tyler colvin is not that great

[Rob]

Colvin is better than most here are giving him credit for.

 

Is gonna be a superstar? Unlikely.

 

Is there anything wrong with him as a starter while he's cheap? Probably not.

[jersey cubs fan]

Colvin is better than most here are giving him credit for.

 

Is gonna be a superstar? Unlikely.

 

Is there anything wrong with him as a starter while he's cheap? Probably not.

 

I don't know how you can say probably not. If he's a sub .300 OBP corner OF there most definitely is something wrong with him as a starter. The more he's played, the worse he's been. The ability for the Cubs to have Tyler Colvin starting everyday, and not suffering as a result, is very much in doubt.

[Rob]

Colvin is better than most here are giving him credit for.

 

Is gonna be a superstar? Unlikely.

 

Is there anything wrong with him as a starter while he's cheap? Probably not.

 

I don't know how you can say probably not. If he's a sub .300 OBP corner OF there most definitely is something wrong with him as a starter. The more he's played, the worse he's been. The ability for the Cubs to have Tyler Colvin starting everyday, and not suffering as a result, is very much in doubt.

 

A NL average RF is hitting .263/.333/.447 so far this season. He may end up a bit light on the OBP side of that, but is showing he can do the slugging. And he has some extra value with baserunning and fielding.

 

An average to slightly below average RF making league minimum? There's real value in that. Not every team can have superstars at every single position on the field... Hell, not even the Yankees can do that.

 

Besides, we're not going anywhere. Where's the harm in seeing what we've got with him? (I had a problem with this before, as it would sink Fukudome's trade value... but that damage is already done)

[UK1679666180]

(I had a problem with this before, as it would sink Fukudome's trade value... but that damage is already done)

 

I don't think he is valued much around the League either. He's basically viewed as an expensive RF'er that doesn't hit well enough for a corner OF spot.

[jersey cubs fan]

Colvin is better than most here are giving him credit for.

 

Is gonna be a superstar? Unlikely.

 

Is there anything wrong with him as a starter while he's cheap? Probably not.

 

I don't know how you can say probably not. If he's a sub .300 OBP corner OF there most definitely is something wrong with him as a starter. The more he's played, the worse he's been. The ability for the Cubs to have Tyler Colvin starting everyday, and not suffering as a result, is very much in doubt.

 

A NL average RF is hitting .263/.333/.447 so far this season. He may end up a bit light on the OBP side of that, but is showing he can do the slugging. And he has some extra value with baserunning and fielding.

 

An average to slightly below average RF making league minimum? There's real value in that. Not every team can have superstars at every single position on the field... Hell, not even the Yankees can do that.

 

Besides, we're not going anywhere. Where's the harm in seeing what we've got with him? (I had a problem with this before, as it would sink Fukudome's trade value... but that damage is already done)

 

Well, if you want to field a below average team, having a guy like him in RF is probably a good way to start. But I think the goal is to try and field one of the 3-4 best teams in the NL, or at least upper half.

 

There's nothing wrong with Pittsburgh giving a guy like him the RF job, but there is likely to be something very wrong with a team like the Cubs having him start in RF, on purpose.

[Rob]

(I had a problem with this before, as it would sink Fukudome's trade value... but that damage is already done)

 

I don't think he is valued much around the League either. He's basically viewed as an expensive RF'er that doesn't hit well enough for a corner OF spot.

 

I don't know if that's the view around all the teams in the league (as shown by smarter teams like the Red Sox being interested), but it seems to be the Cubs view... which is what's really killing the trade value.

[UK1679666180]

There's nothing wrong with Pittsburgh giving a guy like him the RF job, but there is likely to be something very wrong with a team like the Cubs having him start in RF, on purpose.

 

The Cubs right now are closer to Pitt. than one of the top 3-4 teams in the League.

 

Colvin in RF isn't keeping the Cubs from catching Cincy/STL and with the Cubs likely as sellers, it's best to see what they have in him and if he can provide more than a 4th OF'er as he has the tools to do so but not the approach/ability to make contact at this point.

[UK1679666180]

(I had a problem with this before, as it would sink Fukudome's trade value... but that damage is already done)

 

I don't think he is valued much around the League either. He's basically viewed as an expensive RF'er that doesn't hit well enough for a corner OF spot.

 

I don't know if that's the view around all the teams in the league (as shown by smarter teams like the Red Sox being interested), but it seems to be the Cubs view... which is what's really killing the trade value.

 

He has value, he's not Theriot or anything like that but for what he is owed, as previosuly mentioned with Silva, they're going to have to absorb a large % of that contract to get anything of use.

[davearm2]

Colvin is better than most here are giving him credit for.

 

Is gonna be a superstar? Unlikely.

 

Is there anything wrong with him as a starter while he's cheap? Probably not.

 

I don't know how you can say probably not. If he's a sub .300 OBP corner OF there most definitely is something wrong with him as a starter. The more he's played, the worse he's been. The ability for the Cubs to have Tyler Colvin starting everyday, and not suffering as a result, is very much in doubt.

Colvin will never be confused with Youkilis, but he's yet to have an OBP below .300 either.

[Guest]

There's nothing wrong with Pittsburgh giving a guy like him the RF job, but there is likely to be something very wrong with a team like the Cubs having him start in RF, on purpose.

 

The Cubs right now are closer to Pitt. than one of the top 3-4 teams in the League.

 

Colvin in RF isn't keeping the Cubs from catching Cincy/STL and with the Cubs likely as sellers, it's best to see what they have in him and if he can provide more than a 4th OF'er as he has the tools to do so but not the approach/ability to make contact at this point.

I don't really have any problem with him starting in RF right now, but I don't think he's the guy I want starting in RF next year unless the Cubs go crazy and start from scratch.

[jersey cubs fan]

There's nothing wrong with Pittsburgh giving a guy like him the RF job, but there is likely to be something very wrong with a team like the Cubs having him start in RF, on purpose.

 

The Cubs right now are closer to Pitt. than one of the top 3-4 teams in the League.

 

Colvin in RF isn't keeping the Cubs from catching Cincy/STL and with the Cubs likely as sellers, it's best to see what they have in him and if he can provide more than a 4th OF'er as he has the tools to do so but not the approach/ability to make contact at this point.

I don't really have any problem with him starting in RF right now, but I don't think he's the guy I want starting in RF next year unless the Cubs go crazy and start from scratch.

 

That's really the point. 2010 doesn't matter. Although I'd like to give Fukudome some more playing time to have a chance to showcase him for trade purposes. Colvin doesn't need to play everyday. Playing regularly, in a 4 man rotation with 3 other guys isn't bad, and gives plenty of opportunity to "see what they have". Still, Colvin will have to be better than he's showing to justify making him the opening day starting RF in the future, and there's very little reason to believe he will be better.

[UK1679666180]

There's nothing wrong with Pittsburgh giving a guy like him the RF job, but there is likely to be something very wrong with a team like the Cubs having him start in RF, on purpose.

 

The Cubs right now are closer to Pitt. than one of the top 3-4 teams in the League.

 

Colvin in RF isn't keeping the Cubs from catching Cincy/STL and with the Cubs likely as sellers, it's best to see what they have in him and if he can provide more than a 4th OF'er as he has the tools to do so but not the approach/ability to make contact at this point.

I don't really have any problem with him starting in RF right now, but I don't think he's the guy I want starting in RF next year unless the Cubs go crazy and start from scratch.

 

Depends on who's out there and where they're at. I don't see them as contenders anytime soon and if they are a few years away, if he doesn't work out in RF, why not have him keep the seat warm until Jackson is ready?

 

To me, that would be better than some stop-gap at this point like Fukudome and Bradley were supposed to be.

[jersey cubs fan]

Depends on who's out there and where they're at. I don't see them as contenders anytime soon and if they are a few years away, if he doesn't work out in RF, why not have him keep the seat warm until Jackson is ready?

 

To me, that would be better than some stop-gap at this point like Fukudome and Bradley were supposed to be.

 

How were Fukudome and Bradley supposed to be stop gaps? Weren't they both added to quality teams to make them better? 3-4 year contracts aren't stop gap.

 

I just see no reason to concede the division next year. It's still the NL Central. They still have a large resource advantage over the competition. Trying to win in 2011 doesn't stunt the development of anybody, or lessen their chances in 2012 and beyond.

[Guest]

There's nothing wrong with Pittsburgh giving a guy like him the RF job, but there is likely to be something very wrong with a team like the Cubs having him start in RF, on purpose.

 

The Cubs right now are closer to Pitt. than one of the top 3-4 teams in the League.

 

Colvin in RF isn't keeping the Cubs from catching Cincy/STL and with the Cubs likely as sellers, it's best to see what they have in him and if he can provide more than a 4th OF'er as he has the tools to do so but not the approach/ability to make contact at this point.

I don't really have any problem with him starting in RF right now, but I don't think he's the guy I want starting in RF next year unless the Cubs go crazy and start from scratch.

 

Depends on who's out there and where they're at. I don't see them as contenders anytime soon and if they are a few years away, if he doesn't work out in RF, why not have him keep the seat warm until Jackson is ready?

 

To me, that would be better than some stop-gap at this point like Fukudome and Bradley were supposed to be.

I don't have any idea who's available. I also edited my post, I was going to put in something akin to both your and goony's post together.

 

If Colvin is hurting Fukudome's trade value (which I don't think he is) it might be a problem. If they're fielding a subpar team while waiting for Soriano's contract to be tradable, then it's not a bad idea. Getting high draft picks for two years isn't the worst thing in the world. I mean, we've waited this long, what's another couple of years.

 

However, I don't think Ricketts is thinking that, but I'm not sure what he's thinking. I trust Bruce Miles more than any other beat writer and he seems to think that Hendry is staying put for at least one more year. If that's Ricketts plan, I think the Cubs want to contend.

[UK1679666180]

Depends on who's out there and where they're at. I don't see them as contenders anytime soon and if they are a few years away, if he doesn't work out in RF, why not have him keep the seat warm until Jackson is ready?

 

To me, that would be better than some stop-gap at this point like Fukudome and Bradley were supposed to be.

 

How were Fukudome and Bradley supposed to be stop gaps? Weren't they both added to quality teams to make them better? 3-4 year contracts aren't stop gap.

 

I just see no reason to concede the division next year.

 

They were complementary players on teams that were generally unsuccessful. The only reason why they aren't technically stop-gap players is b/c of the lack of position players coming up from the farm to replace them (still holding out hope one of Colvin and espec. Jackson can do so).

 

The only reason not to concede the division is b/c it's the worst in MLB, even with that, the Cubs likely won't have the payroll flexibility to overcome some of the bloated and unproductive salaries on this roster. There will have to be alot of stars aligning for them to win the division next year.

 

It's alot to count on the majority of Zambrano, Soriano, Lee, Ramirez, whichever other starters fill out the rotation.

[Rob]

Well, if you want to field a below average team, having a guy like him in RF is probably a good way to start. But I think the goal is to try and field one of the 3-4 best teams in the NL, or at least upper half.

 

There's nothing wrong with Pittsburgh giving a guy like him the RF job, but there is likely to be something very wrong with a team like the Cubs having him start in RF, on purpose.

 

You do realize the Cubs operate with budgetary constraints, right?

[jersey cubs fan]

Depends on who's out there and where they're at. I don't see them as contenders anytime soon and if they are a few years away, if he doesn't work out in RF, why not have him keep the seat warm until Jackson is ready?

 

To me, that would be better than some stop-gap at this point like Fukudome and Bradley were supposed to be.

 

How were Fukudome and Bradley supposed to be stop gaps? Weren't they both added to quality teams to make them better? 3-4 year contracts aren't stop gap.

 

I just see no reason to concede the division next year.

 

They were complementary players on teams that were generally unsuccessful. The only reason why they aren't technically stop-gap players is b/c of the lack of position players coming up from the farm to replace them (still holding out hope one of Colvin and espec. Jackson can do so).

 

I don't get your reasoning. Fukudome was added to an 85 win team, and Bradley was added to a 97 win team. Neither was going to have a 10 year career in Chicago, but both were acquired to provide significant production to the lineup for multiple years during what should have been a string of runs at the division/league crown. Neither was meant to be a stop gap.

[jersey cubs fan]

Well, if you want to field a below average team, having a guy like him in RF is probably a good way to start. But I think the goal is to try and field one of the 3-4 best teams in the NL, or at least upper half.

 

There's nothing wrong with Pittsburgh giving a guy like him the RF job, but there is likely to be something very wrong with a team like the Cubs having him start in RF, on purpose.

 

You do realize the Cubs operate with budgetary constraints, right?

 

Yes, but that doesn't meant they have to spend $400,000 on a RF who makes an out 70% of the time.

[Rob]

Well, if you want to field a below average team, having a guy like him in RF is probably a good way to start. But I think the goal is to try and field one of the 3-4 best teams in the NL, or at least upper half.

 

There's nothing wrong with Pittsburgh giving a guy like him the RF job, but there is likely to be something very wrong with a team like the Cubs having him start in RF, on purpose.

 

You do realize the Cubs operate with budgetary constraints, right?

 

Yes, but that doesn't meant they have to spend $400,000 on a RF who makes an out 70% of the time.

 

Even if we adjust his BABIP down (and it's not terribly high), and his HR/FB rate down (which is higher), he's still not going to be much more than about 1 win below average over a full season... in his first real playing time... at 24 years old. There is absolutely nothing wrong with giving a player like that a real shot to make adjustments as he enters his prime. Especially when it costs nothing. That is almost exactly the sort of player that teams look for to fill out the roster alongside their higher-paid superstars.

 

Our problem is that our higher salaried players don't nearly earn their paychecks... not that guys like Colvin aren't superstars.

[UK1679666180]

I don't have any idea who's available. I also edited my post, I was going to put in something akin to both your and goony's post together.

 

If Colvin is hurting Fukudome's trade value (which I don't think he is) it might be a problem. If they're fielding a subpar team while waiting for Soriano's contract to be tradable, then it's not a bad idea. Getting high draft picks for two years isn't the worst thing in the world. I mean, we've waited this long, what's another couple of years.

 

However, I don't think Ricketts is thinking that, but I'm not sure what he's thinking. I trust Bruce Miles more than any other beat writer and he seems to think that Hendry is staying put for at least one more year. If that's Ricketts plan, I think the Cubs want to contend.

 

 

As far as who's avail. Werth as an unrestricted FA will likely be the best position player avail., if Colorado does not pick up the option on Hawpe, he would be the other interesting option.

[jersey cubs fan]

Even if we adjust his BABIP down (and it's not terribly high), and his HR/FB rate down (which is higher), he's still not going to be much more than about 1 win below average over a full season... in his first real playing time... at 24 years old. There is absolutely nothing wrong with giving a player like that a real shot to make adjustments as he enters his prime. Especially when it costs nothing. That is almost exactly the sort of player that teams look for to fill out the roster alongside their higher-paid superstars.

 

Our problem is that our higher salaried players don't nearly earn their paychecks... not that guys like Colvin aren't superstars.

 

That's the 2010 Cubs problem. But if Tyler Colvin is the opening day starter for the 2011 Cubs, that will be part of the problem.

[UK1679666180]

I don't get your reasoning. Fukudome was added to an 85 win team, and Bradley was added to a 97 win team. Neither was going to have a 10 year career in Chicago, but both were acquired to provide significant production to the lineup for multiple years during what should have been a string of runs at the division/league crown. Neither was meant to be a stop gap.

 

They weren't brought in as stop-gaps but they ended up being one.

[Rob]

I don't have any idea who's available. I also edited my post, I was going to put in something akin to both your and goony's post together.

 

If Colvin is hurting Fukudome's trade value (which I don't think he is) it might be a problem. If they're fielding a subpar team while waiting for Soriano's contract to be tradable, then it's not a bad idea. Getting high draft picks for two years isn't the worst thing in the world. I mean, we've waited this long, what's another couple of years.

 

However, I don't think Ricketts is thinking that, but I'm not sure what he's thinking. I trust Bruce Miles more than any other beat writer and he seems to think that Hendry is staying put for at least one more year. If that's Ricketts plan, I think the Cubs want to contend.

 

 

As far as who's avail. Werth as an unrestricted FA will likely be the best position player avail., if Colorado does not pick up the option on Hawpe, he would be the other interesting option.

 

I'd be more interested in Carl Crawford than Jayson Werth.

 

And I want no part of Brad Hawpe... He was a born DH.

[Rob]

Even if we adjust his BABIP down (and it's not terribly high), and his HR/FB rate down (which is higher), he's still not going to be much more than about 1 win below average over a full season... in his first real playing time... at 24 years old. There is absolutely nothing wrong with giving a player like that a real shot to make adjustments as he enters his prime. Especially when it costs nothing. That is almost exactly the sort of player that teams look for to fill out the roster alongside their higher-paid superstars.

 

Our problem is that our higher salaried players don't nearly earn their paychecks... not that guys like Colvin aren't superstars.

 

That's the 2010 Cubs problem. But if Tyler Colvin is the opening day starter for the 2011 Cubs, that will be part of the problem.

 

Let's not pretend 2011 isn't a lost cause already.

[CubColtPacer]

If Fukudome is traded, Colvin does make sense to start in 2011. He's likely to be as good as any corner OF that could be brought in on a 1 year deal. And with 2 other OF's that would still have multiple years left on their contract you don't want to bring in a 3rd with Jackson likely being so close at that point. So Colvin starts the year and you hope that one of him or Jackson can hold the position down.

 

Now if Byrd was the one traded, that is a little bit of a different story. Then Fukudome slides back over to CF and the Cubs would probably be looking to add an impact bat in the corner OF position. Colvin plays 4th OF and Jackson replaces Fukudome either sometime during 2011 or after 2011 when his contract is up.

 

Of course one of the best options for competing in 2011 is for the Cubs to do what they are doing now and giving all 4 outfielders AB's. Getting a big bat at 1B and Ramirez coming back would make the Cubs contenders (especially if the Cubs also settled 2B in some way). How the Cubs approach 2011 may be dependent on what they think Ramirez can do as he is the big key to that season. Whatever they do, adding in a long-term contract in either the starting rotation or the OF will likely be a mistake.