2009 Chicago Bears offseason

[Wilson A2000]

Hypothetical Scenario:

 

How would you guys feel if the Bears selected Pat White in the second or third round to be used as a Wilcat QB, backup WR, and third string QB?

 

Note: I personally can't see the Bears drafting White with the intention of regularly running a Wildcat formation. However, the draft expert at RealGM.com has had White as the Bears second round pick for the past few updates, so maybe there is something there. Or maybe the Bears just like him as strictly a QB?

 

The Bears could do better with their third pick than that.

[Soul]

Hypothetical Scenario:

 

How would you guys feel if the Bears selected Pat White in the second or third round to be used as a Wilcat QB, backup WR, and third string QB?

 

Note: I personally can't see the Bears drafting White with the intention of regularly running a Wildcat formation. However, the draft expert at RealGM.com has had White as the Bears second round pick for the past few updates, so maybe there is something there. Or maybe the Bears just like him as strictly a QB?

 

The Bears could do better with their third pick than that.

 

Why would the Bears pursue Pat White, of all players? I don't understand. Especially with a 2nd or 3rd round pick? I guess I'm at a loss to explain the realGM's philosophy. White doesn't really project out to be an NFL QB -- they're asking him to make a position change, which presumably would be to WR. realGM has us picking Maclin in the 1st round, so this doubly makes little sense to me.

 

If the Bears are going to go QB, they need to go with an actual project NFL type QB, not a "wildcat QB" or some transitional guy, or a guy who is an experiment at the position.

 

And if the Bears do go with a WR in the first round, then they absolutely must address the O or D line in the 2nd.

 

Just my opinion, but I think the guy who did that mock for us is out to lunch.

[WrigleyField 22]

I don't know. If the Bears picked White with the intent to run the Wildcat (say 20% of the plays, Miami ran it 12% as reference) I'd be intrigued. If they pick White though, I hope they trade down to pick up a another second or third rounder because White would be kind of a luxury and not filling any need.

 

White and Forte (maybe even Wolfe at times) as your running attack, and Hester with the threat to go deep could work if its done right.

[Soul]

He sounds like exactly the kind of player that slips into the later rounds, and someone picks him up because he's good value later on, and his agent finally agrees that he will try another position when the team calls.

 

I've heard he's resistant to trying other positions. I think that's going to hurt him.

 

Also, I don't like the idea of switching to a fad offense, like we did with Crowton.

[WrigleyField 22]

I read a couple articles yesterday (can't find them now) where he is quoted as saying he'll do whatever he needs to help out his team. On his pro day I know he did almost exclusively QB drills, but I believe he ran a few routes at the end when asked to.

 

As far as him dropping I disagree. Some risk taking GM for a good team that has the luxury of not having to fill multiple needs will take him in the mid second to third round. Angelo definitely likes risks (see all the small school players that he drafts early) so it wouldn't surprise me. Now the Bears don't fit the qualifier of not having multiple needs, but they may be able to trade down to pick up an extra 2/3 round pick and still fill the needs they have. But I think he ends up going in the second round, third round at the latest.

 

Eric Crouch was a late third rounder and I think White projects better at him at QB or WR.

 

Miami actually makes a lot of sense. They have an extra second rounder, are the innovators of the Wildcat, and are coming off a successful season. Not sure if they've shown any interest at this point.

Edited March 20, 2009 by WrigleyField 22

[jersey cubs fan]

The Bears can't afford to gamble a high pick on such an unlikely to succeed player, and I don't see anyway they implement a successful creative "wildcat" type scheme with Ron Turner as offensive coordinator.

[Soul]

I can't disagree that with Angelo anything's possible though.

[WrigleyField 22]

The Bears can't afford to gamble a high pick on such an unlikely to succeed player, and I don't see anyway they implement a successful creative "wildcat" type scheme with Ron Turner as offensive coordinator.

You don't see it that way, but I don't think you're giving Angelo enough "credit" in his ability to do the unexpected.

[jersey cubs fan]

The Bears can't afford to gamble a high pick on such an unlikely to succeed player, and I don't see anyway they implement a successful creative "wildcat" type scheme with Ron Turner as offensive coordinator.

You don't see it that way, but I don't think you're giving Angelo enough "credit" in his ability to do the unexpected.

 

What the heck does that even mean? What does he do that's so crazy? Everybody knew he needed Tackle help last year, and he drafted one. They needed RB and WR as well, and he took those in 2 and 3.

 

He's reached on guys like Bazuin and Wolfe, but what in the world has been so unexpected by him?

[WrigleyField 22]

Small school players way too early mostly. Just a lot of WTF picks.

 

Another great example is Hester. He was a second rounder, right?

[jersey cubs fan]

Small school players way too early mostly. Just a lot of WTF picks.

 

Another great example is Hester. He was a second rounder, right?

 

Late 2nd I believe. He traded down and took Manning, then got Hester later. It wasn't really a reach, he was talented as heck and filled a need they had. White isn't 2nd round worthy and doesn't do anything the Bears can take advantage of, plus they have tons of other actual needs, not part-time QB.

[WrigleyField 22]

Lets look at the TE example:

 

Desmond Clark's stats (Catches, Yards, TDs)

2003- 44, 443, 2

2004- 24, 282, 1

2005- 24, 229, 2

2006- 45, 626, 6

2007- 44, 545, 4

2008- 41, 367, 1

 

Drafted Olsen in 2007, after Clark had put up his best season. There were a lot of people who wanted TE, even a late rounder after '04 and '05. Now I still liked the Olsen pick at the time and still do, but seeing nothing in '04 and '05 was frustrating.

 

Last year, sure he finally addressed the O-Line, after ignoring it for the past 5 years. After Columbo in 2002, the only OL pick higher than the 6th round was Beekman in the fourth round. Now the line was actually a strength for a couple years, but a lot of fans saw the need for some long term growth because it was also an old line.

 

Daniel Manning, Charles Tillman, and Roosevelt Williams left a lot of people wondering.

 

Then as you said, guys like Bauzin and Wolfe way earlier than they were slotted.

[WrigleyField 22]

Small school players way too early mostly. Just a lot of WTF picks.

 

Another great example is Hester. He was a second rounder, right?

 

Late 2nd I believe. He traded down and took Manning, then got Hester later. It wasn't really a reach, he was talented as heck and filled a need they had. White isn't 2nd round worthy and doesn't do anything the Bears can take advantage of, plus they have tons of other actual needs, not part-time QB.

NO ONE thought that at the time. He didn't project as more than backup DB and return man, and I don't think anyone thought "6 TD return man". It was a reach at the time.

[jersey cubs fan]

But talking about reaching for guys is not the same as you portraying as some crazy draft guy that always does the unexpected. Drafting a wildcat back in the 2nd round would be unexpected, but it would be unlike anything else he's done. He reaches and takes small school guys earlier than most would, but that has nothing to do with Pat White.

 

And again, Ron Turner is the offensive coordinator. I don't see the creativity to make something like that work, or be worthwhile.

[minnesotacubsfan]

Turner can be creative, but its his game-calling that kills him

[jersey cubs fan]

Turner can be creative, but its his game-calling that kills him

 

Wildcat formation on a regular basis creative? I don't think so.

 

It took him a year and a half to figure out how to throw to Olsen. The Bears are an extremely vanilla offense.

[Soul]

But talking about reaching for guys is not the same as you portraying as some crazy draft guy that always does the unexpected. Drafting a wildcat back in the 2nd round would be unexpected, but it would be unlike anything else he's done. He reaches and takes small school guys earlier than most would, but that has nothing to do with Pat White.

 

And again, Ron Turner is the offensive coordinator. I don't see the creativity to make something like that work, or be worthwhile.

 

Yeah, it would just be an out-of-character move, for more than one reason.

 

If they do it, and it keeps us from getting something that we really need, I'll probably be looking for a bottle of Jack.

[WrigleyField 22]

 

Why would the Bears pursue Pat White, of all players? I don't understand. Especially with a 2nd or 3rd round pick? I guess I'm at a loss to explain the realGM's philosophy. White doesn't really project out to be an NFL QB -- they're asking him to make a position change, which presumably would be to WR. realGM has us picking Maclin in the 1st round, so this doubly makes little sense to me.

 

If the Bears are going to go QB, they need to go with an actual project NFL type QB, not a "wildcat QB" or some transitional guy, or a guy who is an experiment at the position.

 

And if the Bears do go with a WR in the first round, then they absolutely must address the O or D line in the 2nd.

 

Just my opinion, but I think the guy who did that mock for us is out to lunch.

Just noticed this part. The draft expert at RealGM is an insider, so his picks aren't solely what he sees as good picks but actually based on what teams are looking at. Now obviously he doesn't know what every team is thinking and even if he did he still will get things wrong, but it's possible he has mad this pick in the last two mocks because he knows the Bears are looking at him seriously.

[minnesotacubsfan]

Turner can be creative, but its his game-calling that kills him

 

Wildcat formation on a regular basis creative? I don't think so.

 

It took him a year and a half to figure out how to throw to Olsen. The Bears are an extremely vanilla offense.

 

I said nothing of the Wildcat. and Turner has always had decent plays in his playbook (Des Howard playaction to beat the Packers), it's simply that he brain-farts when it comes to gametime playcalling 90% of the time. They are "vanilla" becuase of his inability to call a game, not becuase he cant draw up a good play.

[Soul]

 

Why would the Bears pursue Pat White, of all players? I don't understand. Especially with a 2nd or 3rd round pick? I guess I'm at a loss to explain the realGM's philosophy. White doesn't really project out to be an NFL QB -- they're asking him to make a position change, which presumably would be to WR. realGM has us picking Maclin in the 1st round, so this doubly makes little sense to me.

 

If the Bears are going to go QB, they need to go with an actual project NFL type QB, not a "wildcat QB" or some transitional guy, or a guy who is an experiment at the position.

 

And if the Bears do go with a WR in the first round, then they absolutely must address the O or D line in the 2nd.

 

Just my opinion, but I think the guy who did that mock for us is out to lunch.

Just noticed this part. The draft expert at RealGM is an insider, so his picks aren't solely what he sees as good picks but actually based on what teams are looking at. Now obviously he doesn't know what every team is thinking and even if he did he still will get things wrong, but it's possible he has mad this pick in the last two mocks because he knows the Bears are looking at him seriously.

 

I guess I just take it on faith that he knows what he's talking about because he claims to be an insider? I mean there's no explanation of the pick or anything. I'm sure the Bears are talking about a lot of guys right now. Who knows how much of that total conversation this guy is picking up. Probably very little.

[jersey cubs fan]

Turner can be creative, but its his game-calling that kills him

 

Wildcat formation on a regular basis creative? I don't think so.

 

It took him a year and a half to figure out how to throw to Olsen. The Bears are an extremely vanilla offense.

 

I said nothing of the Wildcat. and Turner has always had decent plays in his playbook (Des Howard playaction to beat the Packers), it's simply that he brain-farts when it comes to gametime playcalling 90% of the time. They are "vanilla" becuase of his inability to call a game, not becuase he cant draw up a good play.

 

The whole point is somebody thinks the Bears will draft Pat White in the 2nd to run the wildcat.

 

Any offensive coordinator can draw up an interesting play. Actual creative OC's figure out how to implement them on a regular basis and get positive results.

[WrigleyField 22]

The whole point is somebody thinks the Bears will draft Pat White in the 2nd to run the wildcat.

I don't know if anyone has said that. The RealGM guy has predicted the Bears to pick him, but I'm not sure under what idea. He may have made the pick with the understanding the Bears would try and use him as a full time QB. Who knows. I just asked the hypothetical if the Bears picked him with that intention how fans would feel.

[minnesotacubsfan]

see, I thought I read that series of posts correctly, and I did.

[jersey cubs fan]

The whole point is somebody thinks the Bears will draft Pat White in the 2nd to run the wildcat.

I don't know if anyone has said that. The RealGM guy has predicted the Bears to pick him, but I'm not sure under what idea. He may have made the pick with the understanding the Bears would try and use him as a full time QB. Who knows. I just asked the hypothetical if the Bears picked him with that intention how fans would feel.

 

I would feel there's no way the Bears do that because it would be stupid, and because Ron Turner wouldn't know how to make it work.

[minnesotacubsfan]

I would feel there's no way the Bears do that because it would be stupid, and because Ron Turner wouldn't know how to make it work.

 

since Ron Turner probably isnt doing the formal and/or funcion of drafting, I dont think we need to worry about it