Marlins willing to trade Nolasco?

[jersey cubs fan]

couple quick comments:

 

1. The first thing on Randy Wells is which Randy Wells. the Randy Wells late in the year looked remarkably similar to the guy from the previous two seasons. The best guess is that he was slow in rehabbing his way back. I feel like I'm fairly comfortable with Wells as a 4th/5th starter and unless they can do better on cheaper, he should be penciled into the rotation. Yes, his salary is going to go up, but the chances of finding a better guy than him at a cheaper price seems slim, provided he's more the guy in 2009/2010, and late in 2011.

 

Wells had a string of about 6 starts, mostly in August, where he looked like he has in the past at his best but that didn't last through the end of the season. Even when he had his solid seasons he was prone to some really horrible outings where he got rocked. I feel like he probably outperformed in 2009/2010 and is going to struggle to do that again as he gets into his 30's. I do feel he should absolutely be penciled in as part of the rotation, barring a massive overhaul with more top notch talent (or a profitable trade). But I remain concerned about his low K rates and the fact that he still hasn't reached a 200 inning season and he got injured early in the year after his most significant workload.

[KingKongvs.Godzilla]

hey everybody, the Marlins don't think they can afford the $6M Ricky Nolasco, so let's trade the $14M Ryan Dempster or $18M Carlos Zambrano for him!

 

He's making $9m next year and 11.5 in 2013, and I'm pretty sure people were thinking the Cubs would offer cash to offset. It's hardly outlandish, especially if they want to have some names around to help sell the new stadium.

 

20.5 more reasons not to bother right there.

[Clem Fandango]

That's not a financial burden to this team, with or without a $30M Pujols.

[KingKongvs.Godzilla]

That's not a financial burden to this team, with or without a $30M Pujols.

 

It is when they can probably do better, even if it's not immediately. Just because you can doesn't mean you should. CJ Wilson is the kind of arm I'd say that about, not Ricky Nolasco.

[Guest]

That's not a financial burden to this team, with or without a $30M Pujols.

 

It is when they can probably do better, even if it's not immediately. Just because you can doesn't mean you should. CJ Wilson is the kind of arm I'd say that about, not Ricky Nolasco.

Paying Z to play for the fish and getting and paying a pretty decent pitcher in return is a much better option than paying Z to play for some other team and over paying for Wilson (and whoever gets him will over pay).

[KingKongvs.Godzilla]

That's not a financial burden to this team, with or without a $30M Pujols.

 

It is when they can probably do better, even if it's not immediately. Just because you can doesn't mean you should. CJ Wilson is the kind of arm I'd say that about, not Ricky Nolasco.

Paying Z to play for the fish and getting and paying a pretty decent pitcher in return is a much better option than paying Z to play for some other team and over paying for Wilson (and whoever gets him will over pay).

 

Disagree on both accounts...not only should they be aiming to do better than Ricky Nolasco and guys like him because they already have guys like him, but overpaying for Wilson in just money is way better than overpaying for Nolasco in prospects and money. Wilson is a better and more battle tested pitcher who's thrown 200+ in the past couple years to top it off. Nolasco is a short, mediocre fastball RH with a good curve and recent injuries...big pile of

meh for what the Cubs seem to want to try to do.

 

How legit could a Z to the Marlins idea really be anyway?

[Guest]

That's not a financial burden to this team, with or without a $30M Pujols.

 

It is when they can probably do better, even if it's not immediately. Just because you can doesn't mean you should. CJ Wilson is the kind of arm I'd say that about, not Ricky Nolasco.

Paying Z to play for the fish and getting and paying a pretty decent pitcher in return is a much better option than paying Z to play for some other team and over paying for Wilson (and whoever gets him will over pay).

 

Disagree on both accounts...not only should they be aiming to do better than Ricky Nolasco and guys like him because they already have guys like him, but overpaying for Wilson in just money is way better than overpaying for Nolasco in prospects and money. Wilson is a better and more battle tested pitcher who's thrown 200+ in the past couple years to top it off. Nolasco is a short, mediocre fastball RH with a good curve and recent injuries...big pile of

meh for what the Cubs seem to want to try to do.

 

How legit could a Z to the Marlins idea really be anyway?

I don't think it's legit, but if we're having a hypothetical discussion about trading Z plus cash for Nolasco or paying Z to play for someone else and signing Wilson it's a no brainer. Wilson is going to be looking for in the neighborhood of $100,000,000.

 

In my mind I think the Cubs should make nice with Z and bring him back. The only people who seem to be pissed off at him are Quade and Hendry. Then they don't have two holes in the rotation.

[chopsx9]

I don't think Wilson gets anywhere near 100M.

 

I think 3-4 / 12-15 per.

 

We'll see soon enough I guess.

[Clem Fandango]

I don't think Wilson gets anywhere near 100M.

 

I think 3-4 / 12-15 per.

 

We'll see soon enough I guess.

 

As the only Ace-quality starter in this year's FA class (pending a C.C. opt out), Wilson has a truck load of leverage in his favor to bring in a big payday. I'm expecting at least $16M a year, 5 years tops, probably 4 more likely. Granted that's just my opinion

[Guest]

I don't think Wilson gets anywhere near 100M.

 

I think 3-4 / 12-15 per.

 

We'll see soon enough I guess.

There's no way. Five or six years at @20M/year is what someone is going pay him.

[KingKongvs.Godzilla]

I don't think Wilson gets anywhere near 100M.

 

I think 3-4 / 12-15 per.

 

We'll see soon enough I guess.

There's no way. Five or six years at @20M/year is what someone is going pay him.

 

Yeah I'm thinking 5/95-100. Unlike Z and Burnett who got similar deals, I think Wilson will be as worth it as an athlete getting 19-20 million can be. IMO he's just hitting his stride.

[Cubs Fan Dan]

That's not a financial burden to this team, with or without a $30M Pujols.

 

It is when they can probably do better, even if it's not immediately. Just because you can doesn't mean you should. CJ Wilson is the kind of arm I'd say that about, not Ricky Nolasco.

Paying Z to play for the fish and getting and paying a pretty decent pitcher in return is a much better option than paying Z to play for some other team and over paying for Wilson (and whoever gets him will over pay).

 

Disagree on both accounts...not only should they be aiming to do better than Ricky Nolasco and guys like him because they already have guys like him, but overpaying for Wilson in just money is way better than overpaying for Nolasco in prospects and money. Wilson is a better and more battle tested pitcher who's thrown 200+ in the past couple years to top it off. Nolasco is a short, mediocre fastball RH with a good curve and recent injuries...big pile of

meh for what the Cubs seem to want to try to do.

 

How legit could a Z to the Marlins idea really be anyway?

I don't think it's legit, but if we're having a hypothetical discussion about trading Z plus cash for Nolasco or paying Z to play for someone else and signing Wilson it's a no brainer. Wilson is going to be looking for in the neighborhood of $100,000,000.

 

In my mind I think the Cubs should make nice with Z and bring him back. The only people who seem to be pissed off at him are Quade and Hendry. Then they don't have two holes in the rotation.

 

I was bringing up the Z to Marlins idea due to Guillen likely landing there if he gets himself fired. Z and Guillen are close so obviously it is not a legit rumor but an idea that could gain some traction in the coming weeks.. More of a conversation starter.

[imb]

maybe we can trade campana for him. it's only fair.

[Cubs Fan Dan]

Well Ozzie is out and rumored to be going to the Marlins..... I don't think Z to the Marlins is out of question at all if Ozzie goes to FL

[Elrhino]

I think Wilson most likely stick with Texas. He really likes it there, and the Rangers' new ownership isn't going to let him leave after they couldn't resign Lee last year.

[toonsterwu]

Pondering the end of the rotation and didn't have a better place to put this -

 

This might be totally idiotic, but after their epic collapse, and with all the issues that he went through this year, I wonder

 

a) If the Red Sox would shop John Lackey

b) How much of the contract they would eat

 

He's taking a beating in Boston, and a fresh start might not be the worst thing for him. Looking at the numbers, the BABIP went up twenty points this year, the HR rate went up, but the K/BB rates were fairly similar to last year, and the velocity is still there. He went to the slider a bit more this year.

 

He's not an ideal option, and the only way you take him is if the Red Sox eat a gigantic chunk of contract (as I really don't see a bad contract swap happening, don't see the Red Sox going down the Z or Soriano roads). That said, there are few ideal pitching options this off-season. He wouldn't address the top of the rotation, but he would add some innings eating potential to the back end of the rotation. I don't think I'd want to pay more than 5-6 mil a year for him, though, so it might be too tough to work out (hard to see the Red Sox tossing in 10 mil a year).

 

Anyhow, just a thought after the epic collapses tonight. Derek Lowe, assuming the Braves ate a little bit of the money, would be another possible innings eating guy to add to the end of the rotation if the price is right (and the Braves have incentive to shop him harder this offseason, with all their pitching depth and him on his last year of his deal).

 

I wouldn't mind a gamble on someone like Chien-Ming Wang, but he looks likely to head back to the Nationals, if the rumors are true. I hadn't realized how ... decent a year Javier Vazquez had. He's leaning towards retirement (and if he comes back, my guess is that it'd be with the Marlins), but wow, he really had a strong 2nd half of the year. Not a long term solution, but if he would come on a 1 or 2 year deal, worth a thought.

[Little Slide Rooter]

OK, so the Marlins are looking for a veteran starer. They are willing to trade Nolasco. So trade Zambrano for Nolasco, nd figure out the money from there. End of story.

[jersey cubs fan]

Zambrano for Crawford, Epstein and Francona.

[Little Slide Rooter]

Zambrano for Crawford, Epstein and Francona.

 

I bet if you call B2B, he'll be able to work in A Gon.

[Careless]

A source told the South Florida Sun-Sentinel that the Marlins might look to trade Ricky Nolasco this winter.

Nolasco posted a disappointing 4.67 ERA and 1.40 WHIP in 33 starts this season for the last-place Fish. He's a talented right-hander, but the cost-conscious Marlins are paying him to be a reliable number two or three starter and he has not been that. They signed the 28-year-old to a three-year, $26.5 million extension last offseason.

 

He's been far greater than his numbers indicate. He's had some seriously bad luck (.331 BABIP, 2nd highest in the majors), but he's got a 3.53 FIP and 3.55 xFIP and a 3.4 WAR (according to FranGraphs) and if you care to put stock into their "Dollars" metric, he's been worth $15.5 million this year, but it sounds like the Marlins are souring on him because of his traditional numbers being so pedestrian.

 

Seems like this has been his issue for the last 3 years:

 

2009: 5.06 ERA // .317 BABIP // 3.35 FIP // 3.23 xFIP // 4.3 WAR // $19.2m Dollars

2010: 4.51 ERA // .316 BABIP // 3.86 FIP // 3.37 xFIP // 2.5 WAR // $9.9m Dollars

2011: 4.67 ERA // .331 BABIP // 3.53 FIP // 3.55 xFIP // 3.4 WAR // $15.5m Dollars

 

Sounds like he's the victim of some terrible defense, might be a good person to try and swindle if they're seriously tired of his performance. Maybe attempt some sort of package surrounding Zambrano?

 

He's currently signed through 2013 and stands to make $9M next season and $11.5M in 2013

At what point do you look at the BABIP numbers and say and wonder if it's not really bad luck, but merely getting hit hard because his stuff is in decline? He's had injuries, and the strikout rate really plummeted this year.

 

Touché, but the BABIP is more or less just a justifiable stat that compliments what his FIP, xFIP, and WAR says: That he's been far better than advertised.

Isn't BABIP basically baked into those other stats so assuming a higher natural BABIP in them would crash his scores in them?

[Clem Fandango]

A source told the South Florida Sun-Sentinel that the Marlins might look to trade Ricky Nolasco this winter.

Nolasco posted a disappointing 4.67 ERA and 1.40 WHIP in 33 starts this season for the last-place Fish. He's a talented right-hander, but the cost-conscious Marlins are paying him to be a reliable number two or three starter and he has not been that. They signed the 28-year-old to a three-year, $26.5 million extension last offseason.

 

He's been far greater than his numbers indicate. He's had some seriously bad luck (.331 BABIP, 2nd highest in the majors), but he's got a 3.53 FIP and 3.55 xFIP and a 3.4 WAR (according to FranGraphs) and if you care to put stock into their "Dollars" metric, he's been worth $15.5 million this year, but it sounds like the Marlins are souring on him because of his traditional numbers being so pedestrian.

 

Seems like this has been his issue for the last 3 years:

 

2009: 5.06 ERA // .317 BABIP // 3.35 FIP // 3.23 xFIP // 4.3 WAR // $19.2m Dollars

2010: 4.51 ERA // .316 BABIP // 3.86 FIP // 3.37 xFIP // 2.5 WAR // $9.9m Dollars

2011: 4.67 ERA // .331 BABIP // 3.53 FIP // 3.55 xFIP // 3.4 WAR // $15.5m Dollars

 

Sounds like he's the victim of some terrible defense, might be a good person to try and swindle if they're seriously tired of his performance. Maybe attempt some sort of package surrounding Zambrano?

 

He's currently signed through 2013 and stands to make $9M next season and $11.5M in 2013

At what point do you look at the BABIP numbers and say and wonder if it's not really bad luck, but merely getting hit hard because his stuff is in decline? He's had injuries, and the strikout rate really plummeted this year.

 

Touché, but the BABIP is more or less just a justifiable stat that compliments what his FIP, xFIP, and WAR says: That he's been far better than advertised.

Isn't BABIP basically baked into those other stats so assuming a higher natural BABIP in them would crash his scores in them?

 

If it is, I was unaware. I'm not the world's greatest sabermetrician 8-[

[Backtobanks]

Zambrano for Crawford, Epstein and Francona.

 

I bet if you call B2B, he'll be able to work in A Gon.

 

Will you guys quit calling on me. I'm busy interviewing with Ricketts for the GM position.