Chicago Bulls Playoffs Thread

[Mike Aller]

Rose and many others expressed surprise James had switched onto him.

 

"That just shows he was kicking their ass," Brad Miller said.

 

Haha, thats awesome. Oh and 42 minutes of play, playing the point guard position, and guess how many turnovers D Rose had? ZERO, that is [expletive] impressive

Rose pissed me off hardcore tonight, haha. I've seen the Cavs in countless close games where the other team was finally scoring on a consistent basis in the 4th and LeBron would come down and score on nearly every possession. That's what Rose did tonight. I was obviously annoyed, but it was still impressive. He took some of, if not all of the momentum out of countless Cavs' spurts.

[Sammy Sofa]

You can be great but you can't be considered one of the greats of all time without at least one ring.

 

Sure you can. We can't even consider guys like Stockton, Barkley, Malone, Miller, Iverson, etc. in those discussions?

Edited April 23, 2010 by Sammy Sofa

[Mike Aller]

yes, dancing all around during games and on the bench and being a general dufus

He is having a good time. He doesn't do it in the face of anyone else. With the exceptions of a few stares at the Chicago bench, you hardly ever see LeBron taunt any player or team. And, Taj and LeBron were laughing when they were talking late in tonight's game, so obviously it is all in good fun.

 

I could understand dislike for a guy like KG, but why for LeBron? It honestly makes no sense to me. Especially when you have a guy like Noah on your team. Somehow because he acts goofy off of the court that makes it OK? I thought his comments about Cleveland were pretty hysterical (and, for the most part, true).

 

Also, the whole title argument is a bit of a stretch for a 25-year old kid. I mean, really? And, in case you haven't noticed over the past few years (and game two in this series) LeBron doesn't need someone else to take late game shots. People stopped trying to use that against LeBron about 3 years ago, so you should probably catch up.

 

Again, the LeBron hate is ridiculous. He's cut down on the dancing and all of those shenanigans, but it was equally as ridiculous to see him pulling those stunts out.

 

I like LBJ though. I'm praying that we have a fighter's chance at stealing him away from the hole known as Cleveland.

I can understand why someone would think the dances are dumb. But, to dislike LeBron for it is pretty dumb. It's just good fun.

[Keener98]

Rose and many others expressed surprise James had switched onto him.

 

"That just shows he was kicking their ass," Brad Miller said.

 

Haha, thats awesome. Oh and 42 minutes of play, playing the point guard position, and guess how many turnovers D Rose had? ZERO, that is [expletive] impressive

Rose pissed me off hardcore tonight, haha. I've seen the Cavs in countless close games where the other team was finally scoring on a consistent basis in the 4th and LeBron would come down and score on nearly every possession. That's what Rose did tonight. I was obviously annoyed, but it was still impressive. He took some of, if not all of the momentum out of countless Cavs' spurts.

 

Yea the more I watch him the more he amazes me. He has the mid range jumper locked in, and if you try coming out on him, hes at the rim before you know it. During those last 3 mins of the game I told my roommate that this was going to be a Lebron vs Rose end of the game and it was going to be fun.

 

The youth in the league right now is so damn talented its ridiculous.

[Mike Aller]

You can be great but you can't be considered one of the greats of all time without at least one ring.

 

Sure you can. We can't even consider guys like Stockton, Barkley, Iverson, etc. in those discussions?

I suppose you can give the whole "you need a championship" argument more merit in basketball rather than football or obviously baseball, but it's still pretty weak. It amazes me how many people use it and how many people think it holds serious weight in the judgment of a player.

 

LeBron has averaged 29.4PPG, 8.2 RPG and 7.2APG in his playoff career. And, his first three playoff trips he had to carry his team much more than he has to now. How can you blame him? It's mind boggling.

Edited April 23, 2010 by Mike Aller

[Guest]

Rose and many others expressed surprise James had switched onto him.

 

"That just shows he was kicking their ass," Brad Miller said.

 

Haha, thats awesome. Oh and 42 minutes of play, playing the point guard position, and guess how many turnovers D Rose had? ZERO, that is [expletive] impressive

Rose pissed me off hardcore tonight, haha. I've seen the Cavs in countless close games where the other team was finally scoring on a consistent basis in the 4th and LeBron would come down and score on nearly every possession. That's what Rose did tonight. I was obviously annoyed, but it was still impressive. He took some of, if not all of the momentum out of countless Cavs' spurts.

 

Yea the more I watch him the more he amazes me. He has the mid range jumper locked in, and if you try coming out on him, hes at the rim before you know it. During those last 3 mins of the game I told my roommate that this was going to be a Lebron vs Rose end of the game and it was going to be fun.

 

The youth in the league right now is so damn talented its ridiculous.

People need to watch matchups like that if they think the NBA is boring.

[SpongeWorthy]

You can be great but you can't be considered one of the greats of all time without at least one ring.

 

Sure you can. We can't even consider guys like Stockton, Barkley, Iverson, etc. in those discussions?

 

You gotta win titles. I can't even think of a guy who was considered the best player in the league that never won at least one championship.

 

Elgin Baylor and Karl Malone are the greatest players never to have won a ring. Out of those guys and the ones you mentioned only Baylor was considered one of the greats of all time (I'm talking top 10) and that's because his team was always in the Finals losing to the Celtics plus he was the first high flier in league history.

 

Duncan is considered a greater power forward than Malone almost entirely because he has rings and showed up huge when it mattered while the Mailman was frankly kind of a [expletive] in the clutch.

[Keener98]

Rose and many others expressed surprise James had switched onto him.

 

"That just shows he was kicking their ass," Brad Miller said.

 

Haha, thats awesome. Oh and 42 minutes of play, playing the point guard position, and guess how many turnovers D Rose had? ZERO, that is [expletive] impressive

Rose pissed me off hardcore tonight, haha. I've seen the Cavs in countless close games where the other team was finally scoring on a consistent basis in the 4th and LeBron would come down and score on nearly every possession. That's what Rose did tonight. I was obviously annoyed, but it was still impressive. He took some of, if not all of the momentum out of countless Cavs' spurts.

 

Yea the more I watch him the more he amazes me. He has the mid range jumper locked in, and if you try coming out on him, hes at the rim before you know it. During those last 3 mins of the game I told my roommate that this was going to be a Lebron vs Rose end of the game and it was going to be fun.

 

The youth in the league right now is so damn talented its ridiculous.

People need to watch matchups like that if they think the NBA is boring.

 

Yup agreed. The youth in the league is definitely bringing back the excitement in the NBA.

[Sammy Sofa]

You've got 8 guys on the NBA's all-time top 50 list that never won a ring. You've got 16 who only won 1. Championships are not the end-all-be-all of determining whether a player is great or not since even the greatest of all time couldn't win one by himself.

[Mike Aller]

You can be great but you can't be considered one of the greats of all time without at least one ring.

 

Sure you can. We can't even consider guys like Stockton, Barkley, Iverson, etc. in those discussions?

 

You gotta win titles. I can't even think of a guy who was considered the best player in the league that never won at least one championship.

LeBron is relatively openly accepted as the best player in the league right now. I'm not old enough to know for sure, but I would imagine that Jordan was too.

 

Did Jordan become a better player in the clinching game of his first championship? It's an absolutely ridiculous argument.

 

It would be like saying a pitcher has to have twenty wins to be accepted as the best pitcher in baseball (and, sadly, wins still hold far too much weight as well). Wins, like championships, will almost certainly come if the individual plays at a high enough level. But, bad pitchers still end up with high win totals, and great pitchers still end up with low win totals. They are team stats. Not individual stats.

[SpongeWorthy]

You can be great but you can't be considered one of the greats of all time without at least one ring.

 

Sure you can. We can't even consider guys like Stockton, Barkley, Iverson, etc. in those discussions?

 

You gotta win titles. I can't even think of a guy who was considered the best player in the league that never won at least one championship.

LeBron is relatively openly accepted as the best player in the league right now. I'm not old enough to know for sure, but I would imagine that Jordan was too.

 

Did Jordan become a better player in the clinching game of his first championship? It's an absolutely ridiculous argument.

 

It would be like saying a pitcher has to have twenty wins to be accepted as the best pitcher in baseball (and, sadly, wins still hold far too much weight as well). Wins, like championships, will almost certainly come if the individual plays at a high enough level. But, bad pitchers still end up with high win totals, and great pitchers still end up with low win totals. They are team stats. Not individual stats.

 

Jordan was a better player under Jackson than he was under Loughery, Collins, etc. Maybe not a more dominant individual talent, but a player more conducive to winning. And I'm fully expecting Lebron to rip off a bunch of titles. If he doesn't win one (barring some freak injury) it'd blow away the Marinos, Malones, etc. of the world in terms of being a giant black mark on a player's career.

[Mike Aller]

You can be great but you can't be considered one of the greats of all time without at least one ring.

 

Sure you can. We can't even consider guys like Stockton, Barkley, Iverson, etc. in those discussions?

 

You gotta win titles. I can't even think of a guy who was considered the best player in the league that never won at least one championship.

LeBron is relatively openly accepted as the best player in the league right now. I'm not old enough to know for sure, but I would imagine that Jordan was too.

 

Did Jordan become a better player in the clinching game of his first championship? It's an absolutely ridiculous argument.

 

It would be like saying a pitcher has to have twenty wins to be accepted as the best pitcher in baseball (and, sadly, wins still hold far too much weight as well). Wins, like championships, will almost certainly come if the individual plays at a high enough level. But, bad pitchers still end up with high win totals, and great pitchers still end up with low win totals. They are team stats. Not individual stats.

 

Jordan was a better player under Jackson than he was under Loughery, Collins, etc. Maybe not a more dominant individual talent, but a player more conducive to winning. And I'm fully expecting Lebron to rip off a bunch of titles. If he doesn't win one (barring some freak injury) it'd blow away the Marinos, Malones, etc. of the world in terms of being a giant black mark on a player's career.

I agree that it'd be a black mark, and I don't see it happening either. But, there is still too much emphasis put on it. Before last year, you constantly heard how Kobe is a champion and his pedigree and blah blah blah. But, he wasn't even the best player on his own team when he won those championships. Shaq was the MVP of all 3 finals.

 

Given, he was the undisputed "leader" of his team for the most recent championship. But, at what point is a guy disappointing if he doesn't have a championship and at what point isn't he? At what point is it a black mark because he didn't have the "winning attitude," and when is it bad luck and/or bad teams?

 

The only thing that I'll be personally happy in regards to LeBron if the Cavs win the championship is that people will finally stop this stupid argument. They aren't going to hang "LeBron James - 2010 NBA Champions" in the rafters, and they certainly didn't do that with Jordan. He was the dominant player that turned a very, very good team into a dynasty.

[ELCABALLO45]

I heard this first on the Dan Patrick show but I wanted to share it.

 

Chris Webber on Michael Jordan

 

 

Quote:

On playing against Jordan:

 

“One time we played in Washington. We played a five game series against the Bulls. It was the year they won 72 games. We lose all three games by a total of seven points. I saw Michael Jordan come into our locker room with a cigar, while it was lit, and said, ‘Who’s going to check me tonight?’ And we looked at Calbert Cheaney and we were laughing like little school kids knowing that Calbert Cheaney was going to get him, we knew it wasn’t a game for Mike. He was going to be there and he was going to be playing like he said. Game Three we get off the bus and Juwan (Howard) is from Chicago and used to workout there. I’ll never forget, Jordan was sitting on his Ferrari and Pippen was right there and they have a cigar lit. We get off the bus and we have to pass them with a lit cigar. You want to talk about posturing? Forget Phil Jackson. You got Michael Jordan there behind the scenes smoking a cigar before the game, letting us know that he’s the Red Auerbach before the game even started. It was almost like, ‘I lit the cigar. I’m celebrating already. This is just a formality, you guys getting on the court tonight.”

[Bobson Dugnutt]

i had some pretty good 300 level seats for this game. i'm so glad i decided to get in on some tickets. that's about as much fun as i've had at a sporting event. kirk hinrich played out of his mind and derrick rose is a badass as always.

[Guest]

Biggest drawback to tonight's result is now Noah has to go back to Cleveland next week.

 

That's a drawback? I would think Noah going back to Cleveland is a huge positive. I hope he talks more [expletive], too.

[Guest]

I agree that it'd be a black mark, and I don't see it happening either. But, there is still too much emphasis put on it. Before last year, you constantly heard how Kobe is a champion and his pedigree and blah blah blah. But, he wasn't even the best player on his own team when he won those championships. Shaq was the MVP of all 3 finals.

 

Shaq was the MVP of all three finals with the Lakers because the other teams had [expletive] for centers that couldn't guard him. He might have been the better player each of those years, but that's not why he won Finals MVP.

 

Also, Shaq never won a title without Kobe or Wade so it goes both ways.

[Magnetic Curses]

 

So is he missing something or is his team missing something?

 

both, probably.

[Magnetic Curses]

 

Did Jordan become a better player in the clinching game of his first championship? It's an absolutely ridiculous argument.

 

are you [expletive] kidding me? nobody is arguing that the act of winning a championship in itself makes you great. that's either one of the dumbest or one of the most dishonest things i've ever heard. championships are a byproduct of greatness. if you don't have one, then maybe you weren't the total package after all.

 

lebron has time, but i don't see it. in part, because of the last 3-point shot he took last night. it clanged off the side iron and was nowhere close to going in. you can almost hear him saying "square up, elevate, elbow in, follow through" on every jump-shot he takes. in every other field, he's a natural, he's had to work his ass off to be the shooter he is today, and i think he's about capped-out.

 

the gods granted tithonus eternal life, but not eternal youth, and the gods granted lebron great physical abilities, but not a great shot. his one flaw will make his many gifts a condemnation.

 

It would be like saying a pitcher has to have twenty wins to be accepted as the best pitcher in baseball (and, sadly, wins still hold far too much weight as well). Wins, like championships, will almost certainly come if the individual plays at a high enough level. But, bad pitchers still end up with high win totals, and great pitchers still end up with low win totals. They are team stats. Not individual stats.

 

completely different, but anyway, wins are a byproduct of ability. there are no pitchers with 300 wins that weren't great pitchers. they weren't great because they won, but rather they won because they were great.

[Soul]

I heard this first on the Dan Patrick show but I wanted to share it.

 

Chris Webber on Michael Jordan

 

 

Quote:

On playing against Jordan:

 

“One time we played in Washington. We played a five game series against the Bulls. It was the year they won 72 games. We lose all three games by a total of seven points. I saw Michael Jordan come into our locker room with a cigar, while it was lit, and said, ‘Who’s going to check me tonight?’ And we looked at Calbert Cheaney and we were laughing like little school kids knowing that Calbert Cheaney was going to get him, we knew it wasn’t a game for Mike. He was going to be there and he was going to be playing like he said. Game Three we get off the bus and Juwan (Howard) is from Chicago and used to workout there. I’ll never forget, Jordan was sitting on his Ferrari and Pippen was right there and they have a cigar lit. We get off the bus and we have to pass them with a lit cigar. You want to talk about posturing? Forget Phil Jackson. You got Michael Jordan there behind the scenes smoking a cigar before the game, letting us know that he’s the Red Auerbach before the game even started. It was almost like, ‘I lit the cigar. I’m celebrating already. This is just a formality, you guys getting on the court tonight.”

 

The Bulls weren't going to expend any more energy than necessary against a team like Washington that year. They did exactly what was required to win, nothing more. They had a championship to win, and Washington wasn't worth blowing out by 20.

 

Jordan did things like that because he knew it would stick in players' craw, which from Webber's comments 13 years later it sounds like he still hasn't gotten over it.

[Sammy Sofa]

sulley, you do think LeBron will win at least one championship before his career is done, right?

[Magnetic Curses]

if he does, it will be because he played with another superstar.

 

he can't do it on his own, imo. if he does, i'll admit that i was wrong.

[Sammy Sofa]

Nobody can do it on their own. Jordan couldn't do it on his own. And don't even pretend like Pippen wasn't another superstar.

[kujay]

I heard this first on the Dan Patrick show but I wanted to share it.

 

Chris Webber on Michael Jordan

 

 

Quote:

On playing against Jordan:

 

“One time we played in Washington. We played a five game series against the Bulls. It was the year they won 72 games. We lose all three games by a total of seven points. I saw Michael Jordan come into our locker room with a cigar, while it was lit, and said, ‘Who’s going to check me tonight?’ And we looked at Calbert Cheaney and we were laughing like little school kids knowing that Calbert Cheaney was going to get him, we knew it wasn’t a game for Mike. He was going to be there and he was going to be playing like he said. Game Three we get off the bus and Juwan (Howard) is from Chicago and used to workout there. I’ll never forget, Jordan was sitting on his Ferrari and Pippen was right there and they have a cigar lit. We get off the bus and we have to pass them with a lit cigar. You want to talk about posturing? Forget Phil Jackson. You got Michael Jordan there behind the scenes smoking a cigar before the game, letting us know that he’s the Red Auerbach before the game even started. It was almost like, ‘I lit the cigar. I’m celebrating already. This is just a formality, you guys getting on the court tonight.”

 

That's outstanding. I guess I don't know anything about the culture of the locker rooms, but I'm surprised he was allowed to just stroll in there to stir the [expletive].

[Magnetic Curses]

I heard this first on the Dan Patrick show but I wanted to share it.

 

Chris Webber on Michael Jordan

 

 

Quote:

On playing against Jordan:

 

“One time we played in Washington. We played a five game series against the Bulls. It was the year they won 72 games. We lose all three games by a total of seven points. I saw Michael Jordan come into our locker room with a cigar, while it was lit, and said, ‘Who’s going to check me tonight?’ And we looked at Calbert Cheaney and we were laughing like little school kids knowing that Calbert Cheaney was going to get him, we knew it wasn’t a game for Mike. He was going to be there and he was going to be playing like he said. Game Three we get off the bus and Juwan (Howard) is from Chicago and used to workout there. I’ll never forget, Jordan was sitting on his Ferrari and Pippen was right there and they have a cigar lit. We get off the bus and we have to pass them with a lit cigar. You want to talk about posturing? Forget Phil Jackson. You got Michael Jordan there behind the scenes smoking a cigar before the game, letting us know that he’s the Red Auerbach before the game even started. It was almost like, ‘I lit the cigar. I’m celebrating already. This is just a formality, you guys getting on the court tonight.”

 

The Bulls weren't going to expend any more energy than necessary against a team like Washington that year. They did exactly what was required to win, nothing more. They had a championship to win, and Washington wasn't worth blowing out by 20.

 

Jordan did things like that because he knew it would stick in players' craw, which from Webber's comments 13 years later it sounds like he still hasn't gotten over it.

 

that's not disrespectful, that's [expletive] pimp.

 

this is not exactly jordan dancing around like a fool and disrespecting everyone including himself while the game is still going on.

 

by the way, cwebb, who won the championship that year?

[UMFan83]

yes, dancing all around during games and on the bench and being a general dufus

He is having a good time. He doesn't do it in the face of anyone else. With the exceptions of a few stares at the Chicago bench, you hardly ever see LeBron taunt any player or team. And, Taj and LeBron were laughing when they were talking late in tonight's game, so obviously it is all in good fun.

 

I could understand dislike for a guy like KG, but why for LeBron? It honestly makes no sense to me. Especially when you have a guy like Noah on your team. Somehow because he acts goofy off of the court that makes it OK? I thought his comments about Cleveland were pretty hysterical (and, for the most part, true).

 

Also, the whole title argument is a bit of a stretch for a 25-year old kid. I mean, really? And, in case you haven't noticed over the past few years (and game two in this series) LeBron doesn't need someone else to take late game shots. People stopped trying to use that against LeBron about 3 years ago, so you should probably catch up.

 

Again, the LeBron hate is ridiculous. He's cut down on the dancing and all of those shenanigans, but it was equally as ridiculous to see him pulling those stunts out.

 

I like LBJ though. I'm praying that we have a fighter's chance at stealing him away from the hole known as Cleveland.

I can understand why someone would think the dances are dumb. But, to dislike LeBron for it is pretty dumb. It's just good fun.

 

I don't get why you are so surprised about this? If Dwyane Wade starting dancing all over the court after destroying the Cavs, you wouldn't resent that just a little? I can see why YOU would think it's in good fun, and it probably is, but when your team just got beat down the last thing you want to see is the opponent dancing and acting all jovial. He's already the damn most talented player in the league and now he has to essentially rub it in. It's one of those things that on paper it doesn't sound like a big deal, but when you are on the losing side of a game and you are already feeling upset by it and then you see the best player in the league dancing around laughing it up, you quickly develop hate.