good enough if things work out well for you."

 

That's completely different than what I said I was talking about. These fans think that if a projection of.500 is the best you can do, you should instead try to get worse rather than better.

 

Well that is completely different than what was being discussed and a completely different point to try and make.

[jersey cubs fan]

Who wants to not bother trying? I don't think I have ever heard a fan express that opinion.

 

Go to PSD.

 

Or listen to all the people who think it's pointless to sign free agents because it's not time to compete.

 

That's been the stance of a frustratingly large portion of the people on this board for 2 years now.

[Guest]

Who wants to not bother trying? I don't think I have ever heard a fan express that opinion.

 

Go to PSD.

 

Or listen to all the people who think it's pointless to sign free agents because it's not time to compete.

 

That's been the stance of a frustratingly large portion of the people on this board for 2 years now.

 

Signing older players to absurdly huge contracts where the vast majority of the production will come in the first 2-3 years (starting in 2012) is what I think most people who were against that were against.

 

I don't think a large portion of this board would be against signing, say, Ellsbury this offseason. But maybe I'm wrong. Same with a signing like Jackson (or Sanchez) last offseason.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

Who wants to not bother trying? I don't think I have ever heard a fan express that opinion.

 

Go to PSD.

 

Or listen to all the people who think it's pointless to sign free agents because it's not time to compete.

 

It's *really* bad at BCB. You'll see a bit of it at Bleacher Nation and CubsDen too.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

You should avoid projecting to .500 because you should try to be better. Not because, "hey .500 can sometimes be good enough if things work out well for you."

 

That's completely different than what I said I was talking about. These fans think that if a projection of.500 is the best you can do, you should instead try to get worse rather than better.

 

Well that is completely different than what was being discussed and a completely different point to try and make.

 

That's exactly what I was discussing when you said you didn't get why it was frustrating.

 

"You don't get it so much at NSBB, but there's a serious notion among Cubs fans on the internet that going into a season with a .500 projection is undesirable because you can't be a contender but you'll ruin your draft position."

[Castros trade value]

Forget next year, after today the Cubs could be 7 back in the loss column for the final WC. :stickman:

[Hairyducked Idiot]

Forget next year, after today the Cubs could be 7 back in the loss column for the final WC. :stickman:

 

 

I want so badly for the Cubs to go on some little hot streak and force everyone to notice that they are only like 6.5 games out of the second WC or something. I doubt they could get any closer than that, but I want some sort of buzz to replace the "well, we can't possibly win before 2016" mantra.

[jersey cubs fan]

You should avoid projecting to .500 because you should try to be better. Not because, "hey .500 can sometimes be good enough if things work out well for you."

 

That's completely different than what I said I was talking about. These fans think that if a projection of.500 is the best you can do, you should instead try to get worse rather than better.

 

Well that is completely different than what was being discussed and a completely different point to try and make.

 

That's exactly what I was discussing when you said you didn't get why it was frustrating.

 

"You don't get it so much at NSBB, but there's a serious notion among Cubs fans on the internet that going into a season with a .500 projection is undesirable because you can't be a contender but you'll ruin your draft position."

 

Yes that is exactly the pointlessness to which I was referring.